Stamina builds need to be address immediately or else this game will die a slow death.

Shaun98ca2

ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

Let me reverse the argument.

Magicka builds SUCK theres NO way to maintain the High Level of DPS once OOM the DPS plummets through the floor.

Most our abilities are susceptible to being stunned including our Heavy Attacks which we have to rely on to get back our Magicka.

We get NO kind of Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break compared to that of Stamina build PLUS they get to SPAM Heavy Attacks endlessly producing more DPS than us once we OOM.

Any of our good damage abilities are overly blockable making us waste even more mana and instant abilities are even capable of being reflected back to us or simply nullified all together (Negate Magic).

Stamina builds get Magicka abilities that require NO points in Magicka to be good
increasing their survivability and damage, when our addition pool is Stamina which is required to simply stay alive and never enough of and provide no healing or protection.

So hard facts with unbiased comparison is better than simply complaining.

I'm sorry if I don't understand what you are saying but it doesn't make much sense.

Do you think you can't block, dodge, break CC with a magica build? You think your magic abilities are "overly" blockable compared to... mundane abilities?

I'm not even sure what the rest means because it's wrong and doesn't make sense either. Is that a proposal or a couldn't-be-more-wrong counterargument?

Which part don't you understand or is wrong exactly?

UnyieldingFlame

@ferzalrwb17_ESO‌

I think he wants mages to reign supremacy in the game.

ferzalrwb17_ESO

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

Which part don't you understand or is wrong exactly?

Nearly all of it.

If you can tell me what the spirit of the post was: i.e. were you genuinely saying that magicka builds, as is, are as described or were you making some hypothetical without setting it up properly? Then I might be able to tell you how wrong it is or understand what you were getting at.

Shaun98ca2

UnyieldingFlame wrote: »

@ferzalrwb17_ESO‌

I think he wants mages to reign supremacy in the game.

No Not at all my "Magicka sucks rant" was to show I can skew information in a different direction to show IE Magicka builds suck. He didn't understand one of my statements and maybe I made a mistake or he didn't read it right.

I can admit I made a mistake. The idea was to state and show if you feel Stamina build is lacking the only way to truly get looked at is hard numbers facts unbiased comparison. For this a well detailed video helps its info Devs cant ignore. I for one haven't seen a video even come close to discussing the issue.

Shaun98ca2

ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

Which part don't you understand or is wrong exactly?

Nearly all of it.

If you can tell me what the spirit of the post was: i.e. were you genuinely saying that magicka builds, as is, are as described or were you making some hypothetical without setting it up properly? Then I might be able to tell you how wrong it is or understand what you were getting at.

Well this really gets off topic but pick like one good statement and show how its wrong.

Tobiz

Can I have your stuff?

sorry, couldnt resist.

Could we have a screenie of your character sheet? or some more details.
I want 1k heavy attacks too, can you help?

What armor type do you use?
What sets and how many pieces?
How do you allocate attribute points?
Gief intel!

Shaun98ca2

Tobiz wrote: »

Can I have your stuff?

sorry, couldnt resist.

Could we have a screenie of your character sheet? or some more details.
I want 1k heavy attacks too, can you help?

What armor type do you use?
What sets and how many pieces?
How do you allocate attribute points?
Gief intel!

Actually I have seen stated by a VR12 that he can sustain 700 DPS Heavy Attack alone.

UnyieldingFlame

Tobiz wrote: »

Can I have your stuff?

sorry, couldnt resist.

Could we have a screenie of your character sheet? or some more details.
I want 1k heavy attacks too, can you help?

What armor type do you use?
What sets and how many pieces?
How do you allocate attribute points?
Gief intel!

Heavy attacks are only 1k damage when I hit a critical and my weapon enchantment apply to the enemies.

Ardeni

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

Let me reverse the argument.

Magicka builds SUCK theres NO way to maintain the High Level of DPS once OOM the DPS plummets through the floor.

Most our abilities are susceptible to being stunned including our Heavy Attacks which we have to rely on to get back our Magicka.

We get NO kind of Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break compared to that of Stamina build PLUS they get to SPAM Heavy Attacks endlessly producing more DPS than us once we OOM.

Any of our good damage abilities are overly blockable making us waste even more mana and instant abilities are even capable of being reflected back to us or simply nullified all together (Negate Magic).

Stamina builds get Magicka abilities that require NO points in Magicka to be good
increasing their survivability and damage, when our addition pool is Stamina which is required to simply stay alive and never enough of and provide no healing or protection.

So hard facts with unbiased comparison is better than simply complaining.

I don't know what game you are playing, but in ESO magicka builds definitely do not suck compared to stamina ones.

First of all, the aoe damage that you can do with magicka builds spamming pulsar is insane. Add dragonknight standard, bat swarm, supernova, storm atronach and etc and you'll get close to 2k dps. The mobs will die long before you are out of mana. Also, if you use light armor and enchantments to reduce spell cost (accessory), you can easily manage your mana situation. In Cyrodiil/group content you can use equilibrium to get mana back. If you're a sorcerer, you can use the dark ritual to convert stamina into magicka. If you use a restoration staff, heavy attacks restore 10% of your magicka. On top of all this there's potions.

If you were not aware, at least as far as my guildies have tested, the block, dodge and interrupt abilities cost a percentage of your stamina instead of a set amount. Thus the stamina based characters don't get any more of these than you do. On top of that, they need to use the stamina to deal damage. Due to this, rooting/stunning them is much easier than rooting/stunning magicka characters.

I've never noticed my abilities being overly blockable. In pvp, what matters is whom gets to surprise the other character. That gives the biggest advantage along with ultimate abilities. You can dodge out from negate magic (as you should) and in the end very few people use reflected abilities, and even when they do, you can still spam mage's fury, lava whip, biting jabs and etc. depending on your class.

----

Even as a caster dragonknight and sorcerer, I find that stamina builds need to be buffed a lot. I never intended to play them nor am I interested in them at this point, but if nothing is done, this game will end up being a war of mages which can't be good in the long run.

ferzalrwb17_ESO

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

UnyieldingFlame wrote: »

@ferzalrwb17_ESO‌

I think he wants mages to reign supremacy in the game.

No Not at all my "Magicka sucks rant" was to show I can skew information in a different direction to show IE Magicka builds suck. He didn't understand one of my statements and maybe I made a mistake or he didn't read it right.

No offence, but it was a fail on that count because you used clearly incorrect information all the way through. We can counter all of your post by known information (i.e. magicka builds CAN block, break CC etc). You need to use the current rules and mechanics of the game - not invent them - in order to make a valid point there.

I see what you're saying but I think everyone (well nearly everyone...) agrees it's a major problem, including devs. Just how to fix it and balance it without nerfing skirts&sticks to some degree is an issue.

And this answers your post asking to pick one statement that was wrong. All of the stuff you said a magicka build can't do is 100% wrong.

jelliedsoup

Arora wrote: »

find a group of friends and run with them, instead of random parties then and you wont have this problem, they are already aware and addressing the problem it takes time to recode, why are you people so impatient, grind out a second character you will eventually anyways. Or start grinding out secondary weapons and Armour.

I'm impatient as it is an obvious issue conceptually. Whoever thought it would work is a little slow

Shaun98ca2

Yes there are a lot of arguments against Stamina builds. Certain abilities such as pulsar are incredibly powerful if not OP.

Pulsar can be blocked and I know 2hander at least has a knockdown ability with 1 sec cast.

How long can you really spam Pulsar?

Block im overly certain isn't percentage based any more and the rest you mentioned im pretty sure were changed as well as the community stated this gives more benefit to a Stamina build and ZOS made the change to benefit Stamina builds.

But again the point of my rant was IF you wanna show devs Stamina is broken.. Make a fully unbiased video comparing all the ins and outs of Full Magicka versus Full Stamina. So this includes DPS burst, sustained OOM OOS any and everything.

shad0w18

I never really understood how a HEALING staff does more damage compare to a sharpened weapon like dual daggers ie Cycle of Life passive. On paper, I'm better off using the Resto Staff for the +10% dmg compared to daggers but I'll never use staves or LA. Assassins dont leap from the shadows with staffs. IMO remove the Cycle of Life passive =/

Edit:Spell check op lol

Shaun98ca2

shad0w18 wrote: »

I never really understood how a HEALING staff does more damage compare to a sharpened weapon like dual daggers ie Cycle of Life passive. On paper, I'm better off using the Resto Staff for the +10% dmg compared to daggers but I'll never use staves or LA. Assassins dont leap from the shadows with staffs. IMO remove the Cycle of Life passive =/

Edit:Spell check op lol

If you haven't noticed there is a trend where classes Magicka Management is getting destroyed.

Templars had theirs removed right before release.

NightBlades say their DPS sucks when using their Resource Management tool and that's getting nerfed even worse.

DragonKnights were only slightly better than Templars when it came to Magicka and that as well if Im not mistaken was nerfed.

Sorcerers.....Dark Exchange in my eyes is sure go ahead and twiddle your thumbs for 3 secs for 30% Magicka(I have no idea what it really is LOL). Either its fine as is cause Sorcerers suffer from Magicka issues or I for see nerf coming.

That leaves the Restro Staff. Magicka based DPS builds can use Restro Staff and it doesn't seem to noticeably lower their DPS at all giving a strong sustaining Magicka build with High DPS. Might get changed BUT how to not screw healers that actually need that 10% gain with Heavy Attack? 10% refund on all healing abilities?

Endless Magicka makes Magicka builds Strong. Im a Templar in my eyes Magicka versus Stamina makes perfect sense.

Magicka is High damage low sustainment. OOM = BAD damage
Stamina is good damage HIGH sustainment. Stamina doesn't get "bad damage"

BALANCE.

Everybody's using Restro Staffs cause it allows you to sustain HIGH DPS with NO penalty. Balance broken.

Rylana

UnyieldingFlame wrote: »

dragnier wrote: »

There is an entire thread on this in the PTS forums as well.

Yes I am very aware of that topic on the PTS forum section however this needs more exposure regrettably.

Pretty sure every single man, woman, and child on this forum has seen at least 20 threads related to stamina builds since launch.

Pretty sure youre just beating a dead horse at this point. If ZOS is going to do anything, its already planned and not released.

Shaun98ca2

Yea I have read more than my fair share of the threads. They say nothing. Hersey. No facts, no hard comparisons no numbers NOTHING.

1. Stamina uses Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break dipping into a resource pool required for Stamina abilities.

OK that's fine but I find I DONT NEED those abilities to be good at a Stamina build as Stamina DIRECTLY increases ALL Light/Heavy Attacks. This is an endless sustainable resource for damage. WITH the increased survivability of a tank with increased uses of Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break.

PLUS there are abilities that BOOST Stamina builds from the Magicka pool IE Healing or Utilities and MOST the Utilities don't require points in Magicka to be useful.



2. Stamina builds don't produce as much damage as a Magicka build.

WHY SHOULD IT??? It has increased survivability as stated in point 1 and has a HIGHLY sustainable level of Damage that out DPSes a Magicka Build that OOM.


3. Magicka builds DONT go OOM. OH so herein seems to the problem. IF a Magicka user DOES OOM with the right balance then there is no real issue.

Sleepydan

Here is what I don't get. By stamina build, you mean you want to be a physically focused character right? Melee or bow?

Of your 5 skill slots I am willing to bet you have 2-3 utility abilities, 1-2 magicka dumps and 1-2 stamina dumps. I bet you do a fair amount of light +heavy attacks.

Is your beef that there are more magicka based utility abilities? Do you want to just have 5 stamina dumps?


Maybe stamina light/heavy attacks aren't light or heavy enough?


I don't get what you want. I'm pretty sure you can be the type of character you want to be. It's like your complaining about...say...you wanted to be a healer, and you can, but there are too many hots and not enough bubbles, it's game breaking!!!!1!!


I'm sorry your predefined notions of what you wanted don't match up with reality. Hey, maybe stamina builds need a boost. I'm not against you on that point. But you can totally be any classic fantasy archetype, rogue+mage+fighter+cleric, and a fair amount of hybrids and otherwise.

Being who you want to be isn't the same promise as your *** pile of un-synergistic abilities will be effective.

Shaun98ca2

Lets look at a different view point.

IF your Magicka build makes my Stamina build OOS but also OOM itself in the process when Magicka versus Stamina Leaving BOTH builds out of their MAIN resource. WHO benefits MORE?

Stamina has abilities with Magicka that increases Damage or Survivability and most do not require points in Magicka to be useful or even optimal.

Stamina ALSO has the better DPS with than Magicka build without its resource pool.

Magicka users gain VERY little from Stamina versus what Stamina users gain from Magicka.

Magicka DPS suffers without its resource pool. Magicka users rely on their resource pool more than a Stamina user does for DPS, Survivability, CC, Utility.

Gisgo

Arora wrote: »

find a group of friends and run with them, instead of random parties then and you wont have this problem

Solution to stamina builds being weaker than magicka builds: join a party.

Makes sense, uh?

UnyieldingFlame

Sleepydan wrote: »

Here is what I don't get. By stamina build, you mean you want to be a physically focused character right? Melee or bow?

Of your 5 skill slots I am willing to bet you have 2-3 utility abilities, 1-2 magicka dumps and 1-2 stamina dumps. I bet you do a fair amount of light +heavy attacks.

Is your beef that there are more magicka based utility abilities? Do you want to just have 5 stamina dumps?


Maybe stamina light/heavy attacks aren't light or heavy enough?


I don't get what you want. I'm pretty sure you can be the type of character you want to be. It's like your complaining about...say...you wanted to be a healer, and you can, but there are too many hots and not enough bubbles, it's game breaking!!!!1!!


I'm sorry your predefined notions of what you wanted don't match up with reality. Hey, maybe stamina builds need a boost. I'm not against you on that point. But you can totally be any classic fantasy archetype, rogue+mage+fighter+cleric, and a fair amount of hybrids and otherwise.

Being who you want to be isn't the same promise as your *** pile of un-synergistic abilities will be effective.

Why people don't read is beyond my understanding of how to deal with incompetent dolt like these on the forums. Ha funny how you assume I use un-synergy abilities that are not effective. However you are indefinitely wrong on that one, I'm am using the best melee sorcerer build and still can't keep up with mage type builds on the dps meter.

Only because I run out of stamina too quickly period.

Shaun98ca2

UnyieldingFlame wrote: »

Sleepydan wrote: »

Here is what I don't get. By stamina build, you mean you want to be a physically focused character right? Melee or bow?

Of your 5 skill slots I am willing to bet you have 2-3 utility abilities, 1-2 magicka dumps and 1-2 stamina dumps. I bet you do a fair amount of light +heavy attacks.

Is your beef that there are more magicka based utility abilities? Do you want to just have 5 stamina dumps?


Maybe stamina light/heavy attacks aren't light or heavy enough?


I don't get what you want. I'm pretty sure you can be the type of character you want to be. It's like your complaining about...say...you wanted to be a healer, and you can, but there are too many hots and not enough bubbles, it's game breaking!!!!1!!


I'm sorry your predefined notions of what you wanted don't match up with reality. Hey, maybe stamina builds need a boost. I'm not against you on that point. But you can totally be any classic fantasy archetype, rogue+mage+fighter+cleric, and a fair amount of hybrids and otherwise.

Being who you want to be isn't the same promise as your *** pile of un-synergistic abilities will be effective.

Why people don't read is beyond my understanding of how to deal with incompetent dolt like these on the forums. Ha funny how you assume I use un-synergy abilities that are not effective. However you are indefinitely wrong on that one, I'm am using the best melee sorcerer build and still can't keep up with mage type builds on the dps meter.

Only because I run out of stamina too quickly period.

What about your Heavy Attacks does that not help your DPS....how much does your DPS drop when you rely on your Heavy Attack.

UnyieldingFlame

@Shaun98ca2‌

And yet again another poster that doesn't read and only types without thinking..

*Facepalm*

Please stop you're only further embarrassing yourself Shaun. If you want to know then my heavy attacks with no critical bonuses is 700 solid damage, with critical and weapons enchantment it is 1000 damage, however a caster can output 2x more damage every second with better resource management then any stamina build could get.

That is enough to warrant a serious look at a balance change for stamina and I'm not asking for a major buff to damage but just better resource management for stamina user.

Shaun98ca2

UnyieldingFlame wrote: »

@Shaun98ca2‌

And yet again another poster that doesn't read and only types without thinking..

*Facepalm*

Please stop you're only further embarrassing yourself Shaun. If you want to know then my heavy attacks with no critical bonuses is 700 solid damage, with critical and weapons enchantment it is 1000 damage, however a caster can output 2x more damage every second with better resource management then any stamina build could get.

That is enough to warrant a serious look at a balance change for stamina and I'm not asking for a major buff to damage but just better resource management for stamina user.

Ok that's good that's SOMETHING to work with. How long can a Magicka user sustain its 2000 DPS??? Is it using a well known broken build that simply only certain builds are going to pull? Is this an AOE number or single target?

IF my Heavy Attack is sustaining 1000 DPS this leaves Stamina for increased Survivability and control of the battle field IE Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break.

Then my Stamina build also has Magicka for more DPS or Survivability and Utility and Utility scales really well regardless of points in Magicka allowing you to push the threshold closer to hard cap.

So lets say it is simply 1000 DPS Heavy Attack only so I use LESS Survivability and actually increase my DPS....say 1500. I STILL have the increased survivability/utility from Magicka that can also help my performance.

dragnier

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

UnyieldingFlame wrote: »

@Shaun98ca2‌

And yet again another poster that doesn't read and only types without thinking..

*Facepalm*

Please stop you're only further embarrassing yourself Shaun. If you want to know then my heavy attacks with no critical bonuses is 700 solid damage, with critical and weapons enchantment it is 1000 damage, however a caster can output 2x more damage every second with better resource management then any stamina build could get.

That is enough to warrant a serious look at a balance change for stamina and I'm not asking for a major buff to damage but just better resource management for stamina user.

Ok that's good that's SOMETHING to work with. How long can a Magicka user sustain its 2000 DPS??? Is it using a well known broken build that simply only certain builds are going to pull? Is this an AOE number or single target?

IF my Heavy Attack is sustaining 1000 DPS this leaves Stamina for increased Survivability and control of the battle field IE Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break.

Then my Stamina build also has Magicka for more DPS or Survivability and Utility and Utility scales really well regardless of points in Magicka allowing you to push the threshold closer to hard cap.

So lets say it is simply 1000 DPS Heavy Attack only so I use LESS Survivability and actually increase my DPS....say 1500. I STILL have the increased survivability/utility from Magicka that can also help my performance.

We get it. You're saying that a PURE Stamina build can still get utility and dps increases by using what Magicka they have and vice versa.

To a point, that is true. However, having tried it both ways on my NB, I can honestly say that the more you move towards using mostly Stamina, the more the dps falls off.

I don't know what the actual culprit of this is...

Is it resource management?

Is it a difference in mitgation between armor and spell resist?

Is it simply that weapon attacks don't hit as hard as magicka attacks?

I hope someone figures it out, because then the devs can work on fixing it.

Shaun98ca2

dragnier wrote: »

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

UnyieldingFlame wrote: »

@Shaun98ca2‌

And yet again another poster that doesn't read and only types without thinking..

*Facepalm*

Please stop you're only further embarrassing yourself Shaun. If you want to know then my heavy attacks with no critical bonuses is 700 solid damage, with critical and weapons enchantment it is 1000 damage, however a caster can output 2x more damage every second with better resource management then any stamina build could get.

That is enough to warrant a serious look at a balance change for stamina and I'm not asking for a major buff to damage but just better resource management for stamina user.

Ok that's good that's SOMETHING to work with. How long can a Magicka user sustain its 2000 DPS??? Is it using a well known broken build that simply only certain builds are going to pull? Is this an AOE number or single target?

IF my Heavy Attack is sustaining 1000 DPS this leaves Stamina for increased Survivability and control of the battle field IE Block, Dodge, Stun, CC Break.

Then my Stamina build also has Magicka for more DPS or Survivability and Utility and Utility scales really well regardless of points in Magicka allowing you to push the threshold closer to hard cap.

So lets say it is simply 1000 DPS Heavy Attack only so I use LESS Survivability and actually increase my DPS....say 1500. I STILL have the increased survivability/utility from Magicka that can also help my performance.

We get it. You're saying that a PURE Stamina build can still get utility and dps increases by using what Magicka they have and vice versa.

To a point, that is true. However, having tried it both ways on my NB, I can honestly say that the more you move towards using mostly Stamina, the more the dps falls off.

I don't know what the actual culprit of this is...

Is it resource management?

Is it a difference in mitgation between armor and spell resist?

Is it simply that weapon attacks don't hit as hard as magicka attacks?

I hope someone figures it out, because then the devs can work on fixing it.

Well the 1st step towards this is a very detailed video doesn't have to YOU, but SOMEBODY who is good at testing. That can show one character with a Full Magicka build and a Full Stamina build and show LOTS of info of various abilities. Important video topics

1. Magicka Sustained DPS. How long the DPS can be sustain. Whats the DPS when out of the resource. How usefull is the alternative stat with ZERO points towards it. Damage of the Light/Heavy Attacks. Different sustainments of DPS.

2. Same things as point 1. but with Stamina.

---

Reason being is while people FEEL their DPS dropped question is HOW much was there a trade off for the DPS drop IE DPS versus Tank argument but in this instance its more like DPS versus Battle Field Control. Block and Stun are AMAZING abilities. Stamina builds get more uses of this in combat but at the same time this DOES NOT Translate well to bosses.

How much damage does given Stamina ability do versus given Magicka ability. What else did the Stamina/Magicka ability provide to warrant a difference between the two.

Brawler works best against 2-6 targets provide nice damage shield and nice amounts of Ultimate and with 6 targets DOUBLES the damage of my Reverse Slash ability.

Uppercut does about the same damage as Reverse Slash but provides a nice knockback PLUS damage boost on Next NON Uppercut attact. Kinda warrants a 1 sec cast time.

Reverse Slash is a inexpensive ability that hits like a truck that can gain 300% damage boost on Uppercuts damage boost. Sounds tasty for a testin.

Tobiz

May I bother you, @Shaun98ca2‌ and @UnyieldingFlame for what builds you use? Id love to see how you build, and copy it.
You both seem like good sports.

All in all I believe it comes down to synergies.
The Magicka builds have great synergies between the skills and passives on Light armor, Staves, Class spells, Mages guild passive, Vampire et.c.

The Stamina builds has not. Not even the ones you would assume do i.e. Warewolf and Fighters guild. Not that i WW myself.
There are synergies ofcource but some limited to status of target like health/disorient, and most are just mediocre.

The Stamina synergies needs a buff!

edit: Ok the warewolf actually has some goodness, but I dont want to be a werewolf. I kill warewolves...

Shaun98ca2

Tobiz wrote: »

May I bother you, @Shaun98ca2‌ and @UnyieldingFlame for what builds you use? Id love to see how you build, and copy it.
You both seem like good sports.

All in all I believe it comes down to synergies.
The Magicka builds have great synergies between the skills and passives on Light armor, Staves, Class spells, Mages guild passive, Vampire et.c.

The Stamina builds has not. Not even the ones you would assume do i.e. Warewolf and Fighters guild. Not that i WW myself.
There are synergies ofcource but some limited to status of target like health/disorient, and most are just mediocre.

The Stamina synergies needs a buff!

edit: Ok the warewolf actually has some goodness, but I dont want to be a werewolf. I kill warewolves...

Im a Templar my "build" is 7 Heavy with a 2 handed Sword (WISH axes had the 3% damage boost) My level up points are all in Stamina 39 points as im still only a Level 38. My enchantments are Strong(Head/Chest/Legs) Magicka - Weak(Rest of armor) health enchantments. So currently my 3 stats are slightly balanced.

On my hotbar I have Brawler, Explosive Charge(This bad boy stuns casters in mid cast/channel too far away to "interrupt"), Wrecking Blow.

Next is Restoring Aura and Breath of Life.

The last 2 abilities are only there till I can get Blazing Shield. Might add Executioner along as well removing BOTH RA and BOL as Blazing Shield will increase damage and assist in keeping me alive along with Brawler.

dragnier

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

Well the 1st step towards this is a very detailed video doesn't have to YOU, but SOMEBODY who is good at testing. That can show one character with a Full Magicka build and a Full Stamina build and show LOTS of info of various abilities. Important video topics

1. Magicka Sustained DPS. How long the DPS can be sustain. Whats the DPS when out of the resource. How usefull is the alternative stat with ZERO points towards it. Damage of the Light/Heavy Attacks. Different sustainments of DPS.

2. Same things as point 1. but with Stamina.

---

Reason being is while people FEEL their DPS dropped question is HOW much was there a trade off for the DPS drop IE DPS versus Tank argument but in this instance its more like DPS versus Battle Field Control. Block and Stun are AMAZING abilities. Stamina builds get more uses of this in combat but at the same time this DOES NOT Translate well to bosses.

How much damage does given Stamina ability do versus given Magicka ability. What else did the Stamina/Magicka ability provide to warrant a difference between the two.

Brawler works best against 2-6 targets provide nice damage shield and nice amounts of Ultimate and with 6 targets DOUBLES the damage of my Reverse Slash ability.

Uppercut does about the same damage as Reverse Slash but provides a nice knockback PLUS damage boost on Next NON Uppercut attact. Kinda warrants a 1 sec cast time.

Reverse Slash is a inexpensive ability that hits like a truck that can gain 300% damage boost on Uppercuts damage boost. Sounds tasty for a testin.

Again you hit on a breaking point in balancing. Solo versus Group and Questing/World Content versus Dungeons/Trials.

What is good for one is not necessarily good for another... the problem is that people want to use the same exact build for both, but that isn't always feasible.

Equilibrium may be great when there is a healer around, but it is death when you are solo.

By the same token, Mark Target may be an ok trade-off when you are in a questing group but against a boss that could hit you with AoE or random target attacks, not so much.

So with all these situational skills, many people just don't choose to switch even if it would be better because they get used to using a certain set of skills. On top of that, there are many skills that are outright broken to begin with. (Like NB Haste doesn't work on Bow or Staff.)

What I'm trying to say is, weighing and balancing all of these skills for PvE alone is a decently large and complicated task. Add in PvP and it just gets worse.

So the video you are asking someone to make would have to be extremely long and detailed including PvE of all kinds and PvP. The task of making said video is almost as daunting as just trying to figure out what is wrong with Stamina builds based on the numbers and reports.

DuelWieldingCheesyPoofs

I dnt understand why dodge,block,interrupt, sprint cant just have a different resource, imagine if dodge and sprint used magika people would be crying, i play sorc and i want to be a stam build mostly bow and duel wield with surge weap buff, i can and use bolt escape instead of dodging or sprint but seems really unfair for other classes... I think gw2 has a different resource for dodge and sprint ect.

dragnier

inspiral1 wrote: »

I dnt understand why dodge,block,interrupt, sprint cant just have a different resource, imagine if dodge and sprint used magika people would be crying, i play sorc and i want to be a stam build mostly bow and duel wield with surge weap buff, i can and use bolt escape instead of dodging or sprint but seems really unfair for other classes... I think gw2 has a different resource for dodge and sprint ect.

The problem people have with a separate resource for dodge/run/stealth is that it isn't "Elder Scrolls" enough. Need I remind those same people that in the single player ES games power attacks cost stamina too.