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Elite gear hit with the massive nerf hammer in 1.6 nobody does trials anymore: pics
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Daveheart✭✭✭✭I could be wrong, but I thought the context of the older comment regarding "dropped vs crafted" was intended to address the continued viability of blacksmith and clothier as worthwhile pursuits in the game. In effect answering "why would someone bother with the time and expense of crafting something when they could buy clearly better items from a guild store?". Please forgive me if I totally misinterpreted the intentions of the original question and response to and from Paul.
For the most part there's been reasons to consider various crafted, BoE and BoP gear sets. It just seems to have made the decision pretty easy to avoid the trial sets (+dmg > +resource > +crit % in my testing so far on PTS). I tried both the LA and MA Sanctum Ophidia gear sets on several different DPS tests and didn't find the high-end trial gear worth while. I did say earlier that this won't affect my participation in the trials, but unless something is adjusted, it's a nerf.Daggerfall Covenant (PC-NA)
The Order of Mundus | Nightfighters1 -
Yusuf✭✭✭✭✭sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »They did not nerf endgame sets. They had to rebalance crit % because they changed how impen works, and a few other things regarding crit. If you notice, you are getting more than 10x the value of some stats, particularly spell power. The sets are not nerfed at all. They simply rebalanced the value of crit %. They also rebalanced what piece of the pie of your overall character is contributed to from sets, and from enchants, etc. Enchants will not be 10x the amount, this is because of rebalancing. There is no nerfing going on. They simply rebalanced the places you get different stats from.
It doesnt take a rocket scientist to understand this. Please think more deeply and stop with these complaints! Nobody is nerfed.
Let's be honest here, people almost never wear a full Aether Set, they wear 2 or 3 pieces for the crit. Some builds even combine the new and the old Aether to get an increase of 12% for pve.
As it stands right now wearing 2 pieces of Aether or even a full set simply isn't worth it, doing trials as a DPS totally isn't worth the trouble at the moment.1 -
Varicite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Much like character's stats and other things were nerfed heavily in order to make way for the Champion System grind, it seems that most of the endgame sets have suffered to make way for Season Gear to always be the best and second best.1 -
whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Alot of people are crying about the change in Crit,
well in the Champion System there are two Constellations under the Mage,
the Apprentice and the Ritual.
When you place 30 CP (Champion Points) into the Apprentice you get a passive called Spell Precision which adds to your base Spell Critical getting a extra 12%.
PIC- http://deltiasgaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Apprentice.jpg
When you place 30 CP into the Ritual you get a passive called Perfect Stike which adds to your base Weapon Critical getting a extra 12%.
PIC- http://deltiasgaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Ritual.jpg
So with Champion points you can raise your Spell Crit or Weapon Crit with your base of 10% plus the 12% from these passives to 22% not including gear and other things (abilities and other passives that give Crit, etc).
I figured I would add this since I didn't see anyone tell anyone about these passives, your welcome, and thanks to Deltia for making the screenshots of the Champion System..Edited by whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO on February 4, 2015 9:33PMSigned, Kotaro Atani.PS5 NAVR16/ CP 160 Khajiit Nightblade of the Aldmeri Dominion, Guildmaster and Assassin of the Queen's Hand guild on NA PC. PvP Officer in the WOLF guild on NA PS5, and of course Master Thief. Currently 3120 CP out of 3600 CP on NA PS5. Currently 810 CP on NA PC (used for PTS testing purposes only). On PS5 I am also a Master Crafter, all traits done and learned, Jewelry crafting done. all Motifs learned on PS5 except for maybe two-three Motifs. Both Companions are Max level as are their Skills.Warrior, Lover, Thief.... Nightblade. Aldmeri Dominion For Life! For the Queen!! Go Dominion or go home ! "I have no hatred for the races of Man, but they are young. Like all children, they are driven by emotion. They lack the wisdom that comes with age. I would sooner place an Altmer infant on the Ruby Throne than surrender Tamriel to their capricious whims. The Altmer, the Bosmer and the Khajiit share the common traits of intelligence, patience and reason. We do not seek riches or plunder. Domination is not our goal, nor is the acclamation of power for its own sake. Today we make our stand. Today we take back the Ruby Throne, which is ours by ancient right and the blessings of the Divines. Stand with us." ―Your Queen Commands, Ayrenn Arana Aldmeri.(All 18 characters are AD only! This one is a AD Loyalist)Member of ESO Since January 29, 2014, started early Access 3/30/14 on PC, currently subbed on NA PS5 and on NA PC. Note- I only use PC for PTS testing purposes, the PS5 is my dedicated Game Platform.Note- for those that don't know how to say Kotaro Atani it's "Ko tar row Ah ta ni" (Ko with a Oh sound, tar which sounds like the sticky black tar stuff, row like rowing a boat, Ah with a AHHHH sound, Ta with a Tahhh sound, Neeee which sounds like knee)"The blowing sands of time wipe clean the footprints of the past...""Moonsugar may be the key to paradise, but it is through a false door...""A perfect society is always elsewhere..."- Unknown book of Khajiiti proverbs.2 -
itsBishop✭✭✭whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »Alot of people are crying about the change in Crit,
well in the Champion System there are two Constellations under the Mage,
the Apprentice and the Ritual.
When you place 30 CP (Champion Points) into the Apprentice you get a passive called Spell Precision which adds to your base Spell Critical getting a extra 12%.
PIC- http://deltiasgaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Apprentice.jpg
When you place 30 CP into the Ritual you get a passive called Perfect Stike which adds to your base Weapon Critical getting a extra 12%.
PIC- http://deltiasgaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Ritual.jpg
So with Champion points you can raise your Spell Crit or Weapon Crit with your base of 10% plus the 12% from these passives to 22% not including gear and other things (abilities and other passives that give Crit, etc).
I figured I would add this since I didn't see anyone tell anyone about these passives, your welcome, and thanks to Deltia for making the screenshots of the Champion System..
*facepalm*
We're well aware that the crit can be made up through other bonuses in the cp system. What were discussing here is whether the reductions to the crit percentage provided by trial sets is too extreme such that it renders the sets worthless in 1.6. An alternative would be to replace the stunted crit values with equivalent spell damage or magicka buffs.
Please at least read a few posts before bringing up an orthogonal argument that's already been addressed here numerous times.Edited by itsBishop on February 4, 2015 11:06PMPurple
World Record SO - 27m 38s
NA First SO Speedrun Achievement7 -
Yusuf✭✭✭✭✭The *** whine about the whiners club joins yet another thread. Do you feel it's productive to whine about people "whining" because they don't like the changes? This is the *** PTS forum, this is where we feedback things, if that doesn't suit you then just go somewhere else.
Honestly, I don't care whether I can complete the content if I don't want anything from the content. In case you haven't noticed MMOs are about character progression, and itemization is part of that progression. If they up and remove my progression and also remove the possibility to progress through raiding, then obviously I will quit playing.
That's why we're here in the PTS forum, in case you're just completely oblivious, to tell them that we don't appreciate these changes. If they decide that our opinion is not as valuable as some ultra-casuals who like whining about people's (legitimate, because it's an issue to us/them) complaints, then they will go ahead and launch it.
We complain because we care. I'd like to continue playing this game after 1.6, but in it's current state I will not. If you don't have anything to contribute to the subject, then get the *** out of this thread.
Also, this does not apply to comments that have even the tiniest bit of relevance/feedback, but those who just can't get enough of telling people they aren't allowed to complain.
^This times 1000.
Currently the trials don't offer anything worth the hassle anymore.
Sacrificing 2 armor-slots for 1-2% crit simply isn't worth it and everyone would be better off wearing a crafted set that increases your damage-stats flat.
Now people up and say they did this because of the champion-system, well, it was meant to make us stronger and not even out the nerfs we got in the update!2 -
Yusuf✭✭✭✭✭whiteshadow711jppreub18_ESO wrote: »Alot of people are crying about the change in Crit,
well in the Champion System there are two Constellations under the Mage,
the Apprentice and the Ritual.
When you place 30 CP (Champion Points) into the Apprentice you get a passive called Spell Precision which adds to your base Spell Critical getting a extra 12%.
PIC- http://deltiasgaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Apprentice.jpg
When you place 30 CP into the Ritual you get a passive called Perfect Stike which adds to your base Weapon Critical getting a extra 12%.
PIC- http://deltiasgaming.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/Ritual.jpg
So with Champion points you can raise your Spell Crit or Weapon Crit with your base of 10% plus the 12% from these passives to 22% not including gear and other things (abilities and other passives that give Crit, etc).
I figured I would add this since I didn't see anyone tell anyone about these passives, your welcome, and thanks to Deltia for making the screenshots of the Champion System..
These passives don't magically make it worth wearing Aether-set again.5 -
Yusuf✭✭✭✭✭They have to figure something out because quite honestly, no trial is worth the trouble for the reward they are presenting at the time. Either bring back the old crit-values or replace them with flat spell/weapon damage.2
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Titansteele✭✭✭✭✭They have to figure something out because quite honestly, no trial is worth the trouble for the reward they are presenting at the time. Either bring back the old crit-values or replace them with flat spell/weapon damage.
This does seem to be an easy solution to a heated problemGuild Leader of The Twelve Knights, AD PVE, PVP and Trading Guild on the EU Mega Server
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger"0 -
fromtesonlineb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
So, you're hanging your argument on playing semantics over the word drop?Joy_Division wrote: »Yes. The person you are quoting specifically said "Over dropped gear. Not raid gear."
As far as I know this game doesn't have a 'token'-based barter system for gear, therefore all gear is 'dropped' in any meaningful sense of the word, INCLUDING IN RAIDS.
Edited by fromtesonlineb16_ESO on February 5, 2015 8:20AM2 -
Varicite✭✭✭✭✭
✭It is quite sad that vicious and aether will become vendor trash....
This isn't the first time the best sets in the game have become trash.
It won't be the last time.
When the Season gear comes out, you'll be trashing your former "best sets in the game" w/ pretty regular frequency.
Might as well get used to it, I guess.2 -
pppontus✭✭✭✭✭
✭It is quite sad that vicious and aether will become vendor trash....
This isn't the first time the best sets in the game have become trash.
It won't be the last time.
When the Season gear comes out, you'll be trashing your former "best sets in the game" w/ pretty regular frequency.
Might as well get used to it, I guess.
Imo it's one thing when sets get replaced with new better sets, another when sets are changed to be worse than existing easier-to-get sets
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rophez_ESO✭✭✭✭✭It is quite sad that vicious and aether will become vendor trash....
This isn't the first time the best sets in the game have become trash.
It won't be the last time.
When the Season gear comes out, you'll be trashing your former "best sets in the game" w/ pretty regular frequency.
Might as well get used to it, I guess.
Imo it's one thing when sets get replaced with new better sets, another when sets are changed to be worse than existing easier-to-get sets
So the trial gear is no longer the best for any build? Interesting.2 -
ginoboehm✭✭✭✭✭rophez_ESO wrote: »It is quite sad that vicious and aether will become vendor trash....
This isn't the first time the best sets in the game have become trash.
It won't be the last time.
When the Season gear comes out, you'll be trashing your former "best sets in the game" w/ pretty regular frequency.
Might as well get used to it, I guess.
Imo it's one thing when sets get replaced with new better sets, another when sets are changed to be worse than existing easier-to-get sets
So the trial gear is no longer the best for any build? Interesting.
Unfortunately not ....0 -
Yusuf✭✭✭✭✭It is quite sad that vicious and aether will become vendor trash....
This isn't the first time the best sets in the game have become trash.
It won't be the last time.
When the Season gear comes out, you'll be trashing your former "best sets in the game" w/ pretty regular frequency.
Might as well get used to it, I guess.
I thought "seasoned gear" meant that gear from the next season would be stronger than the previous one, not that each season they'd nerf the previous gear and introduce new gear that made no difference whether we'd have seasoned gear or not.
Just my 2 cents.Edited by Yusuf on February 5, 2015 9:59PM1 -
Varicite✭✭✭✭✭
✭It is quite sad that vicious and aether will become vendor trash....
This isn't the first time the best sets in the game have become trash.
It won't be the last time.
When the Season gear comes out, you'll be trashing your former "best sets in the game" w/ pretty regular frequency.
Might as well get used to it, I guess.
I thought "seasoned gear" meant that gear from the next season would be stronger than the previous one, not that each season they'd nerf the previous gear and introduce new gear that made no difference whether we'd have seasoned gear or not.
Just my 2 cents.
True.
And I thought that when ZOS said they were going to scale everything up 10x by adding a "0", that they would just scale everything up 10x by adding a 0.
What we think and what they'll actually do are completely different things.
I assume that, just like our stats, they nerfed the sets both because of the Champ system and because there are new sets in the works that they didn't want to make too powerful.
So instead, they probably nerfed the current endgame sets to make the new ones feel more powerful.
Complete speculation on my part, of course.0 -
Yusuf✭✭✭✭✭It is quite sad that vicious and aether will become vendor trash....
This isn't the first time the best sets in the game have become trash.
It won't be the last time.
When the Season gear comes out, you'll be trashing your former "best sets in the game" w/ pretty regular frequency.
Might as well get used to it, I guess.
I thought "seasoned gear" meant that gear from the next season would be stronger than the previous one, not that each season they'd nerf the previous gear and introduce new gear that made no difference whether we'd have seasoned gear or not.
Just my 2 cents.
True.
And I thought that when ZOS said they were going to scale everything up 10x by adding a "0", that they would just scale everything up 10x by adding a 0.
What we think and what they'll actually do are completely different things.
I assume that, just like our stats, they nerfed the sets both because of the Champ system and because there are new sets in the works that they didn't want to make too powerful.
So instead, they probably nerfed the current endgame sets to make the new ones feel more powerful.
Complete speculation on my part, of course.
I assume the same but i don't necessarily agree with it.0 -
Robbmrp✭✭✭✭✭
✭Hello all, with all discussions going back and forth I thought I would put this quote in from another thread. It was taken from the Sorcerer 1.6 thread.
The issue people are having is running dungeons and trials. With all of the changes that are taking place, SKILLED people are having a lot of trouble completing dungeons.
Another post I was reading was talking about how this patch could be the death of PUG Groups. MMO's live on PUG Groups. That's the whole point the Grouping Tool was created for. If people cannot get a PUG group and complete a Dungeon/Trial then there's a problem. These weren't created for only the elite guilds out there to complete in records speeds. They were put there for everyone to enjoy but that joy seems to be diminishing with this update.
These are the effects of the changes in 1.6 and are going to be experienced by everyone if a little balancing isn't worked out before moving Live.Dagoth_Rac wrote: »The group I ran Vet Wayrest and Vet Spindle with on PTS all had to respec/regear and add a lot of health to have any survivability in the dungeons.
Note that you get Health whenever you put a Champion Point in the Warrior, although it is diminishing returns. I think I got +87 health with first point, +42 health with second point, +34 health with third point, etc. Not sure of exact formula. But after a couple years of grinding out 1200 points in Warrior, we may be back to similar ratios of health.
Having to put concentration on health hurt damage and healing, but again there are Champion Points to increase damage and healing. And you do get magicka and stamina from each of their respective Champion constellations, which can help healing and DPS.
They definitely appear to have left enemy health and damage alone, but reduced player health and damage so that we could make it up from Champion Points.
But you will be significantly weaker as a VR14 with 70 Champion Points in Update 6 compared to an old-fashioned VR14 on Live. You will likely be unable to complete content in Update 6 you were previously able to complete without grinding out more Champion Points. Solo bosses in dungeons are not too bad. But trash groups and bosses with adds are very tough. For example, the first wave of little spiders in Praxin fight is far more difficult than Blood Spawn.
It is kind of understandable. If 70 Champion Points made us as powerful as Live, then we would be godlike once we had hundreds or thousands of Champion Points.
But with dungeons still scaling based on VR level and not how many Champion Points you have, the difficulty is bizarre. And not much fun. Are we going to have to run in circles in Spellscar for months until we gain enough Champion Points to be as powerful as we were and tackle daily quests we are used to completing?NA Server - Kildair1 -
Robbmrp✭✭✭✭✭
✭Here's the thread the quote was taken from.
about.http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/150240/5-pages-of-feedback-on-1-6-by-sigma-draconis-update-trial-videos/p1NA Server - Kildair0 -
angelyn✭✭✭✭
Also I've just done an enchant comparison:
I've done a comparison of basic stats and basic armour in this post, which shows what seems to be the rescaling situation.I've not worked out the scaling on some top sets but they could have scaled in a similar manner.Here are the summary sheets, which are also in original thread.LonePirate wrote: »There are certainly problems with gear stats in 1.6; but even if/when gear is fixed, your character is still going to be remarkably weaker for a very long time due to all of the rescaling that has happened.
TLDR- My calculations on a lv 3 character, on stats that affect all players. I'm not a mathematician so might not be 100%!This is only how the ratio seems to have scaled to me.
- Health scaled on 1:7 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina scaled on 1:9 Ratio
- Health Regen scaled on 1:11.5 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina Regen scaled on 1:11 Ratio
- Heavy/Medium Armour scaled on 1:4 Ratio
- Light Armour scaled on 1:2 Ratio
So we are now sitting at:
- Health scaled on 1:7 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina scaled on 1:9 Ratio
- Health Regen scaled on 1:11.5 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina Regen scaled on 1:11 Ratio
- Heavy/Medium Armour scaled on 1:4 Ratio
- Light Armour scaled on 1:2 Ratio
- Some mobs health scaled on a 1:7 Ratio
- Some mobs health scaled on a 1:9 Ratio
- Max Health Enchants scaled on a 1:5 Ratio
- Max Magicka/Stamina scaled on a 1:6 Ratio
- All recovery enchants scaled on a 1:3 Ratio
- Reduce cost enchants scaled up on a 1:8/9 Ratio
- Spell Resistance/Armour glyphs scaled on a 1:6 Ratio
- X resistance Glyphs (eg Fire Resistance) scaled on a 1:2 Ratio
- Spell/Weapon Damage Glyphs increased on a 1:2 Ratio
- General Damage enchants for weapons varied between 1:3 and 1:10 Ratio
Considering most mobs health levelled in a 1:7 and above ratio, our enchants seem to have scaled a lot less.
All comparisons can still be found in this thread.0 -
HeroOfNone✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Also I've just done an enchant comparison:
I've done a comparison of basic stats and basic armour in this post, which shows what seems to be the rescaling situation.I've not worked out the scaling on some top sets but they could have scaled in a similar manner.Here are the summary sheets, which are also in original thread.LonePirate wrote: »There are certainly problems with gear stats in 1.6; but even if/when gear is fixed, your character is still going to be remarkably weaker for a very long time due to all of the rescaling that has happened.TLDR- My calculations on a lv 3 character, on stats that affect all players. I'm not a mathematician so might not be 100%!This is only how the ratio seems to have scaled to me.
- Health scaled on 1:7 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina scaled on 1:9 Ratio
- Health Regen scaled on 1:11.5 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina Regen scaled on 1:11 Ratio
- Heavy/Medium Armour scaled on 1:4 Ratio
- Light Armour scaled on 1:2 Ratio
So we are now sitting at:
- Health scaled on 1:7 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina scaled on 1:9 Ratio
- Health Regen scaled on 1:11.5 Ratio
- Magicka/Stamina Regen scaled on 1:11 Ratio
- Heavy/Medium Armour scaled on 1:4 Ratio
- Light Armour scaled on 1:2 Ratio
- Some mobs health scaled on a 1:7 Ratio
- Some mobs health scaled on a 1:9 Ratio
- Max Health Enchants scaled on a 1:5 Ratio
- Max Magicka/Stamina scaled on a 1:6 Ratio
- All recovery enchants scaled on a 1:3 Ratio
- Reduce cost enchants scaled up on a 1:8/9 Ratio
- Spell Resistance/Armour glyphs scaled on a 1:6 Ratio
- X resistance Glyphs (eg Fire Resistance) scaled on a 1:2 Ratio
- Spell/Weapon Damage Glyphs increased on a 1:2 Ratio
- General Damage enchants for weapons varied between 1:3 and 1:10 Ratio
Considering most mobs health levelled in a 1:7 and above ratio, our enchants seem to have scaled a lot less.
All comparisons can still be found in this thread.
This still doesn't take into account the changes made to armor sets. Certain ones had abilities switched out or modified (imperium having a 2 piece and 3 piece bonus for example)
And it's also not taking into account some of the damage scaling (some folks seeing 20k-30k consistent dps builds)
I've still yet to see folks show something that shows this armor is "useless" in the new system compared to "this easy to get set". All sets should be viable in some way, however a lot of things changed to include different crit ratings and less ultimate generation.
So, what do you feel are the best armor sets in a 1.6 world, why are they better, and what are these sets lacking That they have? Has the aether set become useless but the Yokeda set is good? Is the 3 piece bonus on the medium serpent gear no long good with the stamina gear?
Change is tough I know, but I haven't seen much theory crafting with the new sets, just comparisons to what it used to be with mechanics from how it used to be...0 -
Those who criticises those that complain about the nerf to end game sets, have absolutely no idea what it takes to get one... it needs a lot of time and dedication, YOU HAVE NO IDEA how difficult it is to make a decent 12 people group able to tackle the trials and the amount of resources and money you waste on pots, this is supposed to be the creme de la creme of gear... it has to be better and it has to make you a bit op. Because then whats the point of the whole thing? In my opinion this is one of the biggest failures of the game, it has become a stick with a string and no carrot.3
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Varicite✭✭✭✭✭
✭henryabelarwb17_ESO wrote: »Those who criticises those that complain about the nerf to end game sets, have absolutely no idea what it takes to get one... it needs a lot of time and dedication, YOU HAVE NO IDEA how difficult it is to make a decent 12 people group able to tackle the trials and the amount of resources and money you waste on pots, this is supposed to be the creme de la creme of gear... it has to be better and it has to make you a bit op. Because then whats the point of the whole thing? In my opinion this is one of the biggest failures of the game, it has become a stick with a string and no carrot.
Well, in MMOs today, there are tons of casuals.
FAR MORE than are running hard mode Trials.
And they would also like a carrot for their stick.
And they are paying ZOS a whole lot more than you ever will.Edited by Varicite on February 6, 2015 1:53AM3 -
fromtesonlineb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭
The fact you're focusing on phat lewt indicates YOU HAVE NO IDEA what the majority of players play for: hint, it's not the e-peen.henryabelarwb17_ESO wrote: »Those who criticises those that complain about the nerf to end game sets, have absolutely no idea what it takes to get one... it needs a lot of time and dedication, YOU HAVE NO IDEA how difficult it is to make a decent 12 people group able to tackle the trials and the amount of resources and money you waste on pots, this is supposed to be the creme de la creme of gear... it has to be better and it has to make you a bit op. Because then whats the point of the whole thing? In my opinion this is one of the biggest failures of the game, it has become a stick with a string and no carrot.
@Varacite said what I was going to, I'll not bother repeating it.
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