LeoRJBrazil wrote: »

I have noticed some GOD likes builds in PvP, as tanky, healing, DDs and almost unlimited resources in a same char. I have seen some single players been chased by 6 or 7 Chars, and took quite some time until he been killed.

Is that correct or only I feel this is unbalaced? It seems to me that it is frustating this kind of gameplay, not fair.

I think it's completely unbalanced tbh. I don't really buy the notion that "The player is just more experienced in PvP." I don't care how experienced a person is; if they're being attacked by 5-7 people at once they should not be alive anymore unless it's pure luck. I've had this happen before where me and like 4 other people tried to kill one guy who's health barely went down. That isn't experience. That's just having ridiculously OP gear and stats.

Unforunately, the "veterans" of PvP will never agree because they are the godlike characters that are nearly impossible to kill. I just think it's off-putting that you supposedly have to spend months-years specifically building up your character just to have any sort of chance against other players. In most games, yes, veteran players are way harder to kill. But that's because they're more skilled, i.e: they attack faster or they're better at making quick decisions. Most of the time the veterans in this game just lock me in place and spam a bunch of abilities that kill me in literally 3 hits, whereas it would take me maybe 20-30 hits to kill them if they were just standing there.

This is what made Midyear Mayhem exhausting for me. I pretty much knew I was dead as soon as someone CP 810 saw me, even as a nightblade, and most of the time I was just trying to do a daily quest in a no-CP campaign. It doesn't provide much incentive for newer players to even continue playing PvP,

God likes who?

Elo106 wrote: »

Kadraeus wrote: »

LeoRJBrazil wrote: »

I have noticed some GOD likes builds in PvP, as tanky, healing, DDs and almost unlimited resources in a same char. I have seen some single players been chased by 6 or 7 Chars, and took quite some time until he been killed.

Is that correct or only I feel this is unbalaced? It seems to me that it is frustating this kind of gameplay, not fair.

I think it's completely unbalanced tbh. I don't really buy the notion that "The player is just more experienced in PvP." I don't care how experienced a person is; if they're being attacked by 5-7 people at once they should not be alive anymore unless it's pure luck. I've had this happen before where me and like 4 other people tried to kill one guy who's health barely went down. That isn't experience. That's just having ridiculously OP gear and stats.

Unforunately, the "veterans" of PvP will never agree because they are the godlike characters that are nearly impossible to kill. I just think it's off-putting that you supposedly have to spend months-years specifically building up your character just to have any sort of chance against other players. This is what made Midyear Mayhem exhausting for me. I pretty much knew I was dead as soon as someone CP 810 saw me, even as a nightblade, and most of the time I was just trying to do a daily quest in a no-CP campaign.

You say experience wont save you from being attacked by 5-7 people but pure luck will, how does luck help?
An experienced PvPer will kite around line of sight and while kiting he will get hit by 1 or 2 people the others will be running around the rock trying to hit him. The PvPer then bursts down the high damage squishy PvE build that didnt get to use his high damage because he cant attack through a rock.

But you wont believe me anyway since its just easier to chalk everything up to "nah its op" why dont you link a video of one of these god like characters in action and we can all take a look and explain whats going on.

I seriously feel like it's impossible to have any sort of discussion on this topic, which is another reason why I probably won't ever touch PvP again unless another event forces me to. It already isn't fun, but every time I or anyone else expresses frustration about it the veteran PvP players go all "well, it's because you suck lol." An experienced player could "kite" around and avoid getting hit by other players, but what about the fact that ranged attacks can hit you through walls? This has killed me a couple times, and I don't understand how "kiting" prevents a person from being killed from it either. The guy we fought was running around in circles like you said, which did make it hard to hit him. But we WERE hitting him, and so were the npcs. If he'd have stood still, I guess his health would've went down faster, but his health was still going down even though it was very slow. The cherry on top was the fact that every time his health neared 50% he'd just heal back to 100%. He did that like 5 times throughout the whole 2 minute fight. I think that's ridiculous, but I guess I don't know what I'm talking about, right? Even if I were to post the video of this happening I'd still get accused of not knowing what I'm talking about since it has become very clear through every conversation I've seen and had about this topic that many PvP veterans think they deserve better than the newer PvP players.

Everyone is annoyed with proc sets but what you're seeing is probably not about that. Proc sets are kinda OP but there are plenty of what you call "godlike" players that don't use them.

Being a strong 1vXer (which I am not, but I'm learning) is all about line of sight. Im 99% certain that when you say "I have seen some single players been chased by 6 or 7 Chars, and took quite some time until he been killed" he was not running around in the open was he? He was running loops around rocks or running around in a tower or something. The reason is that by doing that you can barely ever get a hit off on him and he can heal through the rest. So he just dances around until he sees a chance to pick off a low health target here or there.

If you caught him out truly in the open (and you had 4 people or so with half decent builds) you could kill him in seconds.

Edit: fossilize is one of the best skills for putting a stop to this because it roots & stuns at the same time. Chain pulls are also a good option cuz you can yoink them away from their obstacle course.

Pauwer wrote: »

There used to be a player who was godlike, they would land perfect combo of skills on you before your same skills were not yet in range. We often wondered about this. Then, they were gone one day. Never seen again. Maybe they returned to the heavens with the other gods.

Or banned because this sounds like an obvious exploit/hack

I

Girl_Number8 wrote: »

Kadraeus wrote: »

Elo106 wrote: »

Kadraeus wrote: »

LeoRJBrazil wrote: »

I have noticed some GOD likes builds in PvP, as tanky, healing, DDs and almost unlimited resources in a same char. I have seen some single players been chased by 6 or 7 Chars, and took quite some time until he been killed.

Is that correct or only I feel this is unbalaced? It seems to me that it is frustating this kind of gameplay, not fair.

I think it's completely unbalanced tbh. I don't really buy the notion that "The player is just more experienced in PvP." I don't care how experienced a person is; if they're being attacked by 5-7 people at once they should not be alive anymore unless it's pure luck. I've had this happen before where me and like 4 other people tried to kill one guy who's health barely went down. That isn't experience. That's just having ridiculously OP gear and stats.

Unforunately, the "veterans" of PvP will never agree because they are the godlike characters that are nearly impossible to kill. I just think it's off-putting that you supposedly have to spend months-years specifically building up your character just to have any sort of chance against other players. This is what made Midyear Mayhem exhausting for me. I pretty much knew I was dead as soon as someone CP 810 saw me, even as a nightblade, and most of the time I was just trying to do a daily quest in a no-CP campaign.

You say experience wont save you from being attacked by 5-7 people but pure luck will, how does luck help?
An experienced PvPer will kite around line of sight and while kiting he will get hit by 1 or 2 people the others will be running around the rock trying to hit him. The PvPer then bursts down the high damage squishy PvE build that didnt get to use his high damage because he cant attack through a rock.

But you wont believe me anyway since its just easier to chalk everything up to "nah its op" why dont you link a video of one of these god like characters in action and we can all take a look and explain whats going on.

I seriously feel like it's impossible to have any sort of discussion on this topic, which is another reason why I probably won't ever touch PvP again unless another event forces me to. It already isn't fun, but every time I or anyone else expresses frustration about it the veteran PvP players go all "well, it's because you suck lol." An experienced player could "kite" around and avoid getting hit by other players, but what about the fact that ranged attacks can hit you through walls? This has killed me a couple times, and I don't understand how "kiting" prevents a person from being killed from it either. The guy we fought was running around in circles like you said, which did make it hard to hit him. But we WERE hitting him, and so were the npcs. If he'd have stood still, I guess his health would've went down faster, but his health was still going down even though it was very slow. The cherry on top was the fact that every time his health neared 50% he'd just heal back to 100%. He did that like 5 times throughout the whole 2 minute fight. I think that's ridiculous, but I guess I don't know what I'm talking about, right? Even if I were to post the video of this happening I'd still get accused of not knowing what I'm talking about since it has become very clear through every conversation I've seen and had about this topic that many PvP veterans think they deserve better than the newer PvP players.

No one insulted you quite the opposite. People gave good answers regarding your OP by having a proper discussion with you.

If you just started PvP or are relatively new to it, losing against a solo PvPer that has been playing for years everyday is right on spot.

Let me ask you what class were you playing and what gear and quality were you wearing. Plus, your food, mundus, and which campaign were you in. This information have been given, would get you better answers to help you rather then your vent.

Can you tell me how long have you been playing PvP, as well?

Because all those things left out of your OP make it just another I died in PvP post. Not being rude but it is a moot OP if you do not put in the details.

I've had people insult me in the past, and even the comments that weren't insults certainly came across as condescending, unfortunately. It has put a bad taste in my mouth as far as this topic, and tbh I'm not sure why I even keep joining these conversations. I guess it's just seeing someone state something I agree with and not wanting to see their opinion get drowned by all the people who don't see an issue.

I tried Battlegrounds months ago and I wasn't sure if I liked it because the objectives weren't explained outside of NPC dialogue and I didn't know what I was doing most of the time (Doesn't help that most of them are very similar). I stopped and came back at the start of Midyear Mayhem. I got frustrated with Battlegrounds because it didn't feel like I was doing anything of worth and I met a toxic person who specifically accused me as part of the reason we were losing. I've done plenty of dungeons so far and have had no complaints, so I don't think I'm incompetent.

I'll say that my class is nightblade. Idk what quality or gear I was using. I use a mix of mostly medium armor for the stamina, sometimes 100% medium. I usually have food, but sometimes I don't. It doesn't really make a difference, in my experience. I don't remember the Mundus stone. I was also playing in no-CP Cyrodiil and no-CP Imperial City. CP 600 - 810 players would kill me in a few hits no matter what I did. I tried CP and it was the same thing. I once had someone attack me who was like CP 160 while I was around CP 200 and they barely hurt me. I was able to kill them pretty easily, which shocked me. Like, the only person I could actually kill was someone with less CP. I've told someone this before and they just dismissed everything I said.

And no, this isn't another "I died in PvP" posts. I've seen those, and you can't just say that those people don't have legitimate complaints just because you disagree with them. You might laugh that I've only really been playing PvP for about as long as the event has been active, but I don't see how only having played a week makes my points invalid. When you play a game, you decide pretty quickly whether you want to continue playing it based on those first few hours or days. For me, there were some moments of PvP I enjoyed. I actually kind of liked sneaking around and having whole groups of enemy players run past, never even knowing I was there. But eventually I just got tired of PvP because I was pretty much guaranteed to die if I was seen.

My issue is simply the fact that as someone who is new to PvP, the way it works isn't friendly at all to new players. I know people like to trash the "noobs" and say things like "git gud lol," and that doesn't help in the slightest. At the end of the day, I and many people tried to enjoy PvP but found it completely hard to do so. If I'm constantly getting killed in seconds by most players because they're hundreds of CP over me and attacking them only does a tiny bit in comparison, it completely ruins my desire to even continue playing. And if most people's solution to this is to spend months grinding to get certain types of gear and increase your CP, or that I need to watch a bunch of YouTube videos about the best builds for PvP and then completely redo my character just to even play the game mode, I'm just not interested. I could understand if all that was to help you become REALLY good at PvP, but in my experience I can't even do the one thing that makes PvP different from PvE. At this point it's just "can you complete this PvE quest in a PvP zone fast enough before all the veteran PvP players kill you and force you to try all over again?" And there might be people who read this and say, "Then just don't play lol" (I've gotten this before too), but that's completely against the point. ZOS clearly wants people to try PvP. I assume that's why the event exists. But from what I've seen a lot of people get completely turned away from PvP because it seems like the only way to even play it at all is to spend hours upon hours in preparation. That isn't appealing to me at all.

MasterSpatula wrote: »

The fact that the highest-health, highest-armor characters in Cyrodiil have little appreciable disadvantage in dps AND actually have the best heals in Cyrodiil is totally balanced, didn't you know that? Half-hour 1v12s are totally a thing that should happen in well-designed games, weren't you aware? You can do the same thing, which means there's no argument to be made that there's a problem there, right? The only way to fight Tower Humpers is to leave them alone, even though that means letting them have the keep or resource, don't you get that?

I mean, you can continue to try and fight someone who has got you out-skilled and out-geared and out-experienced and come complain about it on the forums because you're being out-skilled, -geared and -experienced, or you can go and do something else you enjoy.

Because if you're not good enough to 1vX a tower *** then yes, actually, the only way to "fight" them is to leave them alone because you won't be there for them to farm.

Sorry if the reality of it sucks??

LeoRJBrazil wrote: »

That´s was exactly my point in this post origially. I might be a PvEer but my question was, is the current state of the game right? All features at tops level in same char? excatly what they tried to reduce DD in PVE, vanish the god-like types but how about PvP?

You need to be careful what you believe in a Thread like that. PvPers like to downplay a lot of unbalance and chalk it up to Skill versus no skill. Makes them feel good or something.
Fact is, there are some extreme balance-issues in ESOs PvP. It should never ever ever be possible for one player to survive an Assault from 10, even if he is Johnny Combat himself.

But, I think ZOS is fixing those issues soon in a Patch. I heard something about nerfs to Procsets.

Kadraeus wrote: »

renne wrote: »

Kadraeus wrote: »

Elo106 wrote: »

Kadraeus wrote: »

LeoRJBrazil wrote: »

I have noticed some GOD likes builds in PvP, as tanky, healing, DDs and almost unlimited resources in a same char. I have seen some single players been chased by 6 or 7 Chars, and took quite some time until he been killed.

Is that correct or only I feel this is unbalaced? It seems to me that it is frustating this kind of gameplay, not fair.

I think it's completely unbalanced tbh. I don't really buy the notion that "The player is just more experienced in PvP." I don't care how experienced a person is; if they're being attacked by 5-7 people at once they should not be alive anymore unless it's pure luck. I've had this happen before where me and like 4 other people tried to kill one guy who's health barely went down. That isn't experience. That's just having ridiculously OP gear and stats.

Unforunately, the "veterans" of PvP will never agree because they are the godlike characters that are nearly impossible to kill. I just think it's off-putting that you supposedly have to spend months-years specifically building up your character just to have any sort of chance against other players. This is what made Midyear Mayhem exhausting for me. I pretty much knew I was dead as soon as someone CP 810 saw me, even as a nightblade, and most of the time I was just trying to do a daily quest in a no-CP campaign.

You say experience wont save you from being attacked by 5-7 people but pure luck will, how does luck help?
An experienced PvPer will kite around line of sight and while kiting he will get hit by 1 or 2 people the others will be running around the rock trying to hit him. The PvPer then bursts down the high damage squishy PvE build that didnt get to use his high damage because he cant attack through a rock.

But you wont believe me anyway since its just easier to chalk everything up to "nah its op" why dont you link a video of one of these god like characters in action and we can all take a look and explain whats going on.

I seriously feel like it's impossible to have any sort of discussion on this topic, which is another reason why I probably won't ever touch PvP again unless another event forces me to. It already isn't fun, but every time I or anyone else expresses frustration about it the veteran PvP players go all "well, it's because you suck lol." An experienced player could "kite" around and avoid getting hit by other players, but what about the fact that ranged attacks can hit you through walls? This has killed me a couple times, and I don't understand how "kiting" prevents a person from being killed from it either. The guy we fought was running around in circles like you said, which did make it hard to hit him. But we WERE hitting him, and so were the npcs. If he'd have stood still, I guess his health would've went down faster, but his health was still going down even though it was very slow. The cherry on top was the fact that every time his health neared 50% he'd just heal back to 100%. He did that like 5 times throughout the whole 2 minute fight. I think that's ridiculous, but I guess I don't know what I'm talking about, right? Even if I were to post the video of this happening I'd still get accused of not knowing what I'm talking about since it has become very clear through every conversation I've seen and had about this topic that many PvP veterans think they deserve better than the newer PvP players.

Honestly, whenever you encounter a player tower or rock humping just go do something else. They're only there to farm AP off the people chasing them around because they're controlling the fight. Also it's not ridiculous his health healed back from 50% to 100%. Annoying, yes, but not ridiculous. Bust heals and healing sets will do that.

I try to. It's way easier as a nightblade. I have no clue how other classes are able to get away from those sorts of players without shadow cloak. Even then, though, a lot of the time I just can't get away because they can either still see me, the npcs and lag prevent me from cloaking, or the players lock me in place so I'm dead before I can even break out of it. I still think players healing back to 100% constantly is ridiculous though. I assumed the cooldown for potions was to prevent that sort of thing, but I guess not if there are abilities that let you spam heal anyway.

This tells me everything I need to know. First of all, this is by any means offensive, we have all been in your place at aome time.
1. There are more heals in the game than pots. In fact, pots heal like 5k in pvp. Try to imagine that amount in a 35k hp bar.
2. The person is healing himself. You know it, there is your answer. And. While you are trying to get him, you know what? You are not healing yourself. One burst - you are down. This one if a few secrets of 1vX
3. You have to be healing yourself in pvp. You can't rely on cloak only. HOTs have to be ticking on you all the time. Anything else - u ded.
4. Try to find fights elsewhere. Tbh it is a bad decision to chase them. It is all they want. To get you isolated and take the AP.

Do not worry, you will get it eventually. You can hit me up in pc eu if you need any help.

Flaaklypa wrote: »

sarahthes wrote: »

Flaaklypa wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

LeoRJBrazil wrote: »

I have noticed some GOD likes builds in PvP, as tanky, healing, DDs and almost unlimited resources in a same char. I have seen some single players been chased by 6 or 7 Chars, and took quite some time until he been killed.

Is that correct or only I feel this is unbalaced? It seems to me that it is frustating this kind of gameplay, not fair.

Proabably experienced player vs some new PvErs, there is no such thing as 1vX when we talk about same skill level of players.

this 100%. though sadly most of the time those PvErs sees themself as on the same level as an experienced pvper in an optimised build. and quickly come to the conclusion the game is unbalanced.

which is not true, because only imagine 12 "godlike" pvp build players trying vmol. wont get passed the first trash pool.

I don't know about that, one of my favourite highly skilled pvpers also holds the world records for every trial except vCR and vMoL (and did hold those for most of last year as well, only lost them when retiring from active PvE).

again u misunderstand. i am talking ABOUT THE BUILD.

12 people in crimson, vatesh backbar, vma 2h and zaan let these godlike pvp builds go in veteran maw of lorkhaj. a full 12 man pvp group with no tank, no dps no healer, just a hybrid of all would never work.

Pretty sure it could work. vmol is not that hard.