AshTal wrote: »

So we have seen some minor changes to the racials but the crap ones are still crap and the good ones still good. Will the Argonians, Orcs and Bosmer be seeing any improvements on their skill lines?

I can only assume they want these races to be inferior species, and for those who play these races to learn their place. There really is no other explanation for the blatant disparity.

I am voting for my own because i only play an Orc, yet i have always wondered what the point of this passive was. When my group in Cyrodiil are running and not actually using our horses i seriously do not notice my self being faster at all. It just feels like a pointless passive to me.

I gotta say it's a pretty big surprise that out of these options the Nord racial resist frost is not topping the poll. Frost staves are easily the least used of the elements so that resistance is largely pointless.

I'm also surprised to see two of the argonian passives on this list. The increased potion effectiveness is pretty great if you're an alchemist or have a potion addiction, especially when paired with the NB catalyst passive and the medicinal use passive. Also I quite enjoy being able to swim so fast, but that's just a small thing.

The Bosmer and Argonian poison and disease resistance are both nice to have in PVP, archers use lots of poison attacks and meat catapults are no good to get hit by.

Make a Nord i said... it looks cool i said....

I NOW HATE MYSELF! Why didn'T i choose a Breton instead.
BUt truly the Orc thingy passive... i mean... sprinting????^^

I am mystified as to why Argonians never got a racial stat increase or change of any sort. It's really weird how the devs think about this stuff. They obviously think Argonian racials are fine or they don't give a. Either way, it sucks for lizards.

AshTal wrote: »

So hard to pick the Argonain one. Almost went for the health and poison/disease resist. Almost no poison/disease in the game that I can see and only a single attack in the player style, the 3% health however made it seem a little better than the 15% potion bonus. When looking at the number potions just don't do that much and 15% on a 300 healing potion is 45 health extra, an imperial gets far higher than that perm through his health stack.
I hope the Racials are rebalanced soon.

You can't really look at it like this, because unlike the other racials, you can choose how to apply the Argonian one.

Take your example of 45 health on a 300 heal pot. For a correctly built Argonian NB, you add 30% to that 300 just from the NB passive, bringing that number to 390. Now add another 15% to that from Argonian passive (percentages are additive, so this adds another 58.5).

Now your 300 heal pot is healing for 448.5. BUT WAIT! Nobody uses plain health-only pots for anything important; you'd use tri-pots. So now you have to multiply that 58.5 by 3 (3 resources, after all) which brings you to 175.5 total resources gained from the Argonian passive alone.

Every 15 seconds, if you want.

175 total resources every 15 seconds is worlds better 200 more health full-time, especially since softcaps exist, diminishing the potential contribution from stat bonuses. Potions aren't restricted by softcaps, after all.

This was just a simple example. It really starts to get fun when you start talking about spell damage / crit potions, or stealth detect / spell damage potions, which basically translates into a full-time spell damage bonus for as long as you feel like keeping the buff up.

Want to switch to another playstyle? No prob! Argonian passive allows a huge amount of flexibility. Don't need the spellpower / spell crit anymore because you're trying a stamina build? Wish you had Carnage? Simple, pop some weapon crit pots and enjoy your own mini-Carnage buff from the extra crit you get from your passive. And hey, it even works at range.

I guess some people feel that sort of flexibility isn't as valuable because it's not as "in your face" as something easy to swallow like 10% health or 9% stamina, etc. But it's definitely as effective for those willing to take advantage of it. : )

PS) Just as an aside, I'm not sure where you were getting your numbers, but I decided to use them as it would be easier to understand. : P

For the record though, a VR1 tri-pot restores 559 of all resources on my Argonian. 83.85 of that comes from her racial.

That's 251.55 total resources she receives every 15 seconds from her racial alone. Useless, indeed....

PPPPPPllllleease! Ppl its obvious that Argonians have a one. two punch for lamest. most useless passives in game.

Thanks all for the discussion and comments. They've been fun to read.

AshTal wrote: »

So hard to pick the Argonain one. Almost went for the health and poison/disease resist. Almost no poison/disease in the game that I can see and only a single attack in the player style, the 3% health however made it seem a little better than the 15% potion bonus. When looking at the number potions just don't do that much and 15% on a 300 healing potion is 45 health extra, an imperial gets far higher than that perm through his health stack.
I hope the Racials are rebalanced soon.

The proper VR5 Panacea of Health heals for 930 (with an additional 840 over 14 seconds), so an extra 15% is an extra 140 and 126 health, respectively. Importantly, potions are amplified by bonuses to healing received, which Argonians also get. When stacked with set bonuses, and armor and class passives that further increase potion effectiveness and/or healing received, this turns potions into amazing heal/regens that don't cost stamina or magicka.

This is the idea behind my Argonian NB Alchemist tank. Once I get some better dropped sets, I will have close to 40% increase to healing received (makes my self-heals that much better and allows healer to use fewer resources on me), with 45% more effective potions that last 30% longer. I use potions as 'oh crap' heals, and with a couple potion speed glyphs, it becomes my version of DK's GDB except it doesn't use any resources.

Like Varicite said, potions aren't only useful for heals. Crit, damage, invisibility, speed are all buffed, and allows for great role/build flexibility.