Joy's now updated (Morrowind) guide to beating Maelstrom Arena

Joy_Division

As a head's up. I know some folks are going to try and do vMA because of the Orsinium event. Looking at my guide, a lot of the arena strategies are sound, but the game has changed some much from the past two years when I originally wrote this, I'll compose a updated version.

FYI: I ran vMA with a DK that had only 300 CPs and no end-game gear and using no spell pots (I am cheap). I got a 400K score and my greatest enemy was lag. It's definitely doable, so don't feel you need to be at max CP, don't feel the compelled to have perfect gear. I'll try to get the new version up this weekend and the video of my 300 CP run.

I will recommend this to all you magicka players looking for their first clear, do *not* double destro staff as you would against a target dummy.

Fexelea

For the life of me I cannot stand the lag. Living far away from the server, I'm grounded to 1 bar and beating this with 5 skills is just absurd.

It's taking me anywhere between 2-4 seconds to swap bars, which is enough time to spoil decent strategies and dps, It's worse than the dungeons, trials and PvP combined. So frustrating to have to compensate for this on a solo instance - are there any suggestions for dealing with this?

Morgul667

Fexelea wrote: »

For the life of me I cannot stand the lag. Living far away from the server, I'm grounded to 1 bar and beating this with 5 skills is just absurd.

It's taking me anywhere between 2-4 seconds to swap bars, which is enough time to spoil decent strategies and dps, It's worse than the dungeons, trials and PvP combined. So frustrating to have to compensate for this on a solo instance - are there any suggestions for dealing with this?

Patience is your best friend and so are magicka shields

I can clear VMA with 400ms ping, so you can do it as well but the first clear is tricky as you need to deal with the extra difficulty

aeowulf

guide has been invaluable, many thanks.

Few things i've learnt about the final boss, stage 2. Once he ports up, loiter and check there are no CG about to spawn. As a new player, if you get knocked off and there is a CG waiting underneath you, that's almost certain death as you land in lava, stunned.

I also now take the two furthest crystals first and jump down, get my resources back up, then go back up for the closest crystal. I also dot it, and jump down when it's about 10%, waiting for it to die. Means i have more resources for the final part of the fight.

Fexelea

@Morgul667 how are you checking your ping on console?

(This issue with bars I'm having is console specific, at least the horribleness of the weapon swap has not happened to me on PC. I just counted today and indeed it was 4 seconds of one... two... three... four before my bars changed. When lag is at it worst in PvP it can take up to 15, but that comes alongside you being pretty much frozen in the server side.)

Also happening:
No ground effects on screen,
My spells are invisible,
Enemies are invisible,
Enemies don't track animations (ie, the Dwemer Construct in 4th arena's lightning doesn't render, so you know he changed phase because it damages you)

I wanted to get back to Maelstrom because of event and I'm all for hard content and learning and getting that sense of reward... but not digging having to essentially nerf my sorc to a bubble + ulti on one bar because I cannot see half the things I should.

If everyone is experiencing the above and this is common, I'd like some tips on how to diminish it. If not, I tried turning off damage numbers, don't have any pets out... could it be my monster helm? xD

Morgul667

Another solution is to patch your internet box to connect through a vpn that works well for you... but it gets a little techy

Im on PC so dont know for consoles

Fexelea

VPNs on consoles are a pain too. I tried using DNS service from my regular PC VPN and I got 300kb upload, I can't even watch youtube on it lol.

Maybe I'll plan a holiday to the US and bring my console and play from there... I just don't get why this is happening on a solo arena

LadyLethalla

@Joy_Division

Thanks for this guide; I've been reading your stage 9 notes over and over and over.
Got a few small suggestions for next time you update it:

1. While I haven't yet completed the final boss round, although my SD isn't that high, I'm finding good results with a Nirn staff enchanted with a Prismatic glyph. That MD to Daedra is helping a lot, I think. (For the record, I'm dying to lag, dodge-rolling into white ghosts and all sorts of stupid mistakes etc.)

2. The Bone Colossus being summoned in round 4 isn't a death sentence. I've managed to complete that round twice with it, albeit using one of the sigils (defensive, I think), and on one of those occasions (if not both), the Destro Ulti. As well as staying out of the fire rain.

3. For the Ash Titan in round 5 I had to discover for myself that his big fire attack can be rolled through, without a stun if timed correctly. (I have not seen/heard this mentioned anywhere, in any guide.)

Joy_Division

LadyLethalla wrote: »

@Joy_Division

Thanks for this guide; I've been reading your stage 9 notes over and over and over.
Got a few small suggestions for next time you update it:

1. While I haven't yet completed the final boss round, although my SD isn't that high, I'm finding good results with a Nirn staff enchanted with a Prismatic glyph. That MD to Daedra is helping a lot, I think. (For the record, I'm dying to lag, dodge-rolling into white ghosts and all sorts of stupid mistakes etc.)

2. The Bone Colossus being summoned in round 4 isn't a death sentence. I've managed to complete that round twice with it, albeit using one of the sigils (defensive, I think), and on one of those occasions (if not both), the Destro Ulti. As well as staying out of the fire rain.

3. For the Ash Titan in round 5 I had to discover for myself that his big fire attack can be rolled through, without a stun if timed correctly. (I have not seen/heard this mentioned anywhere, in any guide.)

@LadyLethalla - You should consult my "new and improved" guide.

All your suggestions work. The prismatic enchant helps a lot (if people are willing to slot mutliple weapons, it doesnt help on non daedra rounds.

The Bone colossus I think was much more dangerous on release. Still should be avoided but certainly not a reason to quit on a round.

You are correct about the fire in round 5. That can be hard to avoid by just walking.running. rolling is the best way to deal with that for sure.

LadyLethalla

@Joy_Division Oh cool, I didn't know there WAS a new version.
I usually keep several glyphs in my bank - I certainly wouldn't have used the Prismatic for the entire arena; I changed it a couple of days ago when I decided to make a Nirn staff to see if that made a difference.


Going to check out your new guide.

code65536

Yea, competitive players carry two staves in vMA. They'll use the staff with the Prismatic enchant on stages 1, 6, 8, and 9 and their regular staff on other stages. There's no reason--aside from cost, obviously--that a beginner can't use this to give themselves a slight technical edge to ease the learning process.

Beardimus

@code65536 I do this, however I assumed there are Daedra on stage 5 too or am I wrong? (adds etc)

code65536

Beardimus wrote: »

@code65536 I do this, however I assumed there are Daedra on stage 5 too or am I wrong? (adds etc)

Only the frost atronachs. Losing your enchant for everything else just to gain a bit of extra damage on those frost atros is not worth it.

glennsfono

Any content of any game at all that causes this much frustration and pure anger and rage is too hard and is simply wrong. I get it, all the elitists will say "git gud" and all that useless ***. But the fact of the matter is that it causes no emotion other than anger in 99% of all the players. That's just wrong and needs to be looked at and fixed by the developers. You can disagree all you want, but your opinion would be wrong. A game is supposed to be fun and enjoyable. Maybe I missed the part where a game is also supposed to cause furniture destroying rage as well.

Joy_Division

glennsfono wrote: »

Any content of any game at all that causes this much frustration and pure anger and rage is too hard and is simply wrong. I get it, all the elitists will say "git gud" and all that useless ***. But the fact of the matter is that it causes no emotion other than anger in 99% of all the players. That's just wrong and needs to be looked at and fixed by the developers. You can disagree all you want, but your opinion would be wrong. A game is supposed to be fun and enjoyable. Maybe I missed the part where a game is also supposed to cause furniture destroying rage as well.

Is this comment really all that fair?

I cannot understand this perspective and I try to understand all perspectives.

Let's look at ESO. What percentage of the content is it fair to say is easy-peasy lemon squeezy? If you have any amount of champion points, and to be perfectly clear, vMA is meant for people that do, than 95% of all the Overland content is easy-peasy lemon squeezy.

When I rolled a new Warden I intentionally did so without using my Champion Points because I wanted to know how much the CP system has corrupted the game. I was quite surprised that the Overland PvE questing zones was sometimes challenging until like level 25 or something and was never quite easy-peasy. Which is fine and I can see why ZoS has made it as such. But, once you get past level 50 and aquire champion points, you quickly out-level all this content. Point: Almost all the overland content in the base game, all those zones, i.e. the vast majority of stuff to do in this game is leveled difficulty for people who have no Champion Points

The only Overland content that presents something of a challenge to CP players are the World Bosses, and these are clearly designated as "group events." And even then, a single player with say 300ish CPs can take down a World Boss on the own when they learn the mechanics. The "public dungeons," again something ZoS indicates on the map is meant to be done with multiple players, will challenge a low CP inexperienced player, but once people understand the mechanics of the game and have all their skills, these are more or less easily cleared by solitary players.

All the DLC zone and storylines cater to this below level 50, no CP standard. The Thieve's guild, Vardenfell, Orsinium, Dark Brotherhood, etc., all of them are there for those players.

Then there are the instanced 4-player dungeons, the Fungal Grottos, the Spindleclutches, the Vaults of Madnesses, etc. These come in two modes, "normal" and "veteran". All of the "normal" versions fall into the "easy peasy lemon squeezy" category. Even the majority of the "veteran" dungeons are so easily clear, they don't need a tank, don't need a healer, can be done with 4 random "PuGs" from zone with zero problem.

And that's fine.

With all that content made for non "elitists," to use your word, what exactly is the game is for people such as myself who have played since launch and have max CPs? A few DLC dungeons - each by the way that also has a "normal" mode that is easy peasy - and Trials such as Atherian Archive, Halls of Fabrication, and Maelstrom Arena, which also have a "normal" mode that is easy peasy lemon squeezy.

But it's not good enough for you that 100% of the game's content that is available and offered to non "eiltitsts." You want more than 100%. You have a problem with the "veteran" mode that is there for players such as myself because you succumb to rage and frustration trying to do it. That's selfish. I don't smash furniture and get in a rage playing vMA. To say the game or the content causes this behavior is not accurate. I find the content fun and enjoyable. Because you do not believe it is does not make it a universal fact that renders people who hold different opinions as yours as "wrong."

glennsfono

Joy_Division wrote: »

glennsfono wrote: »

Any content of any game at all that causes this much frustration and pure anger and rage is too hard and is simply wrong. I get it, all the elitists will say "git gud" and all that useless ***. But the fact of the matter is that it causes no emotion other than anger in 99% of all the players. That's just wrong and needs to be looked at and fixed by the developers. You can disagree all you want, but your opinion would be wrong. A game is supposed to be fun and enjoyable. Maybe I missed the part where a game is also supposed to cause furniture destroying rage as well.

Is this comment really all that fair?

I cannot understand this perspective and I try to understand all perspectives.

Let's look at ESO. What percentage of the content is it fair to say is easy-peasy lemon squeezy? If you have any amount of champion points, and to be perfectly clear, vMA is meant for people that do, than 95% of all the Overland content is easy-peasy lemon squeezy.

When I rolled a new Warden I intentionally did so without using my Champion Points because I wanted to know how much the CP system has corrupted the game. I was quite surprised that the Overland PvE questing zones was sometimes challenging until like level 25 or something and was never quite easy-peasy. Which is fine and I can see why ZoS has made it as such. But, once you get past level 50 and aquire champion points, you quickly out-level all this content. Point: Almost all the overland content in the base game, all those zones, i.e. the vast majority of stuff to do in this game is leveled difficulty for people who have no Champion Points

The only Overland content that presents something of a challenge to CP players are the World Bosses, and these are clearly designated as "group events." And even then, a single player with say 300ish CPs can take down a World Boss on the own when they learn the mechanics. The "public dungeons," again something ZoS indicates on the map is meant to be done with multiple players, will challenge a low CP inexperienced player, but once people understand the mechanics of the game and have all their skills, these are more or less easily cleared by solitary players.

All the DLC zone and storylines cater to this below level 50, no CP standard. The Thieve's guild, Vardenfell, Orsinium, Dark Brotherhood, etc., all of them are there for those players.

Then there are the instanced 4-player dungeons, the Fungal Grottos, the Spindleclutches, the Vaults of Madnesses, etc. These come in two modes, "normal" and "veteran". All of the "normal" versions fall into the "easy peasy lemon squeezy" category. Even the majority of the "veteran" dungeons are so easily clear, they don't need a tank, don't need a healer, can be done with 4 random "PuGs" from zone with zero problem.

And that's fine.

With all that content made for non "elitists," to use your word, what exactly is the game is for people such as myself who have played since launch and have max CPs? A few DLC dungeons - each by the way that also has a "normal" mode that is easy peasy - and Trials such as Atherian Archive, Halls of Fabrication, and Maelstrom Arena, which also have a "normal" mode that is easy peasy lemon squeezy.

But it's not good enough for you that 100% of the game's content that is available and offered to non "eiltitsts." You want more than 100%. You have a problem with the "veteran" mode that is there for players such as myself because you succumb to rage and frustration trying to do it. That's selfish. I don't smash furniture and get in a rage playing vMA. To say the game or the content causes this behavior is not accurate. I find the content fun and enjoyable. Because you do not believe it is does not make it a universal fact that renders people who hold different opinions as yours as "wrong."

Google it. I'm not the only customer who has this "perspective," as you put it. I've been following your guide, to the letter, for days. Days and days. I have burned through around 3.5 stacks of soul gems. Granted, I'm not a calculator, but that's roughly 700 deaths without 1 single completion. While we're on the subject of whether or not I'm a calculator, I'll point out that those numbers are a bit disproportionate. But, let me save you some typing (you're welcome).

From you: "learn the mechanics, and then git gud. Questions?"

coplannb16_ESO

glennsfono wrote: »

Google it. I'm not the only customer who has this "perspective," as you put it. I've been following your guide, to the letter, for days. Days and days. I have burned through around 3.5 stacks of soul gems. Granted, I'm not a calculator, but that's roughly 700 deaths without 1 single completion. While we're on the subject of whether or not I'm a calculator, I'll point out that those numbers are a bit disproportionate. But, let me save you some typing (you're welcome).

From you: "learn the mechanics, and then git gud. Questions?"

Though I understand your anger/frustration after 3.5K deaths on vMA your feedback hits the wrong person here. Joy took the time to write a long, comprehensive guide (plus making and providing video-footage) and discusses and incorporates feedback from others.
If it was not for Joy and other players creating those guides you would have your 3.5K deaths and not even have the slightest clue about the mechanics. Yes, you have to learn them. But at least you do not have to discover them like as if this was the first time ever someone tried vMA.

I can do the arena. Iam not really good, have bad lag spikes and performance drops thanks to CPU-core switches in the middle of the boss rounds (thanks to Zeni not beeing able to correctly programm versus AMD Ryzens architecture causing up to 20 seconds of unplayability with 1 FPS and 999+ ms latency). And I still yell and swear at my screen when I drop from full to 0 suddenly without notice because the stupid game didnt show the enemy, its animation or whatever... and then after going through all that crap I end up with another worthless dagger, mace or sword instead of a lightning destro the game knows I want, but will never give to me.

Now, this is not a single player RPG. This is an MMO, and MMOs have always tried to cater to a) the biggest audience and b) as many type of players as possible. If you make vMA easy-peasy you could as well make all veteran/hm trials soloable. hardmode trials are also hard, and need not one but 12 players knowing the mechanics and play their class to the optimum possible. Even mDKs pull up to 50K dps in an optimal raid scenario. If you struggle to hit 15K DPS in vMA, well you would not be of any help in one of those trials.
The competetive pve players however like the challenge. They whine that stuff is too easy or that there is not enough content available the second they cleared the hardest/newest trial and dungeon. The devs need weeks and months to build a trial, and the content does not even last a few days or even hours for those players.
Now imagine everything would be watered down to normal dungeon level or even overland questing difficulty while the rewards stay the same. Oh the drama. The outrage would be epic.

However as there is plenty of easy content every type of player can find stuff to do. If you cannot complete vMA, well it wont make or break the game for you, and also the 3k more DPS of a vMA staff wont make or break a build (I still dont have mine and do well).

It is not Zenimax fault that you keep smashing your head in that brickwall. Just do something you enjoy and/or are good at. Or get better until you manage to beat it. It might cost another 10000 deaths (but no soul gems because you should release to wayshrine and run back in), but eventually you might do it. And I can assure you, if you made it, the feeling of your first completion is pure bliss.

glennsfono

coplannb16_ESO wrote: »

glennsfono wrote: »

Google it. I'm not the only customer who has this "perspective," as you put it. I've been following your guide, to the letter, for days. Days and days. I have burned through around 3.5 stacks of soul gems. Granted, I'm not a calculator, but that's roughly 700 deaths without 1 single completion. While we're on the subject of whether or not I'm a calculator, I'll point out that those numbers are a bit disproportionate. But, let me save you some typing (you're welcome).

From you: "learn the mechanics, and then git gud. Questions?"

Though I understand your anger/frustration after 3.5K deaths on vMA your feedback hits the wrong person here. Joy took the time to write a long, comprehensive guide (plus making and providing video-footage) and discusses and incorporates feedback from others.
If it was not for Joy and other players creating those guides you would have your 3.5K deaths and not even have the slightest clue about the mechanics. Yes, you have to learn them. But at least you do not have to discover them like as if this was the first time ever someone tried vMA.

I can do the arena. Iam not really good, have bad lag spikes and performance drops thanks to CPU-core switches in the middle of the boss rounds (thanks to Zeni not beeing able to correctly programm versus AMD Ryzens architecture causing up to 20 seconds of unplayability with 1 FPS and 999+ ms latency). And I still yell and swear at my screen when I drop from full to 0 suddenly without notice because the stupid game didnt show the enemy, its animation or whatever... and then after going through all that crap I end up with another worthless dagger, mace or sword instead of a lightning destro the game knows I want, but will never give to me.

Now, this is not a single player RPG. This is an MMO, and MMOs have always tried to cater to a) the biggest audience and b) as many type of players as possible. If you make vMA easy-peasy you could as well make all veteran/hm trials soloable. hardmode trials are also hard, and need not one but 12 players knowing the mechanics and play their class to the optimum possible. Even mDKs pull up to 50K dps in an optimal raid scenario. If you struggle to hit 15K DPS in vMA, well you would not be of any help in one of those trials.
The competetive pve players however like the challenge. They whine that stuff is too easy or that there is not enough content available the second they cleared the hardest/newest trial and dungeon. The devs need weeks and months to build a trial, and the content does not even last a few days or even hours for those players.
Now imagine everything would be watered down to normal dungeon level or even overland questing difficulty while the rewards stay the same. Oh the drama. The outrage would be epic.

However as there is plenty of easy content every type of player can find stuff to do. If you cannot complete vMA, well it wont make or break the game for you, and also the 3k more DPS of a vMA staff wont make or break a build (I still dont have mine and do well).

It is not Zenimax fault that you keep smashing your head in that brickwall. Just do something you enjoy and/or are good at. Or get better until you manage to beat it. It might cost another 10000 deaths (but no soul gems because you should release to wayshrine and run back in), but eventually you might do it. And I can assure you, if you made it, the feeling of your first completion is pure bliss.

While I understand what you're trying to say, I see the argument as flawed. If vMA is such difficult content, why do these competitive pve'ers consider it easy. Why are there so many people who claim to have completed it hundreds, if not more, of times and can do it with their eyes closed? Because they learned the mechanics and the spawn points, and when to do whatever it is you do.

Even as you stated, they release harder content in the form of new trials, only to be run through "easily" by the best of the best.

So, if vMA is literally only hard for a player the first 1000 times they die in it, after which point it becomes easy content, why the fluff? If it's "easy" for everyone eventually anyway, why make it so rage-inducing? No game should require 1000's of attempts to complete one single activity for their first many times. That's pure nonsense and stupidity in design at its finest.

coplannb16_ESO

glennsfono wrote: »

coplannb16_ESO wrote: »

glennsfono wrote: »

Google it. I'm not the only customer who has this "perspective," as you put it. I've been following your guide, to the letter, for days. Days and days. I have burned through around 3.5 stacks of soul gems. Granted, I'm not a calculator, but that's roughly 700 deaths without 1 single completion. While we're on the subject of whether or not I'm a calculator, I'll point out that those numbers are a bit disproportionate. But, let me save you some typing (you're welcome).

From you: "learn the mechanics, and then git gud. Questions?"

Though I understand your anger/frustration after 3.5K deaths on vMA your feedback hits the wrong person here. Joy took the time to write a long, comprehensive guide (plus making and providing video-footage) and discusses and incorporates feedback from others.
If it was not for Joy and other players creating those guides you would have your 3.5K deaths and not even have the slightest clue about the mechanics. Yes, you have to learn them. But at least you do not have to discover them like as if this was the first time ever someone tried vMA.

I can do the arena. Iam not really good, have bad lag spikes and performance drops thanks to CPU-core switches in the middle of the boss rounds (thanks to Zeni not beeing able to correctly programm versus AMD Ryzens architecture causing up to 20 seconds of unplayability with 1 FPS and 999+ ms latency). And I still yell and swear at my screen when I drop from full to 0 suddenly without notice because the stupid game didnt show the enemy, its animation or whatever... and then after going through all that crap I end up with another worthless dagger, mace or sword instead of a lightning destro the game knows I want, but will never give to me.

Now, this is not a single player RPG. This is an MMO, and MMOs have always tried to cater to a) the biggest audience and b) as many type of players as possible. If you make vMA easy-peasy you could as well make all veteran/hm trials soloable. hardmode trials are also hard, and need not one but 12 players knowing the mechanics and play their class to the optimum possible. Even mDKs pull up to 50K dps in an optimal raid scenario. If you struggle to hit 15K DPS in vMA, well you would not be of any help in one of those trials.
The competetive pve players however like the challenge. They whine that stuff is too easy or that there is not enough content available the second they cleared the hardest/newest trial and dungeon. The devs need weeks and months to build a trial, and the content does not even last a few days or even hours for those players.
Now imagine everything would be watered down to normal dungeon level or even overland questing difficulty while the rewards stay the same. Oh the drama. The outrage would be epic.

However as there is plenty of easy content every type of player can find stuff to do. If you cannot complete vMA, well it wont make or break the game for you, and also the 3k more DPS of a vMA staff wont make or break a build (I still dont have mine and do well).

It is not Zenimax fault that you keep smashing your head in that brickwall. Just do something you enjoy and/or are good at. Or get better until you manage to beat it. It might cost another 10000 deaths (but no soul gems because you should release to wayshrine and run back in), but eventually you might do it. And I can assure you, if you made it, the feeling of your first completion is pure bliss.

While I understand what you're trying to say, I see the argument as flawed. If vMA is such difficult content, why do these competitive pve'ers consider it easy. Why are there so many people who claim to have completed it hundreds, if not more, of times and can do it with their eyes closed? Because they learned the mechanics and the spawn points, and when to do whatever it is you do.

Even as you stated, they release harder content in the form of new trials, only to be run through "easily" by the best of the best.

So, if vMA is literally only hard for a player the first 1000 times they die in it, after which point it becomes easy content, why the fluff? If it's "easy" for everyone eventually anyway, why make it so rage-inducing? No game should require 1000's of attempts to complete one single activity for their first many times. That's pure nonsense and stupidity in design at its finest.

Well, its part of humanities imperfection. Those that endured the pain and "trained" it up until the point that it is simply muscle-memory feel entitled. If ZoS made it easier so everyone could run through it without a hassle they would feel ripped off. Human psychology, the fear of losing something weighs stronger than the hope of getting something, then add greed to it -> what I got by any means should not be gotten "easier" or for free by other people, even though they personally would not lose a thing. The same reason the rich and successful people tell those less fortuned they should work harder and are lazy/dumb whatever because in their world everyone has the same chances to be successful when in reality it is far from that.

In my book ZoS could scrap all PvE content and focus on PvP/AvA, but sadly that wont happen either.

The bad design of ZoS is still that there are no token systems, that the best items are BoP and not craftable and that running normal MSA does not help at all in beating vMA or getting a MA-weapon (in difference to what they did with the latest trial).

Id be all for a token system like: 1 run normal MA -> 1 Token, 1 run vet MA 10 Token (20 hour lockout each similar to reward of the undaunted) -> 100 Token to chose a reward you want (keep the chance to get a random weapon at the end in vMA).

and/or: deconstruction of a vMA weapon (or any set for that matter) grants an item that allows to craft one item of that set of any style, trait and weapon type, e.g. decon a frost staff to craft a lightning staff (but ofc do not allow to craft an armor piece with that).

but that would mean ZoS has to deliver decent content more often, because the grind wouldnt keep us as busy as it currently does. so wont happen...

Dubhliam

glennsfono wrote: »

...
No game should require 1000's of attempts to complete one single activity for their first many times. That's pure nonsense and stupidity in design at its finest.

@glennsfono , this game doesn't require anything from you.

Stop bashing players that want to help you, and start asking questions like:
"what am I doing wrong?"

Joy_Division

glennsfono wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

glennsfono wrote: »

Any content of any game at all that causes this much frustration and pure anger and rage is too hard and is simply wrong. I get it, all the elitists will say "git gud" and all that useless ***. But the fact of the matter is that it causes no emotion other than anger in 99% of all the players. That's just wrong and needs to be looked at and fixed by the developers. You can disagree all you want, but your opinion would be wrong. A game is supposed to be fun and enjoyable. Maybe I missed the part where a game is also supposed to cause furniture destroying rage as well.

Is this comment really all that fair?

I cannot understand this perspective and I try to understand all perspectives.

Let's look at ESO. What percentage of the content is it fair to say is easy-peasy lemon squeezy? If you have any amount of champion points, and to be perfectly clear, vMA is meant for people that do, than 95% of all the Overland content is easy-peasy lemon squeezy.

When I rolled a new Warden I intentionally did so without using my Champion Points because I wanted to know how much the CP system has corrupted the game. I was quite surprised that the Overland PvE questing zones was sometimes challenging until like level 25 or something and was never quite easy-peasy. Which is fine and I can see why ZoS has made it as such. But, once you get past level 50 and aquire champion points, you quickly out-level all this content. Point: Almost all the overland content in the base game, all those zones, i.e. the vast majority of stuff to do in this game is leveled difficulty for people who have no Champion Points

The only Overland content that presents something of a challenge to CP players are the World Bosses, and these are clearly designated as "group events." And even then, a single player with say 300ish CPs can take down a World Boss on the own when they learn the mechanics. The "public dungeons," again something ZoS indicates on the map is meant to be done with multiple players, will challenge a low CP inexperienced player, but once people understand the mechanics of the game and have all their skills, these are more or less easily cleared by solitary players.

All the DLC zone and storylines cater to this below level 50, no CP standard. The Thieve's guild, Vardenfell, Orsinium, Dark Brotherhood, etc., all of them are there for those players.

Then there are the instanced 4-player dungeons, the Fungal Grottos, the Spindleclutches, the Vaults of Madnesses, etc. These come in two modes, "normal" and "veteran". All of the "normal" versions fall into the "easy peasy lemon squeezy" category. Even the majority of the "veteran" dungeons are so easily clear, they don't need a tank, don't need a healer, can be done with 4 random "PuGs" from zone with zero problem.

And that's fine.

With all that content made for non "elitists," to use your word, what exactly is the game is for people such as myself who have played since launch and have max CPs? A few DLC dungeons - each by the way that also has a "normal" mode that is easy peasy - and Trials such as Atherian Archive, Halls of Fabrication, and Maelstrom Arena, which also have a "normal" mode that is easy peasy lemon squeezy.

But it's not good enough for you that 100% of the game's content that is available and offered to non "eiltitsts." You want more than 100%. You have a problem with the "veteran" mode that is there for players such as myself because you succumb to rage and frustration trying to do it. That's selfish. I don't smash furniture and get in a rage playing vMA. To say the game or the content causes this behavior is not accurate. I find the content fun and enjoyable. Because you do not believe it is does not make it a universal fact that renders people who hold different opinions as yours as "wrong."

Google it. I'm not the only customer who has this "perspective," as you put it. I've been following your guide, to the letter, for days. Days and days. I have burned through around 3.5 stacks of soul gems. Granted, I'm not a calculator, but that's roughly 700 deaths without 1 single completion. While we're on the subject of whether or not I'm a calculator, I'll point out that those numbers are a bit disproportionate. But, let me save you some typing (you're welcome).

From you: "learn the mechanics, and then git gud. Questions?"

You have not been following my guide to the letter is you burned through around 3.5 stacks soul gems because I advise people to rez at wayshrine.

Thinking back to when I first did this, Counting every single death, I'm sure I also died over 700 times before my first completion (over multiple attempts). It took me weeks rather than days to complete vMA when it launched.

I will remind of one of the first tips I wrote: "Learning this will make you cry and want to quit ESO. We've all been there. You're not alone." I didn't just write that to be poetic or dramatic or condescending. I know better PvE players than me who got so frustrated with dying in vMA that they actually did quit the game. When I think back to all the problems trying to get my first clear, they basically boiled down to the same thing: I was hell bent on finishing this my way, with my build, with my strategies because I thought I was so damn smart and too stubborn to take a step back and look at things from another perspective.

If other players are doing vMA, getting their titles and their weapons, and I'm not ... that's somehow the fault of the developers? Lol no. Somehow, somewhere the fault was mine. My build is not appropriate. I'm not using the best skills. My strategies are not working. I'm making mistakes. When I was first trying to do this on a sorcerer, I was using mines, atronach ultimate, and no wall of elements, yeah I can see why I died over 700 times.

Yes, learn the mechanics. When you first got to Stage 5 with the Ice flows. You got rekt repeatedly. Now you don't. That's DSA, every stage, every round. Look at my updated guide. It's more appropriate for this patch and I have a video of a 300 Champion clear on a DK without using end-game gear or "BiS" DPS. I can do that not because I "got gud." But because I know the mechanics by heart.

Sparr0w

So the ice stage punishes you for having high dps... hmm explains a lot

EDIT: Necro

Noldornir

Just wanted to leave here a big THANK YOU @Joy_Division !

Went in for my very first time some weeks ago(my main is tank n only recently my DD got ready), locked myself in while reading this guide when needed.

Took many hours in a total of some days before completion but prevailed n then farmed some more (SOOOOO much better after first time, on my second i also got in LB but i think that was luck since score sucked lol)

This guide is VERY helpful, very well done n is actually telling u why you are failing (it's not your DPS most times it's just how/when/where you are appling it) this place feels almost like a different game than ESO n this guide will teach you this new game n the tricks to survive it.

Merlin13KAGL

@Noldornir , congrats!

If you run it on DK, Warden, or Templar, you'll likely get leaderboard simply for clearing, as often <100 people run it each week. It's part of that whole love/hate thing vMA has going for it.

Nightblade and Sorc, not so much.

Get those clears once a week on as many as you can, even if the score is literally only double digits, and you'll likely get a end of week leaderboard reward (Gold weapon, Gold other set piece, and a geode.)

Best case scenario, you get the weapon of choice and save 25k to 50k golding it out. Worst case scenario, you decon and get a single gold mat (3k-8k gold) and/or a Nirncrux (for mat or research, as necessary)

Noldornir

Yeah u right I didn't mention I used DK n got a reward with a nirn bow in it! Banked that for my tank when I'll bring him there as well with an adjusted build for the achievement! Oh n I forgot to mention how much the guide helped on sorting this out:

-reflective scale OP here, target priority is not punishing anymore with this on I just keep it up all time as long as ranged adds are around

-dont fear crematorial guards, and don't try to run, you can't, drop down wall of element, harness magicka, burning embers, harness, embers, harness, embers. If they are alone you don't even need the shield

While the former strategy is class specific the second should be adjustable to anyone who can heal+dps with one skill and I was doing this on vampire 2-3

Btw dropping destroy ultimate on them is still the best thing of course that is when you don't have it or while waiting for them to die.

It would have been much harder to sort this out alone without this guide help! Thanks again!