Star-Made knight achievement is now impossible to complete

Gopher · February 22

Okay, so I rarely make threads in general, but I thought this is something that should be talked about.

While PvP may not be the main focus for a lot of people in this game, it is for me and the Star-Made Knight title was one I waited for nearly the whole year for, just waiting for this event so I could complete it. Only to find out...
The related achievement for this title is now impossible to complete. Simply because of one change zos made for this event... removing scrolls of Pelinal's Ferocity.

I had collected a scroll from a previous event, and was waiting on this one to read it. The scroll is unreadable, lacking even a "use" option on it. I tried putting it on my quick-use bar, which did nothing, I even tried multiple campaigns which also did nothing. I tried deleting the scroll to complete the quest again to see if it'd give me another, which it didn't.

I've been waiting for several months in anticipation of this one event so I could get this title, only to find that zos' quality of life change had made it so I couldn't. I'm not sure if this is just a simple case of an oversight, but is there really nothing that can be done for this now? I really wanted this title and the wreath, and now I can't

@ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_GinaBruno

I have made a support ticket and will send it to those I have tagged in my thread.

ZOS_GinaBruno · February 22

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

aruthandys · February 22

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Why not just put the scroll on a crate or barrel either near the quest NPC or at the Impressario? Granted I don't know how much coding it would take but surely a single person could code this to work during the current event.

colossalvoids · February 22

aruthandys wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Why not just put the scroll on a crate or barrel either near the quest NPC or at the Impressario? Granted I don't know how much coding it would take but surely a single person could code this to work during the current event.

Even if they'll readd scrolls those are made into unusable item, they need to revert it or make other changes.

Reginald_leBlem · February 22

Why not let us interact with the scroll and turn it into an emote or something

Four_Fingers · February 22

I am speechless...
Just remove the Echo of Pelinial's Fury from the requirements.
Real head scratcher. lol

kringled_1 · February 22

Dekrypted wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

@ZOS_GinaBruno So does this mean that for this event, the Achievement will not be available? Just trying to get some kind of clarification.

Just a guess, but if you have an account that's new, then yes, it won't be possible. If your account has been around and read the scroll in a previous mayhem, but not completed the achievement for one of the other parts, then you can probably complete it this time through.

xurkane · February 22

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

At the very least it would be nice if Echo of Pelinal's Fury could be removed as a prerequisite for Star-Made Knight until you can come up with a solution for Echo of Pelinal's Fury in the future.

IncultaWolf · February 22

I'm not sure how anyone didn't see this coming

Gopher · February 22

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Others have given suggestions on what to do about this, such as removing the requirement, etc..

How about we just replace this one requirement with the "Scamp of Mayhem" achievement?

This would make it so that another achievement does not need to be created, and the amount of achievements needed for the title is the same. Just take this achievement which does not provide anything, and replace it for the broken one.

virtus753 · February 22

Gopher wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Others have given suggestions on what to do about this, such as removing the requirement, etc..

How about we just replace this one requirement with the "Scamp of Mayhem" achievement?

This would make it so that another achievement does not need to be created, and the amount of achievements needed for the title is the same. Just take this achievement which does not provide anything, and replace it for the broken one.

A new achievement (mechanics wise) would need to be created to do that. It sounds like they will have to do exactly that and that it will not be doable on the fly during this iteration of the event.

When they release new apartments and update the achievement for entering an apartment, they replace the old version of the achievement with a new one adding the new apartment to the list of eligible homes. It is named the same but replaces the old one, resetting its progress, so people who had the achievement before get it again once they enter any apartment.

Gopher · February 22

virtus753 wrote: »

Gopher wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Others have given suggestions on what to do about this, such as removing the requirement, etc..

How about we just replace this one requirement with the "Scamp of Mayhem" achievement?

This would make it so that another achievement does not need to be created, and the amount of achievements needed for the title is the same. Just take this achievement which does not provide anything, and replace it for the broken one.

A new achievement (mechanics wise) would need to be created to do that. It sounds like they will have to do exactly that and that it will not be doable on the fly during this iteration of the event.

When they release new apartments and update the achievement for entering an apartment, they replace the old version of the achievement with a new one adding the new apartment to the list of eligible homes. It is named the same but replaces the old one, resetting its progress, so people who had the achievement before get it again once they enter any apartment.

Yeah, I just wish I didn't have to wait another full year

virtus753 · February 22

Gopher wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Gopher wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Others have given suggestions on what to do about this, such as removing the requirement, etc..

How about we just replace this one requirement with the "Scamp of Mayhem" achievement?

This would make it so that another achievement does not need to be created, and the amount of achievements needed for the title is the same. Just take this achievement which does not provide anything, and replace it for the broken one.

A new achievement (mechanics wise) would need to be created to do that. It sounds like they will have to do exactly that and that it will not be doable on the fly during this iteration of the event.

When they release new apartments and update the achievement for entering an apartment, they replace the old version of the achievement with a new one adding the new apartment to the list of eligible homes. It is named the same but replaces the old one, resetting its progress, so people who had the achievement before get it again once they enter any apartment.

Yeah, I just wish I didn't have to wait another full year

This event was renamed in part because they started to run it more than once per year. Whether they can have this fixed in time for the next iteration, whenever exactly that will be, is another question.

Dagoth_Rac · February 22

Gopher wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Gopher wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Others have given suggestions on what to do about this, such as removing the requirement, etc..

How about we just replace this one requirement with the "Scamp of Mayhem" achievement?

This would make it so that another achievement does not need to be created, and the amount of achievements needed for the title is the same. Just take this achievement which does not provide anything, and replace it for the broken one.

A new achievement (mechanics wise) would need to be created to do that. It sounds like they will have to do exactly that and that it will not be doable on the fly during this iteration of the event.

When they release new apartments and update the achievement for entering an apartment, they replace the old version of the achievement with a new one adding the new apartment to the list of eligible homes. It is named the same but replaces the old one, resetting its progress, so people who had the achievement before get it again once they enter any apartment.

Yeah, I just wish I didn't have to wait another full year

This is a biannual event. There will be another Whitestrake event in July-ish.

acastanza_ESO · February 22

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Fixing this for "a future Whitestrake's Mayhem" is not an acceptable solution. This is an issue that must be hotfixed. There is zero legitimate reason for ZOS's regular inability to produce timely fixes.

Gopher · February 22

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Gopher wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Gopher wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Others have given suggestions on what to do about this, such as removing the requirement, etc..

How about we just replace this one requirement with the "Scamp of Mayhem" achievement?

This would make it so that another achievement does not need to be created, and the amount of achievements needed for the title is the same. Just take this achievement which does not provide anything, and replace it for the broken one.

A new achievement (mechanics wise) would need to be created to do that. It sounds like they will have to do exactly that and that it will not be doable on the fly during this iteration of the event.

When they release new apartments and update the achievement for entering an apartment, they replace the old version of the achievement with a new one adding the new apartment to the list of eligible homes. It is named the same but replaces the old one, resetting its progress, so people who had the achievement before get it again once they enter any apartment.

Yeah, I just wish I didn't have to wait another full year

This is a biannual event. There will be another Whitestrake event in July-ish.

Ah, well thats kinda good news I guess

acastanza_ESO · February 22

@ZOS_BrianWheeler you've said repeatedly that PVP is still a focus for this game. Issue like this that ZOS can't or won't fix in a timely manner (during the event that they affect) proves that this is not the case.

Dagoth_Rac · February 22

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Fixing this for "a future Whitestrake's Mayhem" is not an acceptable solution. This is an issue that must be hotfixed. There is zero legitimate reason for ZOS's regular inability to produce timely fixes.

Many issues simply cannot be "hotfixed". They can only be fixed by taking down the game, pushing a new patch to the players, and all the other stuff associated with patch maintenance. And taking down the game, again, in the middle of an event, will likely enrage way more people than having to wait until July to get an achievement.

Should ZOS have realized that removing the functionality of the Pelinal scroll would break an achievement? Yes. This was poorly thought out. But the cure cannot be worse than the disease. Having to wait a few months to get a cosmetic title is not the kind of game-breaking bug that requires developers to drop everything and take down the game to fix it. Dumb bug? Yes. Embarrassing bug? Yes. Critical bug? No.

sarahthes · February 22

<snip>

I suggest for the future, if you want to make sure things such as this work and are fixed before an event goes live, you participate in the relevant pts.

Which would have been in October.

Right now they are working on the jesters and anniversary events, and I assume that and Gold Road are where most of their QA staff are focused.

<snipped removed quote>

sarahthes · February 22

Dekrypted wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Creohan wrote: »

I have never ever posted on this forum despite playing on/off from 2016.

T H I S :

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

... has to be the most ************************************************** answer I have ever read from a company employee in my whole life. And I ain't young.

So, mr/mrs/them/they/dragon GinaBruno, please be so kind as to speak to your team leader, which in turn I hope *they* will speak to the development department and drop an unplanned task on the board they use, to make this HOTFIX happen ........ A-S-A-P.

It is most infuriating to hear that this company is unable to make a fixpack which only takes about 2 days of emails, useless calls and meetings and 30 mins of coding.

And also please advise further up the manager ladder that not being able to provide such an easy fix in time, despite being an oversight on your company's part, is a good sign you might as well file for bankruptcy because your business model just fails.

With great love,
An extremely concerned client which waited for this "event" for years

I suggest for the future, if you want to make sure things such as this work and are fixed before an event goes live, you participate in the relevant pts.

Which would have been in October.

Right now they are working on the jesters and anniversary events, and I assume that and Gold Road are where most of their QA staff are focused.

Not sure if you've been over to that category, but there's about half a page full of threads asking about more communication and wondering if there's even a point in participating in it. We're not the quality team that test's these things. We're the consumer..

If they respond to every single bug report in detail, they would have less time to work on the actual bug fixes. From what I've seen, though, actual bugs do get logged and eventually fixed.

Feedback on game direction is certainly listened to. Just because they don't change things the way the loudest players think they should be changed doesn't mean they're not listening. It just means that they are choosing a different direction.

sharquez · February 22

Easy there all, I know y'all want your worthless achievement points now, But the communal internet pretend toy can't have its "doubtlessly life-shattering impact" on you fixed yet because several million players are using it.

It's a shame a minor inconvenience slipped through on the giant freaking game world that constantly gets updated, but I'm sure you will all live.

Now if y'all could find something better to do, than crucify the devs over a hiccup that won't actually affect you in any way other than minor annoyance if you are a well-adjusted person, that would be great

ApoAlaia · February 22

sarahthes wrote: »

Creohan wrote: »

[Snippety Snipsnip]

I suggest for the future, if you want to make sure things such as this work and are fixed before an event goes live, you participate in the relevant pts.

Which would have been in October.

Right now they are working on the jesters and anniversary events, and I assume that and Gold Road are where most of their QA staff are focused.

That is the thing.

There are most definitely people in the dev team that can fix this, but I sincerely doubt they are sitting on their hands waiting for work to come their way.

Furthermore they will want to think this through so the fix doesn't become another oversight and test it before implementing it on live.

Like I get that is frustrating, I wanted to get the achievement on my BB alt this Mayhem too however I just don't think is realistic the expect them to 'stop the presses' to work on a 'hotfix' for a non game-breaking issue.

code65536 · February 22

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Fixing this for "a future Whitestrake's Mayhem" is not an acceptable solution. This is an issue that must be hotfixed. There is zero legitimate reason for ZOS's regular inability to produce timely fixes.

You can't hotfix this. A fix like this would require a client update. By the time they decide how to fix it, make the necessary code changes, get the text changes translated into all the supported languages, and then the client built and certified for console, the event would be over.

There's just no way.

FlopsyPrince · February 22

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

@ZOS_BrianWheeler you've said repeatedly that PVP is still a focus for this game. Issue like this that ZOS can't or won't fix in a timely manner (during the event that they affect) proves that this is not the case.

It is not a PvP issue, it is a "does it benefit some players too much" like an exploit would. Those get almost instant patches. Other things do not.

ZOS really needs a group that reviews changes like removing the scroll and figures out what bad impacts that could have. In the cyber security field it is "abuse case" thinking. It is often skipped/missed, but is vitally important.

I would bet they could make a small group from vocal people on the forums to think many of these things out as well.

Even searching for "Where is the scroll used?" would have quickly found the achievement and actively patched the problem well ahead of time. Surely removing the need for the scroll was noted ahead of time.

virtus753 · February 22

Dekrypted wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Gopher wrote: »

virtus753 wrote: »

Gopher wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Thanks for the heads up about this! We're going to look at how we can fix this so the achievement can be obtained again in a future Whitestrake's Mayhem event.

Others have given suggestions on what to do about this, such as removing the requirement, etc..

How about we just replace this one requirement with the "Scamp of Mayhem" achievement?

This would make it so that another achievement does not need to be created, and the amount of achievements needed for the title is the same. Just take this achievement which does not provide anything, and replace it for the broken one.

A new achievement (mechanics wise) would need to be created to do that. It sounds like they will have to do exactly that and that it will not be doable on the fly during this iteration of the event.

When they release new apartments and update the achievement for entering an apartment, they replace the old version of the achievement with a new one adding the new apartment to the list of eligible homes. It is named the same but replaces the old one, resetting its progress, so people who had the achievement before get it again once they enter any apartment.

Yeah, I just wish I didn't have to wait another full year

This event was renamed in part because they started to run it more than once per year. Whether they can have this fixed in time for the next iteration, whenever exactly that will be, is another question.

That's the thing. With the change, there will still be months, likely 4 - 6 months before the chance comes up again. PvP isn't the focus, clearly. It does kind of stink that these things aren't able to get fixed in a hotfix type of way to allow people to get a chance at getting these right away versus having to wait so long. This event doesn't happen very often compared to the PvE events that happen without notice, or almost every month (it feels like, atleast.)

The significant issues with events are very clearly not limited to PvP ones, and Kevin has been open in acknowledging that they are very limited in terms of what they can get fixed within the timeframe of a single event. They even had to discontinue a major feature last event due to time constraints. It isn’t just about needing more focus on PvP—they aren’t ignoring PvP events while fixing PvE ones. They can’t make fixes possible within a PvP event that they couldn’t do during a PvE one either. I wish they could get these fixes done more quickly, not just because of the relative rarity of PvP events but because everyone would be happier with a more efficient process.

sharquez · February 22

Just trying to put some perspective out there before the pitchforks put someone's eye out.

They said a fix is coming, nothing wrong with polite reminders on the road there but it's not getting fixed overnight.

To make unreasonable demands and threats is far worse than a tongue-in-cheek reality check.

Impotent rage is not constructive.

Creohan · February 22

sharquez wrote: »

Just trying to put some perspective out there before the pitchforks put someone's eye out.

They said a fix is coming, nothing wrong with polite reminders on the road there but it's not getting fixed overnight.

To make unreasonable demands and threats is far worse than a tongue-in-cheek reality check.

Impotent rage is not constructive.

I don't see any impotent rage around this thread, but then again we all see what we want to see.
And I want to see a promise delivered.
Sure we can dance around with words like "unreasonable demands and threats", but please ask yourself this:
At the end of day which mouth would you feed ? The silent one or the loudest one ?

spartaxoxo · February 22

They already said they're fixing it. They aren't going to be able to do a fix until after the event. It has to go through Q&A and the console certification progress. The purpose of being loud has already been filled. The fix is incoming.

FlopsyPrince · February 22

The management at ZOS makes decisions on what to focus on. Development priorities (and staffing) are not satisfying many players. They are getting by with it now, but it could bite them if enough players get frustrated enough and quit playing and do other things.

That would not be good for the game.

People noting frustration with things like this should be a positive thing, not something to pile on posters about.

FlopsyPrince · February 22

spartaxoxo wrote: »

They already said they're fixing it. They aren't going to be able to do a fix until after the event. It has to go through Q&A and the console certification progress. The purpose of being loud has already been filled. The fix is incoming.

The problem is that past performance has frustrated many players, whatever is said now. It would take substantial indications that they listened to concerns to change that.

I would NEVER want @ZOS_Kevin 's job!

spartaxoxo · February 22

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

They already said they're fixing it. They aren't going to be able to do a fix until after the event. It has to go through Q&A and the console certification progress. The purpose of being loud has already been filled. The fix is incoming.

The problem is that past performance has frustrated many players, whatever is said now. It would take substantial indications that they listened to concerns to change that.

I would NEVER want @ZOS_Kevin 's job!

That's true. But given the time table they have established, the next best step is to make sure they have put in the fix by the next MYM. So bring this topic back up around the time this hits because 1 year from now would definitely not be acceptable. Luckily, this event runs again in June/July.