Magelight will be OP in PVP

MrTarkanian48 · February 2016

I am not arguing that Cloak didnt need some attention. I do think the counters to cloak were more reasonable than the counters to shields. Shield breaker may have been viable if it had jewelry. But you can't really consider investing in a full set of armor that is only viable for stam builds and is not even an "insta-win" against shielded opponents even close to what RML will be toward cloak for just slotting a skill.

Also if you think the new CP tree against shields has any value I'd like to hear it.

I agree that Magicka DK will re-surface and probably be the best competition for Sorc.

I still think this patch will seal the deal for Sorc nerfs in the future though.

The reality is NB and Sorc have been OP for some time in comparison to DK and Templar. They both can maximize damage, and neglect investing in defense because they have skills that can mitigate a lot of damage.

Now NB can't mitigate as much damage, and will have to start investing in defense as opposed to full blown offense.

So now you will have three classes that need to balance offense and defense. Which leaves Sorc alone investing fully into offense and sacrificing nothing for defense. It won't take more than a month or two until the "Nerf Sorc Threads" blow up the forums.

Thats why maybe its in everyones best interest to buff DK and Templar up to NB and Sorc level, as opposed to nerfing it all down.

frozywozy · February 2016

MrTarkanian48 wrote: »

Dreyloch wrote: »

Can't believe the NB cry. I don't know how many times I've cast things like caltrops RIGHT in front of me where the NB I'm fighting should be, and yet he's not detected because he cast a spammable ability to get away from just about anything.

I'm sorry, that's OP, needed a nerf badly, and boo hoo, now you have to fight people straight up ROFL. I'm happy for this change. Less ganking, more toe to toe. IMO that requires more skill anyway.

Mages OP now? No, they are still wearing cloth, new CP's will allow more damage to their OP shields to take them out faster. The meta for PvP is changing folks. Have to adapt and adjust.

Sorc's will be OP. If you look at what they will have its undeniable. Honestly, I feel that most of the hate from Sorc's against cloak is because it was the only thing that would occasionally stop them from face-rolling most people.

The new anti-shield CP tree is a joke and no one will use it. Why would anyone invest any CP to do "X% damage against shields", instead of "X% damage against shields and everything else without shields"? Its not like CP in Mighty doesn't apply to shields. It will only be a factor when the CP cap is much, much, higher and even then will probably not be used. The only other way this would get any attention is if it scaled differently (like up to 100%) instead of the 25% that Mighty provides.

Sorcs don't have to invest in health, since as long as their shields are up they don't need health, so they can stack Magic for days. Sorcs don't need to invest in Resistant CP or Impenetrable armor because as long as their shields are up they can't be crit. This means they can wear 7 pieces of armor with infused/divines to maximize damage and not worry about defense. This allows them to put 100 CP in Bastion to blow up their shields and split the rest between Hardy and Elemental defender. Sorcs used to have to choose to optimize Magic attacks or Elemental attacks, but now will have both at their disposal with max damage making their Overloads and Un-Dodgeable/Unreflectable Meteors hit INCREDIBLY hard. They will have much easier access to Mag Detonation (as will everyone else). Now with Magelight they will have constant 56% resistance to stealth damage, and Empower (Metoer/Frags) on demand.

How do you suppose the average Stam build will compete with a Sorc that has 40K+ Magicka, 4K+ Spell Damage, endless non-crittable shields, resistance to stealth, and empower on demand?

If you look at this and don't think Mag Sorc will be on a completely different playing field than everyone else, then I would seriously question your knowledge of how stats, CP, and mechanics in this game work.

And they can have their laugh now. But I guarantee that when this patch brings NB's and stamina builds in general down a few notches in the power rankings, Magicka Sorc is going to be standing head and shoulders above the rest. And it won't be long until the Nerf bat visits them (shields can be crit, shields scale off health, cool downs on application, etc.)

Right now NB and Sorc are above DK and Templar. Why not buff DK and Temp up to NB and Sorc level, instead of cutting NB and stam in general down? It only a matter of time til everything gets nerfed down to the point where its not fun to play.

I agree 100% about the #nerfsorc part of your thread. I disagree about the part where you state that the cloak nerf and the buff to mage light to help stealth detection is not needed. It doesn't mean a class has some unfair advantages that you should not need to nerf another class who has also unfair advantages. Shield stacking has been addressed properly in the CP system. If you want to counter it, you must sacrifice points in mighty or elemental expert. The same way as people who want to counter cloak must sacrifice damaging abilities to slot Mage Light.

Now, they should put Major Prophecy in the Inner Light morph and the damage reduction and stun immunity and larger range in the Radiant Mage Light morph.

MrTarkanian48 · February 2016

The new CP anti-shield is next to worthless and no one will use it.

If I am a stam build and I put 100 points in Mighty I have 25% increase to physical damage. This physical damage can be applied to anything including shields.

If I put 100 points in the anti-shield I get 25% more damage to shields and nothing else.

So why would you put any in it? Maybe people will put a few in since there are diminishing returns, but it will be very few. Everyone will still be loading up Mighty or Elemental Expert. Except for maybe dueling situations where you know you are fighting a sorc.

Meanwhile Sorcs don't have to invest in it at all, and can just focus on Elemental Expert. Elfborn, spell erosion

MrTarkanian48 · February 2016

RML will be providing 10% spell crit and Empower buff, so it enhances the other 3 damage abilities on your bar. It also gives damage mitigation and cloak detection. Doesn't sound like it sacrifices damage at all to me.

GreenSoup2HoT · February 2016

@MrTarkanian48

I agree with your statement about the new anti shield cp. As it stand's with the cp cap, you wont have enough point's to even think about putting any in that tree unless you have a big grudge against sorc's.

You get 167 point's if your at cp cap. 100 for mighty (not recommended). The rest of the 67 are split between crit, penetration, light/heavy attack damage/the new thaumaturge and blessed. I doubt many will have any point's in the new anti shield tree.

Once the cp cap get's raised this cp tree may be an issue in the future, however no cp campaign's are going to be the place to be. Lag will be greatly reduced since there are ton's of passive's in their that doesn't need to be calculated by the server. I can't wait to see how performance is with these no cp campaign's.

frozywozy · February 2016

Let me tell you that if you put 100 points in mighty or elemental expert at the actual CP cap, you are doing it extremely wrong.

Drakilian · February 2016

frozywozy wrote: »

Let me tell you that if you put 100 points in mighty or elemental expert at the actual CP cap, you are doing it extremely wrong.

Not really.

I mean, if you're doing it right on a stam build you'll already have a major armour debuff + a sharpened mace/maul, meaning you'll completely ignore anyone's armour except a tank's. So putting more than 10~ points into the armour penetration passive is really a big waste.

Also, base damage is generally more important than crit damage, since dealing more base damage means you deal more crit damage anyway and base damage is far more reliable. So you'd prioritize mighty over the crit passive.

These are the only 3 stars worth investing in as a stamina build, all in the ritual tree. You can also invest in heavy weapons if you really want to, I guess (I wouldn't unless running a one-shot DK but that's personal preference).

What exactly, is wrong then with a 100:57:10 distribution between those stars? Considering, of course, the relative importance of each star.

It's a very different for magicka builds since there's a lot more spell resistance available (though there's also a lot more spell penetration available in the game), and they have a passive that increases Magicka heals, so they'll be splitting up their CPs along 5 stars rather than 3 (4 stars with the new update). But that's for Magicka, and optimal DPS is still achieved with the same general distribution as the Stam distribution.

Dakrana_Thrazvoth · February 2016

Jhunn wrote: »

So many people who have never played magicka NB obviously thinks this is totally fine.

Lol.

True, and these peoples just cry because nb can escape with cloak and shadow image, and they cant kill them sometimes. If we listen this community of QQ, all class are overpowerd because we cant kill everything easly and quickly. Everything need nerf.

But, this news changes on magelight was not necessary and really overpowered.

frozywozy · February 2016

Drakilian wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

Let me tell you that if you put 100 points in mighty or elemental expert at the actual CP cap, you are doing it extremely wrong.

Not really.

I mean, if you're doing it right on a stam build you'll already have a major armour debuff + a sharpened mace/maul, meaning you'll completely ignore anyone's armour except a tank's. So putting more than 10~ points into the armour penetration passive is really a big waste.

Also, base damage is generally more important than crit damage, since dealing more base damage means you deal more crit damage anyway and base damage is far more reliable. So you'd prioritize mighty over the crit passive.

These are the only 3 stars worth investing in as a stamina build, all in the ritual tree. You can also invest in heavy weapons if you really want to, I guess (I wouldn't unless running a one-shot DK but that's personal preference).

What exactly, is wrong then with a 100:57:10 distribution between those stars? Considering, of course, the relative importance of each star.

It's a very different for magicka builds since there's a lot more spell resistance available (though there's also a lot more spell penetration available in the game), and they have a passive that increases Magicka heals, so they'll be splitting up their CPs along 5 stars rather than 3 (4 stars with the new update). But that's for Magicka, and optimal DPS is still achieved with the same general distribution as the Stam distribution.

Do you even blessed bruh? After 75 points in Mighty, it's much more beneficial to put points in crit damage. But do as you please and stack 100 points in Mighty. Will make it easier for me.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO · February 2016

magilight is fine i dont get why people are QQ so much.

Before: needed on both bars. 100% uptime, free

now: need only on one bar. no uptime, cost magica to get effect for 6 seconds.

its not even stronger!people could already do eveything that is being complained about. its just "more usable" because of only needing to slot on one bar. I suppose I should mention its better now that it procs might of the guild but magica builds already have entropy which is better vs 3 0f 4 classes

ps Piercing mark makes cloak COMPLETELY UNCASTABLE PERIOD. mage light is not the nerf your looking for ( waves hand)

im much more concerned about piercing mark on my nb than magelight, with stealth racial passives and medium they still need to be right on top of you for magelight to be effective, for any build with aoe, aoe will still be more effective anticloak then light....

Helluin · February 2016

I think that the activation of this skill (both morphs), while in sneak, should reveal - remove also the caster from sneak as well.

This would prevent the use of Empower from sneak, that is something that could lead instead to more ganking from ranged especially.
Even if I would like to try that combo sometimes, I consider more balanced Magelight with this side effect.

What do you think about it?

The cost of the skill is still too low at the moment, it could be increased otherwise the target revealed should receive after the expiration of Magelight a sort of immunity like a crowd control effect.
In this way Magelight would be still a strong tool but invisibility/sneak wouldn't be completely negated if Magelight is chain spammed.

Last but not least, as mentioned already, Clouding Swarm should be changed accordingly or in the tooltip or in the way it works atm, since invisibility is not regranted even if broken as it's stated in the tooltip.