The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
PVP Mass Exodus: Give them a reason to return
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marius_buys✭✭✭✭✭
✭BalticBlues wrote: »Two things happened lately:- ZOS killed skilled PvP with the new PvP Proc sets.
- New World came out.
About New World, I am not worried much, it looks shallow to me.
However, I wonder how ZOS wants to repair the mess it created with the latest PvP Proc sets.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/587121/dark-convergence-is-ruining-cyrodiil/p1
By making them crit rotflGM Golden Clover - PC EU (since 2017) Guildex https://eso.guildex.org/view-guild/17669 Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/1312113207951965 -
marius_buys✭✭✭✭✭
✭There is a server withou procsets. 😁
We have had a visit or two there as a guild, very enjoyable
Biggest obstacle was to get everyone into the old test days no proc gearGM Golden Clover - PC EU (since 2017) Guildex https://eso.guildex.org/view-guild/17669 Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/1312113207951961 -
marius_buys✭✭✭✭✭
✭BalticBlues wrote: »Two things happened lately:- ZOS killed skilled PvP with the new PvP Proc sets.
- New World came out.
About New World, I am not worried much, it looks shallow to me.
However, I wonder how ZOS wants to repair the mess it created with the latest PvP Proc sets.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/587121/dark-convergence-is-ruining-cyrodiil/p1
I dare say if sets like Dark Convergence 'killed skilled PvP' that particular fraction of the player base may not be as skilled as advertised.
Most Valuable YouTube of the Year - How to use, and to avoid, Dark Convergence
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93iTGSUT3NU GM Golden Clover - PC EU (since 2017) Guildex https://eso.guildex.org/view-guild/17669 Facebook https://www.facebook.com/groups/1312113207951960 -
LarsS✭✭✭✭✭marius_buys wrote: »
There many more seta that works now than during the testing.GM for The Daggerfall Authority EU PC0 -
TequilaFire wrote: »Don't want to be impolite, but ESO PVP is nteresting for vast minority of ESO players only.
On the other hand, it consumes majority of server resources.
I suppose 70-90 percent of ESO performance problems are related to PVP.
The whole ESO game crashed recently couple of times because of PVP , lags and issues are mainly related to PVP.
We have 7 hours of maintnanace once per week and it seems not to be enough to patch all of that problems.
So who really cares about PVP and losing somebody friends playing PVP ? Not me.
Let them go, the less PVP players, the less problems.
Cyrodil in current state of decay is a nightmare zone not good for anything.
PVP in ESO is what it is and it can't be fixed easily.
ZOS seems not to be interested in refactoring and code optimalization and server capacity enhancement as it is a pure loss. they will rather develop a new chapter and sell it in crownstore and let PVP players struggle.
Just my opinion.
Could you please provide some links backing up your "opinion" that PvP consumes the majority of server resources?
Of course I can do.
Cyrodiil is one huge bottleneck on server performance.
Group dungeons are not so bad but they are the second biggest problem
In PVE world you can always load balance and split groups of players to different nodes so they never use the same capacity in your HW environment. Network bandwitch, CPU cores ore memory cells are today scalable and virtualized and can be added on the fly.
But this is not the case in PVP because big groups fighting each other long fights must work together (or against each other) from the start till the end, no reloads, no leaving the area, whatever giving the program opportunity to break and realocate
So when 40 palyers are casting all they could cast at once against another group doing the same to kill each other, things starting to be pretty rough on server side. Ping goes high , CPU performance down and memory is full. You can divert the load to another node because all is happening in one place and if you do so, all will lag or crash which is happening all the time
If you allocate biug reserve of resources, they will be used for the fraction capacity nearly all the time just to be able to serve in the peaks when huge battle occurs. And allocation of big resources costs big money.
You’ve cited no sources, nor evidence that you have firsthand knowledge of ESO specific infrastructure or netcode. You offer opinion and conjecture, and use that to write off an entire segment of the player base. Poor form.
[snip]
The question was what succesfull MMORPG game is nowadays based on PVP.
[snip]
None MMORPG based on PVP exists.
Why ?
Because PVP gaming is bringing much more complexity and unpredictable situtations then PVE gaming
and it is overall bad for business.
You need much more HW capacity, much more testing, much more maintanance and in the end
mostprofit comes from the PVE players as PVP community is much smaller then PVE.
Yeah, there are couple of youtubers and editors with obsession for PVP but they can't pay the whole game
so the company advertise PVP features a lot in the beginning and then tend to burry it or let it die itself.
I don't care about PVP at all as long as performance problems related to PVP content are blocking PVP players only but recently we experienced problems on PVE content as well.
[snip]
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on 29 October 2021 15:100 -
NagualV✭✭✭✭New World currently is a completely broken dumpster fire, every patch has broken more things than fixed....there are problems everywhere....you cant really trust what the game tells you about traits, skills, etc......
......and you know what? I havent , for a moment, thought about coming back here.
Because there is so much fun to be had in it, despite its flaws. Every reviewer I've seen has more or less the same sentiment - this thing is utterly broken, holy crap, but I still log in and play and have fun. There is a good foundation here, if it gets fixed, this will be highly successful etc.....
ESO is a wonderful, high quality PVE focused game. That's it. Nothing wrong with that. It's not a pvp game. They've made that decision a long time ago...
My opinion.6 -
Sun7dance✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It's not only DCv.
It's also the upcoming crit procc meta that is making players run away from pvp.
Players are simply tired of ZOS and their constant change of course!
We had one year with the Malacath procc meta. Then it seemed ZOS was finally listening to the players and balanced the procc sets.
Just a few weeks later they released three new procc sets and all of them were completely outside the new rules. Proccs were back again!
And last but not least proccs can now crit again!
The player whose set procc first will win!
Proccs, proccs, proccs, proccs...
That's not the pvp that players love!PS5|EU4 -
.... if it gets fixed
Seriously , you have 60 percent probability that NW game will worsen or will be closed at all as it leaves phase 1 (attracting new players) and enters phase 2 (earn money and milk existing players)
Amazon studio will not hesitate to shut it down if they wouldnt be able to fix it and start to earn money (as they closed 2 previous attempts for "inability to see a sustained future").
And don't forget what I said before, maintain PVP content is much more difficult then PVE.
So good luck.
1 -
AuraStorm43✭✭✭✭✭marius_buys wrote: »BalticBlues wrote: »Two things happened lately:
- ZOS killed skilled PvP with the new PvP Proc sets.
- New World came out.
About New World, I am not worried much, it looks shallow to me.
However, I wonder how ZOS wants to repair the mess it created with the latest PvP Proc sets.
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/587121/dark-convergence-is-ruining-cyrodiil/p1
By making them crit rotfl
DC/Plaguebreak/Hrothgaar aren’t on the list of proc sets that can crit0 -
0
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xxslam48xxb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭I said this in another thread, but the only way pvp is going to improve is if Zos invests in it and improves it. First they are going to need a reason to invest in it though. Right now pvp is just a free addition to the game. It doesn't get a constant stream of new dungeon packs or chapters. Its got an extremely small population as well, so even the pvpers that are buying this pve content are not that big of a customer base.
Zos, in order to make pvp profitable to your company you should create a battlepass like every other game. You will start making money off of pvp and you will draw in more people. If zos starts making money off of pvp I believe they will feel motivated and incentivized to fix all the bugs/lag. The influx of new players will demand better servers and their complaints will help bring about balance changes that would have never happened otherwise. If battle pass buyers are complaing about dc it would get nerfed. If they think tank meta is unfun, it will get patched. If they can't kill ball groups, zos will bring the hammer down on them. All in the name of making more money and keeping the pass users happy.
Zos isn't incompetent, they just don't want to fix anything pvp related because it will not give any returns. This is what I firmly believe.Edited by xxslam48xxb14_ESO on 29 October 2021 16:34I wrote a poem that I titled, "The ganker's delight."
As you lay upon the ground, cry not little pawn.
The pain will pass as quickly as my blade did take you,
but my delight will last and you will respawn.
My heart simply cannot contain my joy, when I ply my trade.
The fault lies with you, your skill was lacking.
Now your salt is mine forever, can't you hear the laughing?
Once you were so proud and now you are reduced to this.
A miserable, loud deuced fool.
With every tear you drip, with every excuse you let slip.
All of your insecurities and worries bring a smile to my lip.
From your despair I have ripped endless glories,
but our affair is over now. Be afraid for I will return for more.
I have received many titles, to my allies I am The sniper Emperor and Grand champion hero of the Pact. However these titles mean little to me, it is the ones given to me by my victims that I prefer. To them I am "Xv1er", "trash", "no balls", "zerger", "noob", "cringe", "no skill", "camper", "100% new", "the reason this game is dying", "pathetic", "a sack of piece of [snip]", "mediocre", "absolute inbred", "beyond a virgin", "ganky dork", "fat smelly 40yr old virgin", "little girl", "daddy", "exploiting loser", and every [snipped] word known to man.2 -
xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »
Zos, in order to make pvp profitable to your company you should create a battlepass like every other game. You will start making money off of pvp and you will draw in more people.
I think it works perfectly opposite way.
PVP and Arena temfights 1vs1 . 3vs3 and 5vs 5 could be profitable if rewards are worth to play it and if the system is balanced and not based on one or two copypasta setups that works on one or two classes.
One big guild PVP fight per week (let's say 30vs30) could be profitable if the environment is relatively small and controlled and not very HW demanding and people will not be fighting more with lags instead of their enemies.
I think ESO developers should look closely at World of tanks and learn a lesson how good PVP fights in big group should look like. A lot of features should be implemented, a lot of balancing and preparation before the match done and a lot of existing buffs and bonuses removed from the existing PVP content to make it more straightforward and easy to follow even for the beginners.
But huge maps like current CYRO with hundred of players can't be never profitable. I have never seen any huge MMORPG battles that were not twisted in that manner that group of 4-10 highest lvls were systematically tyrannizing the rest of the players, abusing every little opportunity the game gives them. Always one step ahead of the developers and the studio.
If the performance aspects are not the limit. Even if rewards are high, people tends to hate it and it is not worth the big investments to HW infrastructure and coding it.
1 -
Sorry but this forum is opened for 3 days old account as well as for 8 years old accounts.
You doesn't have any right to judge the quality of my posts as I don't judge quality of yours or others.
The topic is "PVP Mass Exodus: Give them a reason to return"
As I'm still keeping the toppic, I can hardly be trolling this thread.
BTW I asked 4 times this community to give me one example of MMORPG based on PVP content, no answer yet.
So my conclussion is that I'm right and PVP is is just one little aspect of any successfull MMORPG today.
So your position that I'm wrong in everything I posted needs some more explanation.
What particulary is wrong ?
Maybe I'll get answer this time .
[snip]
[edited for baiting]Edited by ZOS_Icy on 29 October 2021 17:450 -
IronWooshu✭✭✭✭✭
✭Sorry but this forum is opened for 3 days old account as well as for 8 years old accounts.
You doesn't have any right to judge the quality of my posts as I don't judge quality of yours or others.
The topic is "PVP Mass Exodus: Give them a reason to return"
As I'm still keeping the toppic, I can hardly be trolling this thread.
BTW I asked 4 times this community to give me one example of MMORPG based on PVP content, no answer yet.
So my conclussion is that I'm right and PVP is is just one little aspect of any successfull MMORPG today.
So your position that I'm wrong in everything I posted needs some more explanation.
What particulary is wrong ?
Maybe I'll get answer this time .
[snip]
[edited for baiting]
You seemed to completely skip over my posts then. League of Legends and DOTA 2 are both PVP in the style of classic MMORPG's and are 10x's more successful than any game currently. These games draw in 10's of thousands of spectators, they have multiple leagues across the different continents and they don't need a PVE aspect to survive and make money.
"BTW I asked 4 times this community to give me one example of MMORPG based on PVP content, no answer yet.
So my conclusion is that I'm right and PVP is is just one little aspect of any successful MMORPG today."
This right here from you is trolling as you have continually bashed PVP stating opinion as fact without a single evidence of data backing up your point. You've consistently bashed PVP players for making the game performance trash without any evidence other than you have 20 years of experience.
I respect your opinion but nothing in your posts have carried any weight. You have no right to your claims and the foundation to your theories are like cement poured without any rebar.Edited by IronWooshu on 29 October 2021 19:5011 -
adirondack✭✭✭✭✭IronWooshu wrote: »I respect your opinion but nothing in your posts have carried any weight. You have no right to your claims and the foundation to your theories are like cement poured without any rebar.
I am totally stealing this line. Well done sirRay1 -
Casul✭✭✭✭✭
✭I was in GH last night on PCNA, I gotta say. It's pretty bad. Feels like it's the proc meta in there cause even my bar swap was a 10% chance to occur.PvP needs more love.1 -
techyeshic✭✭✭✭✭I was in GH last night on PCNA, I gotta say. It's pretty bad. Feels like it's the proc meta in there cause even my bar swap was a 10% chance to occur.
It's awful. I keep wanting to come back and I just feel it more than ever when I do. Last time I did, I uninstalled to try to save me from myself. It prevented maybe one time as I had to wait for the reinstall. I just don't have the balls to delete my characters1 -
LarsS✭✭✭✭✭Ravenwatch is an alternative, if all who complains about proc meta would go there Ravenwatch would have long queues
GM for The Daggerfall Authority EU PC0 -
Mrtoobyy✭✭✭✭It's not only DCv.
It's also the upcoming crit procc meta that is making players run away from pvp.
Players are simply tired of ZOS and their constant change of course!
We had one year with the Malacath procc meta. Then it seemed ZOS was finally listening to the players and balanced the procc sets.
Just a few weeks later they released three new procc sets and all of them were completely outside the new rules. Proccs were back again!
And last but not least proccs can now crit again!
The player whose set procc first will win!
Proccs, proccs, proccs, proccs...
That's not the pvp that players love!
Yes! If the changes to Dark convergence won't change it for the better I will uninstall the game for the first time since launch day. As you said we were headed towards A REALLY good spot for pvp but then they JUST HAD to stir things up again. I don't get it. Who has the final word on what goes live or not, that person must either hate pvp and just wants to f*ck it up or haven't played it for a long long time.2 -
kuschlwuschl116Soul Shrivenmartinhpb16_ESO wrote: »
That´s the point. A lot of CP defence has been made passiv during the last year. Crit resist, health and battle spirit.
Add functioning defence sets like sithis to the mix and you get what we see there now. They should really reduce the passives a bit and move them into CP passives. Give us some of the no-cp speed back, ZOS.Please!1 -
xxslam48xxb14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭kuschlwuschl116 wrote: »martinhpb16_ESO wrote: »
That´s the point. A lot of CP defence has been made passiv during the last year. Crit resist, health and battle spirit.
Add functioning defence sets like sithis to the mix and you get what we see there now. They should really reduce the passives a bit and move them into CP passives. Give us some of the no-cp speed back, ZOS.Please!
Seriously I miss old ravenwatch so much =((((((
It was literally perfect. We had the cp campaigns for slow paced high ttk and ravenwatch for fast paced low ttk. Even the tankier people on old ravenwatch were killable. Nu Ravenwatch is the worst campaign now. Should just delete it at this point.I wrote a poem that I titled, "The ganker's delight."
As you lay upon the ground, cry not little pawn.
The pain will pass as quickly as my blade did take you,
but my delight will last and you will respawn.
My heart simply cannot contain my joy, when I ply my trade.
The fault lies with you, your skill was lacking.
Now your salt is mine forever, can't you hear the laughing?
Once you were so proud and now you are reduced to this.
A miserable, loud deuced fool.
With every tear you drip, with every excuse you let slip.
All of your insecurities and worries bring a smile to my lip.
From your despair I have ripped endless glories,
but our affair is over now. Be afraid for I will return for more.
I have received many titles, to my allies I am The sniper Emperor and Grand champion hero of the Pact. However these titles mean little to me, it is the ones given to me by my victims that I prefer. To them I am "Xv1er", "trash", "no balls", "zerger", "noob", "cringe", "no skill", "camper", "100% new", "the reason this game is dying", "pathetic", "a sack of piece of [snip]", "mediocre", "absolute inbred", "beyond a virgin", "ganky dork", "fat smelly 40yr old virgin", "little girl", "daddy", "exploiting loser", and every [snipped] word known to man.0 -
LyraEmber✭✭✭Lowbei detailed the history of the slow removal of server resources at the datacenter ZOS rents servers from, to the point where we are now on the lower tier that their datacenter provides.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-Cgg9EqLPQ
Edited by LyraEmber on 31 October 2021 17:223 -
drsalvation✭✭✭✭✭Someone mentioned on one of my posts that adding PvP to overland would be interesting.
I partially agree, just because I don't like how PvP works generally, but that would still be a refreshing concept.1 -
kargen27✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭IronWooshu wrote: »IronWooshu wrote: »For more information on the data I pulled:
https://twitchtracker.com/games/peak-viewers
If you notice on this list of peak viewers of all time, 14 of the top 20 games on this list are competitive in nature.
That could be for a variety of reasons. Maybe people that play those types of games tend to be the types of people that like watching others play? Watching others compete after all is a bit more exciting than watching someone talk to NPCs while on a quest. You might be seeing a correlation that doesn't exist.
I'm basing my theory off scientific data, humans are competitive by nature.
"Competitions have the undesirable quality of being a “zero-sum” game (i.e., in order for you to win, someone else must lose). Nonetheless, throughout human history, people seemed to have enjoyed organizing competitions in one form or another, from the ancient Greek Olympic Games (going back as far as 776 BC) to modern soccer (I would say American Football, but soccer is actually the most popular sport in the world). In fact, when you look closely, you’ll notice that competition is everywhere in modern society. Economists tell us that competition is an essential force in maintaining productive and efficient markets"
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/socially-relevant/201506/the-psychology-competition
You can read more, another article from sciencedirect on why people like competition
"We hypothesized that people who are motivated by competition are motivated for at least three reasons: competition allows them to satisfy the need to win, competition provides the opportunity or reason for improving their performance, and competition motivates them to put forth greater effort that can result in high levels of performance."
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0191886995000355#:~:text=We hypothesized that people who,that can result in high
I mean the study is everywhere and its been that way throughout civilization dating back to before a time we even have proper history for. It's not a wild theory to jump to the theory that the top most watched/played games are competitive in nature (sans a few). Look at League of Legends, it's 5v5 PVP is largely MMORPG style and that game is a professional esport with multiple leagues and huge dollar amounts/sell out crowds. They don't have an PVE side to the game and it does way better than ESO.
ZoS would be crazy to eliminate PVP, as much as PVER's think they can sustain this game alone, simple truth is they cant and if Zenimax doesn't focus more on PVP they will hemorrhage more players. Competition is healthy for this game, for the players, for its future on Twitch. You fix alot of the problems plaguing Cyrodiill and I guarantee you a lot of streamers come back because the combat in this game is fun when it works.
While interesting none of that has anything to do with trying to gauge the popularity of a game based on how many people watch others play it on Twitch.
Chess is a game enjoyed by millions (800 million registered players) but few enjoy watching others play. Yeah League of Legends is huge. It is an entire different type of game. One that will continue to grow. They offer tournaments often with huge cash prizes for winning, have a world ranking and are investing heavily in creating an atmosphere that will rival attending other major sporting events.
But they are different and they are not what everyone wants. Again back to chess. 800 million registered players and how many around the world that play just for fun both on a board and with a computer.
The point still stands. You can not judge the popularity of a game by looking at the number of viewers on Twitch. I agree players will return when/if Cyrodiil is improved or maybe even when the new wears off that other game. There will be some Twitch types that come back but those looking for large viewing audiences and revenue are going to continue to always jump to the new thing. That is where the hype is.and then the parrot said, "must be the water mines green too."2 -
kargen27✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »I said this in another thread, but the only way pvp is going to improve is if Zos invests in it and improves it. First they are going to need a reason to invest in it though. Right now pvp is just a free addition to the game. It doesn't get a constant stream of new dungeon packs or chapters. Its got an extremely small population as well, so even the pvpers that are buying this pve content are not that big of a customer base.
Zos, in order to make pvp profitable to your company you should create a battlepass like every other game. You will start making money off of pvp and you will draw in more people. If zos starts making money off of pvp I believe they will feel motivated and incentivized to fix all the bugs/lag. The influx of new players will demand better servers and their complaints will help bring about balance changes that would have never happened otherwise. If battle pass buyers are complaing about dc it would get nerfed. If they think tank meta is unfun, it will get patched. If they can't kill ball groups, zos will bring the hammer down on them. All in the name of making more money and keeping the pass users happy.
Zos isn't incompetent, they just don't want to fix anything pvp related because it will not give any returns. This is what I firmly believe.
They have actually invested a good amount of time into trying to fix PvP. All those changes that players complain about are attempts to improve PvP. I've been in some top PvP guilds. You would be surprised by how much many PvP'rs spend on this game. They like the cool mounts and costumes just like other players. They have some really nice homes. I would be willing to bet four Ta and three bananas that if ZoS put siege weapons and other PvP oriented stuff in the crown store as furnishings they would make a killing. Well maybe not right at the moment. But if PvP'rs forgive them for the Dark Convergence mess selling PvP furnishings would be a boon.and then the parrot said, "must be the water mines green too."3 -
AuraStorm43✭✭✭✭✭Lowbei detailed the history of the slow removal of server resources at the datacenter ZOS rents servers from, to the point where we are now on the lower tier that their datacenter provides.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-Cgg9EqLPQ
Where’s his sources for this information?0 -
AJones43865✭✭✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »I said this in another thread, but the only way pvp is going to improve is if Zos invests in it and improves it. First they are going to need a reason to invest in it though. Right now pvp is just a free addition to the game. It doesn't get a constant stream of new dungeon packs or chapters. Its got an extremely small population as well, so even the pvpers that are buying this pve content are not that big of a customer base.
Zos, in order to make pvp profitable to your company you should create a battlepass like every other game. You will start making money off of pvp and you will draw in more people. If zos starts making money off of pvp I believe they will feel motivated and incentivized to fix all the bugs/lag. The influx of new players will demand better servers and their complaints will help bring about balance changes that would have never happened otherwise. If battle pass buyers are complaing about dc it would get nerfed. If they think tank meta is unfun, it will get patched. If they can't kill ball groups, zos will bring the hammer down on them. All in the name of making more money and keeping the pass users happy.
Zos isn't incompetent, they just don't want to fix anything pvp related because it will not give any returns. This is what I firmly believe.
They have actually invested a good amount of time into trying to fix PvP. All those changes that players complain about are attempts to improve PvP. I've been in some top PvP guilds. You would be surprised by how much many PvP'rs spend on this game. They like the cool mounts and costumes just like other players. They have some really nice homes. I would be willing to bet four Ta and three bananas that if ZoS put siege weapons and other PvP oriented stuff in the crown store as furnishings they would make a killing. Well maybe not right at the moment. But if PvP'rs forgive them for the Dark Convergence mess selling PvP furnishings would be a boon.
It seems more like they've put a ton of time and focus on doing everything except providing modern servers that can handle the load, except during MYM events, then Cyro works pretty good even with much higher numbers of players. This was the proof that the bottleneck is almost certainly the servers; they can make cyro work at least a few weeks out of the year for the MYM events.4 -
AuraStorm43✭✭✭✭✭xxslam48xxb14_ESO wrote: »I said this in another thread, but the only way pvp is going to improve is if Zos invests in it and improves it. First they are going to need a reason to invest in it though. Right now pvp is just a free addition to the game. It doesn't get a constant stream of new dungeon packs or chapters. Its got an extremely small population as well, so even the pvpers that are buying this pve content are not that big of a customer base.
Zos, in order to make pvp profitable to your company you should create a battlepass like every other game. You will start making money off of pvp and you will draw in more people. If zos starts making money off of pvp I believe they will feel motivated and incentivized to fix all the bugs/lag. The influx of new players will demand better servers and their complaints will help bring about balance changes that would have never happened otherwise. If battle pass buyers are complaing about dc it would get nerfed. If they think tank meta is unfun, it will get patched. If they can't kill ball groups, zos will bring the hammer down on them. All in the name of making more money and keeping the pass users happy.
Zos isn't incompetent, they just don't want to fix anything pvp related because it will not give any returns. This is what I firmly believe.
They have actually invested a good amount of time into trying to fix PvP. All those changes that players complain about are attempts to improve PvP. I've been in some top PvP guilds. You would be surprised by how much many PvP'rs spend on this game. They like the cool mounts and costumes just like other players. They have some really nice homes. I would be willing to bet four Ta and three bananas that if ZoS put siege weapons and other PvP oriented stuff in the crown store as furnishings they would make a killing. Well maybe not right at the moment. But if PvP'rs forgive them for the Dark Convergence mess selling PvP furnishings would be a boon.
Turning off almost all sets is not a “fix”3
