Improvements for Stamina-Based Skills and Passives
Update 46 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/676209
Maintenance for the week of April 14:
· [COMPLETE] Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – April 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
· [COMPLETE] PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – April 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
· [COMPLETE] Xbox: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – April 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
· [COMPLETE] PlayStation®: NA and EU megaservers for maintenance – April 16, 6:00AM EDT (10:00 UTC) - 9:00AM EDT (13:00 UTC)
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Lyall84✭✭✭✭Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »
How am I rude? For asking about the two lines that need love the most but are absent? I love it when obvious trolls are obvious, like my opinion is worthless because I pay to play this game.
Your opinion they need the most, clearly not ZeniMax.0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭Maverick827 wrote: »I was thinking more like:
Restores X% Magicka and Y% Stamina on a successful block. Can only occur once every Z seconds. Requires 5 or more heavy armor pieces.
Makes sense.0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭
Snipe suffers from the ultimate cap in this game, the pvp balance cap. You shall never one shot your opponent in pvp. As long as this rule is on and they cannot find a way to disengage skills from their pvp dmg (like adding protection passives in a tree against certain attacks), snipe (and a lot of other skills) will remain useless.
But you can two shot with snipe, if the first attack happens to be from behind, it stuns, allowing the second shot and kill.0 -
Mortosk✭✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »
Can start by making it actually mitigate damage. Then, if you're giving Medium 14% max stamina regen/reduction, why not give Heavy 7% max magicka and 7% max stamina regen/reduction.
"Now I stand, the lion before the lambs and they do not fear. They can not fear." --Arthas Menethil (aka, The Lich King)0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭ruze84b14_ESO wrote: »
Caring for the game isn't bad, at all. Don't let me or anyone else tell you it is.
Caring for your class, or your personal weapon type? Also, nothing wrong with it.
Insulting developers, pushing agenda's with false or just exaggerated claims, and offering little positive force to the agenda? I personally feel there's something wrong with that.
Your opinion is NOT worthless. Your attitude is.
You said it.2 -
zazamalek✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »We're looking at ways we can improve the Heavy Armor skill line as well.
I'm a HA user.
Not sure if you guys took the time to read my risk/reward post but along those lines of thinking: HA is too high risk.
The theory is that a HA should be able to solo the same content a LA should. They should die less (less risk, ditto it is heavy armor) but the kicker is it should take them longer (less reward). That's my take on it at least.
This obviously doesn't apply to DKs who are still viable (if not more viable) in PvP with HA. Additionally I'm not sure how this would apply to dungeons, the level of survivability boost needed for HA would completely ruin dungeon difficulty.
I had a NB guildie complain that he was dying more in "legendary set-bonus V12 HA" than "hodgepodge green V12 LA." Something ain't right.4101 -
Cogo✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »
We're looking at ways we can improve the Heavy Armor skill line as well.
Hi!
I been tanking in heavy armor since day 1 of launch pretty much.
On a tanking view, there is nothing seriously wrong with heavy tank skill line.
Please consider not to buff, unless there is a balancing need for other builds then tanks.
I tanked through 1-50. Doing Vet areas now and I am doing just fine.
It is harder, yes, but isn't it supposed to be harder?
Its great that you listen to us and doing one giant great job balancing across all skills. But from a tanking view, and I am not alone in this (even if most on forums wants everything buffs up to god mode).
Heavy armor works fine for tank. If there is a problem among other builds, then ok.
A tanks view who play ESO daily.Oghur Hatemachine, Guild leader of The Nephilim - EU Megaserver
Orc Weapon Specialist and Warchief of the Ebonheart Pact - Trueflame Cyrodiil War Campaign
Guildsite: The Nephilim
"I don't agree with what you are saying, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it"
-Voltaire
"My build? Improvise, overcome and adapt!"3 -
Savitar✭✭✭This is just dumb... our problems with stam builds isn't the damage. It's the ridiculously high cost of defensive maneuvers, the insanely high cost of our bread and butter attacks, and the sluggishness of stam recovery even when it's overcharged inside of fights. Regular light and heavy attacks are garbage and basically only fill the voids between being OOS and having enough to trigger an ability one more time. Which is way too far between. Since most stam builds stack on the stamina and leave the magicka alone, magicka only serves as a buff or a dot or two before magicka is useless as well.
Wanna buff stam and not magicka inadvertantly? Fine, return half of melee damage recieved as stamina back every 1 second... Light armor and magicka types can't handle that for too long before they're toast and since stam builds are usually in-your-face melee types or tanks, they'll actually be able to keep fighting.0 -
SilverWF✭✭✭✭✭
✭I'm personally agree with all, over this:
Just want to say: WHAT?ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Medium Armor
With the Wind Walker passive, medium armor will reduce stamina costs by 2% per piece equipped.
Every single stamina weapon already have 20% reduction in the passives, so you granting them 14% more?
Just a 34% cost reduction for weapon skills?
The game becomes [snip]...
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]Edited by ZOS_LeroyW on June 21, 2014 12:04AM- PC EU. Ebonheart Pact. CP 1k+
- YouTube: All ESO disguises (2014)
- EU players are humans too! We want our maintenances in the least pop time (at deep night) and not lasted for several hours!
- Animation canceR - is true PvP cancer! When you can't see which actions your opponent do - you can't react properly on them!
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Ragnar_Lodbrok✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Hi!
I been tanking in heavy armor since day 1 of launch pretty much.
On a tanking view, there is nothing seriously wrong with heavy tank skill line.
Please consider not to buff, unless there is a balancing need for other builds then tanks.
I tanked through 1-50. Doing Vet areas now and I am doing just fine.
It is harder, yes, but isn't it supposed to be harder?
Its great that you listen to us and doing one giant great job balancing across all skills. But from a tanking view, and I am not alone in this (even if most on forums wants everything buffs up to god mode).
Heavy armor works fine for tank. If there is a problem among other builds, then ok.
A tanks view who play ESO daily.
I completely disagree as a tank who is forced to park his main and play other games while they fix the balance issues.0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭
Can start by making it actually mitigate damage. Then, if you're giving Medium 14% max stamina regen/reduction, why not give Heavy 7% max magicka and 7% max stamina regen/reduction.
Go for the increase in mitigation and survival first. See how that plays out before screaming for regen. You have to be careful about keeping the balance. Everyone wants their armor type or play style to be the best, but that is unreasonable.0 -
SilverWF✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Ok, if they want to be a "pure" staminers - so be it!ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »We look forward to hearing your thoughts!
Medium armor - +3% magicka cost per piece of Medium armor equipped
Heavy armor - +1% magicka cost per piece of Heavy armor equipped
Fair? Yes.- PC EU. Ebonheart Pact. CP 1k+
- YouTube: All ESO disguises (2014)
- EU players are humans too! We want our maintenances in the least pop time (at deep night) and not lasted for several hours!
- Animation canceR - is true PvP cancer! When you can't see which actions your opponent do - you can't react properly on them!
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Ragnar_Lodbrok✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ok, if they want to be a "pure" staminers - so be it!
Medium armor - +3% magicka cost per piece of Medium armor equipped
Heavy armor - +1% magicka cost per piece of Heavy armor equipped
Fair? Yes.
Only if stick users lose the ability to block, run, cc break, and dodge.3 -
SilverWF✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Your post is not relevantRagnar_Lodbrok wrote: »
Only if stick users lose the ability to block, run, cc break, and dodge.
This is not 'stick' but staff.
You all are hate magicka skills, wants only use stamina skills - so you have nothing to afraid.- PC EU. Ebonheart Pact. CP 1k+
- YouTube: All ESO disguises (2014)
- EU players are humans too! We want our maintenances in the least pop time (at deep night) and not lasted for several hours!
- Animation canceR - is true PvP cancer! When you can't see which actions your opponent do - you can't react properly on them!
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Ragnar_Lodbrok✭✭✭✭✭
✭Your post is not relevant
This is not 'stick' but staff.
You all are hate magicka skills, wants only use stamina skills - so you have nothing to afraid.
It is a stick.2 -
SilverWF✭✭✭✭✭
✭
You can find stick in your... only.Ragnar_Lodbrok wrote: »It is a stick.- PC EU. Ebonheart Pact. CP 1k+
- YouTube: All ESO disguises (2014)
- EU players are humans too! We want our maintenances in the least pop time (at deep night) and not lasted for several hours!
- Animation canceR - is true PvP cancer! When you can't see which actions your opponent do - you can't react properly on them!
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Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
It takes like 30% stamina, regardless of max. So it really beats up stamina builds vs magicka. If it was a set amount, like 400, it would not be as rough for people that have 1500 or more stamina.
I have not tested it myself but read a post about it on another message board, but I'm fairly certain block, CC break, bash are all a % of base stamina. Base stamina apparently is whatever your level has as stamina without considering attributes spent or gear enchants, therefore all classes of the same level have the same base stamina. Could be wrong cause I was too lazy to check but the post and people agreeing seemed pretty sure on it.This is just dumb... our problems with stam builds isn't the damage. It's the ridiculously high cost of defensive maneuvers, the insanely high cost of our bread and butter attacks, and the sluggishness of stam recovery even when it's overcharged inside of fights. Regular light and heavy attacks are garbage and basically only fill the voids between being OOS and having enough to trigger an ability one more time. Which is way too far between. Since most stam builds stack on the stamina and leave the magicka alone, magicka only serves as a buff or a dot or two before magicka is useless as well.
Wanna buff stam and not magicka inadvertantly? Fine, return half of melee damage recieved as stamina back every 1 second... Light armor and magicka types can't handle that for too long before they're toast and since stam builds are usually in-your-face melee types or tanks, they'll actually be able to keep fighting.
This is a good post, especially when it comes to stam recovery.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭I'm personally agree with all, over this: Just want to say: WHAT?
Every single stamina weapon already have 20% reduction in the passives, so you granting them 14% more?
Just a 34% cost reduction for weapon skills?
The game becomes [snip]...
WHAT? Light armor already has 21% reduction, yet class skills trees also have reductions...
...your point is moot. This is only bringing stamina in line with Magicka.
[Moderator Note: Edited moderated quote.
Edited by ZOS_LeroyW on June 21, 2014 12:09AM2 -
Shaun98ca2✭✭✭✭✭
You must really be afraid of an even playing field. While I agree with the 1% & 2% increase. 4% would be too much. A sarcastic comment like that when gets 21% ON TOP of the class passives or mage guild passives that reduce magicka costs makes you look incredibly bias. If you are going to start pulling numbers to prove your point you need to make sure you include all the numbers, not just the ones that support your point. Why are you so afraid of balance?
No I really didn't expect it. Im not against it either. If this will help create the balance then Im all for it. HOPEFULLY that 2% per goes towards Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break as well and not just hotbar abilities.0 -
Thejollygreenone✭✭✭
WHAT? Light armor already has 21% reduction, yet class skills trees also have reductions...
...your point is moot. This is only bringing stamina in line with Magicka.
agreed here. also, fighters guild abilities have no stamina cost reduction without this passive and the abilities cost an assload so this really helps there. people will complain about the lack of attention to magicka builds and let them, they can feel bad about whatever ridiculous idea they want, as is their right on the internet.
EDIT: while I have a post already up, I'd like to suggest that the medium armor passive 'Athletics' should be changed to include sprint cost reduction (I'd take this over speed) as well as CC-break cost reduction if these functions are to remain stamina based.
blocking we can do without since that should be a tanking based thing and shouldn't be improved upon unless in heavy armor and/or 1h shield.
I think such a change to athletics would go a LONG way to mitigating the damage these utility functions have on our resource pool.Edited by Thejollygreenone on June 21, 2014 12:00AM0 -
Lyall84✭✭✭✭Shaun98ca2 wrote: »
No I really didn't expect it. Im not against it either. If this will help create the balance then Im all for it. HOPEFULLY that 2% per goes towards Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break as well and not just hotbar abilities.
That would be nice, but I am betting only active abilities.0 -
Cogo✭✭✭✭✭
✭Balance is needed of all skills and feedback are always good.
But people tend to forget that one component in how well you play in ESO, is your play style.
Cant blame everything on skills/gear or whatever. Just sometimes...maybe look at how you can improve or adapt?
ESO really is a game where personal skill in playing makes a difference. I suck at pvp because I am to slow to react....it shows :-pEdited by Cogo on June 20, 2014 11:59PMOghur Hatemachine, Guild leader of The Nephilim - EU Megaserver
Orc Weapon Specialist and Warchief of the Ebonheart Pact - Trueflame Cyrodiil War Campaign
Guildsite: The Nephilim
"I don't agree with what you are saying, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it"
-Voltaire
"My build? Improvise, overcome and adapt!"0 -
Eivar✭✭✭✭great to see some changes coming, one thing that occurs to me though is that in a stamina build weapon attacks (light/heavy) should be more prevalent in weapon based rotations, so maybe tooling with the dmg and speeds could help out the overall dps of a weapon based build.0
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SilverWF✭✭✭✭✭
✭
you are not sure, just talking, right?
WHAT? Light armor already has 21% reduction, yet class skills trees also have reductions...
So let the staves will get reduction passives, at least for 10%- PC EU. Ebonheart Pact. CP 1k+
- YouTube: All ESO disguises (2014)
- EU players are humans too! We want our maintenances in the least pop time (at deep night) and not lasted for several hours!
- Animation canceR - is true PvP cancer! When you can't see which actions your opponent do - you can't react properly on them!
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Cogo✭✭✭✭✭
✭You can find stick in your... only.
Don't bother with him. He is baiting you to say something that gets you banned.
I do not understand this person. He does not play, but seams to enjoy being aggressive and negative here.
I followed his posts, and he is quite good at not crossing the line, but to make others do it.Oghur Hatemachine, Guild leader of The Nephilim - EU Megaserver
Orc Weapon Specialist and Warchief of the Ebonheart Pact - Trueflame Cyrodiil War Campaign
Guildsite: The Nephilim
"I don't agree with what you are saying, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it"
-Voltaire
"My build? Improvise, overcome and adapt!"0 -
SilverWF✭✭✭✭✭
✭- PC EU. Ebonheart Pact. CP 1k+
- YouTube: All ESO disguises (2014)
- EU players are humans too! We want our maintenances in the least pop time (at deep night) and not lasted for several hours!
- Animation canceR - is true PvP cancer! When you can't see which actions your opponent do - you can't react properly on them!
0 -
Eivar✭✭✭✭I'm personally agree with all, over this: Just want to say: WHAT?
Every single stamina weapon already have 20% reduction in the passives, so you granting them 14% more?
Just a 34% cost reduction for weapon skills?
The game becomes [snip]...
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]
Your point would be valid if magicka was used for more than just active skills, as it is stamina is used for dodge rolling, blocking, cc breaking, AND weapon based active skills. As long as they keep the stamina based damage relatively low compared to magicka it should balance out fine.2 -
SilverWF✭✭✭✭✭
✭
You even didn't understand what you are talking!Your point would be valid if magicka was used for more than just active skills, as it is stamina is used for dodge rolling, blocking, cc breaking, AND weapon based active skills. As long as they keep the stamina based damage relatively low compared to magicka it should balance out fine.
I'm praying for turning all of this dodging etc into the magicka cost! Because as a mage I have a tons of magicka.
But you all, staminers, didn't understand that fact what every mage lost all of it's stamina after 2nd CCbreak!- PC EU. Ebonheart Pact. CP 1k+
- YouTube: All ESO disguises (2014)
- EU players are humans too! We want our maintenances in the least pop time (at deep night) and not lasted for several hours!
- Animation canceR - is true PvP cancer! When you can't see which actions your opponent do - you can't react properly on them!
1 -
Shaun98ca2✭✭✭✭✭You even didn't understand what you are talking!
I'm praying for turning all of this dodging etc into the magicka cost! Because as a mage I have a tons of magicka.
But you all, staminers, didn't understand that fact what every mage lost all of it's stamina after 2nd CCbreak!
Magicka users don't really need much Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break.
You get Self Heals, Buffs and Crowd Control yourself.0
