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Myself? Worried after guild summit
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babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭starkerealm wrote: »I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Its probably the emphasis on crafting. I love the idea you have; but I suspect it is because I enjoy most aspects of the game including crafting. Hopefully with time we can see content like you describe being fleshed out and expanded. I think though in the short term we will see more bug fixes and PvP content (which isn't bad to be clear).
Content like I described will never happen if nobody talks about it. Right now that thread is buried, where it will stay unless people start getting active in there.
...because no one talks about the Mages or Fighter's Guild questlines?
Look, what you're describing, some of it, does happen in game right now. Group only players cannot get their hands on any of the guild questline sets. The ones that require traveling to Eyevea or The Earthen Forge (or whatever it's called.)
Those are single player exclusive sets.
You do get exclusive gear for running the single player content that exists. I mean the forced solo content.
So, I honestly don't know what you're saying unless you think we need more of that, in which case, no.
I'm not paying $15 a month for a version of Skyrim with an added chat box and very limited mod support. I was furious at Halls of Torment when I ran it the first time. Doing the guild quest lines waffled between annoying and inconsequential.
I like that there's stuff you can do solo, but if you're playing with someone else, you should never be forced to split up and try to tackle the same content separately. Never.
Because this is an MMO. The second M there stands for Multiplayer, in case there was some confusion. It is not a single player game with a monthly fee. While I'm happy to have stuff I can do alone. I'll say that again, that I can choose to do alone. I should never be told I can't join in with my friends.
My idea does not force solo play, which you'd know if you actually read it instead of just coming here to yell at me.1 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Its probably the emphasis on crafting. I love the idea you have; but I suspect it is because I enjoy most aspects of the game including crafting. Hopefully with time we can see content like you describe being fleshed out and expanded. I think though in the short term we will see more bug fixes and PvP content (which isn't bad to be clear).
Content like I described will never happen if nobody talks about it. Right now that thread is buried, where it will stay unless people start getting active in there.
...because no one talks about the Mages or Fighter's Guild questlines?
Look, what you're describing, some of it, does happen in game right now. Group only players cannot get their hands on any of the guild questline sets. The ones that require traveling to Eyevea or The Earthen Forge (or whatever it's called.)
Those are single player exclusive sets.
You do get exclusive gear for running the single player content that exists. I mean the forced solo content.
So, I honestly don't know what you're saying unless you think we need more of that, in which case, no.
I'm not paying $15 a month for a version of Skyrim with an added chat box and very limited mod support. I was furious at Halls of Torment when I ran it the first time. Doing the guild quest lines waffled between annoying and inconsequential.
I like that there's stuff you can do solo, but if you're playing with someone else, you should never be forced to split up and try to tackle the same content separately. Never.
Because this is an MMO. The second M there stands for Multiplayer, in case there was some confusion. It is not a single player game with a monthly fee. While I'm happy to have stuff I can do alone. I'll say that again, that I can choose to do alone. I should never be told I can't join in with my friends.
My idea does not force solo play, which you'd know if you actually read it instead of just coming here to yell at me.
I did read it. I also read this:Well my suggestion has to be "forced" solo play, to earn the rewards. Letting people group up would trivialise the content and wouldn't deserve the rewards.
At that point, no. Chuck it all on the fire and call it a day.
The problem is the game already trivializes the content. Go run Halls of Torment with a mage using Negate Magic and tell me you "earned" that fight. Now try it on a DW medium armor nightblade.Edited by starkerealm on October 13, 2014 2:08PM1 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭starkerealm wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Its probably the emphasis on crafting. I love the idea you have; but I suspect it is because I enjoy most aspects of the game including crafting. Hopefully with time we can see content like you describe being fleshed out and expanded. I think though in the short term we will see more bug fixes and PvP content (which isn't bad to be clear).
Content like I described will never happen if nobody talks about it. Right now that thread is buried, where it will stay unless people start getting active in there.
...because no one talks about the Mages or Fighter's Guild questlines?
Look, what you're describing, some of it, does happen in game right now. Group only players cannot get their hands on any of the guild questline sets. The ones that require traveling to Eyevea or The Earthen Forge (or whatever it's called.)
Those are single player exclusive sets.
You do get exclusive gear for running the single player content that exists. I mean the forced solo content.
So, I honestly don't know what you're saying unless you think we need more of that, in which case, no.
I'm not paying $15 a month for a version of Skyrim with an added chat box and very limited mod support. I was furious at Halls of Torment when I ran it the first time. Doing the guild quest lines waffled between annoying and inconsequential.
I like that there's stuff you can do solo, but if you're playing with someone else, you should never be forced to split up and try to tackle the same content separately. Never.
Because this is an MMO. The second M there stands for Multiplayer, in case there was some confusion. It is not a single player game with a monthly fee. While I'm happy to have stuff I can do alone. I'll say that again, that I can choose to do alone. I should never be told I can't join in with my friends.
My idea does not force solo play, which you'd know if you actually read it instead of just coming here to yell at me.
I did read it. I also read this:Well my suggestion has to be "forced" solo play, to earn the rewards. Letting people group up would trivialise the content and wouldn't deserve the rewards.
At that point, no. Chuck it all on the fire and call it a day.
Magically you pick out things without reading everything there.
Later I progressed the idea to include people who want to group, which again, you'd know if you actually read the linked thread.Also given some consideration to how ZOS might be able to ensure they can make the solo crafting quest series + endboss system challenging without being impossible for certain builds.
To balance quests and endboss for solo players (who might be good at healing but have no dps or defence, or might be good at tanking but have no dps or healing, or might be good at dps but have no healing or defence), they could add in an NPC who you choose to take with you through to the endboss. There could be a choice of three different NPC companions you could bring with you (one dps type, one healer type, one tank type). That way any solo player would be able to take some backup who is strong in the area they're weak in, so the whole thing is okay for any kind of player to achieve, with some effort.
Basically so that ZOS can make the quest series and endboss difficult but achieveable for any solo player.
Also seen some concerns on having "forced" solo content.
In this case the content I suggested was "forced" solo content in order to earn the rewards (chances at learning new crafting sets and recipes etc).
Having people steamroll through this in groups would trivialise the content, which brings up the point that people don't actually earn the rewards and don't "need" the good gear they'd be learning by doing these quests. But if the content was, as above, balanced for a solo player + NPC companion then it seems possible to ditch the NPC companion and bring a real player in its place. And if they wanted more than one friend in there for social purposes, maybe just allow players to do the content for fun, without the chance of rewards/researchable set item drops/recipe drops (in whatever form they all take).0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭LonePirate wrote: »Nox_Aeterna wrote: »You can get to VR14 by doing PvP. Is it going to take longer? Sure, but it's still entirely feasible. In fact, you can get to VR14 just grinding mobs outside Craglorn as well, and they're making leveling up even easier next patch (Veteran Points converted to normal XP).
You can't realistically expect an MMO to focus primarily on solo player content. MMO stands for Massive Multiplayer Online.
There are many other departments that currently need just as much attention, if not more than singleplayer content; such as end game PvE and especially PvP.
That said, they are bringing in stuff that'll be interesting for solo players, since those are a reasonably large group as well (it's an Elder Scrolls game after all).- Solo PvE Arena was mentioned in the latest ESO Live I believe.
- Crafting writs are coming next patch, rewarding you with a recipe upon completion.
- A whole zone called Wrothgar, designed for singleplayer is coming soon(tm).
This, along with the fact that most of the game (apart from end game) is tailored for solo (there are no "elite mobs" or anything that'd require a group outside grp dungeons...).
I wont even bother answer the first part of your post , it was already done at this point thousands of times.
Outside that , endgame is probably the most important part in a MMO , that simple.
Sure it takes a long time to reach it in ESO , that is why i said now is that many are even getting to VR10 heh. But the point is , you get there and once you get to VR10 the solo content ends.
Cyro is PvP , which has nothing to do with PvE players , and if grinding mobs is what the game wants us to do , i can mention a very , very long list of korean MMOs that allow you to do that for free from lvl 1 heh :P.
And ofc like you said they said a solo zone will be added , a pity that like so many other things in this game that remains in the future , a future that considering the other many , many big update features that also have to be added even before it , one can say what? In the best case march next year? And that is in the best case.
So many months of nothing to do hardly keeps players also :P.- Solo PvE Arena was mentioned in the latest ESO Live I believe.
- Crafting writs are coming next patch, rewarding you with a recipe upon completion.
Nice how you ignored these completely.
Not sure what you're expecting to be honest. Them to scrap Imperial City for 1.6 & implement more solo content instead? I'm quite sure the PvP folks wouldn't like that.
What should ZOS do that would help the situation? Some constructive feedback would do wonders for your argument.
First, I don't think the solo arena was confirmed. It was merely discussed as a possibility. It certainly is not playable content any time soon.
Second, the crafting writ quests are non-combat quests. That is perfectly fine as they serve as nice part-time jobs for players; but they do not offer much of a challenge or allow one to hone or practice or experiment with skills.
Well, I'm sorry that particular solo content doesn't appeal to you. As someone else mentioned, they're restructuring all the delves in the game, maybe this would be something that interests you? 18 Delves will be improved next patch.LonePirate wrote: »As for constructive feedback, all quests and delves in Craglorn and in every future new zone including Murkmire and Wrothgar should scale to the number of players in your group if ZOS doesn't want to make them public instead of instanced. If I want to solo a quest or delve, this allow me to do so. If I want to tackle it with a group of three, then I can do that as well.
Solo players like myself simply want a compromise that is fair for everyone. Group players do not want to share and want content for them and no one else. Which side do you think is the better one for ZOS to choose when creating new content?
The problem with your suggestion is, that it has multiple technical difficulties & several fundamental ones.
For instance, how are you going to incentivize people to do it in a group? There is a reason why people complained about lack of group content during leveling (after launch there were big topics on this). In other words, if you can do it solo, why bother to get a group at all?
Second problem would be having someone enter a delve, mobs scaled to his level & then inviting people to the group. Would the mobs somehow automatically scale infront of your eyes, or would you risk people being able to faceroll through solo scaled mobs with a group of 4?
These are just a couple of examples of issues this kind of scaling would have.
I'd just be patient and wait for Wrothgar, like PvPers are being (well, more or less...) patient waiting for PvP fixes & IC and PvErs are being patient waiting for itemization fixes.
After all, how many MMOs these days release whole zones as solo content, without them being a part of an expansion?
Another concern is that they might raise VR caps again with these new zones, but I fear that is off-topic so I won't ramble more about them...I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.2 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.Edited by babylon on October 13, 2014 2:13PM0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
I'm sorry, but that's just a, "if they do it right it'll be perfect," response. It's hard enough to balance one encounter. Again, harvester fights for a solo player are a fantastic example, and the game does feel quite comfortable with throwing those at us.
Adding the option for NPC followers just screws the whole, "no you gotta do it alone" line of thought, at a conceptual level. It was part of the thing with the main quest that never sat right with me.
And, seriously, how do you distinguish between a DPSer and a Tank, especially when you've also got this DPSer over here who's discovered how to completely trivialize the heal boss?
I have honestly seen MMOs that tried this, it does not work.Edited by starkerealm on October 13, 2014 2:21PM2 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »Because this is an MMO. The second M there stands for Multiplayer, in case there was some confusion. It is not a single player game with a monthly fee. While I'm happy to have stuff I can do alone. I'll say that again, that I can choose to do alone. I should never be told I can't join in with my friends.
You seem to be conflating multiplayer content with grouped content. The two terms are not synonymous. The world bosses and dolmens are multiplayer content in that several players can play the same content at the same time without being grouped. The Craglorn quests and delves along with the Undaunted dungeons and trials are group content in that you must be grouped with your friends if you want to play them together. You seem to want more of the latter even though more of the former would work for you and eliminate any hypocrisy or selfishness as well.
For the record, I believe the game should allow grouping for the Main ashes, the Fighters Guild and the Mages Guild quest lines. I also think all Craglorn and Undaunted content should scale to the number of players in your party, be it 1 or 4 or 12 or 24 or whatever.0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭starkerealm wrote: »I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
I'm sorry, but that's just a, "if they do it right it'll be perfect," response. It's hard enough to balance one encounter. Again, harvester fights for a solo player are a fantastic example, and the game does feel quite comfortable with throwing those at us.
Adding the option for NPC followers just screws the whole, "no you gotta do it alone" line of thought, at a conceptual level. It was part of the thing with the main quest that never sat right with me.
And, seriously, how do you distinguish between a DPSer and a Tank, especially when you've also got this DPSer over here who's discovered how to completely trivialize the heal boss?
I have honestly seen MMOs that tried this, it does not work.
It's obvious you haven't read the thread at all.
I suggested balancing to player + one NPC companion, of your choice (healer NPC, tank NPC, or dps NPC), to balance against player weakness in any area. Or they could bring a friend in the NPC's place. The balancing is to make it challenging, without being impossible, if the player is putting in good effort. This means the player will earn their right to learn new sets (crafted sets) to research.
The balancing in this way would work well.
Edited by babylon on October 13, 2014 2:27PM0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭starkerealm wrote: »I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
I'm sorry, but that's just a, "if they do it right it'll be perfect," response. It's hard enough to balance one encounter. Again, harvester fights for a solo player are a fantastic example, and the game does feel quite comfortable with throwing those at us.
Adding the option for NPC followers just screws the whole, "no you gotta do it alone" line of thought, at a conceptual level. It was part of the thing with the main quest that never sat right with me.
And, seriously, how do you distinguish between a DPSer and a Tank, especially when you've also got this DPSer over here who's discovered how to completely trivialize the heal boss?
I have honestly seen MMOs that tried this, it does not work.
It's obvious you haven't read the thread at all.
I suggested balancing to player + one NPC companion, of your choice (healer NPC, tank NPC, or dps NPC), to balance against player weakness in any area. Or they could bring a friend in the NPC's place.
The balancing in this way would work well.
Based on what? We've both played the game, I'm assuming. We've both seen the "caliber" of NPC allies we can get for various quests. How is ZoS supposed to take the systems that already exist in the game and magically balance them so they work properly?0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭starkerealm wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
I'm sorry, but that's just a, "if they do it right it'll be perfect," response. It's hard enough to balance one encounter. Again, harvester fights for a solo player are a fantastic example, and the game does feel quite comfortable with throwing those at us.
Adding the option for NPC followers just screws the whole, "no you gotta do it alone" line of thought, at a conceptual level. It was part of the thing with the main quest that never sat right with me.
And, seriously, how do you distinguish between a DPSer and a Tank, especially when you've also got this DPSer over here who's discovered how to completely trivialize the heal boss?
I have honestly seen MMOs that tried this, it does not work.
It's obvious you haven't read the thread at all.
I suggested balancing to player + one NPC companion, of your choice (healer NPC, tank NPC, or dps NPC), to balance against player weakness in any area. Or they could bring a friend in the NPC's place.
The balancing in this way would work well.
Based on what? We've both played the game, I'm assuming. We've both seen the "caliber" of NPC allies we can get for various quests. How is ZoS supposed to take the systems that already exist in the game and magically balance them so they work properly?
How are they supposed to...?
It's far from impossible. Are you saying ZOS can't do this?
If you feel unable to solo things then maybe you're not a solo player and should really group up so you can be propped up by the good playing of others. Maybe...solo play really isn't for you at an endgame level. But there are a lot of solo players who would enjoy play at an endgame level, and that's what my idea is designed to provide for us.Edited by babylon on October 13, 2014 2:33PM0 -
KingRebz✭✭✭Man I got 88 lols in one discussion about making the game better lol..V14 Sorceror [Ebonheart]0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LonePirate wrote: »starkerealm wrote: »Because this is an MMO. The second M there stands for Multiplayer, in case there was some confusion. It is not a single player game with a monthly fee. While I'm happy to have stuff I can do alone. I'll say that again, that I can choose to do alone. I should never be told I can't join in with my friends.
You seem to be conflating multiplayer content with grouped content.
No, I'm actually not.LonePirate wrote: »The two terms are not synonymous. The world bosses and dolmens are multiplayer content in that several players can play the same content at the same time without being grouped.
You actually forgot delves in there.LonePirate wrote: »The Craglorn quests and delves along with the Undaunted dungeons and trials are group content in that you must be grouped with your friends if you want to play them together.
Oh, wait, no, I see you didn't. Thing is Delves are actually supposed to be solo content. You can choose to bring friends with you, but they're balanced to be done alone.
That's what I'm advocating, by the way. Not more dolmens, not more undaunted, not more craglorn style "you must be in a team" informal dungeons pretending to be delves. More content that can be done solo but doesn't lock your friends outside until you're done. Which is exactly what Babylon is begging for here.LonePirate wrote: »You seem to want more of the latter even though more of the former would work for you and eliminate any hypocrisy or selfishness as well.
I'm talking about not gating off content because you have the misfortune of knowing people. I'm talking about not creating an arbitrary wall "because 'reasons'" where you go into an area to deal with a thing and your friends are left with their noses against the glass.
And, note: I'm saying "friends," as in people I actually know, and want to spend time with, not random PUG members I'm forced to drag along with me, because I can't advance without them.LonePirate wrote: »For the record, I believe the game should allow grouping for the Main ashes, the Fighters Guild and the Mages Guild quest lines. I also think all Craglorn and Undaunted content should scale to the number of players in your party, be it 1 or 4 or 12 or 24 or whatever.
I'm not sure if I'd want to see the game try to handle scaling for your team. Systems like that are incredibly hard to balance, usually. I am fine with the Undaunted content, even though I haven't done most of it, because it is a good thing to stick out there and say, "here, work together for a prize." It's a nice extra, and they're not part of the story, so it's all optional.
What I hate, and what Babylon seems to be demanding is more content that actively punishes me because I actually used a Pledge of Mara and play along side my girlfriend. And, I'm sorry, I've had enough of that crap from Funcom and Cryptic.
That said, I do loathe Craglorn, on principle. Simply because keeping a group together long enough to clear it is going to be an utter pain in the ass.
EDIT: and we are in complete agreement on the guild questlines and the main quest, for whatever that's worth.Edited by starkerealm on October 13, 2014 3:02PM1 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭starkerealm wrote: »
That's what I'm advocating, by the way. Not more dolmens, not more undaunted, not more craglorn style "you must be in a team" informal dungeons pretending to be delves. More content that can be done solo but doesn't lock your friends outside until you're done. Which is exactly what Babylon is begging for here.
Stop making stuff up, that's NOT what I am advocating at all. I have stated over and over again I am suggesting a solo experience with the quest series + endboss balanced to one player + companion (NPC of choice OR a real player).
Again, anyone with some sense and an open mind, read this - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Trying to offer up a good solution to a solo player endgame, and I really do think I've nailed it here.0 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
I have thrown out several improvement ideas in the past.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/106935/my-proposal-for-overhauling-veteran-content
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/130558/build-your-gear-vendors-needed
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/129214/hey-zos-here-is-how-you-need-to-design-new-end-game-zones
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/126138/add-daily-quests-related-to-dark-anchors-and-world-bosses
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/112038/daily-vr-level-quest-idea
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babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭LonePirate wrote: »
I have thrown out several improvement ideas in the past.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/106935/my-proposal-for-overhauling-veteran-content
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/130558/build-your-gear-vendors-needed
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/129214/hey-zos-here-is-how-you-need-to-design-new-end-game-zones
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/126138/add-daily-quests-related-to-dark-anchors-and-world-bosses
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/112038/daily-vr-level-quest-idea
Nice, well have a look at my idea (and how I've progressed it) if you would.
What I'm trying to do is give a dedicated solo player endgame experience, with solid activity (not sideline activity like fishing or etc) and proper rewards at an endgame level, given for effort and time spent doing this activity - with continued crafting sets getting added to the game.Edited by babylon on October 13, 2014 2:53PM0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
I did read your thread and my concerns still stand valid (in fact, there's even more of them now).
Firstly, why would people do group content for the best stuff, if they can solo it much easier?
Secondly, how long would that research time be? An ideal end game raid (atleast according to me) should take anywhere between 2-5 months to clear with daily raids, not two weeks or 2 days. If people can do the solo content in 2-3 days and then research for a month for equal gear, that would hardly be fair. Then again, if you make something have a 6 month research, that'd hardly be fair (or fun) either, considering there'd probably be another raid tier released during that time period (with better loot than what you're currently researching). In short: balance issues.
Thirdly, the reason that good gear is so exalted, is because not everyone has access to it. If you make all solo players have access to it in a few days (+research), it hardly is anything "special" anymore, just something you get after x hours & little effort.
You could make this researchable gear a rare drop from the boss (assuming the crafting quests were repeatable), but that'd make it more RNG than time+effort in the end & would lead to more frustration.
My verdict: Too many balance issues. If they nailed the difficulty of these solo bosses, so that it took 4-5 months of "solo raiding" it could work, but otherwise it'd only discourage people from running the normal raids (since they could get equal rewards solo, without the chance someone else messes up).1 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭How are they supposed to...?
That's my question.It's far from impossible. Are you saying ZOS can't do this?
Are you saying you've seen any evidence that they're willing to, or even capable?
Again, there's at least five Harvesters as solo bosses. This is an enemy with an entire move set built around team mechanics. One player gets stunned, and then four orbs are produced moving towards her, that will heal her if they get to her. Players are expected to snuff the orbs, which requires some scrambling or specific AoE attacks. But, they're dumped into forced solo instances. In a couple cases you're given NPC allies that are semi-useful in the fight as an impromptu meat shield, but that's about it.If you feel unable to solo things then maybe you're not a solo player and should really group up so you can be propped up by the good playing of others.
Good, attack me and my skill as a player. That's relevant. Because the part where I might find playing alongside someone else to be fun, and being told, "nope, you do this separately for no articulate reason," isn't.Maybe...solo play really isn't for you at an endgame level.
Hasn't been an issue yet. I did Cold Harbour, and almost all of the VR1-5 content by myself (not counting dungeons, because I still haven't gotten around to them.) To be fair, I didn't do the delve in Bangkorai with all those storm atronochs alone, but it wasn't an intentional choice, someone else was running it at the same time. My biggest issue lately has been trying to get a level 12 through Hircine's Gift, because doing it at 16 isn't that much of a challenge with the right gear, really.But there are a lot of solo players who would enjoy play at an endgame level, and that's what my idea is designed to provide for us.
No. From everything I've read, your idea is to punish players who enjoy doing solo content with their friends. It's different. Maybe you had some genius insight somewhere in there, but everything I've seen is, "no, punish those players who actually group up for content because that makes it way too easy."
I read enough of what you posted there to get an idea of what you were saying. I'm not impressed.1 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
Firstly, why would people do group content for the best stuff, if they can solo it much easier?
Secondly, how long would that research time be?
Thirdly, the reason that good gear is so exalted, is because not everyone has access to it. If you make all solo players have access to it in a few days (+research), it hardly is anything "special" anymore, just something you get after x hours & little effort.
It won't be "much easier". It will be good, solid, hard content, but like raids, far from impossible. Some of the challenge comes from mob difficulty, some comes from the gambling nature of not knowing if the thing you want will drop, and some comes from the time it takes to research the set pieces. To do this activity will require time, effort, and dedication - all things any good endgame activity requires.
Solo players are looking for an endgame, and should not be forced into grouping in order to have an endgame and find rewards and participate in the economy. Everyone will do what they prefer doing, if all content is provided for the three playstyles (solo, group, pvp) and is of relatively equal difficulty and relatively equal reward.
Research time, as we know, takes now around 30 days PER ITEM. On top of that you don't know you'll get the item you need to research, because the endboss might not drop it - same as in a raid. People don't get frustrated and give up when they don't get their drops in a raid, same will go for a solo player and how they tackle their endgame. Solo players are not mentally weaker than group players, and I hope that isn't anything you'd suggest. Anyway, that all should mean sets will take many, many months for a player to learn.
And again, it will not take "a few days", so none of your worries stand. I have already addressed all your fears and provided good solutions, and can't see any drawbacks at all, at the point my idea has now progressed to.Edited by babylon on October 13, 2014 3:13PM0 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭starkerealm wrote: »From everything I've read, your idea is to punish players who enjoy doing solo content with their friends.
I have stated repeatedly people can play it solo or with a friend. Obviously with an endgame activity it has to be balanced TO SOMETHING, and in my idea it is balanced to one solo player + one companion (NPC of their choice - healer/tank/dps) OR a real friend). If it's group activity you are actually wanting, ZOS does provide this already. The point of my idea is to offer a solo player endgame, which does not exist, and again, it needs to be balanced to something in order for a player to earn rewards.
You keep ignoring this and keep repeating yourself, making it pointless to continue discussion with you as it's clear you do not listen.
This will be the last time I address you.
Edited by babylon on October 13, 2014 3:18PM2 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
I did read your thread and my concerns still stand valid (in fact, there's even more of them now).
Firstly, why would people do group content for the best stuff, if they can solo it much easier?
Secondly, how long would that research time be? An ideal end game raid (atleast according to me) should take anywhere between 2-5 months to clear with daily raids, not two weeks or 2 days. If people can do the solo content in 2-3 days and then research for a month for equal gear, that would hardly be fair. Then again, if you make something have a 6 month research, that'd hardly be fair (or fun) either, considering there'd probably be another raid tier released during that time period (with better loot than what you're currently researching). In short: balance issues.
Thirdly, the reason that good gear is so exalted, is because not everyone has access to it. If you make all solo players have access to it in a few days (+research), it hardly is anything "special" anymore, just something you get after x hours & little effort.
You could make this researchable gear a rare drop from the boss (assuming the crafting quests were repeatable), but that'd make it more RNG than time+effort in the end & would lead to more frustration.
My verdict: Too many balance issues. If they nailed the difficulty of these solo bosses, so that it took 4-5 months of "solo raiding" it could work, but otherwise it'd only discourage people from running the normal raids (since they could get equal rewards solo, without the chance someone else messes up).
In all of this, you failed to make the case for why the best gear and the highest level content needs to be available to groups only. Why should only groups be able to obtain this gear? Shouldn't the experience, mechanics and fun from playing with a group be sufficient? What difference does it make if the same gear drops from a solo boss or drops from a group boss?
If you play in a group more for the gear than for the fun of playing with your friends, then either you or ZOS is doing it wrong.
Edited by LonePirate on October 13, 2014 3:40PM2 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭LonePirate wrote: »I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
I did read your thread and my concerns still stand valid (in fact, there's even more of them now).
Firstly, why would people do group content for the best stuff, if they can solo it much easier?
Secondly, how long would that research time be? An ideal end game raid (atleast according to me) should take anywhere between 2-5 months to clear with daily raids, not two weeks or 2 days. If people can do the solo content in 2-3 days and then research for a month for equal gear, that would hardly be fair. Then again, if you make something have a 6 month research, that'd hardly be fair (or fun) either, considering there'd probably be another raid tier released during that time period (with better loot than what you're currently researching). In short: balance issues.
Thirdly, the reason that good gear is so exalted, is because not everyone has access to it. If you make all solo players have access to it in a few days (+research), it hardly is anything "special" anymore, just something you get after x hours & little effort.
You could make this researchable gear a rare drop from the boss (assuming the crafting quests were repeatable), but that'd make it more RNG than time+effort in the end & would lead to more frustration.
My verdict: Too many balance issues. If they nailed the difficulty of these solo bosses, so that it took 4-5 months of "solo raiding" it could work, but otherwise it'd only discourage people from running the normal raids (since they could get equal rewards solo, without the chance someone else messes up).
In all of this, you failed to make the case for why the best gear and the highest level content needs to be available to groups only? Why should only groups be able to obtain this gear? Shouldn't the experience, mechanics and fun from play with a group be sufficient? What difference does it make if the same gear drops from a solo boss as drops from a group boss?
If you play in a group more for the gear than for the fun of playing with your friends, then you or ZOS is doing it wrong.
Sorry, honest question, but is the best gear really group gated? I mean, on one hand, they get the cool unique looking stuff. But, on the other, I'm constantly hearing people complain about how terrible the traits are, or how it would be better if it was just in a different armor type. So, I'm left asking, is this a real, "group gear is the best," or is it just a perception of they're getting a neat thing?
EDIT: The best gear being gated to group content is usually a concession for PUGs. (Specifically in other MMOs.) It's a lot easier to get strangers to work together for a special carrot, then for something they could get by being anti-social and playing on their own. So, you dangle good rewards out there to entice them into the group. The hard part comes in making sure those rewards are good enough to get a group going, but not so good that everyone else feels completely shafted for not getting them.Edited by starkerealm on October 13, 2014 3:32PM1 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
Firstly, why would people do group content for the best stuff, if they can solo it much easier?
Secondly, how long would that research time be?
Thirdly, the reason that good gear is so exalted, is because not everyone has access to it. If you make all solo players have access to it in a few days (+research), it hardly is anything "special" anymore, just something you get after x hours & little effort.
It won't be "much easier". It will be good, solid, hard content, but like raids, far from impossible. Some of the challenge comes from mob difficulty, some comes from the gambling nature of not knowing if the thing you want will drop, and some comes from the time it takes to research the set pieces. To do this activity will require time, effort, and dedication - all things any good endgame activity requires.
Solo players are looking for an endgame, and should not be forced into grouping in order to have an endgame and find rewards and participate in the economy. Everyone will do what they prefer doing, if all content is provided for the three playstyles (solo, group, pvp) and is of relatively equal difficulty and relatively equal reward.
Research time, as we know, takes now around 30 days PER ITEM. On top of that you don't know you'll get the item you need to research, because the endboss might not drop it - same as in a raid. People don't get frustrated and give up when they don't get their drops in a raid, same will go for a solo player and how they tackle their endgame. Solo players are not mentally weaker than group players, and I hope that isn't anything you'd suggest. Anyway, that all should mean sets will take many, many months for a player to learn.
And again, it will not take "a few days", so none of your worries stand. I have already addressed all your fears and provided good solutions, and can't see any drawbacks at all, at the point my idea has now progressed to.
I'm still not convinced...
As mentioned before, having 12 players do the right thing at the right time is much more difficult than just having one person do so. This would likely lead to very skilled individuals being able to complete these "solo raids" very quickly, unless there was a lot of gear checks along the way, which would in turn require the other bosses in this "Crafting Quest" line have good drops.
Also you would have to account the extra month required for being able to craft that gear, and either make it easier (one month earlier completion time), which would make it require less effort than normal raiding (one month less wiping), or you could not take it into account & have it take one month longer than normal raiding to acquire the gear (possibly trivializing it by the time you get it).
Also, what about class balance? Currently, certain classes/specs would be able to faceroll through the content while others would struggle. In group PvE this isn't much of an issue, because every class is needed for something (Veil, Negate, Nova etcetc).
Having an NPC companion as you discussed in your thread would hardly fix it, unless you implement some kind of super AI, which knows exactly what to do & when. I can imagine having some stupid AI run after melee mobs instead of healing you or interrupting casters could lead to some frustrations...
There are a lot of drawbacks to your system, you just might not have thought about them yet
Edited by DDuke on October 13, 2014 3:35PM3 -
babylon✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
Firstly, why would people do group content for the best stuff, if they can solo it much easier?
Secondly, how long would that research time be?
Thirdly, the reason that good gear is so exalted, is because not everyone has access to it. If you make all solo players have access to it in a few days (+research), it hardly is anything "special" anymore, just something you get after x hours & little effort.
It won't be "much easier". It will be good, solid, hard content, but like raids, far from impossible. Some of the challenge comes from mob difficulty, some comes from the gambling nature of not knowing if the thing you want will drop, and some comes from the time it takes to research the set pieces. To do this activity will require time, effort, and dedication - all things any good endgame activity requires.
Solo players are looking for an endgame, and should not be forced into grouping in order to have an endgame and find rewards and participate in the economy. Everyone will do what they prefer doing, if all content is provided for the three playstyles (solo, group, pvp) and is of relatively equal difficulty and relatively equal reward.
Research time, as we know, takes now around 30 days PER ITEM. On top of that you don't know you'll get the item you need to research, because the endboss might not drop it - same as in a raid. People don't get frustrated and give up when they don't get their drops in a raid, same will go for a solo player and how they tackle their endgame. Solo players are not mentally weaker than group players, and I hope that isn't anything you'd suggest. Anyway, that all should mean sets will take many, many months for a player to learn.
And again, it will not take "a few days", so none of your worries stand. I have already addressed all your fears and provided good solutions, and can't see any drawbacks at all, at the point my idea has now progressed to.
I'm still not convinced...
As mentioned before, having 12 players do the right thing at the right time is much more difficult than just having one person do so. This would likely lead to very skilled individuals being able to complete these "solo raids" very quickly, unless there was a lot of gear checks along the way, which would in turn require the other bosses in this "Crafting Quest" line have good drops.
Also, what about class balance?
The content just needs to be tricky without using full range of mechanics, which the NPC companion of the player's choice, or their friend, will cover any shortfall in the player's own skill selection.
The player will be earning these recipes/set gear items for research and so on, which will allow some progression as well as they go through the quests and get to learn more sets and recipes/etc.
As for time, each item takes 30 days or so - so to get full sets will take much longer than raiders take to get their own gear, in many ways making the content even more worthy of the rewards they get. Different endgames for different situations, meaning the way players earn their rewards are different, and that's okay.
Pvp players for example earn rewards not through playing well, but through playing a long time, and that's considered acceptable. A solo player in this vision will earn their rewards both through playing a long time (working though quests and endboss and having chances at drops, same as dungeon grinders do) and through playing well (finding the right ways to beat the endboss, same as dungeon grinders do), and added on top of this is the research time needed to learn set items (which continues the crafting system and keeps it current so long as the game is running, tying all activities in together nicely), which I think easily covers all concerns anyone might have about them having earned their rewards.
Edited by babylon on October 13, 2014 3:46PM0 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I wrote up a really elegant solution to solo player endgame, and can't even get people to look at it. No idea why. Take a look if any of you solo players and crafters are genuinely looking at making something happen - Crafting Quests - Solo Player Endgame
Your idea is good if balanced correctly, but a nightmare if balanced poorly. Can you imagine everyone (or certain % of population) having access to the best gear in 2-3 days? There are some skilled individuals out there, and while it's difficult to get 12 players together who do everything correctly, content like you're proposing wouldn't be that difficult for that one skilled individual.
I've not yet seen a game pull off that level of solo content, but that doesn't mean it isn't possible. Sounds a little bit too risky to me though.
My idea is that people get a chance at gaining drops from the endboss after doing a quest series (each time, a series of quests working up to the endboss), that they would need to research first, so not only does it take time for the drops to happen, but they need to research the set items first, which will take a lot of time, so nobody will have sets after a couple of days. It will take real endgame time and effort to get these sets together.
Do read the thread, and comment on it after reading.
Firstly, why would people do group content for the best stuff, if they can solo it much easier?
Secondly, how long would that research time be?
Thirdly, the reason that good gear is so exalted, is because not everyone has access to it. If you make all solo players have access to it in a few days (+research), it hardly is anything "special" anymore, just something you get after x hours & little effort.
It won't be "much easier". It will be good, solid, hard content, but like raids, far from impossible. Some of the challenge comes from mob difficulty, some comes from the gambling nature of not knowing if the thing you want will drop, and some comes from the time it takes to research the set pieces. To do this activity will require time, effort, and dedication - all things any good endgame activity requires.
Solo players are looking for an endgame, and should not be forced into grouping in order to have an endgame and find rewards and participate in the economy. Everyone will do what they prefer doing, if all content is provided for the three playstyles (solo, group, pvp) and is of relatively equal difficulty and relatively equal reward.
Research time, as we know, takes now around 30 days PER ITEM. On top of that you don't know you'll get the item you need to research, because the endboss might not drop it - same as in a raid. People don't get frustrated and give up when they don't get their drops in a raid, same will go for a solo player and how they tackle their endgame. Solo players are not mentally weaker than group players, and I hope that isn't anything you'd suggest. Anyway, that all should mean sets will take many, many months for a player to learn.
And again, it will not take "a few days", so none of your worries stand. I have already addressed all your fears and provided good solutions, and can't see any drawbacks at all, at the point my idea has now progressed to.
I'm still not convinced...
As mentioned before, having 12 players do the right thing at the right time is much more difficult than just having one person do so. This would likely lead to very skilled individuals being able to complete these "solo raids" very quickly, unless there was a lot of gear checks along the way, which would in turn require the other bosses in this "Crafting Quest" line have good drops.
Also, what about class balance?
The content just needs to be tricky without using full range of mechanics, which the NPC companion of the player's choice, or their friend, will cover any shortfall in the player's own skill selection.
But, they've already demonstrated they can't do that now. How exactly is this supposed to happen?The player will be earning these recipes/set gear items for research and so on, which will allow some progression as well as they go through the quests and get to learn more sets and recipes/etc.
As for time, each item takes 30 days or so - so to get full sets will take much longer than raiders take to get their own gear, in many ways making the content even more worthy of the rewards they get. Different endgames for different situations, meaning the way players earn their rewards are different, and that's okay.
Or, six hours if you've got an alt you haven't been using as a research minion... unless we're talking about 9 trait sets... no, that would work with nirncrux and the rest... or 10 trait sets, but that would require you already have nirncrux and did group activities... uh...Edited by starkerealm on October 13, 2014 3:39PM1 -
Aenra✭✭✭✭my "congratulations" to all those who posted in order to 'inform me' about the pve cyrodiil side, the new grind trophy collection and the crafting dailies, oops, i meant writs..
if you think a Darkness Falls copy/paste (google it) that can only be opened and maintained through PvP is solo content..
if you think daily grinds and farms barricated further by long hours CDs can be considered solo content..
it's like the forced solo content guy here, explaining how forced solo..is actually..solo..who would have thought..
guys with thinking this shallow, you ever wondered why 99% of the MMOs out there suck? If they pass you ..these.. and you say "ooooh, how niiiiiice!"..
why would they ever need to bother with anything actually meaningful?
Pride, honour and purity2 -
kewl✭✭✭✭✭
✭You need to ask yourselves what have you done, since before launch to be honest, for the casual, for the content-driven, for the explorer, for the TES lore junkie.
Abolishing the Vet system was a good start.
Craglorn came first because ESO launched without endgame.
Orsinium and more of Black Marsh are in the works. Also expect solo crafting quests, solo spell crafting quests. Plus the Imperial City is PvE content (not sure if solo quests will be included.)
Lots of good stuff for solo players in the pipe.
Paying monthly sub to get bi-annual or even annual content is illogical. Group players are getting new content every freaking month.
Maybe there should be a paygate here, separating solo and solo+group areas, $15 for normal and forced group area access, $5 for others.
Look man, they have limited resources and we have unlimited needs. The game launched with hundreds of hours of solo PvE content and no endgame group content. If you can't wait a few moths or try something outside your comfort zone, quit and return in two months.3 -
starkerealm✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭my "congratulations" to all those who posted in order to 'inform me' about the pve cyrodiil side, the new grind trophy collection and the crafting dailies, oops, i meant writs..
if you think a Darkness Falls copy/paste (google it) that can only be opened and maintained through PvP is solo content..
if you think daily grinds and farms barricated further by long hours CDs can be considered solo content..
it's like the forced solo content guy here, explaining how forced solo..is actually..solo..who would have thought..
guys with thinking this shallow, you ever wondered why 99% of the MMOs out there suck? If they pass you ..these.. and you say "ooooh, how niiiiiice!"..
why would they ever need to bother with anything actually meaningful?
Yeah, I feel you. All I can suggest is, did you actually run Cadwell's Silver and Gold on all three factions?
I mean, the vet system as it exists today works as a kind of New Game + and New Game ++ progression. So, in playing the other factions at a higher difficulty, you're actually seeing a souped up version of that content, which is still more single player content, even if it is just in the range of, "can I do this when it's harder?"1 -
Aenra✭✭✭✭@starkerealm thanks, am not "out" of things to do thankfully
this was not a complaint, just..my thinking in response to what came out of the guild summit; Or let us be straight, what they wanted to come out in the first place, bathed in as positive a light as possible, hence the handpicking of "representatives"
the fact that so many months later (other MMOs don't even last this long prior to major cutbacks) they are increasing their team size has a lot to say for the game. A positive lot. As however it only relates to gameplays directed at specific target groups, well i thought i'd enquire.Pride, honour and purity0