Dungeon quests

AlnilamE

DenverRalphy wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

AvalonRanger wrote: »

fedouva wrote: »

Just been in the Crypt of Hearts dungeon and couldn't take the back because while me and two low level players were killing the initial mobs, a 2000 point champion player ran in and activated the first boss. I think players go to dungeons just to run them, but not for a compelling story and it's sad. I certainly have an idea how to fix it, but no one will like forced dialogues without text) Just for today my impressions of hiking in the dungeons because of such sittuatsii spoiled.Also I will not be able to complete some quests, because the levers and other devices activated other players because of what I do not count the completion of these tasks, this is also very sad ... What do you think about this?

1, If you want to enjoy story reading in the dungeon quest, then don't use random grouping.
GO TO THE GROUPING TOOLS.

2, If you just want skill point by finishing dungeon quest, just say "I have quest" at the group chat.
Most of people accept your situation except jerk.

3, You should not expect slow pace running or deep exploring with the random team.

By that same token, a single speed runner should not expect it to be a fast pace run either. Just like in the OP's example. One player decided to zoom off and speed run and trigger the bosses while the other 3 were like "what the wha?"

In that case, you open the group menu, right-click on that player's name and select "vote to kick" and than the other players can decide as a group what they want to do. If someone is being obnoxious in a dungeon, the rest of the group has the choice to kick them.

Three players queued up for a dungeon, had to wait however long it took to get matched with a 4th from the random daily group finder, and now they're expected to kick one player only to have to wait what may be a long while to get matched again? Not to mention that the quest may well be botched.

If you kick someone, it doesn't break the group. The group 'leader' gets a prompt to find a replacement. The same thing happens if someone drops from the group. I've had a couple of runs where someone dropped at the beginning (usually the tank). Both times, we asked for a replacement and started running the dungeon. One time we got a replacement half-way through, the other time we got the tank at the last boss.

If a player is ruining the experience for the rest of the group, kick them. If the other players don't agree, they won't vote for it. It's a group decision.

Ardriel

I don't like the way "speed runners" are portrayed as bad people here. When I do random dungeons, 80% of them are speed runs. Most players have done these dungeons a hundred times and just want to get through them quickly. So to call them bad people is unfair. In 99.9% of all the dungeons I do regularly, the speed is slowed down as soon as "someone" writes "need quest" or something. So the vast majority of "bad" speed runners are actually nice people. You can't expect "story and quest mode" to be standard in a random normal dungeon in an MMO like Eso. Write once briefly in the chat, right at the beginning, as has already been mentioned here several times. Speedrunners are not selfish and inconsiderate just because they can't read minds.

SilverBride

Pevey wrote: »

Truly veteran players don't do dungeons with random groups for transmutes. They form a group before queuing or source transmutes in other ways.

Of course truly veteran players do random groups for transmutes. It's the quickest, most efficient way to get them. I don't know anyone going for transmutes that makes a group first.

Pevey

SilverBride wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

Truly veteran players don't do dungeons with random groups for transmutes. They form a group before queuing or source transmutes in other ways.

Of course truly veteran players do random groups for transmutes. It's the quickest, most efficient way to get them. I don't know anyone going for transmutes that makes a group first.

It's way more efficient to do the bare minimum for tier 1 rewards int he 30 day campaigns on all toons. It takes about half a day to do this for 20 toons. Each month, 1000 transmutes. I have probably 200 geodes with 50 transmutes each sitting on all my toons from doing this. Much more efficient than RNDs. You would have to do 100 RNDs to get those 1000 transmutes. Ouch.

Vet players also get transmutes without even thinking about them. From trials coffers, bgs, etc.

Soarora

Pevey wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

Truly veteran players don't do dungeons with random groups for transmutes. They form a group before queuing or source transmutes in other ways.

Of course truly veteran players do random groups for transmutes. It's the quickest, most efficient way to get them. I don't know anyone going for transmutes that makes a group first.

It's way more efficient to do the bare minimum for tier 1 rewards int he 30 day campaigns on all toons. It takes about half a day to do this for 20 toons. Each month, 1000 transmutes. I have probably 200 geodes with 50 transmutes each sitting on all my toons from doing this. Much more efficient than RNDs. You would have to do 100 RNDs to get those 1000 transmutes. Ouch.

Vet players also get transmutes without even thinking about them. From trials coffers, bgs, etc.

People do T1s but also do random normals. I do random vets for mine. Trial transmute is like… 5 transmute per character per week from the quest coffer.

EdjeSwift

Pevey wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

Truly veteran players don't do dungeons with random groups for transmutes. They form a group before queuing or source transmutes in other ways.

Of course truly veteran players do random groups for transmutes. It's the quickest, most efficient way to get them. I don't know anyone going for transmutes that makes a group first.

It's way more efficient to do the bare minimum for tier 1 rewards int he 30 day campaigns on all toons. It takes about half a day to do this for 20 toons. Each month, 1000 transmutes. I have probably 200 geodes with 50 transmutes each sitting on all my toons from doing this. Much more efficient than RNDs. You would have to do 100 RNDs to get those 1000 transmutes. Ouch.

Vet players also get transmutes without even thinking about them. From trials coffers, bgs, etc.

While it is more efficient to just do T1's for transmutes, what else are you going to do for the other 25-28 days of the month? I literally knocked out all my T1s in a weekend thanks to MYM; even without it's not much more than 30-45 minutes per toon. Caveat being I don't bother staying in PvP if it's a dead map on my home campaign.

Also, for some players, doing 100 randoms is much more enjoyable than 10 minutes of PvP, especially outside of MYM where the gains come slower.

Pevey

EdjeSwift wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Pevey wrote: »

Truly veteran players don't do dungeons with random groups for transmutes. They form a group before queuing or source transmutes in other ways.

Of course truly veteran players do random groups for transmutes. It's the quickest, most efficient way to get them. I don't know anyone going for transmutes that makes a group first.

It's way more efficient to do the bare minimum for tier 1 rewards int he 30 day campaigns on all toons. It takes about half a day to do this for 20 toons. Each month, 1000 transmutes. I have probably 200 geodes with 50 transmutes each sitting on all my toons from doing this. Much more efficient than RNDs. You would have to do 100 RNDs to get those 1000 transmutes. Ouch.

Vet players also get transmutes without even thinking about them. From trials coffers, bgs, etc.

While it is more efficient to just do T1's for transmutes, what else are you going to do for the other 25-28 days of the month? I literally knocked out all my T1s in a weekend thanks to MYM; even without it's not much more than 30-45 minutes per toon. Caveat being I don't bother staying in PvP if it's a dead map on my home campaign.

Also, for some players, doing 100 randoms is much more enjoyable than 10 minutes of PvP, especially outside of MYM where the gains come slower.

I was only responding to the point about efficiency. The most amount of transmutes for the least amount of time.

The most efficient way to get transmutes is to get them from things you would be doing anyway. So the time investment is basically zero. For some ppl, this includes RNDs. They would be doing the dungeons anyway because they enjoy them. But that sort of undermines the argument for why speedrunning is so important.

For me, trial coffers are a big source. It's only a few per coffer, but I have lots of toons, and there is zero time investment to get these because I am not doing the content for the transmutes at all. They are just "freebies," and they do add up. I like to keep room in my currency inventory (sitting around 900/1000 transmutes) to open these small geodes when I get them so I don't have to keep them in item inventory, but I constantly find myself running up against the ceiling without meaning to.

If there are no freebies because there is no content you would be doing anyway, and you are purposely grinding for transmutes, the most efficient is Cyro. You don't even have to PvP for it. Go to dead campaign, pop a torte, take a few resources, switch to next toon.

As to what you do for the other 29 days, play the game however you want. Do the content you want. No need to speedrun dungeons just for transmutes.

DenverRalphy

AlnilamE wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

AvalonRanger wrote: »

fedouva wrote: »

Just been in the Crypt of Hearts dungeon and couldn't take the back because while me and two low level players were killing the initial mobs, a 2000 point champion player ran in and activated the first boss. I think players go to dungeons just to run them, but not for a compelling story and it's sad. I certainly have an idea how to fix it, but no one will like forced dialogues without text) Just for today my impressions of hiking in the dungeons because of such sittuatsii spoiled.Also I will not be able to complete some quests, because the levers and other devices activated other players because of what I do not count the completion of these tasks, this is also very sad ... What do you think about this?

1, If you want to enjoy story reading in the dungeon quest, then don't use random grouping.
GO TO THE GROUPING TOOLS.

2, If you just want skill point by finishing dungeon quest, just say "I have quest" at the group chat.
Most of people accept your situation except jerk.

3, You should not expect slow pace running or deep exploring with the random team.

By that same token, a single speed runner should not expect it to be a fast pace run either. Just like in the OP's example. One player decided to zoom off and speed run and trigger the bosses while the other 3 were like "what the wha?"

In that case, you open the group menu, right-click on that player's name and select "vote to kick" and than the other players can decide as a group what they want to do. If someone is being obnoxious in a dungeon, the rest of the group has the choice to kick them.

Three players queued up for a dungeon, had to wait however long it took to get matched with a 4th from the random daily group finder, and now they're expected to kick one player only to have to wait what may be a long while to get matched again? Not to mention that the quest may well be botched.

If you kick someone, it doesn't break the group. The group 'leader' gets a prompt to find a replacement. The same thing happens if someone drops from the group. I've had a couple of runs where someone dropped at the beginning (usually the tank). Both times, we asked for a replacement and started running the dungeon. One time we got a replacement half-way through, the other time we got the tank at the last boss.

If a player is ruining the experience for the rest of the group, kick them. If the other players don't agree, they won't vote for it. It's a group decision.

Yes, I'm aware how it works. You can search for a replacement, but all too often it can take ages to get that replacement if it's a tank or healer. And if the quest is broken because of the speed runner, then no amount of time waiting for a replacement will fix that.

Ezhh

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

The speed runner typically needs nothing from anyone else. The random dungeon queue comes with no guarantees, but they don't need any. They can go it alone. They don't need to speak up.

Then why don't they just solo it? Oh, I know... they NEED the rest of the team to start, in order to qualify for the daily 'Random Dungeon' rewards. In other words, they need to be carried.

We have very different ideas of what the word "carried" means then. If you feel this way, it's the system you want to blame, not the players.

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

Would you read a single book by one of those authors 10+ times within, let's say a year? I can appreciate it if you and the OP do that, but I don't think it's the normal approach.
<snip>

Probably not. But then too, I'd be smart enough not to pick up and open the book if I knew I wasn't going to read it. Nor would I just skip to the last page if someone else were reading it with me.

I think this is stretching the comparison a bit here. Books don't give you vital equip drops or transmutes, or experience. I don't think you can expect people to always listen to all the NPCs every time they go in for another purpose, and because dungeons have multiple purposes, trying to complete a different one of those efficiently is not the same thing as having no appreciation for story. That's all the point was.

Pevey wrote: »

Truly veteran players don't do dungeons with random groups for transmutes. .

Responding to the whole conversation about this: I'd imagine most players would consider me a vet player (all trifectas apart from 2 trial and 2 dungeon, have done most PvP achievements including emp, high CP and so on...). I 100% definitely do dungeons in the random queue for transmutes.

Yes nothing beats T1s for efficiency, but I will burn my transmutes fast when starting with a new group or trying something new. It happened to me at least twice in the past year - once when I decided to take up tanking and had to make all the tank sets, and once when I moved back into PvP more seriously and made set ups for four different classes. Both times this happened the wait on T1s was too long, so into the random queue I went.

Would I have preferred to make my own group to do it? Sure, but my friends usually have other groups, as do I, and when something is annoying to schedule but there is a random queue I can hop in and have pop within a minute.... Why would I wait around?

Ardriel wrote: »

I don't like the way "speed runners" are portrayed as bad people here.

This. It's the main reason I keep coming back to the topic. Most would classify me as a speed runner, but I always try to be aware of group needs even if I don't stop and ask who needs things very often (I've found I get no answers). I always slow down if people say they have a quest to complete and always try to explain mechs if people are struggling to clear something. Yet based on the way some people react, everyone like me is a monster who ignores chat.

DenverRalphy

Ezhh wrote: »

I think this is stretching the comparison a bit here. Books don't give you vital equip drops or transmutes, or experience. I don't think you can expect people to always listen to all the NPCs every time they go in for another purpose, and because dungeons have multiple purposes, trying to complete a different one of those efficiently is not the same thing as having no appreciation for story. That's all the point was.

First, I'm not the one who created the comparison. I simply presented the counterpoint.

Second. The Normal version of the dungeon isn't the only source of those precious equipment drops, transmute crystals, and experience points you speak of. It's simply faster and thus more convenient. So should expedience and convenience trump common courtesy and respect? Should expedience and convenience determine the primary purpose of the dungeon run?

N00BxV1

Pevey wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

fedouva wrote: »

...do not need to fly forward as a space shuttle immediately to the first boss, you can wait until you kill mobs near the initial quest, it is also not difficult and no more difficult than me to write in the chat agree?

The thing is that fast runs have become the norm and there probably aren't that many characters that still need the quests. So those that want something other than the norm of a fast run are the ones that need to say something.

I disagree. From my experience, it seems about half and half in normal dungeons. Truly veteran players don't do dungeons with random groups for transmutes. They form a group before queuing or source transmutes in other ways.

I disagree (with the bold part).

I've been playing since 2014 and am a veteran player. I'm currently in a few guilds but they aren't very active, and my friends list is almost full but most of them either don't play anymore or are doing their own thing. So I'm not gonna waste time looking for a pre-made group every time that I want to run the Daily Random (Veteran) Dungeons or Pledges, because it's faster for me to solo queue as a Tank in the Activity Finder than it is to look for other players. Besides, there isn't much difference in the types of players that I'd get from a Group Finder post compared to the players that I'd get in the Activity Finder. They're still just random players; the Group Finder isn't gonna magically provide me with professional gamers...

Also, the Daily Random Dungeon is absolutely the best source of Transmute Crystals in the entire game. That's why so many people do it, and that's why so many people have issues with the dungeon experience. A player can run it on 20 characters and will get 200 Transmute Crystals, there is nothing else in game that even comes close to rewarding that many Transmute Crystals in ONE DAY. [Edit] And I refuse to partake in ESO PVP anymore, so that isn't even an option.


OT:
(read in a grumpy old man voice): "Back in my day" players wearing whatever random gear they found would have to walk uphill just to get to the dungeon entrance, and then stand around outside in the rain while looking for other players that also wanted to run the dungeon (because there was no Activity Finder or Group Finder). And when we did a dungeon it was because we wanted to do a dungeon, not because of some other priority that usually conflicts with other group members' priorities (Bonus XP, Transmute Crystals, Leads, etc.). If it were up to this old fart, I'd take all of that extra crap out of the dungeons and just leave the dungeons for the people that actually want to run dungeons.

old_scopie1945

alpha_synuclein wrote: "Discaimer: I don't think that we should have any dedicated anti-solo mechanics though. If you can do it, you shouldn't be artificially gated."
A yes to that point, spot on.

FlopsyPrince

fedouva wrote: »

OsUfi wrote: »

fedouva wrote: »

OsUfi wrote: »

Did you ask them to slow down?

On the rare occasion I set foot inside a dungeon I'll usually ask "fast or slow". I'll usually consider fast to be default due to the RND rewards.

I mean, I can't even take a task or fulfill certain conditions sometimes because either another player is doing it or I just can't keep up with everyone else.

I mean, did you ask them to slow down?

If you did and they ignored you, then they are muppets and I hope they endure a mild inconvenience upon their day.

If you didn't, then they will assume everyone's task is Random Daily Dungeon for transmutes, Exp, and gold or Undaunted keys.

20 seconds after the battle started, the three of us were beating mobs while the fourth one had already run up to the boss. It was the very beginning of the dungeon. You can reproduce it yourself in the crypt of hearts and you will understand what I'm talking about)

I think Crypt of Hearts is the nasty one that requires an optional boss for the questline. I can usually even solo kill that boss myself in time, but I have been too slow at others, needing to repeat the entire dungeon run to finish the quest for the skillpoint.

thedocbwarren

So wish these would scale to team size and level. This wouldn't be a problem if someone wished to go in with one or two persons in their own group. Or maybe quests should be removed from these if they are just going to get circumvented anyway by veteran players.

Ezhh

DenverRalphy wrote: »

First, I'm not the one who created the comparison. I simply presented the counterpoint.

No, I was. And I feel like my point - that people wanting to clear quickly on their xth time through doesn't mean they don't appreciate the quest - is getting lost, despite it being a pretty simple one.

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Second. The Normal version of the dungeon isn't the only source of those precious equipment drops, transmute crystals, and experience points you speak of. It's simply faster and thus more convenient. So should expedience and convenience trump common courtesy and respect? Should expedience and convenience determine the primary purpose of the dungeon run?

Who are you asking this of? I'm not championing people who act selfishly and I have said I stop if someone needs their quest. I've suggested what I can to try to help those having problems, and that's all I can do, so I'm the wrong person to try and argue this with. I don't have the power to change other people's behaviour.

valenwood_vegan

Ezhh wrote: »

Who are you asking this of? I'm not championing people who act selfishly and I have said I stop if someone needs their quest. I've suggested what I can to try to help those having problems, and that's all I can do, so I'm the wrong person to try and argue this with. I don't have the power to change other people's behaviour.

Yeah lol this is why I came back to this topic a few times too after my first post, trying to further explain myself a little better. I really don't get the hostility being directed at people who tried to offer some advice / workarounds / tips regarding the questing problem. We do not develop the game, nor are we capable of making random strangers show "courtesy and respect" to other random strangers, in situations where we aren't even present.

But for whatever it's worth, I assure people who are upset by speed-running that I'm not in any of your dungeons, as I don't even use the random finder anymore and run with my friends for the express purpose of avoiding drama, poor behavior, and miscommunication. (We do very rarely use the random finder to fill the 4th spot and *always* ask that person if they need anything from the dungeon. Very rarely do they respond, but if they do we're happy to help.).

Ezhh

valenwood_vegan wrote: »

I really don't get the hostility being directed at people who tried to offer some advice / workarounds / tips regarding the questing problem.

Thank you for posting this. I've encountered the same attitude in the past as well and it's exhausting. Apparently trying to explain or offer insight into the problem gets you flagged as being part of it, no matter how many disclaimers you add to explain that you are not supporting certain things.

People need to accept that this is the system we have for dungeons. No matter what any one of us thinks is right or wrong, all any of us can do is find the least painful way to work within it, or ways to not engage with it. Anyone who doesn't like this situation can always try writing support tickets to ask them to reconsider or change things. I'd 100% support a quest mode for dungeons, but I can't see them ever doing it.

valenwood_vegan

Yeah I mean ZoS has never responded to any of these threads in all the years I've been here. They did go back and fix a couple of the old quests I think... like in FG1 now, the quest progresses even if you don't put the Goblin King's head on the pike. They did add the group finder tool, but it seems like no one wants to use it and all think OTHERS should use it. There's absolutely nothing wrong with asking them for changes, but I don't expect much more than maybe a few basic quest fixes from them anytime soon.

Nharimlur_Finor

Ezhh wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

The speed runner typically needs nothing from anyone else. The random dungeon queue comes with no guarantees, but they don't need any. They can go it alone. They don't need to speak up.

Then why don't they just solo it? Oh, I know... they NEED the rest of the team to start, in order to qualify for the daily 'Random Dungeon' rewards. In other words, they need to be carried.

We have very different ideas of what the word "carried" means then. If you feel this way, it's the system you want to blame, not the players.

I have advocated for the system to be changed. It is always met with hostility and incredulity.
The carry issue became clear from you comment (bolded) above.
Speed running players do need the rest of the team to get their goals.
Your statement is just wrong.

Nharimlur_Finor

Ezhh wrote: »

People need to accept that this is the system we have for dungeons. No matter what any one of us thinks is right or wrong, all any of us can do is find the least painful way to work within it, or ways to not engage with it. Anyone who doesn't like this situation can always try writing support tickets to ask them to reconsider or change things. I'd 100% support a quest mode for dungeons, but I can't see them ever doing it.

No, we don't have to accept this, at all. It's already been accepted for way too long.

A quest mode for dungeons isn't the solution. Moving the transmute rewards somewhere else is.

Ezhh

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

The speed runner typically needs nothing from anyone else. The random dungeon queue comes with no guarantees, but they don't need any. They can go it alone. They don't need to speak up.

Then why don't they just solo it? Oh, I know... they NEED the rest of the team to start, in order to qualify for the daily 'Random Dungeon' rewards. In other words, they need to be carried.

We have very different ideas of what the word "carried" means then. If you feel this way, it's the system you want to blame, not the players.

I have advocated for the system to be changed. It is always met with hostility and incredulity.
The carry issue became clear from you comment (bolded) above.
Speed running players do need the rest of the team to get their goals.
Your statement is just wrong.

Since when was requiring a group the same as a carry? By your definition, everyone is being carried so it becomes a moot point in the argument anyway. Even if we go with this and say you are right to use the word this way, the speed runner still needs nothing from the group in terms of their behaviour/actions. They just have to exist. That's it. The quest runner does need the speed runner to vary their actions though. This is the imbalance. You can try and dodge it by arguing the definition of words, but it's what it is. If this was not the case, the quest runner would not have a problem. AGAIN - I am not saying the speed runner is the one who is RIGHT.

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

People need to accept that this is the system we have for dungeons. No matter what any one of us thinks is right or wrong, all any of us can do is find the least painful way to work within it, or ways to not engage with it. Anyone who doesn't like this situation can always try writing support tickets to ask them to reconsider or change things. I'd 100% support a quest mode for dungeons, but I can't see them ever doing it.

No, we don't have to accept this, at all. It's already been accepted for way too long.

A quest mode for dungeons isn't the solution. Moving the transmute rewards somewhere else is.

Can you change it? Can I?

So go and write your support ticket and take your arguments to the ones who can.

ESO_player123

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

People need to accept that this is the system we have for dungeons. No matter what any one of us thinks is right or wrong, all any of us can do is find the least painful way to work within it, or ways to not engage with it. Anyone who doesn't like this situation can always try writing support tickets to ask them to reconsider or change things. I'd 100% support a quest mode for dungeons, but I can't see them ever doing it.

No, we don't have to accept this, at all. It's already been accepted for way too long.

A quest mode for dungeons isn't the solution. Moving the transmute rewards somewhere else is.

Why quest mode is not as solution?

Let's look at your suggestion. Say, they move transmute rewards somewhere else. Then a lot of people will stop running dungeons for transmutes. But then there will be those that run for the daily XP. That also encourages to run as fast as possible. Ok, let's remove the daily XP. Those people will leave. Wait, there are still leads and gear. Those also benefit from running as fast as possible. Let's remove those as well.

Now, finally, there is nothing to farm dungeons for. Why would anyone return there? How long the queues will be and how will those few new players get someone to run the dungeons with? The game is not new, so there should be something to entice the players to go back to dungeons.

So, quest mode seems like a possible solution.

tincanman

Moving the "transmute reward somewhere else" won't help - it will just change the nature of the forum complaint threads to "queues are empty/stuck".

Expecting randoms to 'play the way you want' - and this is really what these threads are all about: expecting others to play the way 'YOU' want while disregarding their playstyle(s) - is naive at best.

The singular solution has been illustrated by many in this and other similar threads: pre-form a group with like-minded individuals if you prefer to play any particular style while enjoying the random dungeon bonuses.

tincanman

And look - it's right there in the Group Finder: options that include story and speed run.

You don't even need to be in guilds or use chat to look for like-minded individuals.

Nharimlur_Finor

tincanman wrote: »

Moving the "transmute reward somewhere else" won't help - it will just change the nature of the forum complaint threads to "queues are empty/stuck".

Expecting randoms to 'play the way you want' - and this is really what these threads are all about: expecting others to play the way 'YOU' want while disregarding their playstyle(s) - is naive at best.

The singular solution has been illustrated by many in this and other similar threads: pre-form a group with like-minded individuals if you prefer to play any particular style while enjoying the random dungeon bonuses.

Dungeons are fundamentally co-operative events, regardless of how players arrive there.
I'll continue with my choice of not playing dungeons.

old_scopie1945

tincanman wrote: »

And look - it's right there in the Group Finder: options that include story and speed run.

You don't even need to be in guilds or use chat to look for like-minded individuals.

Thanks, I didn't know that, I never really checked it out. You are never too old to learn.

spartaxoxo

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

People need to accept that this is the system we have for dungeons. No matter what any one of us thinks is right or wrong, all any of us can do is find the least painful way to work within it, or ways to not engage with it. Anyone who doesn't like this situation can always try writing support tickets to ask them to reconsider or change things. I'd 100% support a quest mode for dungeons, but I can't see them ever doing it.

No, we don't have to accept this, at all. It's already been accepted for way too long.

A quest mode for dungeons isn't the solution. Moving the transmute rewards somewhere else is.

Strongly disagree. Those transmute crystals are bringing in groups of people that want to complete the dungeon. It gives people a reason to be there even if they don't need the gear or skill points.

And doing the quest in a group is absolutely terrible for actually reading and listening to the story anyway. Listening to an NPC talk or taking the time to read are best done alone so you can actually hear and understand the storyline.

Dax_Draconis

tincanman wrote: »

And look - it's right there in the Group Finder: options that include story and speed run.

You don't even need to be in guilds or use chat to look for like-minded individuals.

It would be nice if speed runners would use it.

Amottica

fedouva wrote: »

I think players go to dungeons just to run them, but not for a compelling story and it's sad.

There as aspects of the game that encourage running dungeons many times. As such those who have run a dungeon a great many times tend to rush through them as their goal is an incentive that merely requires clearing the dungeon.

I have said many times that when asking the game to find a random group of players with random interests, we will get random, and that is exactly what the OP got with that group. It is best to pre-form a group for a specific purpose so all are on the same page. Even better, take the time to find a decent active guild and run with guildies. One will tend to have a much better experience on average going this route vs what the GF will put together. It is very much worth the time to find that decent guild.

FlopsyPrince

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

LaintalAy wrote: »

Ezhh wrote: »

The speed runner typically needs nothing from anyone else. The random dungeon queue comes with no guarantees, but they don't need any. They can go it alone. They don't need to speak up.

Then why don't they just solo it? Oh, I know... they NEED the rest of the team to start, in order to qualify for the daily 'Random Dungeon' rewards. In other words, they need to be carried.

We have very different ideas of what the word "carried" means then. If you feel this way, it's the system you want to blame, not the players.

I have advocated for the system to be changed. It is always met with hostility and incredulity.
The carry issue became clear from you comment (bolded) above.
Speed running players do need the rest of the team to get their goals.
Your statement is just wrong.

What do speed running players need from others in many dungeons? They may be able to solo the entire thing.