Please Open 1-2 Faction Locked Campaigns

frozywozy

Joshlenoir wrote: »

Aliyavana wrote: »

Astrid_V wrote: »

1 CP and 1 non-CP would be good.

This, the ap farmers that think factions are meaningless have their old campaigns but those that care about faction loyalty will have this campaign.

Lol I can still go in those campaigns and farm AP for my enjoyment on my main characters. This will have no effect on that.
Factions are meaningless though.
And faction pride is a outdated empty concept which dictates the "team" you play for is more important than your merits as a player individually.
Who cares if you have every keep on the map and gate camp low pop factions? Or constantly have people taking empty keeps and painting the map one color at night, or running 50+ man groups faction stacking and lagging out keeps during primetime which takes 0 skill and just ruins PvP for everyone. As long as you "win" the campaign. The reason people don't care about campaign is because there's no way to effectively gauge who's actually being more effective and who has the better more coordinated players. Because at the end of the day numbers and siege rule all, when it comes to the scoreboard that's why people don't care.
People hop to the other factions when there's nobody to fight (like myself) because I actually enjoy PvPing against players, not only keeps.
The thing that's funny (and a little sad) is you'll have these veteran elitist pvpers who demonize people for hopping factions because they don't want to constantly subject themselves to the miserable, fruitless one month grind to "win" a campaign wherein you learn almost nothing about PvP class wise, only marginally improve, make minimal AP, and spend more time PvPing against doors and walls than players.

I agree with alot of your points. Most of the problems mentioned resolve on the fact that we don't have enough active players to support multiple campaigns with constant active gameplay. With 2 or 3 active campaigns involving active guilds playing for different factions during different timezones, it would make things much easier to establish which campaign and which faction needs assistance during a specific timeframe and make sure that no map flipping occurs at all.

Until the community grows back up and can sustain multiple campaigns, I don't believe there are simple and easy solutions to counter the problem of map flipping during offhours. Ideas like locking a campaign at a certain time of the day or disabling points does not make sense because some people work on different shifts and it would be unfair for them.

One thing that could help and that I have been a supporter of since a long time ago would be to reduce the population cap (max pop + queue) to what 3 bars actually is. When all populations are at 3bars with active guilds running and getting into aoe fights, the server is still very playable. This solution would also force people to play on an additional campaign since the queues would be too high at primetime and meanwhile creating an additional competitive environment with 24/7 gameplay.

This being said, there is something that you seem to neglect into your entire post @Joshlenoir. No matter if the incentives, the rewards and the motivations are not very present and encouraging to play the map, some people simply get bored of the repetitive "Kill, Die Respawn" scenario. They need something to work on in the background to make it more interesting.

I compare this playstyle to CoD Nuketown VS Battlefield Domination. Some people enjoy respawning right into the action and start killing in a few seconds when some other people like me enjoy long lifetime with objective based gameplay.

Joshlenoir

Iduyenn wrote: »

But how far would this go? Could a EP player not whisper an AD friend, while in PVP? What about guild communications?
I know some ppl with girlfriends/boyfriends/guildmates/friends in other factions.

Though you are right. Its not eliminating the risk, but minimizing it.

Exactly this. As long as opposing factions can still whisper this will always be a thing. If not people can use discord.
There are so many ways to get around a faction locked campaign to grief it.
This is why the design of AvAvA is poor and needs serious reworking. The current state it's in can never be taken seriously by anyone that's been PvPing for a decent amount of time. It loses its charm fast.

albesca

Iduyenn wrote: »

But how far would this go? Could a EP player not whisper an AD friend, while in PVP? What about guild communications?
I know some ppl with girlfriends/boyfriends/guildmates/friends in other factions.

Though you are right. Its not eliminating the risk, but minimizing it.

I think that the point is minimizing the risk of foul play with the least possible limitations imposed on players (I wouldn't limit communications, for example).
As a general rule I think that we should be allowed to do pretty much whatever we want but there should be incentives to do the "right" things: loyalty bonus for playing a whole campaign on a single alliance, for example.

Joshlenoir

frozywozy wrote: »

One thing that could help and that I have been a supporter of since a long time ago would be to reduce the population cap (max pop + queue) to what 3 bars actually is. When all populations are at 3bars with active guilds running and getting into aoe fights, the server is still very playable. This solution would also force people to play on an additional campaign since the queues would be too high at primetime and meanwhile creating an additional competitive environment with 24/7 gameplay.

This being said, there is something that you seem to neglect into your entire post @Joshlenoir. No matter if the incentives, the rewards and the motivations are not very present and encouraging to play the map, some people simply get bored of the repetitive "Kill, Die Respawn" scenario. They need something to work on in the background to make it more interesting.

Reducing Max pop is a good idea all around, especially due to lag issues in big fights. However there is an issue with that

The current state of the game in cyrodill Is very repetitive, whether you like killing players or taking keeps. The main issue with cyrodill is that there's no incentive to go outside of the dreaded EMP ring and utilize the map. The only time I see people legitimately spread out are when scrolls are being ran or farmed.
Cyrodill has so many awesome delves, large quest hub areas, enormous landscapes and other huge terrains could legitimately fit BG maps in it due to it's size, this is without even considering IC - but the space is never used. This needs to change. As long as the only thing to do on a map that's actually worth your time is farm players / groups and kill as many people as you can, or repetitively siege down keeps whether they're empty or not (because it really doesn't matter if every keep on the map is empty lol), people won't care enough about faction loyalty to respect it- because there's nothing to respect. If they added legitimate objectives with real consequences for neglecting across the map it would offer smaller groups and other players more incentive to PvP and utilize the space provided on the map, and would discourage people from bringing 24+ to one objective across the map because of population cap and sacrificing keeps.

But we'll see what ZoS does.

Iduyenn

Joshlenoir wrote: »

frozywozy wrote: »

One thing that could help and that I have been a supporter of since a long time ago would be to reduce the population cap (max pop + queue) to what 3 bars actually is. When all populations are at 3bars with active guilds running and getting into aoe fights, the server is still very playable. This solution would also force people to play on an additional campaign since the queues would be too high at primetime and meanwhile creating an additional competitive environment with 24/7 gameplay.

This being said, there is something that you seem to neglect into your entire post @Joshlenoir. No matter if the incentives, the rewards and the motivations are not very present and encouraging to play the map, some people simply get bored of the repetitive "Kill, Die Respawn" scenario. They need something to work on in the background to make it more interesting.

Reducing Max pop is a good idea all around, especially due to lag issues in big fights. However there is an issue with that
.

I am not sure i agree. Cyrodiil is realy big and if you lack players, the whole map becomes gank-ground-zero because the groups are to small for real sieges. (Yes, due to the low efficiency of some groups).

If i remember correctely, they already reduced maximal players allowed in Cyrodiil.
I dont know, if anything has changed concerning the correlating problems between IC and Cyrodiil. Some still claim, that Cyrodiil had better times before IC hit live.
They even upgraded the server once, but perhaps its time again. And with all the new effects..

I am very lucky and dont have as many problems as other people. Yes, there are lags and the occasional loadingscreen, but i think not all of it has to do with the game. There are multiple factors. Most ppl don`t know how to optimize their own performance. Others have the bad luck of crappy lines and distances to servers, acess points, package sequencing yadayadayada.


.

TazESO

Yes please

DirkRavenclaw

Faction Lock now, complete. Oh, you know so many in the other Faction? Hm, then play in this other Faction. Dont get me wrong, Im in 5 Guilds, 1 of the Guilds is a AD PVP Guild, the others, i have Guildies from all Factions, i craft for them, i help out in PVE but when meeting them in Cyrodiil, i dont hold back. Im proud to be AD and i hate this permanent switching, especially beetween EP and DC, you see it all the Time

Kikke

DirkRavenclaw wrote: »

Faction Lock now, complete. Oh, you know so many in the other Faction? Hm, then play in this other Faction. Dont get me wrong, Im in 5 Guilds, 1 of the Guilds is a AD PVP Guild, the others, i have Guildies from all Factions, i craft for them, i help out in PVE but when meeting them in Cyrodiil, i dont hold back. Im proud to be AD and i hate this permanent switching, especially beetween EP and DC, you see it all the Time

Same as this guy 100%

Joy_Division

If ZOS felt the PvP population was large enough to sustain a divided player base, they'd do this. Just like they'd implement a CP BG option.

On PC NA, there is only one server that has constant activity expect during peak prime time and that makes dividing the community unrealistic.

And, no, implementing such a decision is not going to all of a sudden bring back all those people who left and uninstalled the game. Because even if they went through the trouble of logging back in after week, they would quickly rediscover why it was they left in the first place: performance issues, questionable balance, undesirable emphasis of stuff that has nothing to do with our abilities, and there would still be emp-trading/spais/political nonsense just as there was when faction locks were a thing.

Sandman929

They could try it. If the campaign stays dead, then I guess not that many people were into it. I also wouldn't mind one-time use per character faction change tokens. There's a lot ZOS could do to incentivize faction loyalty, but most ideas to do so seem to fall on deaf ears.

ZOS_Mika

We have recently removed some off topic commentary. This is a reminder to keep the discussion focused on the original thread topic. Thank you for your understanding.

Enkil

Please stop trolling the thread @Joshlenoir. We dgaf about that video and it has nothing to do with the topic.

Joshlenoir

Enkil wrote: »

Please stop trolling the thread @Joshlenoir. We dgaf about that video and it has nothing to do with the topic.

"Any opinion I dislike or disagree with is trolling because I have no counter argument."

And she specifically brought up few players destroying large groups of people and how ZoS should remedy that. So I showed a video about it and asked her if she thinks thhat shouldn't happen. It was perfectly in line with the context.
None of which had anything to do with you though so not quite sure why you felt the need to irrelevantly interject.

Iduyenn

wow wow wow ppl! Take it easy. Geee!

I didnt say to nerf anyone or anything. Tough i think, PVP could use some changes. Some new additions, where smaller group fights are formated into smaller landscapes (like valleys). And perhaps make it a 12v12 or so. PVP still has a huge potential in this game.

We are discussing the possibilities of faction locked campaigns. Though i would love to have some more specifics. I admit, i had to read it twice, because i first thought the OT wanted two-faction campaigns.

Just keep in mind, that "fun" in pvp has different wiewing angles.
I come from a long line of grinding and min/maxing mmorpg`s. I expirienced PVP in a lot of different ways. And yes, even the massives fights with a good leader (in Teamspek). Have been fun. (GW2 for example).
And i am not a fan to nerf the game constantely. I even want the old days back, where you had to take your time to get to V10.
The time, where you could get killed by normal overland creatures (for example).

The thing is; Shouldn`t those fights mean something? I mean, they are fun sure. The campaign points are very often besides the point. Imho that is one point of @Enkil. He want`s. that the identification with your campaign and the collaboration of all parties have significance. (Correct me, if i am wrong).

Enkil wrote: »

would rather play the map than being forced to tolerate some cross-factions players turning siege around, starting fake groups, disparaging the regular players, constant trolling and general nonsense that goes on by a minority of players that behave that way. There are few, if any, proper tools in place to deal with these players other than ignoring them individually, which is not a solution to the bulk of the problems.

Anazasi

I read through most of the posts and the biggest issue I keep hearing is "play as you like" means no population locks. Well I think there might be a population that wants to play with population locks. Why do players assume what they believe is the only way the game can be played? There is just as much validity in saying the game launched with locks, we want them back as they were originally. Don't get me wrong I agree the population probably doesn't support locks but none-the-less, It's a valid request. No one is saying lock all the campaigns they are simply asking for 1 locked campaign. If you don't want to be there well you simply don't have to be. But if you do and this is the type of game you want to play, there is absolutely no reason ZOS couldn't try it and see what happens.

Miriel

Right now the only thing that matters in my opinion is how we can get new players to pvp and make them stay, and to get old players back... Its clear that pvp in the form we have now simply dosent work, we have a half full campaign, its a shadow of what pvp once was...

Adding options to allow people to play difrently might or might not bring people back, but atleast its a try !

Enkil

Miriel wrote: »

Right now the only thing that matters in my opinion is how we can get new players to pvp and make them stay, and to get old players back...

*raises hand*

Hi, I just returned to game after quitting 3 years ago. I've recently talked to and helped brand new players while in Summerset leveling up to 10 for PvP.

New players are already here and the devs are heavily marketing the game with Summerset and Morrowind before that, so more will be coming. Maintaining a hostile environment, trolling newer players and/or calling them pugs when they ask for group in zone chat is a deterrent and off-putting. I experienced this immediately upon entering Kyne... was laughed at and ridiculed for asking for a group... on a healer toon. What gives?? It’s moronic.

I'm just gonna throw this out there, but maybe Instead of just complaining about how the game needs new players we could all be a little more welcoming rather than seeing them as low skill/un-geared players to be farmed/misled. Joking around is fun and fine, but don't be oblivious as to when it is inappropriate jerky behavior.

Enkil

I really do hope a faction locked campaign is added soon. I've been playing Kyne NA PC since returning to ESO and it has become a complete mockery and total clusterf&!* lately.

• Tri-faction guilds recruit and fight each other wearing the same guild tags despite being on different faction toons
• Scroll ran into the water so it will warp back to a held keep because the carrier could not run it back on their own
• Faction hoppers log alts and take and drop scrolls to enemy faction (they are loyal to on their mains) every other day
• Players hop faction and trash talk / troll the regular players and stir up chaos at times when zone chat is most needed for comms
• Faction hopping takes place multiple times in same few hours by same players. They will take keep on one faction, swap and take back on alt from other faction
• Player keeps second account toon logged in constantly checking map ever so often (presumably to burn FC's) every night for multiple weeks now
• Faction hoppers turn ‘friendly’ siege around and can’t be attacked/killed/hanged despite being obvious ***
• On and on...

Sure, some people think these are valid tactics and seem to get some kinda rise out of it. *golfclap*

Free-for-all campaigns should not be the only option.

Please add a faction locked campaign.

Heimpai

Enkil wrote: »

Miriel wrote: »

Right now the only thing that matters in my opinion is how we can get new players to pvp and make them stay, and to get old players back...

*raises hand*

Hi, I just returned to game after quitting 3 years ago. I've recently talked to and helped brand new players while in Summerset leveling up to 10 for PvP.

New players are already here and the devs are heavily marketing the game with Summerset and Morrowind before that, so more will be coming. Maintaining a hostile environment, trolling newer players and/or calling them pugs when they ask for group in zone chat is a deterrent and off-putting. I experienced this immediately upon entering Kyne... was laughed at and ridiculed for asking for a group... on a healer toon. What gives?? It’s moronic.

I'm just gonna throw this out there, but maybe Instead of just complaining about how the game needs new players we could all be a little more welcoming rather than seeing them as low skill/un-geared players to be farmed/misled. Joking around is fun and fine, but don't be oblivious as to when it is inappropriate jerky behavior.

Funny you mention that...when i first started dc pvdoored every night with a group waiting at gates and some would tbag me after killing me with their group

I nearly quit and went back to overwatch/battlefield but instead went to pve till i understood the game better..

I will always hate DC because of the experience they gave me

Nermy

Lots of conjecture here. The only way we can know if it will change anything is to try it for 1 campaign, see what difference it makes.

DirkRavenclaw

Faction Lock now, i even would pay for playing in a campaign that is faction logged, look at the state of Vivec(Not that i wanna bring ZOS of any Ideas, lol)

Ormtunge

I absolutely support this. I also think it would make pvping alot more friendly, since we are all really one fraction and want to win the campaign together. Personally I think it would be a great way to recruit more pvpers to Cyrodil.

Anrose

Ormtunge wrote: »

we are all really one fraction and want to win the campaign together.

Typo is unintentionally correct since only a fraction of people actually care about winning th campaign. Faction locks won’t change that.

adirondack

Anrose wrote: »

Ormtunge wrote: »

we are all really one fraction and want to win the campaign together.

Typo is unintentionally correct since only a fraction of people actually care about winning th campaign. Faction locks won’t change that.

I was told there would be no math.

Ormtunge

Anrose wrote: »

Ormtunge wrote: »

we are all really one fraction and want to win the campaign together.

Typo is unintentionally correct since only a fraction of people actually care about winning th campaign. Faction locks won’t change that.

Well actually most pvpers I talk to care about winning:) And with fraction lock I think more would want to play. Not everyone want to just farm, u know?:)

Ormtunge

Anrose wrote: »

Ormtunge wrote: »

we are all really one fraction and want to win the campaign together.

Typo is unintentionally correct since only a fraction of people actually care about winning th campaign. Faction locks won’t change that.

..and just to be sure if u are a slow one (im not saying u are, so relax), I ofc ment that all IN the fraction is ONE fraction:) Like all in DC are one fraction even thou people dont behave that way. But if we get a fraction lock I think more will behave like it:)

Anrose

Ormtunge wrote: »

Anrose wrote: »

Ormtunge wrote: »

we are all really one fraction and want to win the campaign together.

Typo is unintentionally correct since only a fraction of people actually care about winning th campaign. Faction locks won’t change that.

Well actually most pvpers I talk to care about winning:) And with fraction lock I think more would want to play. Not everyone want to just farm, u know?:)

Ormtunge wrote: »

Anrose wrote: »

Ormtunge wrote: »

we are all really one fraction and want to win the campaign together.

Typo is unintentionally correct since only a fraction of people actually care about winning th campaign. Faction locks won’t change that.

..and just to be sure if u are a slow one (im not saying u are, so relax), I ofc ment that all IN the fraction is ONE fraction Like all in DC are one fraction even thou people dont behave that way. But if we get a fraction lock I think more will behave like it:)

Guess it wasn’t a typo.

adirondack

These complex polynomials are conjugating with incompatible coefficients.

Katahdin

A faction locked campaign will be red 24/7 and it will die from boredom

Also many people have multiple accounts or can get new ones for $10.

If I want to play AD, I get on account no 1
If I want to play EP, I get on account no 2
If I want to play DC, I get on account no 3

It happened all the time the last time we had faction locks.

This. Will. Solve. Nothing.

dtsharples

Katahdin wrote: »

A faction locked campaign will be red 24/7 and it will die from boredom

Also many people have multiple accounts or can get new ones for $10.

If I want to play AD, I get on account no 1
If I want to play EP, I get on account no 2
If I want to play DC, I get on account no 3

It happened all the time the last time we had faction locks.

This. Will. Solve. Nothing.

New accounts don't come with pre-levelled Max CP chars though do they.
That's a lot of time to put into a new account just to skip a queue that is aimed at evening the odds in Cyrodil for once.

And nobody is talking about locking out your whole account at all.
Just as it was originally intended. You choose one campaign per faction for its duration.
It really is a very simple concept - and allows you to do pretty much what you do already now, just without all the Bull that happens due to people switching factions nightly to influence the score.