RNG is not welcome anymore.

SonOfSoma

There gets to a point where (if RNG is against you) trying to get that mask style, that lead, that once only cosmetic becomes tedious and soul-destroying!

Wasting hours and even days trying, continuously... and then not to have the desired "object" is a kick I the teeth.

It's too painful and sickening, especially when someone else who runs the content and has great RNG.. and ultimately gets the drop either immediately or within a couple of runs.

Doesn't this system need to be adjusted, or changed?
I don't want to waste my gaming time anymore, hoping to get that one thing I desire.

And yeah... you'll say, you don't have to do it... and now... I won't.

XSTRONG

Would it be better that Zos release a new lead, stylepage etc, you just go to a place press collect and you have it?

Not a fun game in my opinion.

Now what they could do is have the item as rng drop but if you have "really bad rng" as people say they have, you can somehow get it anyway but to a high cost.

Traders for example is a place to get rid of rng, Infinite Archive is another place, style pages there can be bought with currency.

Luminous Ink are a guaranteed reward for questing and are available in traders but people still cry over rng.

zaria

I was thinking Random Normal Dungeon as RND.
Now RND has gotten way better over the years.

Desiato

If one chooses to do something that is painful and sickening to them, that's a them thing. When this happens, they should take a step back to regain perspective.

There's nothing in this game that is absolutely must have.

I'm gonna guess you decided to roll the dice with a style page drop by grinding city of ash II and are upset it didn't work out the way you wanted it to.

I like rare drops in a game. They're fun to get. Sometimes I grind for them, and when I do I set my expectations accordingly, recognize it's something I'm choosing to do and make a point of enjoying the ride. If I can't do that, then I won't do it.

The thing is, if it wasn't so rare, you might not even care enough to get it. Its value is entirely based on its scarcity. They've made 99.9%+ of the items in this game trivial to get. It's nice to have a few things left that are a thrill to loot.

AlnilamE

SonOfSoma wrote: »

There gets to a point where (if RNG is against you) trying to get that mask style, that lead, that once only cosmetic becomes tedious and soul-destroying!

Wasting hours and even days trying, continuously... and then not to have the desired "object" is a kick I the teeth.

It's too painful and sickening, especially when someone else who runs the content and has great RNG.. and ultimately gets the drop either immediately or within a couple of runs.

Doesn't this system need to be adjusted, or changed?
I don't want to waste my gaming time anymore, hoping to get that one thing I desire.

And yeah... you'll say, you don't have to do it... and now... I won't.

What do you suggest be done? Generally increase drop rates? Create a token system where if you don't get the item you want in 50 runs you can "buy" it? Having everything be a quest reward?

SonOfSoma

@Desiato ❤️

SonOfSoma

You know what... don't care now.

I'm not chasing any of it anymore.

The game mechanics (RNG) has made me disengage with the game.

AlnilamE

SonOfSoma wrote: »

You know what... don't care now.

I'm not chasing any of it anymore.

The game mechanics (RNG) has made me disengage with the game.

OK, but again, what game mechanic do you want to replace the RNG with?

Pelanora

It's not the mechanics it's the calculations of chance. That's what needs changing.

Stafford197

AlnilamE wrote: »

SonOfSoma wrote: »

You know what... don't care now.

I'm not chasing any of it anymore.

The game mechanics (RNG) has made me disengage with the game.

OK, but again, what game mechanic do you want to replace the RNG with?

Fun

SonOfSoma

I don't know what it should be replaced with....

Just something a little "fairer" ..

Maybe after you've run the content a thousand times you should get a definite drop..

licenturion

SonOfSoma wrote: »

I don't know what it should be replaced with....

Just something a little "fairer" ..

Maybe after you've run the content a thousand times you should get a definite drop..

They just should make everything tradeable. Whatever you do, you always earn gold. That way bad luck can be offset with enough gold.

Also ask yourself if this item is really needed for your build. Usually I am chasing things too and when I randomly get stuff, I use it for a day and that's it. If that is the case, it is not worth the stress.

SkaiFaith

I think what OP would want to see added is a "pity system" like other games have.
I agree with this: after a certain number of "rolls" you are guaranteed the item - I'd appreciate this in every aspect, from crown crates to leads, to motives, etc...
It's not my job to decide at which point it becomes guaranteed, that's for the devs to decide, but a system like this should be in place IMHO.

It would have made such a huge difference during last April anniversary when the forum got filled of pages upon pages of frustrated people because of unique style pages not dropping for them.

FlopsyPrince

XSTRONG wrote: »

Would it be better that Zos release a new lead, stylepage etc, you just go to a place press collect and you have it?

Not a fun game in my opinion.

Now what they could do is have the item as rng drop but if you have "really bad rng" as people say they have, you can somehow get it anyway but to a high cost.

Traders for example is a place to get rid of rng, Infinite Archive is another place, style pages there can be bought with currency.

Luminous Ink are a guaranteed reward for questing and are available in traders but people still cry over rng.

Be real!

It is not one or the other as the only choices. That is why many games use a "after so many times" mechanic.

Even adding curation to some things in U43 would go against your idea.

Those who have good RNG don't care or are fine with it the way it is. Those who do not are not fine with how things are.

Should they cancel out the curation aspect in U43 because "RNG is good" and having curation makes it "go someplace to press a button and get something"?

XSTRONG

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

XSTRONG wrote: »

Would it be better that Zos release a new lead, stylepage etc, you just go to a place press collect and you have it?

Not a fun game in my opinion.

Now what they could do is have the item as rng drop but if you have "really bad rng" as people say they have, you can somehow get it anyway but to a high cost.

Traders for example is a place to get rid of rng, Infinite Archive is another place, style pages there can be bought with currency.

Luminous Ink are a guaranteed reward for questing and are available in traders but people still cry over rng.

Be real!

It is not one or the other as the only choices. That is why many games use a "after so many times" mechanic.

Even adding curation to some things in U43 would go against your idea.

Those who have good RNG don't care or are fine with it the way it is. Those who do not are not fine with how things are.

Should they cancel out the curation aspect in U43 because "RNG is good" and having curation makes it "go someplace to press a button and get something"?

No I dont think the game should have " new item click to collect"

I said Traders and other activitys as Infinite Archive helps if you cant stand farming for certain items.

DarthCuddlefluff

Still been thousands of maps since I got an apocryphal well lead. Over a year. I want my over 100 mil in gold back. NOW. And I want 3 free apocryphal wells too.

AlnilamE

SonOfSoma wrote: »

I don't know what it should be replaced with....

Just something a little "fairer" ..

Maybe after you've run the content a thousand times you should get a definite drop..

I'm not sure if this applies to everything you are looking for, but if it's in a zone or dungeon, how about chances increase with the % of the sticker book you have completed, with a guaranteed drop at 100% completion, and then when you have all the codex entries (in the case of leads), it reverts back to normal?

FlopsyPrince

AlnilamE wrote: »

SonOfSoma wrote: »

I don't know what it should be replaced with....

Just something a little "fairer" ..

Maybe after you've run the content a thousand times you should get a definite drop..

I'm not sure if this applies to everything you are looking for, but if it's in a zone or dungeon, how about chances increase with the % of the sticker book you have completed, with a guaranteed drop at 100% completion, and then when you have all the codex entries (in the case of leads), it reverts back to normal?

Some things you want are to fill that sticker book!

barney2525

so after something major, instead of a single item have a choice of 5 different types of items. Player picks the one they want.

Pelanora

LaintalAy wrote: »

Pelanora wrote: »

It's not the mechanics it's the calculations of chance. That's what needs changing.

Take a "1%" chance of dropping; and make it "2%"

Is that the change you say is needed?

2% of what though.

All attempts by all players of that boss? All attempts by the player of that boss? All attempts by the player of all random things in an hour or day? All attempts of all random things by all players in an hour or a day?

Tbh it feels like they do it off the latter.

And what safety valve is there, for those players who have exceeded some determined level of tries and still not got it? None clearly. There should be.

derkaiserliche

Thats how these MMORPGs work. Just because you dont have the time or motivation to grind, doesnt mean the game has to deliver everything to you on a golden plate. There is a reason these masks are worth a lot of gold for example.

And yea there could be a better calculated dropchance for some items, but players nowadays are getting really lazy and demanding and prefer to mourn on the forums instead of just grinding..

colossalvoids

Honestly from all the issues the game have this one is a player perception problem more of. If chases and struggles isn't something you easily endure it might be wiser to change focus at least for awhile until continuing.

Some things took me months, some were closer to chasing something that's almost not in the game it felt like. But that's the appeal of an mmo, where goals aren't met within a matter of days, mostly. Changing your focus helps tremendously when you're feeling down, dev "handouts" tinkering with drop chances aren't feeling as good as some might think, the chase is better than the catch one might say.

OsUfi

XSTRONG wrote: »

Luminous Ink are a guaranteed reward for questing and are available in traders but people still cry over rng.

The inconsistency of RNG of ink drops was an issue for many of us. I'm probably over 120 hours since completing Scribing quest, I run boss dailies daily as I enjoy boss hunting, harvested thousands of nodes. The only 2 inks I've found were in one session of Imperial City.

BretonMage

I don't mind a moderate amount of grinding, but I agree with OP that too much, and it starts to feel hopeless. I know people expect grinding in an MMO, but extreme grinding is ridiculous. I have taken long breaks from ESO, and it was usually due to frustration with RNG.

I think it should be modified so that players can either get intermittent (but not, again, too rare) strokes of good luck, or that chances just get a slight increase across the board.

Pelanora

LaintalAy wrote: »

Pelanora wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Pelanora wrote: »

It's not the mechanics it's the calculations of chance. That's what needs changing.

Take a "1%" chance of dropping; and make it "2%"

Is that the change you say is needed?

2% of what though.

All attempts by all players of that boss? All attempts by the player of that boss? All attempts by the player of all random things in an hour or day? All attempts of all random things by all players in an hour or a day?

Tbh it feels like they do it off the latter.

And what safety valve is there, for those players who have exceeded some determined level of tries and still not got it? None clearly. There should be.

I doubt that there's a safety valve as in 'that's enough, here's your drop'.
I'd argue that you're more likely to be not rewarded for excessive grinding.

Don't expect change.

That's what I said, there's none and there should be.

I know your disposition, but they've curated drops now, they are changing things.

Ph1p

Instead of pure RNG, I would prefer stuff to be awarded for a set amount of effort. For example, complete a zone daily 30 times for the achievement or clear the first arc in IA 50 times to get a new mount. The new lead in Halls of Fabrication follows this logic, since it's a guaranteed drop. It could also be a combination of RNG and set effort, like with the stickerbook. Due to RNG, you are initially unlikely to get the dagger or ice staff you want, but eventually it will be guaranteed.

However, I don't think ZOS will implement such a system for leads, styles, and other drops. It would require them to track completion rates for probably hundreds of tasks across every single character in the game. Given the recent and mostly unpopular changes to mail expiration and trader listings in the name of "server performance and stability", I doubt they will add this burden to the game.

FlopsyPrince

Talking about RNG: I failed 4 times trying to pop a Medium chest. I believe that is 80%. That means I got under 20% 4 times in a row. Annoying , but a feature of such RNG and poor RNG engines.

Looking for a drop or a lead would be much worse. I have enough lockpicks, but grinding forever means I don't try.

MidniteOwl1913

Part of the problem is that it isn't really random, real random is hard to code. It is sort-of-mostly random. And the sorta mostly part can have problems.

For ink drops it does seem that something is off. The variation in people's different experiences is not what I would expect for a normal distribution.

And this particular resource is one that people can't use the new system without. It's understandable that they are upset.

Even if they suffered through the quest again on each character that's only 4 skills per. Not a lot considering the number of grimiores.

Ishtarknows

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Talking about RNG: I failed 4 times trying to pop a Medium chest. I believe that is 80%. That means I got under 20% 4 times in a row. Annoying , but a feature of such RNG and poor RNG engines.

Looking for a drop or a lead would be much worse. I have enough lockpicks, but grinding forever means I don't try.

I've failed the "trivial" lock in the Wailing Prison more than once on a fully levelled character with the full force lock passive lol.

MidniteOwl1913

LaintalAy wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Talking about RNG: I failed 4 times trying to pop a Medium chest. I believe that is 80%. That means I got under 20% 4 times in a row. Annoying , but a feature of such RNG and poor RNG engines.

Looking for a drop or a lead would be much worse. I have enough lockpicks, but grinding forever means I don't try.

I don't even bother wasting skillpoints on the 'break' passive.
I just pick the lock the long way and take the XP for my effort.
You get more loot for picking over forcing. Soul gems etc.

I like the force passive and use it on my toons. Especially when chest farming. I've never seen a difference in the quality of loot from picking it. Which I do when it's the endeavor.

AnduinTryggva

SonOfSoma wrote: »

There gets to a point where (if RNG is against you) trying to get that mask style, that lead, that once only cosmetic becomes tedious and soul-destroying!

Wasting hours and even days trying, continuously... and then not to have the desired "object" is a kick I the teeth.

It's too painful and sickening, especially when someone else who runs the content and has great RNG.. and ultimately gets the drop either immediately or within a couple of runs.

Doesn't this system need to be adjusted, or changed?
I don't want to waste my gaming time anymore, hoping to get that one thing I desire.

And yeah... you'll say, you don't have to do it... and now... I won't.

This RNG would not be such an issue if prices on guildstore would be more accessible to average players with average gold coffers. And if less rng items would be bound to the character.