Hoodster92_ESO wrote: »SorataArisugawa wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Paying for content updates that you would otherwise get for free in a sub model... Gaming industry is going down the drain.
It is your choice, pay nothing for 5 month and than pay the equal as 1,5 month for an DLC and play free for the next time again. Or pay the whole 5 month for the same "DLC". I don't understand the problem here...
The problem is that this content was already payed for prior to the Crown Stores Arival through the Subcsriptions the earlier players had to pay. It's not about the system now, its the fact that this content is "essentially" grouped with the system that was before aka that this content should have been no DLC.
Shadesofkin wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Paying for content updates that you would otherwise get for free in a sub model... Gaming industry is going down the drain.
To be fair, the video game industry has been in the decline since the era of digital updates began and they could patch products instead of truly finishing them, this is why I continue to hold tabletop gaming as superior in nearly every way.
But, on to the subject at hand: Imperial City.
Exciting news, trailer looked great and so far everything sounds exactly like I expected and told others to expect. I'm really glad you're not just dumping this out for free on non-subscribers and former members. I feel renewed justification in my continued subscription.
Really looking forward to those 4-man dungeons in particular.
It's not so hard to please a PC gamer: Release a quality product, update it often and do not make false promises.LillyAngel wrote: »Shadesofkin wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Paying for content updates that you would otherwise get for free in a sub model... Gaming industry is going down the drain.
To be fair, the video game industry has been in the decline since the era of digital updates began and they could patch products instead of truly finishing them, this is why I continue to hold tabletop gaming as superior in nearly every way.
But, on to the subject at hand: Imperial City.
Exciting news, trailer looked great and so far everything sounds exactly like I expected and told others to expect. I'm really glad you're not just dumping this out for free on non-subscribers and former members. I feel renewed justification in my continued subscription.
Really looking forward to those 4-man dungeons in particular.
No wonder game companies are turning away from PCs, PC gamers are nothing but a bunch of whiners... it's becoming more and more difficult to please them...
Lava_Croft wrote: »It's not so hard to please a PC gamer: Release a quality product, update it often and do not make false promises.LillyAngel wrote: »Shadesofkin wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Paying for content updates that you would otherwise get for free in a sub model... Gaming industry is going down the drain.
To be fair, the video game industry has been in the decline since the era of digital updates began and they could patch products instead of truly finishing them, this is why I continue to hold tabletop gaming as superior in nearly every way.
But, on to the subject at hand: Imperial City.
Exciting news, trailer looked great and so far everything sounds exactly like I expected and told others to expect. I'm really glad you're not just dumping this out for free on non-subscribers and former members. I feel renewed justification in my continued subscription.
Really looking forward to those 4-man dungeons in particular.
No wonder game companies are turning away from PCs, PC gamers are nothing but a bunch of whiners... it's becoming more and more difficult to please them...
ZOS failed on all three of these accounts.
Lava_Croft wrote: »It's not so hard to please a PC gamer: Release a quality product, update it often and do not make false promises.LillyAngel wrote: »Shadesofkin wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Paying for content updates that you would otherwise get for free in a sub model... Gaming industry is going down the drain.
To be fair, the video game industry has been in the decline since the era of digital updates began and they could patch products instead of truly finishing them, this is why I continue to hold tabletop gaming as superior in nearly every way.
But, on to the subject at hand: Imperial City.
Exciting news, trailer looked great and so far everything sounds exactly like I expected and told others to expect. I'm really glad you're not just dumping this out for free on non-subscribers and former members. I feel renewed justification in my continued subscription.
Really looking forward to those 4-man dungeons in particular.
No wonder game companies are turning away from PCs, PC gamers are nothing but a bunch of whiners... it's becoming more and more difficult to please them...
ZOS failed on all three of these accounts.
Way to go, ZOS. Introduce a new currency for all the new stuff, making what we have right now completely worthless and then make it attainable in PK environment with the risk to lose it.
Didn't you say you wanted to tackle the zerg issue?
bloodravnb14_ESO wrote: »So wait... there is already an imbalance in PvP, and that imbalance is only going to increase as champion points increase. So these ridiculously powerful players that everyone ALREADY *** about will just be able to roam around IC and kill people, taking their stone and preventing them from getting the new / better gear? Or what's to stop a zerg doing the same thing?
For that matter, who gets the stone drops? does just one person, or does everyone who contributed to ganking that person get a copy of the stone stack? That would make farming people a lot more efficient than anything else.
Really getting tired of forcing PvX on those that aren't interested in that game type. Separate out your systems please, if you plan on having both in your game.
Lava_Croft wrote: »So after all this waiting. All this subscription paying. All these promises. All these delays.
You want 2500 Crowns for the Imperial City.
I cannot think of a better way ZOS could have said "go *** yourself, scrub" to loyal customers.
Don't get confused - Orsinium is the capital city of the Wrothgar region, while High Hrothgar is up a mountain in Skyrim and has never even been suggested as DLC.Desolationz wrote: »So wait, this DLC pack doesn't include Orsinium/High Wrothgar?
This. This is exactly why I was trying to put forward the case for Imperial City being free content (along with the ragequit scenarios), and, along with Lava_Croft's points, why I will be cancelling my sub.CrustyMudcrab wrote: »Zenimax,
To access the Imperial City, will my friends and I have to traverse through Cyrodil and attempt to fight our way through just to access the DLC we pay for? Sounds borderline impossible if my alliance is on the losing end of nearly every campaign. Am I not seeing the whole picture here or is that pretty accurate?
-Subscriber
vladimilianoub17_ESO1 wrote: »Hoodster92_ESO wrote: »SorataArisugawa wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Paying for content updates that you would otherwise get for free in a sub model... Gaming industry is going down the drain.
It is your choice, pay nothing for 5 month and than pay the equal as 1,5 month for an DLC and play free for the next time again. Or pay the whole 5 month for the same "DLC". I don't understand the problem here...
The problem is that this content was already payed for prior to the Crown Stores Arival through the Subcsriptions the earlier players had to pay. It's not about the system now, its the fact that this content is "essentially" grouped with the system that was before aka that this content should have been no DLC.
You got crowns for every month you suscribed.There is your Imp City DLC.I still have my crowns that they gave us.There is my IC DLC.You already spend your free crowns? Buy a 60 day card,there you get 2 months sub and crowns to buy the dlc.
So much nerd rage in this post, amazing. I love how people are complaining that they subbed for a year and now have to pay for IC, even though they already received enough free crowns to buy it. Their fault if they bought frivolous stuff like mounts and pets when it was made clear that DLC would come at a price.
To play PvP. I paid a year of subscription money and I am still waiting for the content that was promised. Also, there's not much of an alternative when it comes to ESO's PvP, which is one of the big reasons why a lot of people stick around.Lava_Croft wrote: »It's not so hard to please a PC gamer: Release a quality product, update it often and do not make false promises.LillyAngel wrote: »Shadesofkin wrote: »tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »Paying for content updates that you would otherwise get for free in a sub model... Gaming industry is going down the drain.
To be fair, the video game industry has been in the decline since the era of digital updates began and they could patch products instead of truly finishing them, this is why I continue to hold tabletop gaming as superior in nearly every way.
But, on to the subject at hand: Imperial City.
Exciting news, trailer looked great and so far everything sounds exactly like I expected and told others to expect. I'm really glad you're not just dumping this out for free on non-subscribers and former members. I feel renewed justification in my continued subscription.
Really looking forward to those 4-man dungeons in particular.
No wonder game companies are turning away from PCs, PC gamers are nothing but a bunch of whiners... it's becoming more and more difficult to please them...
ZOS failed on all three of these accounts.
So why are you even here? Just to troll?
Jamesbr1b14_ESO wrote: »Lava_Croft wrote: »So after all this waiting. All this subscription paying. All these promises. All these delays.
You want 2500 Crowns for the Imperial City.
I cannot think of a better way ZOS could have said "go *** yourself, scrub" to loyal customers.
I think you missed something while you were reading the launch details, because if you've been paying your subscription (as you stated above), you do NOT have to pay the 2500 crowns for the expansion pack. That cost is for non-ESO Plus members. As seen in their quote below:
The full Imperial City DLC game pack is included with an active ESO Plus membership. If you are not an ESO Plus member, or your membership lapses, the Imperial City DLC game pack costs 2,500 crowns in the ESOTU Crown Store.
I can't agree with this assessment (because I'm a programmer). The statement implies a subscription is going to "X", rather than "Y", but that's never the case.Hoodster92_ESO wrote: »Now.... with the Imperial City being a DLC, even after essentially paying for the content due to previous subscription model, it tells me that they burned the Subscriptions of players attempting to fix the games mistakes (which they still haven't done completely yet) and are making me reinburse their work towards the imperial city by paying them again.....
MSchroeder wrote: »I can't speak to engineering issues, but let me address some of the itemization questions.@ZOS_JasonLeavey @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler
I am aware there will be new sets but how about sets like Ravager, Morag Tong, Shadow Walker, Archmage, etc? Will these be updated at the launch or are they to be replaced with the new sets and fade into memory (Red Mountain)? I know it took you guys months to finally give us v14 versions of these sets, will you repeat this pattern? Also will be using AP to get these items or will we now need the Tel Var Stones? If so, this makes AP rather useless, especially those of us who are saving it.
About a dozen item sets from Cyrodiil are being updated and re-released in the Rewards for the Worthy and Leaderboard reward mails, and they will be available at every Level and Veteran Rank (including VR 16). Another dozen or so Cyrodiil sets have had their statistics updated, but will not be included in those mails.
Tel Var stones can only be gained and spent inside the Imperial City.Shall we also assume this new gear will be 'bound' on pick up? This would force players to purchase a subscription and or DLC to have access to the new items.
The item sets in the new dungeons will be Bind on Pickup. However, item sets purchased via Tel Var stones are all Bind on Equip - meaning that you can sell them on Guild Stores or trade them to other players. Further, the crafting materials found in Imperial City can also be sold or traded, and used to craft VR 15 and VR 16 gear at any crafting bench.
ESO+ doesn't even matter in this case. As a PvP player, I have paid a subscription fee for over a year, only to see next to no new content and a state of PvP that is worse than it ever was when you look at things like the lag and bugs.SturgeHammer wrote: »Jamesbr1b14_ESO wrote: »Lava_Croft wrote: »So after all this waiting. All this subscription paying. All these promises. All these delays.
You want 2500 Crowns for the Imperial City.
I cannot think of a better way ZOS could have said "go *** yourself, scrub" to loyal customers.
I think you missed something while you were reading the launch details, because if you've been paying your subscription (as you stated above), you do NOT have to pay the 2500 crowns for the expansion pack. That cost is for non-ESO Plus members. As seen in their quote below:
The full Imperial City DLC game pack is included with an active ESO Plus membership. If you are not an ESO Plus member, or your membership lapses, the Imperial City DLC game pack costs 2,500 crowns in the ESOTU Crown Store.
I think @Lava_Croft is saying that paying the ESO+ for months is not worth unlimited access to a 2500 crown DLC, which they probably have, like every other ESO+ member, enough dead crowns in pocket to buy it straight up with more crowns to spare. It is a huge smack in the face for players that have been subbed for a while with the promise that the DLC will make up for a lack of Value that ESO+ provides. This lack of value has been officially acknowledged by ZOS.
lordrichter wrote: »So what happened to the promise Zenimax made that The Imperial City was gonna be free?!
You just can't trust Zenimax I guess...
The Imperial City was never promised to be "free".
The Imperial City is, was, and always has been, said to be included with your paid ESO subscription. You can quibble over B2P and that you are not required to pay a subscription, but the fact remains that it is included with the current ESO Plus subscription, just as it was intended to be included in the old ESO subscription. This has been a constant that has not changed.
What has changed is that now you do not need to subscribe and you can purchase Imperial City using Crowns. Before Tamriel Unlimited, if you did not want to subscribe, you did not get to play. You did not get Imperial City. You did not get anything. Pay or go home. Thanks to the change in business model, you get to choose whether to subscribe. Choose to subscribe, you get Imperial City as part of that subscription, same as before. Choose not to subscribe, you get the option of buying Imperial City outright or playing without it.jcodbf2b14_ESO wrote: »I think this DLC should be free to any that had an account and paid a subscription before the switch to buy to play. It is the right thing to do.. Or at least give those same people a window of a week to claim it for free.
Why?
I can think of two reasons to not do this.
1. Whenever ZOS attempts to reward past participation, it does nothing but create dissent. Even though they do it to be nice, it is widely rebuked by vocal players. There is always a cutoff, and there is always someone on the wrong side of that cutoff. Look at all of the exclusive Senche offers over the last 6 months and the people begging to be included in those offers after the fact. It will be 100x worse with Imperial City.
2. It was always intended to be included in your subscription and it still is. If you dropped your subscription under the old plan, you did not get Imperial City. Imperial City was never something that was gifted, it was always included with the recurring subscription. The terms of that offer have not changed. Subscribe to ESO Plus, get the Imperial City at no extra charge, just as it was before B2P. Or.... do not subscribe and buy it separately, something new with B2P that gives you the option.
jcodbf2b14_ESO wrote: »lordrichter wrote: »So what happened to the promise Zenimax made that The Imperial City was gonna be free?!
You just can't trust Zenimax I guess...
The Imperial City was never promised to be "free".
The Imperial City is, was, and always has been, said to be included with your paid ESO subscription. You can quibble over B2P and that you are not required to pay a subscription, but the fact remains that it is included with the current ESO Plus subscription, just as it was intended to be included in the old ESO subscription. This has been a constant that has not changed.
What has changed is that now you do not need to subscribe and you can purchase Imperial City using Crowns. Before Tamriel Unlimited, if you did not want to subscribe, you did not get to play. You did not get Imperial City. You did not get anything. Pay or go home. Thanks to the change in business model, you get to choose whether to subscribe. Choose to subscribe, you get Imperial City as part of that subscription, same as before. Choose not to subscribe, you get the option of buying Imperial City outright or playing without it.jcodbf2b14_ESO wrote: »I think this DLC should be free to any that had an account and paid a subscription before the switch to buy to play. It is the right thing to do.. Or at least give those same people a window of a week to claim it for free.
Why?
I can think of two reasons to not do this.
1. Whenever ZOS attempts to reward past participation, it does nothing but create dissent. Even though they do it to be nice, it is widely rebuked by vocal players. There is always a cutoff, and there is always someone on the wrong side of that cutoff. Look at all of the exclusive Senche offers over the last 6 months and the people begging to be included in those offers after the fact. It will be 100x worse with Imperial City.
2. It was always intended to be included in your subscription and it still is. If you dropped your subscription under the old plan, you did not get Imperial City. Imperial City was never something that was gifted, it was always included with the recurring subscription. The terms of that offer have not changed. Subscribe to ESO Plus, get the Imperial City at no extra charge, just as it was before B2P. Or.... do not subscribe and buy it separately, something new with B2P that gives you the option.
Because many have paid a subscription and went a very long time without any new content to show for the subscription? Saying it was " always a part of the sub model " doesnt fly because people paid a sub and didnt get a thing for a long time. That is why those that had accounts and paid a sub prior to buy to play should get this DLC for free.
Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »@ZOS_GinaBruno
Has the team considered granting a one time bonus of 2500 coins to those who have subbed longer than 9/12 months at this point as a thank you for the loyalty shown by PC customers during the launch year? (would allow players who feel cheated, whether rightly or wrongly, by the fact that 'no content' was delivered during their sub period a gesture of good will and would encourage others who haven't subbed to sub knowing that after that long duration they get a bonus) for example?
If not is it something you would consider for the future?
Dagoth_Rac wrote: »Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO wrote: »@ZOS_GinaBruno
Has the team considered granting a one time bonus of 2500 coins to those who have subbed longer than 9/12 months at this point as a thank you for the loyalty shown by PC customers during the launch year? (would allow players who feel cheated, whether rightly or wrongly, by the fact that 'no content' was delivered during their sub period a gesture of good will and would encourage others who haven't subbed to sub knowing that after that long duration they get a bonus) for example?
If not is it something you would consider for the future?
They gave PC subscribers crowns when they transitioned from subscription required to B2P. The amount of crowns was dependent on how long you subscribed. Why would they give us crowns again? If you spent all those crowns on mounts or costumes or XP scrolls, and have no crowns left to buy Imperial City ... I am not sure what to say. You want mounts and costumes and XP scrolls and Imperial City?