Miat's add-on

pogopwns_ESO

This needs to be stopped, enough said lol

Gilvoth

i second this.
it is against the whole concept of stealth, and stealth surprise to have add-ons like this one remove our ability to surprise the enemy.
if they know we are nearby, we lose our chance that we naturaly get from eso's original design.

Xexpo

Idk ....
watching high ranked trash can pvpers freak out and start popping shields and infernal guardian because you heavy attacked with your sword and board from 40m away ,
is pretty freaking hilarious

Gilvoth

Xexpo wrote: »

Idk ....
watching high ranked trash can pvpers freak out and start popping shields and infernal guardian because you heavy attacked with your sword and board from 40m away ,
is pretty freaking hilarious

i don't need a cheat add-on for that, i can get the same reaction from placing piercing mark on them.
this add-on is marking me when otherwise you would never have been able to know i was there. = cheating and not eso's original intent.

Sigtric

I've been running and testing the capabilities of this addons since it came to light in the main thread about it and so far the only big useful thing I've gotten out of it has been helping me find the people already running it so I can troll them from stealth. It's a lot of fun to watch.

Otherwise? If you play pvp for a couple hours you'll learn stealthed players are everywhere. The addons is not really telling me anything I don't already know in that regard.


Is it fair? Not really. Not unless everyone is running it.

Is it cheating? Not really. It's only using information already found in the official game API. And ZOS current stance is that it's fine to use.

Do you have to like it? Nope

Do you have to live with it? For the time being, yep.

Derra

I want to be able to instantly kill everybody from invisibility. Anything impairing that functionality is basically cheating.

JohunBleek

I don't mind gankers, I really don't. BUT, if I'm going to be jumped on after running 10 minutes to get to a fight, when I'm fighting outnumbered, ganked by multiple people, or just can't do anything about it because 3 procs deal 8k damage each all at once, I'm going to be happy I have the addon. Though I do agree ZOSE should fix some aspects of it, at least until procs are nerfed to the ground.

LegacyDM

Wear some heavy armor, use a shield, invest in health traits, use detect pots, run magelight, practice your hand eye coordination reflexes, or take the high road and convince ZOS to make a balance case. Resorting to a third party addon for a crutch to negate a glass canon nb because you don't know how to l2p is pathetic.

kadar

Derra wrote: »

I want to be able to instantly kill everybody from invisibility. Anything impairing that functionality is basically cheating.

I want to be completely immune to all attacks from invisibility. I am elite and anyone that can kill me should not be allowed to do so, even at the cost of nullifying an entire build and play style.

YetiSpaghetti

Sigtric wrote: »

I've been running and testing the capabilities of this addons since it came to light in the main thread about it and so far the only big useful thing I've gotten out of it has been helping me find the people already running it so I can troll them from stealth. It's a lot of fun to watch.

Otherwise? If you play pvp for a couple hours you'll learn stealthed players are everywhere. The addons is not really telling me anything I don't already know in that regard.


Is it fair? Not really. Not unless everyone is running it.

Is it cheating? Not really. It's only using information already found in the official game API. And ZOS current stance is that it's fine to use.

Do you have to like it? Nope

Do you have to live with it? For the time being, yep.

You forget it tells you if you're getting ganked. If you see the ambush skill you know you should block or dodge roll.

Redn3ck

99% sure it tells you when someone is lining a heavy up on you. I've seen serval people who were standing perfectly still through block up when I would begin charging my heavy from stealth on them. That's bull crap, an add on having that capability makes it a cheat.

I'd much rather be detected by infernal guardian then having this add on in game...and I think that set is bull crap as well...

Sigtric

Derra wrote: »

I want to be able to instantly kill everybody from invisibility. Anything impairing that functionality is basically cheating.

It doesn't hinder this at all. I've ganked a number of people using it, while using it.

YetiSpaghetti wrote: »

Sigtric wrote: »

I've been running and testing the capabilities of this addons since it came to light in the main thread about it and so far the only big useful thing I've gotten out of it has been helping me find the people already running it so I can troll them from stealth. It's a lot of fun to watch.

Otherwise? If you play pvp for a couple hours you'll learn stealthed players are everywhere. The addons is not really telling me anything I don't already know in that regard.


Is it fair? Not really. Not unless everyone is running it.

Is it cheating? Not really. It's only using information already found in the official game API. And ZOS current stance is that it's fine to use.

Do you have to like it? Nope

Do you have to live with it? For the time being, yep.

You forget it tells you if you're getting ganked. If you see the ambush skill you know you should block or dodge roll.

Have you used it? Anyone ganking out there now should know the few tricks to tricking miat. It's not hard.

But it doesnt really matter anyway, as ZOS has stated its legal. Until they fix the API or make it illegal (they probably should) its pretty stupid not to use it, regardless of which side of the ambush you are on.

Sigtric

Redn3ck wrote: »

99% sure it tells you when someone is lining a heavy up on you. I've seen serval people who were standing perfectly still through block up when I would begin charging my heavy from stealth on them. That's bull crap, an add on having that capability makes it a cheat.

I'd much rather be detected by infernal guardian then having this add on in game...and I think that set is bull crap as well...

It does. Don't aim at them while youre charging your heavy and they don't get the alert.

Or charge heavy weapon at them from outside of melee range and laugh while they freak out. It's almost as good as ganking them a few minutes later

Derra

The_Outsider wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

I want to be able to instantly kill everybody from invisibility. Anything impairing that functionality is basically cheating.

I want to be completely immune to all attacks from invisibility. I am elite and anyone that can kill me should not be allowed to do so, even at the cost of nullifying an entire build and play style.

So explain to me. In what way do instantkills create good/fun gameplay?

Derra

LegacyDM wrote: »

Wear some heavy armor, use a shield, invest in health traits, use detect pots, run magelight, practice your hand eye coordination reflexes, or take the high road and convince ZOS to make a balance case. Resorting to a third party addon for a crutch to negate a glass canon nb because you don't know how to l2p is pathetic.

Anyone still claiming a properly executed gank allows for counterplay is probably really bad at ganking or flatout lying.

Before you even try it: 24k health (light armor - so significant investment in health) 2600 impen 1 active shield, magelight and defensive rune. Still won´t save you.

@Joy_Division why don´t you have a talk with the people here. That´s more fun than arguing with me about not disagreeing but still arguing for the sake of it.

Knootewoot

Derra wrote: »

LegacyDM wrote: »

Wear some heavy armor, use a shield, invest in health traits, use detect pots, run magelight, practice your hand eye coordination reflexes, or take the high road and convince ZOS to make a balance case. Resorting to a third party addon for a crutch to negate a glass canon nb because you don't know how to l2p is pathetic.

Anyone still claiming a properly executed gank allows for counterplay is probably really bad at ganking or flatout lying.

Before you even try it: 24k health (light armor - so significant investment in health) 2600 impen 1 active shield, magelight and defensive rune. Still won´t save you.

@Joy_Division why don´t you have a talk with the people here. That´s more fun than arguing with me about not disagreeing but still arguing for the sake of it.

Just for the sake of the topic.

Any class can stealth and do a gank attack, it's not NB only (not directed @Derra but some topics above)

Then also if we look @NB's it is not the magblade that one shots people from stealth/cloak. It's the stanmblade. And mostly in combination with 3 proc sets.

This discussion can go on and on and on. But nerfing stealth or using addons to help does ruin some builds that rely on stealth. I agree it is annoying to die in one shot by anyone, but it can even be done without being in stealth thanks to the powerfull sets @Zos introduced. Viper is one of the main culprits with to much damage in PvP. And guess what, light armor magblades, sorcs and more don't use the proc sets that allow for one-shots. It's mostly the stamina builds.

Stealth is not the one-shot issue in my opinion. It's the ridiculous combinations of sets, no soft/hard caps and on CP-campaigns the CP gap between players.

Lieblingsjunge

The add-on doesn't really offer much assistance. The nearby player-counter is unreliable, the people-in-sneak function is also kinda meh, it doens't tell you anything about where it is.

The incoming charged-attack is not really of much help either. You can hear someone sniping you if your volume is loud enough.

Honestly, this add-on feels nice. It doesn't give the user any insane advantage and it doesnt offer reliable information, it just takes the information and hands it to you - same information you can get by volume/view distance. 'Cus of my performance I have low view-distance & my headset is not optimal for volume, so the addon functions as enhanced senses. Doesn't really offer any huge advantages.

Derra

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

The add-on doesn't really offer much assistance. The nearby player-counter is unreliable, the people-in-sneak function is also kinda meh, it doens't tell you anything about where it is.

The incoming charged-attack is not really of much help either. You can hear someone sniping you if your volume is loud enough.

Honestly, this add-on feels nice. It doesn't give the user any insane advantage and it doesnt offer reliable information, it just takes the information and hands it to you - same information you can get by volume/view distance. 'Cus of my performance I have low view-distance & my headset is not optimal for volume, so the addon functions as enhanced senses. Doesn't really offer any huge advantages.

I´ve deactivated everything but the killfeed and KOS. The killfeed is something that should exist in the basegame in my opinion. It adds tremendously to the flair of pvp.

<XXX> was killed by <YYY> in <insert local zone> using <abilitynamehere>

Wouldn´t that be nice to have?

Lieblingsjunge

Derra wrote: »

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

The add-on doesn't really offer much assistance. The nearby player-counter is unreliable, the people-in-sneak function is also kinda meh, it doens't tell you anything about where it is.

The incoming charged-attack is not really of much help either. You can hear someone sniping you if your volume is loud enough.

Honestly, this add-on feels nice. It doesn't give the user any insane advantage and it doesnt offer reliable information, it just takes the information and hands it to you - same information you can get by volume/view distance. 'Cus of my performance I have low view-distance & my headset is not optimal for volume, so the addon functions as enhanced senses. Doesn't really offer any huge advantages.

I´ve deactivated everything but the killfeed and KOS. The killfeed is something that should exist in the basegame in my opinion. It adds tremendously to the flair of pvp.

<XXX> was killed by <YYY> in <insert local zone> using <abilitynamehere>

Wouldn´t that be nice to have?

Yeah. It would be really nice. Zenimax, pwetty please with sugar on top, listen to Derra

Berenhir

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Lieblingsjunge wrote: »

The add-on doesn't really offer much assistance. The nearby player-counter is unreliable, the people-in-sneak function is also kinda meh, it doens't tell you anything about where it is.

The incoming charged-attack is not really of much help either. You can hear someone sniping you if your volume is loud enough.

Honestly, this add-on feels nice. It doesn't give the user any insane advantage and it doesnt offer reliable information, it just takes the information and hands it to you - same information you can get by volume/view distance. 'Cus of my performance I have low view-distance & my headset is not optimal for volume, so the addon functions as enhanced senses. Doesn't really offer any huge advantages.

I´ve deactivated everything but the killfeed and KOS. The killfeed is something that should exist in the basegame in my opinion. It adds tremendously to the flair of pvp.

<XXX> was killed by <YYY> in <insert local zone> using <abilitynamehere>

Wouldn´t that be nice to have?

Yeah. It would be really nice. Zenimax, pwetty please with sugar on top, listen to Derra

Even better are the summarys:

The battle at Alessia Farm lasted 2 minutes. Casualties: 25 AD 3 EP.

Makes that little fight feel like an awesome battle.

Qbiken

Xexpo wrote: »

Idk ....
watching high ranked trash can pvpers freak out and start popping shields and infernal guardian because you heavy attacked with your sword and board from 40m away ,
is pretty freaking hilarious

Since infernall guardian is free stealth detection you don´t even need Miat´s addon xD

Mr_Nobody

i actually love it. I use it myself, i got trolled myself a few times due to heavy attacks, but damn, the amount of people i troll with heavy attacks is insane. I often just sit somewhere on the rock spamming my poor templar's dual wield attacks from stealth and watch them cast shields, roll & block for no reason. The best part is that you can swipe your heavy attack between multiple targets and they all do go crazy.

Kutsuu

Redn3ck wrote: »

99% sure it tells you when someone is lining a heavy up on you. I've seen serval people who were standing perfectly still through block up when I would begin charging my heavy from stealth on them. That's bull crap, an add on having that capability makes it a cheat.

I'd much rather be detected by infernal guardian then having this add on in game...and I think that set is bull crap as well...

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/310499/gankers-counter-the-miats-addon-dont-just-be-a-victim#latest

ced30

i tried to use it but it gave me an ui error i could not recover from, had to alt-f4 and deactivate the addon

kadar

Derra wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

I want to be able to instantly kill everybody from invisibility. Anything impairing that functionality is basically cheating.

I want to be completely immune to all attacks from invisibility. I am elite and anyone that can kill me should not be allowed to do so, even at the cost of nullifying an entire build and play style.

So explain to me. In what way do instantkills create good/fun gameplay?

@Derra
I'll try. Ganking is fun. Not everyone enjoys it, and that's okay. Many ESO players enjoy it as their primary goal, or as opportunity allows. There is thrill in not being seen, avoiding the enemy, other gankers, and magelight spammers, waiting for the opportune moment, and executing a practiced burst combo. There are hundreds of things that can go wrong during this process. I won't argue this much, because you seem set in your opinion.

"Insta kills" are not a given. The fact is, we all know how easy it is to counter stealth play. To pull off a true "insta kill" on a decent player is not only hard to do, but rewarding. To escape successfully from a horde of vigorously spamming magelight wielders is a feat in and of itself.

Neoakropolis

If it makes the ganking proctato nb's, stamtramps and what ever else less effective then great.. Keep it. ZOS already said it wasn't against TOS.

Derra

The_Outsider wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

I want to be able to instantly kill everybody from invisibility. Anything impairing that functionality is basically cheating.

I want to be completely immune to all attacks from invisibility. I am elite and anyone that can kill me should not be allowed to do so, even at the cost of nullifying an entire build and play style.

So explain to me. In what way do instantkills create good/fun gameplay?

@Derra
I'll try. Ganking is fun. Not everyone enjoys it, and that's okay. Many ESO players enjoy it as their primary goal, or as opportunity allows. There is thrill in not being seen, avoiding the enemy, other gankers, and magelight spammers, waiting for the opportune moment, and executing a practiced burst combo. There are hundreds of things that can go wrong during this process. I won't argue this much, because you seem set in your opinion.

"Insta kills" are not a given. The fact is, we all know how easy it is to counter stealth play. To pull off a true "insta kill" on a decent player is not only hard to do, but rewarding. To escape successfully from a horde of vigorously spamming magelight wielders is a feat in and of itself.

Point 1: Ganking is easy enough nowadays that players who with other characters never stood a chance over the past years can reliably instantly kill me from invisibility. It´s obviously easier than other means of playing (judging from personal experience and performance of other players) while also being associated with less risk (see all players of your own faction lurking in sneak only engaging in fights that are already won by their faction to finish of anything left).

Point 2: I get killed withing 1s when someone who knows what they´re doing ganks me. That means as breakfree requires 1gcd it allows for no counterplay at all. I get stunned and die while breaking the stun.
This happens with:
24khp, 17k armor, 2600impenetrable, an active shield of 10k, radiant magelight and defensive rune active. What kind of easy counterplay is there available to ganking - please do enlighten me.

Also you don´t answer my question. I asked how ganking/instantkills create good and fun gameplay. You say ganking is fun. That´s your explanation.
You completely fail to give any explanation how it´s good gameplay. I get that it´s fun for 50% of the participating players. I just don´t think that a scenario where only half of the players has fun is good gameplay.
There is nothing to learn from being ganked. There is no counterplay available if the ganker is somewhat competent. The only thing you can do is accept the fact that some builds will instantly kill you with no chance of combating that.

I do think that is the epitome of bad gameplay and should not exist. If makes the game less enjoyable for every other player apart from the ganker.
I do believe any combat in an mmo should allow for active counterplay (meaning instantkills of any form should never exist).

Kutsuu

You're completely full of it @Derra. You are not dying within 1 second when you have a 10k shield, 24khp, and radiant magelight going unless you do absolutely nothing to react and die in more like 2-3 seconds. First, that half damage stealth heavy attack that can't crit against your shields is going to take a whole 3-4k off the top. Then there's the fact that you claim you are stunned and need to CC break - you do realize that your radiant magelight prevents the stealth attack stun, which gives you time to react and counter play before the incap hits? Are you such a potato that you can't block the incap after being hit by the previous abilities? I'm guessing the answer HAS to be yes, for your scenario to have any chance of playing out.

We've had this same stupid discussion in several threads now and you never bring anything to the table other than wild exaggerations and lies.

Derra

Kutsuu wrote: »

You're completely full of it @Derra. You are not dying within 1 second when you have a 10k shield, 24khp, and radiant magelight going unless you do absolutely nothing to react and die in more like 2-3 seconds. First, that half damage stealth heavy attack that can't crit against your shields is going to take a whole 3-4k off the top. Then there's the fact that you claim you are stunned and need to CC break - you do realize that your radiant magelight prevents the stealth attack stun, which gives you time to react and counter play before the incap hits? Are you such a potato that you can't block the incap after being hit by the previous abilities? I'm guessing the answer HAS to be yes, for your scenario to have any chance of playing out.

We've had this same stupid discussion in several threads now and you never bring anything to the table other than wild exaggerations and lies.

I guess claiming you have reaction time to counter the incap stun just proves my point as when that happens the ganker was pretty incompetent.

I guess when the only thing you can resort to is l2p i know there is no point in discussing because essentially you have no argument and have to resort to wild exaggerations and assumptions in the attempt to refute my point. Which obviously it doesn´t.
Screaming l2p never did. That´s poor form.

Minalan

Kutsuu wrote: »

You're completely full of it @Derra. You are not dying within 1 second when you have a 10k shield, 24khp, and radiant magelight going unless you do absolutely nothing to react and die in more like 2-3 seconds. First, that half damage stealth heavy attack that can't crit against your shields is going to take a whole 3-4k off the top. Then there's the fact that you claim you are stunned and need to CC break - you do realize that your radiant magelight prevents the stealth attack stun, which gives you time to react and counter play before the incap hits? Are you such a potato that you can't block the incap after being hit by the previous abilities? I'm guessing the answer HAS to be yes, for your scenario to have any chance of playing out.

We've had this same stupid discussion in several threads now and you never bring anything to the table other than wild exaggerations and lies.

A 10K shield? No ganker is hitting you with that up. Lets be honest and sincere here, shields last six seconds. Keeping them up all the time hasn't been an option since TG.

Radiant only stops the stun out of stealth, it won't help you against incap or anything else. Besides, it's a garbage morph, most of us use the other (5% magicka, because we NEED it in trials and vet PVE). So we just pay the occasional 'stealth ass-hat' tax. All while hoping beyond hope that ZOS fixes night blades and ganking.

They never do.

Derra

Minalan wrote: »

Kutsuu wrote: »

You're completely full of it @Derra. You are not dying within 1 second when you have a 10k shield, 24khp, and radiant magelight going unless you do absolutely nothing to react and die in more like 2-3 seconds. First, that half damage stealth heavy attack that can't crit against your shields is going to take a whole 3-4k off the top. Then there's the fact that you claim you are stunned and need to CC break - you do realize that your radiant magelight prevents the stealth attack stun, which gives you time to react and counter play before the incap hits? Are you such a potato that you can't block the incap after being hit by the previous abilities? I'm guessing the answer HAS to be yes, for your scenario to have any chance of playing out.

We've had this same stupid discussion in several threads now and you never bring anything to the table other than wild exaggerations and lies.

A 10K shield? No ganker is hitting you with that up. Lets be honest and sincere here, shields last six seconds. Keeping them up all the time hasn't been an option since TG.

Radiant only stops the stun out of stealth, it won't help you against incap or anything else. Besides, it's a garbage morph, most of us use the other (5% magicka, because we NEED it in trials and vet PVE). So we just pay the occasional 'stealth ass-hat' tax. All while hoping beyond hope that ZOS fixes night blades and ganking.

They never do.

It even happened while i was standing in mines with out grps templar standing beside me. I was dead before even he could react. Admittedly a bugged double procc was involved.

But i guess we´re all potatoes. Yes. That mus be it. Poor yuke and etaniel having to carry our incompetence the whole day.