I will be sincerely disappointed in ZoS's common sense if they nerf Cloak.

Heathenpride

ToRelax wrote: »

Heathenpride wrote: »

I love how everyone is whining about the ability of rogues/assassins to use stealth, which is part of their core structure as a class, but no one is mentioning that it's odd seeing a 5 foot tall elf strolling around Tramriel with a two handed weapon bigger than she is and ripping new arses for fighter class characters...

NBs should be using light weapons, daggers preferably, whilst sorcs should be using staves and daggers and the fighter classes need to be rocking the heavy weaponry.

NBs should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy.

Whatever happened to that style?

I REFUSE to use two handed or staves, i keep my daggers and that's how it should be so don't nerf cloak, nerf the ability for all classes to use all weapons because we all know how messed up it's become, odd that no one mentions it...

Are you for real? >_>

Old school role player from way back so yeah, I am.

Will it happen? of course not.

This is the role playing of the modern age and it's changed which I get but don't complain about assassins using stealth whilst the same game allows for an elven female to use a 2 handed maul and plate armour...

Cathexis

JDar wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

The_Outsider wrote: »

jnorris91ub17_ESO wrote: »

Go play Nightblade.

In combat, Cloak is extremely unreliable as a tool of evasion because AoEs and potions are extremely easy to obtain.

It's useless as a tool of escape against anyone with these counters.

And outside of combat, it doesn't matter what it does. All this complaint about Cloaking around is completely beside the point. A Cloaked Nightblade is not dealing damage, and what damage they do deal is either inhibited by Magelight (for magicka uses) or completely outclassed by your own damage (for stamina users) thanks to the CP system and weapon damage weapon glyphs.

What Stamina users gain in damage, they lose in the inability to spam Cloak.

Also, most people wrongly assume that Cloak is just an insta-win. An avoid all damage and pressure at the push of a button. This is not the case. Cloak must be combined with positioning, situational awareness, Line-of-Sight, and a few earnest prayers that your enemies don't slot counters, to even be effective.

Also most of the NBs posting here are doing so in response to either the forum-wide non-NB QQ, or the reply given by ZOS that they are considering nerfs. That is the definition of feedback.

...And players have realized that through the use of positioning, line of sight, situational awareness, and movement speed buffs, they can effectively remain cloaked and avoid damage indefinitely which is the real problem.

Also I have heard players in TS bragging about how good cloak spam with maneuvers is.

Also you are still plugging magelight as a counter? Now you can really smell the BS.

The reason cloak is so good with Rapid Maneuvers is because of Concealed Weapon. It gives the bonus, it is not inherent in cloak.

edit: totally screwed up the quote

The fundamental attribute of being invisible is granted by the cloak ability.

Also to be fair the [snip] hole who doesn't think he needs too use cloak counters is a poor example of the argument to make changes to cloak.

Cloak in and of itself is not ALWAYS op or infallible. The reasonable argument being made against cloak is the previous argument I have stated in this thread.

Edit to remove profanity

Cathexis

AshTal wrote: »

I am wondering how much will change when the CP cap comes in. I was fighting a NB today, me plus a DK and it was almost impossible for us to come any where close to killing him. As soon as he got low he vanished then came back on full health. We hit him with everything and just couldn't do enough damage, then he managed to crit the DK a few times killed him and I had to run.

In the end it took 4 lv 16 VETS to kill 1 lv 16 VET

This isn't an issue with cloak being too powerful or NB's being god mode but anyone seeing this would instantly want them nerfed but the same happens against uber DKs, Sorcs or Templars. There is always a few people regardless of class who make their class seem uber powerful.

I have to disagree because there is a difference between killing 4 people outright and killing 4 people because you can just completely disappear any time you feel like it. Its the same reasoning as bolting away any time you feel like it.

CP5

butoijo wrote: »

As stamina user, i'll use RML if no one in my group use it. It's fun looking for NB when you assault keep . They don't know that i can see them LOL.

And then they go and make post about cloak not working. I spent one evening chain killing a group of nb's. Had a few allies who would kill them while I kept them in place with RML, invasion and talons. One would go to rez, would chase/kill them, the dead one was rezed, rinse repeat. Got more than a few whispers about cheating to keep track of them.

ToRelax

Heathenpride wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Heathenpride wrote: »

I love how everyone is whining about the ability of rogues/assassins to use stealth, which is part of their core structure as a class, but no one is mentioning that it's odd seeing a 5 foot tall elf strolling around Tramriel with a two handed weapon bigger than she is and ripping new arses for fighter class characters...

NBs should be using light weapons, daggers preferably, whilst sorcs should be using staves and daggers and the fighter classes need to be rocking the heavy weaponry.

NBs should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy.

Whatever happened to that style?

I REFUSE to use two handed or staves, i keep my daggers and that's how it should be so don't nerf cloak, nerf the ability for all classes to use all weapons because we all know how messed up it's become, odd that no one mentions it...

Are you for real? >_>

Old school role player from way back so yeah, I am.

Will it happen? of course not.

This is the role playing of the modern age and it's changed which I get but don't complain about assassins using stealth whilst the same game allows for an elven female to use a 2 handed maul and plate armour...

Look, I don't have a problem with stricter classes/archetypes, although I like this open system more (one of the reasons I'm still here).
But it was said pretty clear from the start you could "play the way you want", wich included choosing your class as a kind of base direction, then deciding with your skills, attributes and weapons of choice how your character/build would work. So you should really know better then coming into this comletely unrelated thread and complaining about the problem you have with this game's design.

Heathenpride

ToRelax wrote: »

Heathenpride wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Heathenpride wrote: »

I love how everyone is whining about the ability of rogues/assassins to use stealth, which is part of their core structure as a class, but no one is mentioning that it's odd seeing a 5 foot tall elf strolling around Tramriel with a two handed weapon bigger than she is and ripping new arses for fighter class characters...

NBs should be using light weapons, daggers preferably, whilst sorcs should be using staves and daggers and the fighter classes need to be rocking the heavy weaponry.

NBs should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy.

Whatever happened to that style?

I REFUSE to use two handed or staves, i keep my daggers and that's how it should be so don't nerf cloak, nerf the ability for all classes to use all weapons because we all know how messed up it's become, odd that no one mentions it...

Are you for real? >_>

Old school role player from way back so yeah, I am.

Will it happen? of course not.

This is the role playing of the modern age and it's changed which I get but don't complain about assassins using stealth whilst the same game allows for an elven female to use a 2 handed maul and plate armour...

Look, I don't have a problem with stricter classes/archetypes, although I like this open system more (one of the reasons I'm still here).
But it was said pretty clear from the start you could "play the way you want", wich included choosing your class as a kind of base direction, then deciding with your skills, attributes and weapons of choice how your character/build would work. So you should really know better then coming into this comletely unrelated thread and complaining about the problem you have with this game's design.

I'm not coming in to an unrelated thread mate. Indeed this is the umpteenth thread on this topic (thread duplication being a forum taboo but that's for the mods) that I've commented on and I'm tired of people complaining about a regular class trait just because they're too lazy to counter it with the multiple counters available.

So instead of the usual argument I thought I'd throw some logic out there to highlight that there are other logic based "issues" that are far more relevant...

Gunphu

Since magicka users tend to complain most about cloak maybe a magicka morph for caltrops instead of anti-calvary. If they did this it should have a slightly increased cost though. This is because the STA morph decreases your break free/ dodgeroll pool. It could have the same affect and diameter as anti-calvary just use magicka instead.

IDK...this could be a dumb idea but just something to think about. I seriously doubt anyone would use it though because a ton of options are currently available and no one uses them. Just like anyone can go stealth to heal and replenish resources (via potions) and they dont. I know a couple templars that do this and it can really mess your day up!

JDar

Ezareth wrote: »

KenaPKK wrote: »

I'm one of the best PvP magicka nightblade players in the game, actually.

That's a pretty ballsy statement for someone I've never heard of.

He's probably right. I've seen his work first hand lol

Jahosefat

Derping through eso forums at lunch, typical forum blade dribble, then this beauty of a post:

Heathenpride wrote: »

I love how everyone is whining about the ability of rogues/assassins to use stealth, which is part of their core structure as a class, but no one is mentioning that it's odd seeing a 5 foot tall elf strolling around Tramriel with a two handed weapon bigger than she is and ripping new arses for fighter class characters...

NBs should be using light weapons, daggers preferably, whilst sorcs should be using staves and daggers and the fighter classes need to be rocking the heavy weaponry.

NBs should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy.

Whatever happened to that style?

I REFUSE to use two handed or staves, i keep my daggers and that's how it should be so don't nerf cloak, nerf the ability for all classes to use all weapons because we all know how messed up it's become, odd that no one mentions it...

My first thought was "wow, that is off topic", and it is, but beyond that I have to highlight the argument that was just made.

Assertion 1: NB should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy. (Classic mmo fantasy roles)

Assertion 2: I use daggers on my NB because that is how the class should be played.

Conclusions: Thus cloak shouldn't be nerfed, nerf peoples ability to use things outside the classic roles (because that helps what?)

lol sorry poster, it was too ridiculous to not point out. You can blame it on being drunk or something.

Heathenpride

Jahosefat wrote: »

Derping through eso forums at lunch, typical forum blade dribble, then this beauty of a post:

Heathenpride wrote: »

I love how everyone is whining about the ability of rogues/assassins to use stealth, which is part of their core structure as a class, but no one is mentioning that it's odd seeing a 5 foot tall elf strolling around Tramriel with a two handed weapon bigger than she is and ripping new arses for fighter class characters...

NBs should be using light weapons, daggers preferably, whilst sorcs should be using staves and daggers and the fighter classes need to be rocking the heavy weaponry.

NBs should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy.

Whatever happened to that style?

I REFUSE to use two handed or staves, i keep my daggers and that's how it should be so don't nerf cloak, nerf the ability for all classes to use all weapons because we all know how messed up it's become, odd that no one mentions it...

My first thought was "wow, that is off topic", and it is, but beyond that I have to highlight the argument that was just made.

Assertion 1: NB should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy. (Classic mmo fantasy roles)

Assertion 2: I use daggers on my NB because that is how the class should be played.

Conclusions: Thus cloak shouldn't be nerfed, nerf peoples ability to use things outside the classic roles (because that helps what?)

lol sorry poster, it was too ridiculous to not point out. You can blame it on being drunk or something.

Heathenpride wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Heathenpride wrote: »

ToRelax wrote: »

Heathenpride wrote: »

I love how everyone is whining about the ability of rogues/assassins to use stealth, which is part of their core structure as a class, but no one is mentioning that it's odd seeing a 5 foot tall elf strolling around Tramriel with a two handed weapon bigger than she is and ripping new arses for fighter class characters...

NBs should be using light weapons, daggers preferably, whilst sorcs should be using staves and daggers and the fighter classes need to be rocking the heavy weaponry.

NBs should be restricted to medium armour, sorcs light and fighters heavy.

Whatever happened to that style?

I REFUSE to use two handed or staves, i keep my daggers and that's how it should be so don't nerf cloak, nerf the ability for all classes to use all weapons because we all know how messed up it's become, odd that no one mentions it...

Are you for real? >_>

Old school role player from way back so yeah, I am.

Will it happen? of course not.

This is the role playing of the modern age and it's changed which I get but don't complain about assassins using stealth whilst the same game allows for an elven female to use a 2 handed maul and plate armour...

Look, I don't have a problem with stricter classes/archetypes, although I like this open system more (one of the reasons I'm still here).
But it was said pretty clear from the start you could "play the way you want", wich included choosing your class as a kind of base direction, then deciding with your skills, attributes and weapons of choice how your character/build would work. So you should really know better then coming into this comletely unrelated thread and complaining about the problem you have with this game's design.

I'm not coming in to an unrelated thread mate. Indeed this is the umpteenth thread on this topic (thread duplication being a forum taboo but that's for the mods) that I've commented on and I'm tired of people complaining about a regular class trait just because they're too lazy to counter it with the multiple counters available.

So instead of the usual argument I thought I'd throw some logic out there to highlight that there are other logic based "issues" that are far more relevant...

Reposted, clearly you missed it.

EDIT. OK so I agree that I'm not being as clear as I thought, apologies.

Allow me to clarify:

Agree with OP but I stand by the duplicated thread comment.

My comments are directed at those in disagreement with OP, definitely could have worded it better so as not to appear drunk, bonkers or both!.

It's 3am, time for bed methinks.

Jahosefat

Heathenpride wrote: »

It's 3am, time for bed methinks.

It's ok, I just found it funny. In reply to your actual comment: a statement thrown around early on in ESO's life was "play how you want"; meaning classes would not be restricted to the classic mmo fantasy roles. Any class could fill any role (or was at least the intention). Obviously this was not the case due to balancing issues, and the viability of certain rolls or builds for each class has ebbed and flowed with each patch.

But yeah, that is why classes are not restricted in the way you propose. I'm not saying I agree or disagree with this philosophy, just that the "play how you want" philosophy has been at the core of class balance and development efforts since beta. To change that at this point would be a complete ground-up overhaul of the class and ability systems (and there are a lot of mag NB who love their resto staffs and would be very sad to not have access to these despite how much you love daggers).

KozawahGaming

KenaPKK wrote: »

contact.opiumb16_ESO wrote: »

jnorris91ub17_ESO wrote: »

Go play Nightblade.

In combat, Cloak is extremely unreliable as a tool of evasion because AoEs and potions are extremely easy to obtain.

It's useless as a tool of escape against anyone with these counters.

And outside of combat, it doesn't matter what it does. All this complaint about Cloaking around is completely beside the point. A Cloaked Nightblade is not dealing damage, and what damage they do deal is either inhibited by Magelight (for magicka uses) or completely outclassed by your own damage (for stamina users) thanks to the CP system and weapon damage weapon glyphs.

Damn where is my lol button ?

Cmon ! top 10 players in EU are almost all NB (others are sorcerers). When a class dominate so much you know their is something wrong right @jnorris91ub17_ESO ? So what solution could you give to balance this ?

Magicka Nightblade isn't the problem. Stamina nb damage is the problem.

Wrecking blow still hits for upwards of 15k plus its free heavy attack, Steel Tornado is unavoidable in the tight areas of IC, and it still shreds, and snare immunity from Shuffle in a meta where snares are powerful.

This damage is acquired from a few sources. Percentage weapon damage amplification comes from Flawless Dawnbreaker and medium armor passives, and a flat weapon damage glyph can by applied to weapons. Magicka users get nothing comparable to these. Also, Hardy reduces magic damage by a percent, and there is no percentage physical damage mitigation CP.

These disparities need to be repaired before ANY facet of magicka nb is touched.

No, Wrecking blow is a 2h skill problem not a cloak problem. They just need to nerf Wrecking blow. Plus all AoE's are unavoidable in tight areas, not just Steel Tornado.

Gunphu

Nothing KenaPKK discussed is nightblade specific. Also if they nerf WB (rediculously easy to counter) then that would be a wrecking blow to any STA Sorc and STA DKs DPS in PvE and PvP.

Waffennacht

STA DK? What is this mystical creature you speak of? Jk lol

WB ... plus NB... is the bane of my existence...

No nerf to cloak please. Id much prefer the old school detect pots plz.

revonine

Revert the detect pot nerf, make revealing flare actually useful at detecting stealth-ed enemies, change magelight to I dunno a timed ability so it doesn't take up two slots (just brainstorming there) and most complaints about cloak will vanish.

The people that don't wanna slot counters and are complaining that a nightblade killed them so naturally "nerf cloak plz"..well can't help you there. I'm killed, wrecked even by other classes that know what they're doing and I consider myself a decent NB.

apostate9

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

It is very simple, NB was gimped for a year so while everyone (except maybe the temps) were enjoying easy mode we learned to adapt and play. Now ZOS have fixed a broken skill and suddenly with our full toolset all that learning is paying off, we know about mobility and LoS, but other classes now need to learn that too - but it is much easier to call for nerfs and ZOS have already said they will change their nappies... no... sorry... 'balance' cloak... but we will still kill the bad ones. The good ones won't care 'cos they already adapted to a nearly working cloak and are still doing fine.

Sweet. So I'll be getting unlimited reflects back for my reflective plate, and stam regen while blocking...right?

m1ck10v1n

To be honest, Nightblades are overpower, but so is every other class in some way.
Because it is PVP everyone is going to moan about the classes they don't play to make it easier for them rather than learning their own class.
Although I do think that Cloak, Bolt, stuff like that should have a cooldown of about 10-15 seconds.

Yes I do have a Nightblade, Sorcerer and templar.

_Proteus_

Bashev wrote: »

jnorris91ub17_ESO wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

Even if they remove the invisibility from dark cloak it will be still useful cause it removes up to 5 DoTs.

It would still be useful in very, very limited situations, but pretty much ANY other skill would be more useful.

Also, the Nightblade class as a whole would be weak as hell because they rely so heavily on cloak. No other class relies as heavily on one skill as Nightblade does on cloak.

DKs relied on GDB and block. Guess what ZOS dont care. When ppl complain ZOS nerf. And BTW if you check the posts since release I am pretty sure that all the other classes combined together didn call for nerfs as much NBs did.

Not true, DKs relied the most on dynamic ulti regen and battle roar. And I'm completely for bring back dynamic ulti regen.

Derra

m1ck10v1n wrote: »

To be honest, Nightblades are overpower, but so is every other class in some way.
Because it is PVP everyone is going to moan about the classes they don't play to make it easier for them rather than learning their own class.
Although I do think that Cloak, Bolt, stuff like that should have a cooldown of about 10-15 seconds.

Yes I do have a Nightblade, Sorcerer and templar.

Just to be sure - you want gapclosers to stay without cooldown at the same time?

olsborg

As a stamina nightblade, nerfing cloak as it is now would be an extremely bad move on zos' part.

I can cast it maybe 3 times during a short fight...and atleast 1 of those times it will fail and I will get pulled out of it.

Magicka nbs however can spam this endlessly...so if they do decide to change cloak somehow they should be real careful as to not limit the already limited usefulness for a stamina nightblade.

CP5

olsborg wrote: »

As a stamina nightblade, nerfing cloak as it is now would be an extremely bad move on zos' part.

I can cast it maybe 3 times during a short fight...and atleast 1 of those times it will fail and I will get pulled out of it.

Magicka nbs however can spam this endlessly...so if they do decide to change cloak somehow they should be real careful as to not limit the already limited usefulness for a stamina nightblade.

Same story with stam sorc's and bolt. Did that stop people from demanding another round of nerfs for bolt escape?

Also as a side note, i've ran radiant magelight for a while (most recently last night) and found something very strange about it. 1. I think I can confirm that magelight and the sentry sets don't stack, but I would need someone to test with to confirm that. 2. magelight 'pulses'. What I mean by that is, just like lightning form only kicks people out of cloak once a second when the damage hits, so does magelight only with no damage being done. Sometimes a nb cloaks and is immediately visible (they cloaked right before the 'pulse' happened) or they cloak and during the 1s delay (seemingly 1s) they are able to get out of magelight's aoe and continue cloaking. Anyone else notice this?

Cinbri

Templars got Eclipse and Honor the Dead ninja nerfs + DKs got Scale nerf + Sorcs got Streak nerf = I will be questioned in common sense of those who believe that NBs won't be nerfed at some time.

Digerati

anyone saying NBs cloaking is not stupid does not play in IC... 2 NBs can shut down an entire side with just being slippery and opportunistic.

Seriously, when 10+ guys can't drop 2 NBs, a nerf is needed.

This thread would not have been created if some NB didn't realize how big of an advantage they've got.

The fact that there's pre-whining "don't nerf me!" should tell ZoS a nerf needs to happen.

TRIPLE THE COST OF CLOAK. Make it remove dots OR make invisible, so that you have to drop your magicka pool on escaping from 10 people rather than being able to indefinitely evade a fight.

Digerati

Also, people keep mentioning counters to cloak...
there are NO HARD COUNTERS. There are abilities that help mitigate it, there are abilities that make it easier to deal with but there are NO HARD COUNTERS. There's no ability or even full bar of abilities that hard counter this one ability.

if you're roaming solo and a NB engages you, he can decide to disengage and escape almost 100% of the time, regardless of what abilities you have slotted. This is exactly the reason bolt escape was nerfed into the ground.

edit: should NBs be BETTER at escaping a fight than other classes? Sure they should be. they shouldn't, however, be so good at escaping a fight that they're able to spend hours picking people off in IC and evading the zerg.

Either couple cloak with a 10 second -50% DR debuff, triple the cost, make it remove dots OR make invisible, or all of the above.

Chori

Digerati wrote: »

anyone saying NBs cloaking is not stupid does not play in IC... 2 NBs can shut down an entire side with just being slippery and opportunistic.

Seriously, when 10+ guys can't drop 2 NBs, a nerf is needed.

This thread would not have been created if some NB didn't realize how big of an advantage they've got.
.

LOL then I would say those 10+ players need a better AOE/CC setup and need to L2P honestly.
If anybody of those 10+ players cant land a CC or spam AOEs or even one of them cant use a detect pot accordingly for such size of a group, then I will say the problem is not in the game or class balance but in between the chair and the keyboard.

Oh and by the way, I play in IC a lot. I gank as much as I find myself getting ganked when I'm trying to farm mats or anything of that sort.

Honestly, I can feel how frustrating it can be to be killed by probably the best solo class in game atm. But I would only justify a nerf if the class gets compensation buff/s in other areas due to the fact cloak has several counters, nightblades do not have damage shields like other classes, and at some examples still have a scape tool *cough cough*.

Really... people should stop asking for nerfs and start asking for buffs in other areas to increase build diversity and/or buff counters.

revonine

Digerati wrote: »

Seriously, when 10+ guys can't drop 2 NBs, a nerf is needed.

If 10 guys can't pin down and kill 2 NB's they're either primarily PvE players, need to re-evaluate their builds, slot appropriate counters or pop a detect potion.

Not one out of 10 of them thought to gap close and aoe?

Cathexis

revonine wrote: »

Digerati wrote: »

Seriously, when 10+ guys can't drop 2 NBs, a nerf is needed.

If 10 guys can't pin down and kill 2 NB's they're either primarily PvE players, need to re-evaluate their builds, slot appropriate counters or pop a detect potion.

Not one out of 10 of them thought to gap close and aoe?

Its comments like this that astound me.

Obviously, obviously, they thought to use counters.

It astounds me that nightblades automatically make the assumption that the players are at fault for not running counters.

I don't know anyone who walks around without some form of nb counter.

Digerati wrote: »

Also, people keep mentioning counters to cloak...
there are NO HARD COUNTERS. There are abilities that help mitigate it, there are abilities that make it easier to deal with but there are NO HARD COUNTERS. There's no ability or even full bar of abilities that hard counter this one ability.

if you're roaming solo and a NB engages you, he can decide to disengage and escape almost 100% of the time, regardless of what abilities you have slotted. This is exactly the reason bolt escape was nerfed into the ground.

edit: should NBs be BETTER at escaping a fight than other classes? Sure they should be. they shouldn't, however, be so good at escaping a fight that they're able to spend hours picking people off in IC and evading the zerg.

Either couple cloak with a 10 second -50% DR debuff, triple the cost, make it remove dots OR make invisible, or all of the above.

This is the exact point I have been trying to make about counters. I run 8 counters vs nightblades. Five skills, two ultimates AND potions. None of them give me an absolute advantage or even close to it.

The fact that I have to spend gold and time to prepare for nightblades and run an entire bar of counters to keep up doesn't illustrate how absurd the ability is in its current state I don't know what will.

Darnathian

Digerati wrote: »

anyone saying NBs cloaking is not stupid does not play in IC... 2 NBs can shut down an entire side with just being slippery and opportunistic.

Seriously, when 10+ guys can't drop 2 NBs, a nerf is needed.

This thread would not have been created if some NB didn't realize how big of an advantage they've got.

The fact that there's pre-whining "don't nerf me!" should tell ZoS a nerf needs to happen.

TRIPLE THE COST OF CLOAK. Make it remove dots OR make invisible, so that you have to drop your magicka pool on escaping from 10 people rather than being able to indefinitely evade a fight.

Yup. This hits it on the head. They should NOT remove dots. One of the main reasons they are a hard counter to magicka DKs. Literally the best spell in the game.

Darnathian

Chori wrote: »

Digerati wrote: »

anyone saying NBs cloaking is not stupid does not play in IC... 2 NBs can shut down an entire side with just being slippery and opportunistic.

Seriously, when 10+ guys can't drop 2 NBs, a nerf is needed.

This thread would not have been created if some NB didn't realize how big of an advantage they've got.
.

LOL then I would say those 10+ players need a better AOE/CC setup and need to L2P honestly.
If anybody of those 10+ players cant land a CC or spam AOEs or even one of them cant use a detect pot accordingly for such size of a group, then I will say the problem is not in the game or class balance but in between the chair and the keyboard.

Oh and by the way, I play in IC a lot. I gank as much as I find myself getting ganked when I'm trying to farm mats or anything of that sort.

Honestly, I can feel how frustrating it can be to be killed by probably the best solo class in game atm. But I would only justify a nerf if the class gets compensation buff/s in other areas due to the fact cloak has several counters, nightblades do not have damage shields like other classes, and at some examples still have a scape tool *cough cough*.

Really... people should stop asking for nerfs and start asking for buffs in other areas to increase build diversity and/or buff counters.

I am so sick of hearing that. Now that all the other nerfs have been done now nb's and some sorcs don't want any more nerfs now that they are OP.

I see what you did there.

Digerati

Chori wrote: »

Digerati wrote: »

anyone saying NBs cloaking is not stupid does not play in IC... 2 NBs can shut down an entire side with just being slippery and opportunistic.

Seriously, when 10+ guys can't drop 2 NBs, a nerf is needed.

This thread would not have been created if some NB didn't realize how big of an advantage they've got.
.

...

Really... people should stop asking for nerfs and start asking for buffs in other areas to increase build diversity and/or buff counters.

OK sure. Add a morph to every class that prevents stealth for X amount of time... Give us a hard counter to cloak... Make caltrops reveal all? Increase radius of magelight?