ESO is not a sci fi spaceship shoot-em up (or at least it shouldn't be)

Jordan_Black · September 22

Arcanist beam builds should thus be nerfed as hard as oakensoul - it could be a fun build to run around with, or if people want another ezmode (I'm not bashing - I actually love oakensoul builds), but nerfed hard enough where no high level players are using it in meta, and no content creators are recocommending it for anything other than an ez build. I'm getting sick of every raid and dungeon being just a huge lazer beam fest. It simply no longer looks like a fantasy game.

wolfie1.0. · September 22

Jordan_Black wrote: »

Arcanist beam builds should thus be nerfed as hard as oakensoul - it could be a fun build to run around with, or if people want another ezmode (I'm not bashing - I actually love oakensoul builds), but nerfed hard enough where no high level players are using it in meta, and no content creators are recocommending it for anything other than an ez build. I'm getting sick of every raid and dungeon being just a huge lazer beam fest. It simply no longer looks like a fantasy game.

Be disappointed then. It will be 3 to 6 months before anything is likely to change in that regard.

Herald of the tome is just too good of a class line not to take it.

Also, beams and such effects have always been present in the game. May I introduce.you to templars? Whose spammable, aoe, and execute are all light based weapons including similar beams? Or destruction staffs main spammable being a similar energy beam?

Jordan_Black · September 22

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

Jordan_Black wrote: »

Arcanist beam builds should thus be nerfed as hard as oakensoul - it could be a fun build to run around with, or if people want another ezmode (I'm not bashing - I actually love oakensoul builds), but nerfed hard enough where no high level players are using it in meta, and no content creators are recocommending it for anything other than an ez build. I'm getting sick of every raid and dungeon being just a huge lazer beam fest. It simply no longer looks like a fantasy game.

Be disappointed then. It will be 3 to 6 months before anything is likely to change in that regard.

Herald of the tome is just too good of a class line not to take it.

Also, beams and such effects have always been present in the game. May I introduce.you to templars? Whose spammable, aoe, and execute are all light based weapons including similar beams? Or destruction staffs main spammable being a similar energy beam?

LOL I've been waiting since the day arc launched - if they make my requested change 3 - 6 months from now, I will be absolutely pleased as punch. Templar beam and jabs still look fantasy.

Jordan_Black · September 22

And also templar beam and jabs are not and never have been so powerful that they are required use for every. single. trial. team. member. at high level.

Punches_Below_Belt · September 22

It is ridiculously immersion breaking like the day-glo gummy mounts, the other apex reward mounts with over-the-top spawn animations and Las Vegas showgirl adventurers. Being the “meta” just makes arcanist beams that much more ubiquitous and encourages more and more of the dim to latch onto it. I hate this Mundus timeline.

I know it pays the bills, but some moderation would be welcome. This stuff should be limited to player housing where only the owner needs to look at it. In fact, my personal feeling is that anything other than a horse or a camel mount, a dog or a cat pet should send the locals fleeing in terror and grouping to drive the “monsters” from their towns. But alas NPC’s don’t get to vote, or merit consideration from ZOS or the vast majority of the player base, “walking proudly in our winter coats, wearing smells from laboratories.”

There must be a whole team of artists who have been given instructions to focus solely on garish, Disneyesque/comic book creations that will sell crowns, and they are so far removed from the high fantasy/Tamriel milieu, they carry out there orders without a second thought.

I’d buy ESO the single player experience in a second to escape these abominations just to ride my chestnut mare to a fire at an inn and not have to walk through Times Square to do it.

tauriel01 · September 22

Arcanist was ZOS's answer to getting more people into more content... raising the floor on the DPS spread. On the low end you have the casual players, the people who can't or won't light attack weave, the people who aren't interested in practicing a rotation for hours on end, and the people who don't understand sets and rotations. ZOS had been trying for years to lower the ceiling on DPS... stuff like capping crit damage. It never worked. With oakensoul they started the effort to raise the floor. Now people who couldn't or wouldn't bar swap could still get decent DPS. Arc is the ultimate answer to raising the floor. They stopped caring that the top end elite players would now parse 120k or higher; it was just more important to raise the floor from sub-50k to something that could get them into vet content... more like 90k. But since Arc ALSO substantially raised the ceiling, the top end DPSers also played the class... most raids were 6 or more parse arcs. Subclassing is just doubling down on that concept. Now you can take the three most potent skill lines and stack them. The ceiling is now, what? 170k? More? I stopped following it. But it also raised the floor some more. Now anyone can tackle any content, which is pretty much what ZOS's goal was from what I can see. They have had many opportunities to nerf arcs. They have chosen repeatedly not to because it is doing EXACTLY what they wanted it to do. Beam isn't going anywhere, and if it distresses you so much to see it, this probably isn't the game for you anymore.

Jordan_Black · September 22

Punches_Below_Belt wrote: »

It is ridiculously immersion breaking like the day-glo gummy mounts, the other apex reward mounts with over-the-top spawn animations and Las Vegas showgirl adventurers. Being the “meta” just makes arcanist beams that much more ubiquitous and encourages more and more of the dim to latch onto it. I hate this Mundus timeline.

I know it pays the bills, but some moderation would be welcome. This stuff should be limited to player housing where only the owner needs to look at it. In fact, my personal felling is that anything other than a horse or a camel mount, a dog or a cat pet should send the locals fleeing in terror and grouping to drive the “monsters” from their towns. But alas NPC’s don’t get to vote, or merit consideration from ZOS or the vast majority of the player base, “walking proudly in our winter coats, wearing smells from laboratories.”

There must be a whole team of artists who have been given instructions to focus solely on garish, Disneyesque/comic book creations that will sell crowns, and they are so far removed from the high fantasy/Tamriel milieu, they carry out there orders without a second thought.

I’d buy ESO the single player experience in a second to escape these abominations just to ride my chestnut mare to a fire at an inn and not have to walk through Times Square to do it.

I agree with some of what you said here (I do not want the single player experience and flashier mounts don't bother me that much.) Flashy mounts pay the bills? Okay, do it, I want ESO to be profitable. But if my Arc lazer nerf suggestion goes through, meta players will build other metas at no loss of profit, every single trial will not look like a Las Vegas light show, and Average Arc Lazer Delve Clear Enjoyers can still go on clearing delves to their hearts' content.

Jordan_Black · September 22

tauriel01 wrote: »

Arcanist was ZOS's answer to getting more people into more content... raising the floor on the DPS spread. On the low end you have the casual players, the people who can't or won't light attack weave, the people who aren't interested in practicing a rotation for hours on end, and the people who don't understand sets and rotations. ZOS had been trying for years to lower the ceiling on DPS... stuff like capping crit damage. It never worked. With oakensoul they started the effort to raise the floor. Now people who couldn't or wouldn't bar swap could still get decent DPS. Arc is the ultimate answer to raising the floor. They stopped caring that the top end elite players would now parse 120k or higher; it was just more important to raise the floor from sub-50k to something that could get them into vet content... more like 90k. But since Arc ALSO substantially raised the ceiling, the top end DPSers also played the class... most raids were 6 or more parse arcs. Subclassing is just doubling down on that concept. Now you can take the three most potent skill lines and stack them. The ceiling is now, what? 170k? More? I stopped following it. But it also raised the floor some more. Now anyone can tackle any content, which is pretty much what ZOS's goal was from what I can see. They have had many opportunities to nerf arcs. They have chosen repeatedly not to because it is doing EXACTLY what they wanted it to do. Beam isn't going anywhere, and if it distresses you so much to see it, this probably isn't the game for you anymore.

This is exactly what I am saying. If Arc lazer builds raised the floor to 90k but lowered your ceiling to 110k, it would solve the problem. Pleased as punch. This is doable. I want this to happen. I don't want them to remove it from the game, I want them to nerf the high end of it into oblivion.

Jordan_Black · September 22

I mean, I wouldn't be upset if they removed it from the game either I guess but yes, I understand why it is there.

twisttop138 · September 22

tauriel01 wrote: »

Arcanist was ZOS's answer to getting more people into more content... raising the floor on the DPS spread. On the low end you have the casual players, the people who can't or won't light attack weave, the people who aren't interested in practicing a rotation for hours on end, and the people who don't understand sets and rotations. ZOS had been trying for years to lower the ceiling on DPS... stuff like capping crit damage. It never worked. With oakensoul they started the effort to raise the floor. Now people who couldn't or wouldn't bar swap could still get decent DPS. Arc is the ultimate answer to raising the floor. They stopped caring that the top end elite players would now parse 120k or higher; it was just more important to raise the floor from sub-50k to something that could get them into vet content... more like 90k. But since Arc ALSO substantially raised the ceiling, the top end DPSers also played the class... most raids were 6 or more parse arcs. Subclassing is just doubling down on that concept. Now you can take the three most potent skill lines and stack them. The ceiling is now, what? 170k? More? I stopped following it. But it also raised the floor some more. Now anyone can tackle any content, which is pretty much what ZOS's goal was from what I can see. They have had many opportunities to nerf arcs. They have chosen repeatedly not to because it is doing EXACTLY what they wanted it to do. Beam isn't going anywhere, and if it distresses you so much to see it, this probably isn't the game for you anymore.

This exactly. So many members of my social guild have been able to start raiding on a level more than normal that multiple vet trials teaching run nights had to be established and a prog team. Disabled vets, senior citizens and more have been able to take part in stuff they never could before. I think this is exactly what they intended with arc and the velothi.

I saw a recent rich Lambert interview quoted on the forums that was quite illuminating on this. He kinda misses the meta and says if you don't like it you don't need to run it. I think that misses the mark and disregards the experience of high end players that have to run what's best for the team. To be clear I'm not one of those guys, I'm learning hard mode trials but still run an arc plar DK to get the best damage possible for my team.

But I think that ZOS has had many chances to bring arc in line with other classes and have not. They seem to have done their best to get around it with easy things like class mastery. I think the lack of changes speaks loudly. If many many people are having a good time with it and then some of us are not, they will probably side with the many.

To be clear, while it doesn't bother me to see beams and I don't mind running it, I have fun with the class (the spending time raiding with my friends is what's important to me) I would not be upset if things are brought in line. Let's maybe try to get to the place where everyone enjoys things and can choose to run what they want in any content. I think though that, with the way things have been going, the argument should be to buff up instead of nerf cause it doesn't look like that's on the table for awhile.

Jordan_Black · September 22

twisttop138 wrote: »

tauriel01 wrote: »

Arcanist was ZOS's answer to getting more people into more content... raising the floor on the DPS spread. On the low end you have the casual players, the people who can't or won't light attack weave, the people who aren't interested in practicing a rotation for hours on end, and the people who don't understand sets and rotations. ZOS had been trying for years to lower the ceiling on DPS... stuff like capping crit damage. It never worked. With oakensoul they started the effort to raise the floor. Now people who couldn't or wouldn't bar swap could still get decent DPS. Arc is the ultimate answer to raising the floor. They stopped caring that the top end elite players would now parse 120k or higher; it was just more important to raise the floor from sub-50k to something that could get them into vet content... more like 90k. But since Arc ALSO substantially raised the ceiling, the top end DPSers also played the class... most raids were 6 or more parse arcs. Subclassing is just doubling down on that concept. Now you can take the three most potent skill lines and stack them. The ceiling is now, what? 170k? More? I stopped following it. But it also raised the floor some more. Now anyone can tackle any content, which is pretty much what ZOS's goal was from what I can see. They have had many opportunities to nerf arcs. They have chosen repeatedly not to because it is doing EXACTLY what they wanted it to do. Beam isn't going anywhere, and if it distresses you so much to see it, this probably isn't the game for you anymore.

This exactly. So many members of my social guild have been able to start raiding on a level more than normal that multiple vet trials teaching run nights had to be established and a prog team. Disabled vets, senior citizens and more have been able to take part in stuff they never could before. I think this is exactly what they intended with arc and the velothi.

I saw a recent rich Lambert interview quoted on the forums that was quite illuminating on this. He kinda misses the meta and says if you don't like it you don't need to run it. I think that misses the mark and disregards the experience of high end players that have to run what's best for the team. To be clear I'm not one of those guys, I'm learning hard mode trials but still run an arc plar DK to get the best damage possible for my team.

But I think that ZOS has had many chances to bring arc in line with other classes and have not. They seem to have done their best to get around it with easy things like class mastery. I think the lack of changes speaks loudly. If many many people are having a good time with it and then some of us are not, they will probably side with the many.

To be clear, while it doesn't bother me to see beams and I don't mind running it, I have fun with the class (the spending time raiding with my friends is what's important to me) I would not be upset if things are brought in line. Let's maybe try to get to the place where everyone enjoys things and can choose to run what they want in any content. I think though that, with the way things have been going, the argument should be to buff up instead of nerf cause it doesn't look like that's on the table for awhile.

" Disabled vets, senior citizens and more have been able to take part in stuff they never could before. I think this is exactly what they intended with arc and the velothi."

I love this. Oakensoul was wonderful for this reason. But a) why does it need to look like a space ship lazer, and b) why does it not only need to be floor raising but also ceiling raising? Surely ZOS has someone on staff who can figure out the mathematics for this to work right, to not have every single trial be SPACE LAZER MANIA

twisttop138 · September 22

Jordan_Black wrote: »

twisttop138 wrote: »

tauriel01 wrote: »

Arcanist was ZOS's answer to getting more people into more content... raising the floor on the DPS spread. On the low end you have the casual players, the people who can't or won't light attack weave, the people who aren't interested in practicing a rotation for hours on end, and the people who don't understand sets and rotations. ZOS had been trying for years to lower the ceiling on DPS... stuff like capping crit damage. It never worked. With oakensoul they started the effort to raise the floor. Now people who couldn't or wouldn't bar swap could still get decent DPS. Arc is the ultimate answer to raising the floor. They stopped caring that the top end elite players would now parse 120k or higher; it was just more important to raise the floor from sub-50k to something that could get them into vet content... more like 90k. But since Arc ALSO substantially raised the ceiling, the top end DPSers also played the class... most raids were 6 or more parse arcs. Subclassing is just doubling down on that concept. Now you can take the three most potent skill lines and stack them. The ceiling is now, what? 170k? More? I stopped following it. But it also raised the floor some more. Now anyone can tackle any content, which is pretty much what ZOS's goal was from what I can see. They have had many opportunities to nerf arcs. They have chosen repeatedly not to because it is doing EXACTLY what they wanted it to do. Beam isn't going anywhere, and if it distresses you so much to see it, this probably isn't the game for you anymore.

This exactly. So many members of my social guild have been able to start raiding on a level more than normal that multiple vet trials teaching run nights had to be established and a prog team. Disabled vets, senior citizens and more have been able to take part in stuff they never could before. I think this is exactly what they intended with arc and the velothi.

I saw a recent rich Lambert interview quoted on the forums that was quite illuminating on this. He kinda misses the meta and says if you don't like it you don't need to run it. I think that misses the mark and disregards the experience of high end players that have to run what's best for the team. To be clear I'm not one of those guys, I'm learning hard mode trials but still run an arc plar DK to get the best damage possible for my team.

But I think that ZOS has had many chances to bring arc in line with other classes and have not. They seem to have done their best to get around it with easy things like class mastery. I think the lack of changes speaks loudly. If many many people are having a good time with it and then some of us are not, they will probably side with the many.

To be clear, while it doesn't bother me to see beams and I don't mind running it, I have fun with the class (the spending time raiding with my friends is what's important to me) I would not be upset if things are brought in line. Let's maybe try to get to the place where everyone enjoys things and can choose to run what they want in any content. I think though that, with the way things have been going, the argument should be to buff up instead of nerf cause it doesn't look like that's on the table for awhile.

" Disabled vets, senior citizens and more have been able to take part in stuff they never could before. I think this is exactly what they intended with arc and the velothi."

I love this. Oakensoul was wonderful for this reason. But a) why does it need to look like a space ship lazer, and b) why does it not only need to be floor raising but also ceiling raising? Surely ZOS has someone on staff who can figure out the mathematics for this to work right, to not have every single trial be SPACE LAZER MANIA

I don't think you're wrong as it's your opinion. It's just an aesthetic opinion. I'm not having the same experience as I don't mind it, but it's cool not to. I kinda wish it looked more like Mora's magic as that is what it's supposed to be. A channel of, and I'll probably butcher this spelling, apocryphal magick. From a sacred tome or maybe a black book like the one you discover on the necrom story. I don't know that it's ever explained. It would be kinda hard for them to please everyone though.

Edit to add. As for your second point. I'm not sure man. How do they raise DPS for people who struggle without making it accessible to everyone? That's not a question I can answer.

tomofhyrule · September 22

Jordan_Black wrote: »

twisttop138 wrote: »

tauriel01 wrote: »

Arcanist was ZOS's answer to getting more people into more content... raising the floor on the DPS spread. On the low end you have the casual players, the people who can't or won't light attack weave, the people who aren't interested in practicing a rotation for hours on end, and the people who don't understand sets and rotations. ZOS had been trying for years to lower the ceiling on DPS... stuff like capping crit damage. It never worked. With oakensoul they started the effort to raise the floor. Now people who couldn't or wouldn't bar swap could still get decent DPS. Arc is the ultimate answer to raising the floor. They stopped caring that the top end elite players would now parse 120k or higher; it was just more important to raise the floor from sub-50k to something that could get them into vet content... more like 90k. But since Arc ALSO substantially raised the ceiling, the top end DPSers also played the class... most raids were 6 or more parse arcs. Subclassing is just doubling down on that concept. Now you can take the three most potent skill lines and stack them. The ceiling is now, what? 170k? More? I stopped following it. But it also raised the floor some more. Now anyone can tackle any content, which is pretty much what ZOS's goal was from what I can see. They have had many opportunities to nerf arcs. They have chosen repeatedly not to because it is doing EXACTLY what they wanted it to do. Beam isn't going anywhere, and if it distresses you so much to see it, this probably isn't the game for you anymore.

This exactly. So many members of my social guild have been able to start raiding on a level more than normal that multiple vet trials teaching run nights had to be established and a prog team. Disabled vets, senior citizens and more have been able to take part in stuff they never could before. I think this is exactly what they intended with arc and the velothi.

I saw a recent rich Lambert interview quoted on the forums that was quite illuminating on this. He kinda misses the meta and says if you don't like it you don't need to run it. I think that misses the mark and disregards the experience of high end players that have to run what's best for the team. To be clear I'm not one of those guys, I'm learning hard mode trials but still run an arc plar DK to get the best damage possible for my team.

But I think that ZOS has had many chances to bring arc in line with other classes and have not. They seem to have done their best to get around it with easy things like class mastery. I think the lack of changes speaks loudly. If many many people are having a good time with it and then some of us are not, they will probably side with the many.

To be clear, while it doesn't bother me to see beams and I don't mind running it, I have fun with the class (the spending time raiding with my friends is what's important to me) I would not be upset if things are brought in line. Let's maybe try to get to the place where everyone enjoys things and can choose to run what they want in any content. I think though that, with the way things have been going, the argument should be to buff up instead of nerf cause it doesn't look like that's on the table for awhile.

" Disabled vets, senior citizens and more have been able to take part in stuff they never could before. I think this is exactly what they intended with arc and the velothi."

I love this. Oakensoul was wonderful for this reason. But a) why does it need to look like a space ship lazer, and b) why does it not only need to be floor raising but also ceiling raising? Surely ZOS has someone on staff who can figure out the mathematics for this to work right, to not have every single trial be SPACE LAZER MANIA

The problem is it's impossible to raise the floor without also raising the ceiling.* Everything that they've ever done to try to bring the damage down at the top end, the top 1% has bounced back and then some within a few weeks. The group that gets hit the hardest is the group who is comfortably doing vets, who now can't bounce back as easily.

*ok, fine, there is one way they can do it, but it does against every philosophy of combat and will absolutely drive people away: capping damage. They already capped crit damage at 125%, but if they ever came out and said that raw damage was also capped, people would riot.
...however, considering that crit damage and basic resistances do have caps, I could totally see them eventually deciding to put caps on weapon/spell damage and/or crit chance. That would definitely infuriate a lot of people, but it would be the only way they could actually serve the goal of lowering the ceiling without lowering the floor as well.

Jordan_Black · September 22

[/quote]

The problem is it's impossible to raise the floor without also raising the ceiling.* Everything that they've ever done to try to bring the damage down at the top end, the top 1% has bounced back and then some within a few weeks. The group that gets hit the hardest is the group who is comfortably doing vets, who now can't bounce back as easily.

*ok, fine, there is one way they can do it, but it does against every philosophy of combat and will absolutely drive people away: capping damage. They already capped crit damage at 125%, but if they ever came out and said that raw damage was also capped, people would riot.
...however, considering that crit damage and basic resistances do have caps, I could totally see them eventually deciding to put caps on weapon/spell damage and/or crit chance. That would definitely infuriate a lot of people, but it would be the only way they could actually serve the goal of lowering the ceiling without lowering the floor as well.[/quote]

I'm not sure it's the *only* way to do it. You could probably introduce parabolic equations for calculating damage, but that might require a whole new datacenter or something. I know something about mathematics and software, but I don't know much about hardware.

But, cap damage? Sure. Cap *beam* damage. That's it. Just beam. I can't imagine people will get too upset about this. I mean, oblivion damage is often capped, which has the result of no one using it at the high end. Which is what I want. It will work. It can be done.

And while they're at it, don't make it look like a spaceship laser?

moderatelyfatman · September 22

Read @Jordan_Black

Jordan_Black · September 22

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

ZOS raised the floor on the arcanist to get new players in. The problem is that they raised the floor so high that it's above the ceilings of some of the other classes.

O awesome man I totally didn't know this kthxbai i'll delete my post.

wolfie1.0. · September 22

Jordan_Black wrote: »

And also templar beam and jabs are not and never have been so powerful that they are required use for every. single. trial. team. member. at high level.

Its been a long while, but at one point ya that was the case.

Jordan_Black · September 22

wolfie1.0. wrote: »

Jordan_Black wrote: »

And also templar beam and jabs are not and never have been so powerful that they are required use for every. single. trial. team. member. at high level.

Its been a long while, but at one point ya that was the case.

May it be this way for arc beam!

wolfie1.0. · September 22

Jordan_Black wrote: »

The problem is it's impossible to raise the floor without also raising the ceiling.* Everything that they've ever done to try to bring the damage down at the top end, the top 1% has bounced back and then some within a few weeks. The group that gets hit the hardest is the group who is comfortably doing vets, who now can't bounce back as easily.

*ok, fine, there is one way they can do it, but it does against every philosophy of combat and will absolutely drive people away: capping damage. They already capped crit damage at 125%, but if they ever came out and said that raw damage was also capped, people would riot.
...however, considering that crit damage and basic resistances do have caps, I could totally see them eventually deciding to put caps on weapon/spell damage and/or crit chance. That would definitely infuriate a lot of people, but it would be the only way they could actually serve the goal of lowering the ceiling without lowering the floor as well.[/quote]

I'm not sure it's the *only* way to do it. You could probably introduce parabolic equations for calculating damage, but that might require a whole new datacenter or something. I know something about mathematics and software, but I don't know much about hardware.

But, cap damage? Sure. Cap *beam* damage. That's it. Just beam. I can't imagine people will get too upset about this. I mean, oblivion damage is often capped, which has the result of no one using it at the high end. Which is what I want. It will work. It can be done.

And while they're at it, don't make it look like a spaceship laser?[/quote]

Probably to sell the class. Its the closest thing to p2w they have had.

But like I said, its not going to change for months to half a year.

Even then beam isnt going to be unbalanced.

So get used to it. Just like I had to get used to having bat wings in my face for years on end. Or the unholy new jabs animation.

DenverRalphy · September 22

A bit late to the party, but one quick item of note..

Oakensoul raises the floor and lowers the ceiling. So yeah, it's possible.

Fischblut · September 22

Fatecarver is the coolest-looking skill in the game for me! The satisfaction of charging my laser at the pack of mobs is unmatched by anything combat-related in any game I've played

Few months ago I had lot of fun with NPC version of Azandar thanks to this skill (and to subclassing, which allowed my character to use it, because my Arcanists unlocked him long time ago):

https://youtu.be/dfsLf5-x7vg

If only Azandar could use this skill after he becomes Companion

I also love seeing players use it so we can cross our beams

This brings me lot of joy, and being able to live in colorful fantasy world is important part of MMO for me.

There are lot of colorful beams in ESO, but Fatecarver is the best and the most epic

Also, ally player version of this skill was toned down very soon after the release of Arcanist... You can only see it in full glory from yourself, NPCs or enemy players. And with beams, the picture is much more clear than when there are dozens of different abilities and combat pets on the boss fight.

Jaimeh · September 22

I don't like the visual of the beam either, it's super tiring on the eyes, especially when there's a few of them targeted on the same mob. It's not only the beam shape itself but the colour of it, this fluorescent toxic green is a bit jarring and feels a little out of place in the game. I'm used to it by now, but I wouldn't say no to a toning down of arc skills in general (at least on the user end so we could have the option to tune it down on our screens).

redlink1979 · September 22

Radiate77 · September 22

It’s not just Fatecarver, even the healing one looks terrible. These skills should not be channeled, just look at how they’re used… Fatecarver is 50%* of an Arcanist rotation. If the fear is that the class would play more like Dragonknight with Seething stacks, or a Nightblade with Bow procs, then why did they design themself into that corner to begin with?

Accessibility is already available with Heavy Attack builds, and has been for quite some time. Why release a class with a single skill making up most of the rotation, when all we needed were more options for Heavy Attack builds? For example, they easily could have made Two-Handers cleave better, or Dual-Wield and Bow do much better Single-Target.

Instead of easy solutions, this is what we got.

(*Probably a higher percentage for most people.)

Soarora · September 22

It’s a magic blast coming out of a book. It’s not a laser gun. Therefore, not immersion breaking. Hell, you can make a beam in Skyrim with enough points in Destruction by slotting chain lightning or blizzard or whatever in both hands. If the problem’s that it looks too smooth… look at instances of “wizards fight by shooting giant beams of magic at each other in a tug of war” scenes. Same thing.

noblecron · September 22

I just wanna be viable without needed to slap arcanist on

Orbital78 · September 22

tauriel01 wrote: »

Arcanist was ZOS's answer to getting more people into more content... raising the floor on the DPS spread. On the low end you have the casual players, the people who can't or won't light attack weave, the people who aren't interested in practicing a rotation for hours on end, and the people who don't understand sets and rotations. ZOS had been trying for years to lower the ceiling on DPS... stuff like capping crit damage. It never worked. With oakensoul they started the effort to raise the floor. Now people who couldn't or wouldn't bar swap could still get decent DPS. Arc is the ultimate answer to raising the floor. They stopped caring that the top end elite players would now parse 120k or higher; it was just more important to raise the floor from sub-50k to something that could get them into vet content... more like 90k. But since Arc ALSO substantially raised the ceiling, the top end DPSers also played the class... most raids were 6 or more parse arcs. Subclassing is just doubling down on that concept. Now you can take the three most potent skill lines and stack them. The ceiling is now, what? 170k? More? I stopped following it. But it also raised the floor some more. Now anyone can tackle any content, which is pretty much what ZOS's goal was from what I can see. They have had many opportunities to nerf arcs. They have chosen repeatedly not to because it is doing EXACTLY what they wanted it to do. Beam isn't going anywhere, and if it distresses you so much to see it, this probably isn't the game for you anymore.

Oakensoul with heavy attacks started to help newer player and less experienced, but heavy attacks were nerfed to herald in Arcanist. Probably mostly because they couldn't figure out how to prevent the pvp damage. Personally I don't see the problem with Arcanist, but do think they need to look at other class skills to give them more use/love. I would love to see jabby jabs get more power. Sorc heavy attackers got another nerf recently with the loss of 8% resource pool. I really wish they would replace some of the loss of power via buffing/unnerfing void mantle's resources, passive adjustment, or improving sets like undaunted unweaver and infiltrator (I think that is the mag and stam sets) and replace the stat parts with crit dmg or sd/wd. They keep adding heavy attack themed sets and mythics and not actually knowing what is needed to make it fun. I don't think anyone is going to use the next mythic.

Anyways Arcanist is obviously very powerful because of its cleave potential, but it is also very fun to player because they nerfed many of the viable aoe farming builds. I would not be opposed to the ability to tone down others special effects, heck I would like a way to turn off others emote sounds as well. Not everyone appreciates bards all the time. I have no clue what the top end dps is anymore, I stopped doing end game for the most part because it stopped being fun getting close to clearing the content then being nerfed and set back 6 months.

Orbital78 · September 22

noblecron wrote: »

I just wanna be viable without needed to slap arcanist on

Even the red headed stepchildren of the community heavy attackers are viable to a point. If you mean viable in hardmode or super true end game then prepare to be disappointed unless you can master light weaving and become part of the 120+k club and even then you might not be able to do that level of content. I've seen all classes pretty much able to top arcanists if they are top tier, even wardens (which is rarer).

mdjessup4906 · September 22

The battlespire is a literal space station.
And Remans empire had an space program (aethernauts).
Also the dwemer exist.

The hell tes, and by extension eso, isnt sci-fi lol.

Arc beam 1000% lore approved.

mdjessup4906 · September 22

Balance problems and not liking the playstyle is a different problem.

moderatelyfatman · 3:24AM

Jordan_Black wrote: »

moderatelyfatman wrote: »

ZOS raised the floor on the arcanist to get new players in. The problem is that they raised the floor so high that it's above the ceilings of some of the other classes.

O awesome man I totally didn't know this kthxbai i'll delete my post.

Sorry man. I shoulda quoted you.