Is ESO console ready without Addons?

coolermh

I play with addons, but could imagine playing without addons.

The only thing I will be upset about is not having any damage output information

BBSooner

I play without addons.

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

nastuug

There are some addons I cannot do without. I wouldn't play if these addons didn't exist.

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

Because many of these addons provide much needed support, which should have been included in the base game. Now, we must rely on third-party personnel to provide timely updates when necessary for basic features that one would typically expect in a modern MMORPG.

BBSooner

I play without addons.

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

Because many of these addons provide much needed support, which should have been included in the base game. Now, we must rely on third-party personnel to provide timely updates when necessary for basic features that one would typically expect in a modern MMORPG.

The expectation of "what should be in a modern MMORPG" is completely opinionated and based on the individual though. One person may expect text to blink mid-screen to "cast X spell now" to take advantage of a proc, others just expect a visual cue on their character. Some expect to be notified when their opponent buffs or heals, others expect the game to hide that information and force the player to rely on player skill/knowledge to time their counter.

The API was given so addons could allow players to shape their UI to their specific expectations. Complaining that they have to do it is really biting the hand that feeds them.

gard

Haqikah wrote: »

Since early release I have been playing merrily without any addons, neither do I feel the urge to install any. So I expect no issues for the console.

Then you don't craft

gard

Seraphyel wrote: »

ShadowHvo wrote: »

If you want to play a traditional MMO where you stand and spam buttons then go back to WoW or SW:TOR or what other game you find to have the "Perfect UI" to your taste. ESO does not have it implemented, but you can get it with addons. Then take it or leave it as you yourself so desire. But yet again, it is outright false and wrong to claim that you can't play effectively without, because you absolutely can.

Again, because you need training wheels doesn't mean that everyone does. Get them if you want to, but don't try to force us who can ride our bike just fine to get them too.

ESO is a dozen times more of a "spam buttons" game than WoW or SW:TOR are. Nowhere else I repeatedly use the same skill a million times (like Wrecking Blow spam or things like that).

The other part about the addons... there is absolutely no room for more discussion about it, I'm tired to explain it to guys like you again and again.

So lets say you didn't use wrecking blow (why do you, if you don't like to spam the same button?) but instead used other abilities. That gives you 12 buttons not counting block, interrupt, and roll dodge. So what exactly are you complaining about?

No one is making you use the skill of the month, and you can be viable without it.

zachary4828

It is absolutely ready, far and away better than the PC release version, and in many ways better than the current PC version.

It is missing some of the addons we've gotten used to, but it isn't missing anything that you can't live without. The devs have already mentioned being at work on some of the features the community has identified as being important.

If you have played Elder Scrolls: Skyrim on console you will be very comfortable with the controls. This game was designed with consoles in mind.

Attorneyatlawl

There are some addons I cannot do without. I wouldn't play if these addons didn't exist.

BBSooner wrote: »

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

What cues? You mean the tiny purple glow that's about 1/20th of the size of your screen at the middle when 10-20+ other spell effects are covering it that are much larger and all over constantly? Or the non-existent visual cues unless you directly observe someone being hit by a skill you already know is a DOT if it isn't covered by 5 other DOT's already on the target leaving him burning even before you saw him? The truth is that outside of solo questing, without buff-debuff icons and indicators the "cues" just don't cut it in anything moderately demanding in gameplay difficulty.

Attorneyatlawl

There are some addons I cannot do without. I wouldn't play if these addons didn't exist.

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

Because many of these addons provide much needed support, which should have been included in the base game. Now, we must rely on third-party personnel to provide timely updates when necessary for basic features that one would typically expect in a modern MMORPG.

The expectation of "what should be in a modern MMORPG" is completely opinionated and based on the individual though. One person may expect text to blink mid-screen to "cast X spell now" to take advantage of a proc, others just expect a visual cue on their character. Some expect to be notified when their opponent buffs or heals, others expect the game to hide that information and force the player to rely on player skill/knowledge to time their counter.

The API was given so addons could allow players to shape their UI to their specific expectations. Complaining that they have to do it is really biting the hand that feeds them.

Except for the fact that the API doesn't allow for most of the important combat info, and the default UI is barely there in the first place. That not only leaves people having no way to get the information to play the game well, but anyone who doesn't know how to go download addons and then hassle keeping them updated every patch, is high and dry right off the bat of even basics like health bar numbers or how hard they have attacked an enemy for.


-How much damage am I gaining by adding Sharpened to my staff against this monster?

-How much less damage did I take from that monster's attack because of my armor? Wait, which monster even hit me?

-Ok, I downloaded the combat log addon... wait, the API can't even tell me what hit me!?

-I pressed a buff.... it says it has 15 seconds! What the--- I didn't even get the buff or the Heal over Time even tho the addon showed it? What do you mean it has no access to tell me even with an addon?

-Boss taunted!! Wait, why is it going for the heal----errr oh shoot, he died... even with an addon clogging things up it still just guesses it off of having pressed the taunt button. Really????

-Alright, gonna go craft some stuff.... why can't I just see provisioning items again?

I think you get the idea... .

BBSooner

I play without addons.

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

What cues? You mean the tiny purple glow that's about 1/20th of the size of your screen at the middle when 10-20+ other spell effects are covering it that are much larger and all over constantly? Or the non-existent visual cues unless you directly observe someone being hit by a skill you already know is a DOT if it isn't covered by 5 other DOT's already on the target leaving him burning even before you saw him? The truth is that outside of solo questing, without buff-debuff icons and indicators the "cues" just don't cut it in anything moderately demanding in gameplay difficulty.

Can't say I have a problem missing my fragment proc with the 'tiny purple glow' , mid trial or mid cyrodiil.

BBSooner

I play without addons.

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

Because many of these addons provide much needed support, which should have been included in the base game. Now, we must rely on third-party personnel to provide timely updates when necessary for basic features that one would typically expect in a modern MMORPG.

The expectation of "what should be in a modern MMORPG" is completely opinionated and based on the individual though. One person may expect text to blink mid-screen to "cast X spell now" to take advantage of a proc, others just expect a visual cue on their character. Some expect to be notified when their opponent buffs or heals, others expect the game to hide that information and force the player to rely on player skill/knowledge to time their counter.

The API was given so addons could allow players to shape their UI to their specific expectations. Complaining that they have to do it is really biting the hand that feeds them.

Except for the fact that the API doesn't allow for most of the important combat info, and the default UI is barely there in the first place. That not only leaves people having no way to get the information to play the game well, but anyone who doesn't know how to go download addons and then hassle keeping them updated every patch, is high and dry right off the bat of even basics like health bar numbers or how hard they have attacked an enemy for.

Which is an entirely different issue than the post I was responding to. Stating the API needs more information added != stating addons for the current API should be the base UI for the game.

MercyKilling

I play without addons.

gard wrote: »

Haqikah wrote: »

Since early release I have been playing merrily without any addons, neither do I feel the urge to install any. So I expect no issues for the console.

Then you don't craft

I craft, and whenever I mosey up to a crafting table, I have no problems finding my crafting materials, motifs, tempers, etc. They're all right there, displayed prominently on my screen.

My inventory or bank? Sure, I have to scroll to find them, but it's really no inconvenience to have to do that. They are, after all found in at least ONE of the tabs. So they don't have their own tab, big deal. I got used to it. Now, I don't even notice it.

Attorneyatlawl

There are some addons I cannot do without. I wouldn't play if these addons didn't exist.

BBSooner wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

Because many of these addons provide much needed support, which should have been included in the base game. Now, we must rely on third-party personnel to provide timely updates when necessary for basic features that one would typically expect in a modern MMORPG.

The expectation of "what should be in a modern MMORPG" is completely opinionated and based on the individual though. One person may expect text to blink mid-screen to "cast X spell now" to take advantage of a proc, others just expect a visual cue on their character. Some expect to be notified when their opponent buffs or heals, others expect the game to hide that information and force the player to rely on player skill/knowledge to time their counter.

The API was given so addons could allow players to shape their UI to their specific expectations. Complaining that they have to do it is really biting the hand that feeds them.

Except for the fact that the API doesn't allow for most of the important combat info, and the default UI is barely there in the first place. That not only leaves people having no way to get the information to play the game well, but anyone who doesn't know how to go download addons and then hassle keeping them updated every patch, is high and dry right off the bat of even basics like health bar numbers or how hard they have attacked an enemy for.

Which is an entirely different issue than the post I was responding to. Stating the API needs more information added != stating addons for the current API should be the base UI for the game.

It's essentially the same thing if it's in the API , just more of a hassle for players on the essentials. There's absolutely no reason not to simply allow for these options in the settings screen to turn on or off as you like to establish a stable and non-3rd-party dependent baseline of functionality for some of these things. Guild store pricing plots and history calculators, sure, those aren't exactly standard issue, but a minimap or numbers on your health bars... those are no-brainers .

Attorneyatlawl

There are some addons I cannot do without. I wouldn't play if these addons didn't exist.

MercyKilling wrote: »

gard wrote: »

Haqikah wrote: »

Since early release I have been playing merrily without any addons, neither do I feel the urge to install any. So I expect no issues for the console.

Then you don't craft

I craft, and whenever I mosey up to a crafting table, I have no problems finding my crafting materials, motifs, tempers, etc. They're all right there, displayed prominently on my screen.

My inventory or bank? Sure, I have to scroll to find them, but it's really no inconvenience to have to do that. They are, after all found in at least ONE of the tabs. So they don't have their own tab, big deal. I got used to it. Now, I don't even notice it.

That isn't fun gameplay or intuitive UI. That's just tedious and annoying on a daily basis as you play. Nothing is gained for the game by not having a tiny little dropdown to let you choose "Woodworking" for materials to show in your bags or bank, just repetition.

BBSooner

I play without addons.

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

Because many of these addons provide much needed support, which should have been included in the base game. Now, we must rely on third-party personnel to provide timely updates when necessary for basic features that one would typically expect in a modern MMORPG.

The expectation of "what should be in a modern MMORPG" is completely opinionated and based on the individual though. One person may expect text to blink mid-screen to "cast X spell now" to take advantage of a proc, others just expect a visual cue on their character. Some expect to be notified when their opponent buffs or heals, others expect the game to hide that information and force the player to rely on player skill/knowledge to time their counter.

The API was given so addons could allow players to shape their UI to their specific expectations. Complaining that they have to do it is really biting the hand that feeds them.

Except for the fact that the API doesn't allow for most of the important combat info, and the default UI is barely there in the first place. That not only leaves people having no way to get the information to play the game well, but anyone who doesn't know how to go download addons and then hassle keeping them updated every patch, is high and dry right off the bat of even basics like health bar numbers or how hard they have attacked an enemy for.

Which is an entirely different issue than the post I was responding to. Stating the API needs more information added != stating addons for the current API should be the base UI for the game.

It's essentially the same thing if it's in the API , just more of a hassle for players on the essentials. There's absolutely no reason not to simply allow for these options in the settings screen to turn on or off as you like to establish a stable and non-3rd-party dependent baseline of functionality for some of these things. Guild store pricing plots and history calculators, sure, those aren't exactly standard issue, but a minimap or numbers on your health bars... those are no-brainers .

Absolutely there's a reason not to have them in the base game. API and addons allow for customization. If you're unhappy with what is given in the API, that's completely another matter than requesting devs (as suggested by another poster) to put dev hours in to adding randomly chosen addons currently available in game. Infact, it's much more likely to happen (adding information to the API), since they don't have to design menu screens and updates.

StaticWax

I play without addons.

Most addons are a crutch for substandard players. There, I said it.

Attorneyatlawl

There are some addons I cannot do without. I wouldn't play if these addons didn't exist.

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

That isn't personalization, it is core RPG info and functionality. Personalization is changing the colors button icons, etc. Basics like how much you hit for, what hit you, and how long the buff you cast has left, are not OK to relegate to be handled only by third party addons which many don't know how to maintain, and gives a very poor first impression of polish and gameplay when their starter quests are to Google how to use addons and their second one is to download and install them so they have a minimap. And many core functions aren't even allowed to be done by addons such as guild and player nameplates, and seeing who hit you with what rather than just you were hit for x damage. Add in no buff debuff info applied by or to you, and it's not a good thing. It's a flaw.

StaticWax wrote: »

Most addons are a crutch for substandard players. There, I said it.

Lacking addons is a crutch for substandard players who want it to be harder for others to figure out how poorly they're performing. Right, then?

BBSooner

I play without addons.

Attorneyatlawl wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

nastuug wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Divinius wrote: »

Pallmor wrote: »

As for all these "ESO should look like every other MMO" posts, I can only assume that THIS is what you want ESO to look like:



No thanks! I like the minimalist immersive approach. If I wanted a control screen from the Enterprise, I'd apply to Starfleet.

BBSooner wrote: »

You can kick your feet and scream that the base game should also display abcdef and g on the screen, I'll however be glad that it doesn't. That's what the compromise was afterall, ZOS catered to one side by not including features in the base UI, and catered to the other by allowing the display of the extras through addons. The argument is moot.

Why does everyone seem to think that all addons are UI-hogging monstrosities that clutter everything up? Sure, some of them are, but the vast majority are not.

I am currently running 37 addons. With the exception of the minimap and the multi-quest tracker (2 of the 37 addons), my game screen doesn't look any different from the stock UI. All of the other 35 addons are things that simply add more info or functionality to menus, maps, and the chat box, or they are additional screens that are opened only briefly when needed.

All these "anti-addon" folks keep accusing addon-users of cluttering up their screen. Addons only clutter up the screen if you want them to. I have 35 addons you can use that don't touch the main game view.

I didn't mention a cluttering of the screen, so I'm not entirely sure why I was quoted. I'm simply content to use the base game visual cues instead of being told when to cleanse, when to crystal frag, etc.

I remember the first thing I was asking myself when I started a Sorc: "How the hell do I know when to pop frag?" Personally, with everything else going on, I need some other type of indicator. From there, I discovered how the game was missing things that were vital and many felt should have been basic UI options.

Which is fine, and if you prefer to rely on an addon to let you know when to use your skill that's fine, however many threads criticizing the UI for being minimal assert that the indicator we already get isn't good enough and we should get more. I disagree, and I'm glad ZOS has decided that (for now) visual cues are sufficient , and for those that require a larger indicator they have addons to help them - instead of coding in varying degrees of preference based on who wants what in a game where we are already content starved.

Well, I find it quite upsetting that players/fan boys have time/energy to code an addon for free, but the guys who, ya know, developed the game couldn't take the necessary time to work in optional UI items. Optional UI items that are clearly very popular...

Because ... that's the whole point of addons? They presented an API and said "if you want to tweek the UI, go for it". Players have the ability to adjust it, why must the game change to fit their preference instead of using the tools given to them for personalization?

That isn't personalization, it is core RPG info and functionality. Personalization is changing the colors button icons, etc. Basics like how much you hit for, what hit you, and how long the buff you cast has left, are not OK to relegate to be handled only by third party addons which many don't know how to maintain, and gives a very poor first impression of polish and gameplay when their starter quests are to Google how to use addons and their second one is to download and install them so they have a minimap. And many core functions aren't even allowed to be done by addons such as guild and player nameplates, and seeing who hit you with what rather than just you were hit for x damage. Add in no buff debuff info applied by or to you, and it's not a good thing. It's a flaw.

StaticWax wrote: »

Most addons are a crutch for substandard players. There, I said it.

Lacking addons is a crutch for substandard players who want it to be harder for others to figure out how poorly they're performing. Right, then?

It's absolutely personalization. Wanting real time feedback for every activity isn't currently in the API, yet there are players who don't want numbers scrolling their screen, a combat window, etc. Those are things that can safely be added to the API and the player can decide what they want to display where. That is a far better solution than having devs spend time coding in these display changes when players are still going to desire to alter it.

Naivefanboi

Just play pc with no addons or chatlogs open ... It makes playing really insightful.

ShadowMole25

I play with addons, but could imagine playing without addons.

I haven't seen the UI for the console and I don't plan because I don't own one of the new consoles, but this argument hasn't really solved much. Personally, I have just gotten into addons. I use ESOTheater, FTC, Combat Cloud, and Kill Counter. As far as I can see, the inventory is easy to navigate, as is researching. The bank UI could use an upgrade, but it's not that hard to quickly scroll through it. There is also this thing called your memory that tell you can use to see where you are in research. I played Skyrim on the 360 for close to 1000 hours, and never had a problem. I never played it on PC where I could have used mods.

As far as damage is concerned, just find a single MOB to test skills on, you don't need access to the numbers to maximize builds. Its not necessary. A minimap also is not necessary because there is the traditional ES compass that shows you the directions and nearby objects.

I said that I just started using addons. What I mean is that I have been playing for two months without them, and only installed them 2 days ago to test them out. Personally, I am not a fan of FTC as is takes away my traditional resource bars, and Combat Cloud gets annoying. Kill Counter is nice as it tells me who I killed in Cyrodil, and shows me my KDR telling me how bad I am. ESOTheater is one that I like, only because it allows me to keybind emotes. I am going to keep the last two for a while, but as far as FTC and Combat Cloud go, I will test them out, but if they stay annoying, I will get rid of them.

One last thing, you don't need these addons in order to play. While they may make things easier, ES has always been about the little things. You can use these addons to get a world of information, the console versions of previous ES games did not have access to mods and they were still plenty of fun. For those of you who say that addons are the equivalent of modern tech, while the vanilla UI is like the stone age, who said that a "modern MMO", needed to have all of this information, and why is it necessary to have fun?

Have fun on the consoles regardless of how it turns out

Ojustaboo

There are some addons I cannot do without. I wouldn't play if these addons didn't exist.

Some add ons are needed to satisfy the majority of average players Imo.

Things like sorting inv etc, or seeing what buffs are active in PvP.

Sure some of us are happy playing with zero addons, but for every one in this vote that don't use addons, there seems to be four that do.

We don't know how all those that voted no addons play the game, for example, do they pvp, do they manage guild stores etc.

I think a lot of new players buying the console game will be up in arms about certain things there in almost all other mmos missing in teso, and I think it will sadly drive many away.

NadiusMaximus

Playing this with no addon changes the game from an mmo to skyrim with friends.
Sure we can go with out them..... Wait, I just can't do it. There is no way you can play this game effectively as an mmo without knowing your exact stats, dps, buff times, research times etc. If you don't absolutely need these fine, but your not playing an mmo then, your playing a massive co-op version of a ES game. Which is fine, but don't complain when you enter pvp and get rolled not knowing why. Or by what.