stealth attack

chevalierknight

If i foces aim from stealth do i have to wait for it to hit to get the stealth damage or can i fire a venom arrow right away?

Soris

Yes and no. Depends on the distance. In max distance, when you cast in this order;
Focused Aim - Medium Attack - Venom Arrow they will all land at the same time which means you still get that stealth bonus for the first strike.
Though I'm not the expert in ganking business. But it's something like I said

chevalierknight

Yeh some times i get 2 crits and onebow combo people. One last thing to ask what does more damage after ambush supprise attack or hidden dagger as in the duel wield tree i get 16% more damage on stuned enemys?
Would ambusg>suprise attack>then span dagger till stun comes off be good

Soris

Again not expert on NBs but I'd use Surprise Attack at least once just to debuff enemy. As for Hidden Blade dmg bonus, people will CC break almost instantly after being CCed, so its bonus damage may be wasted most of the time.

For me, Surprise Attack is better because its armor reduction debuff stacks with dual maces and sharpened, means you ignore a ton of armor. And also good damage for a spamable ability. You have bow already for range, you don't need Hidden Blade I think.

chevalierknight

Soris wrote: »

Again not expert on NBs but I'd use Surprise Attack at least once just to debuff enemy. As for Hidden Blade dmg bonus, people will CC break almost instantly after being CCed, so its bonus damage may be wasted most of the time.

For me, Surprise Attack is better because its armor reduction debuff stacks with dual maces and sharpened, means you ignore a ton of armor. And also good damage for a spamable ability. You have bow already for range, you don't need Hidden Blade I think.

I like using blade because it does 20% more damage if there below 25% i find if someones about to heal and i cant go to bow forsome resene its a nice 28m finisher. Do you know why i can stun after ambush with dark cloak then supprise attack but not stealth supprise attack then abush ?

Soris

Hmm yeah there is also that. Your call man, whatever fits you better... Dunno about stun issue.

DeanTheCat

As long as you are holding your pair of Dual Wielded weapons, any attacks on a Off-Balanced/Rooted/Silenced/Stunned target activates the Ruffian passive. This fact makes DW feel like it was made for NBs, as it combos so well with Veiled Strike and it's morphs along with the whole stealth based gameplay.

As for the stealthed attack, the first hit that connects with the target will get the stealth bonus (And any hits that connect within 0.5 sec of the first hit), so if you are sniping someone, time all your attacks to hit at the same time. And for the record, your cloak doesn't grant stealth attack bonuses. Only crouched stealth does that. The only passives the activate while cloaked are Master Assassin and Stealthy.

With the current high damage meta in PvP, executes aren't really needed unless you are fighting a permablocker, and even then, as a Nightblade, you can use fear to force the block to drop, allowing you to use standard Surprise Attack spam to finish them off. Thus Flying Blade while also having a bow on off swap is completely redundant.

Ambush is a rather unique gap closer, in the fact that it teleports you rather then charging to the destination. What ambush does is that it teleports you first, then deals the damage after a 0.5 second delay + animation lag. In addition, the GCD of this skill begins when you press the button, so at max distance, the delay between the damage being applied and you pressing the button is roughly 1.5 seconds, which allows a 0.2 second window where you are still "In stealth" beside your target. Thus you can activate Surprise Attack for the stealthed bonus in addition to the ambush, which is incidentally the stun + armor debuff.

Soris

DeanTheCat wrote: »

As long as you are holding your pair of Dual Wielded weapons, any attacks on a Off-Balanced/Rooted/Silenced/Stunned target activates the Ruffian passive. This fact makes DW feel like it was made for NBs, as it combos so well with Veiled Strike and it's morphs along with the whole stealth based gameplay.

It says "while using dw attacks" So it is bug?

chevalierknight

Soris wrote: »

DeanTheCat wrote: »

As long as you are holding your pair of Dual Wielded weapons, any attacks on a Off-Balanced/Rooted/Silenced/Stunned target activates the Ruffian passive. This fact makes DW feel like it was made for NBs, as it combos so well with Veiled Strike and it's morphs along with the whole stealth based gameplay.

It says "while using dw attacks" So it is bug?

He means the stun from veild strike works well if you follow with a dw abilty

DeanTheCat

Soris wrote: »

DeanTheCat wrote: »

As long as you are holding your pair of Dual Wielded weapons, any attacks on a Off-Balanced/Rooted/Silenced/Stunned target activates the Ruffian passive. This fact makes DW feel like it was made for NBs, as it combos so well with Veiled Strike and it's morphs along with the whole stealth based gameplay.

It says "while using dw attacks" So it is bug?

It applies to spells too, if that's what you are asking. But this bonus has been around for pretty much since the launch of the game, I don't see it changing anytime soon. Same way how Twin Blade and Blunt applies it's bonuses to all types of spells/attacks.

There exist similar stuff from other weapon lines, like the Heavy Weapons and Battle Rush passives from Two-Handed. And I still remember the old pre-nerf Cycle of Life passive from the restoration staff. Dual Wield has it's niche, and I would say that other then Nightblades who can afford to use Surprise Attack instead of Wreaking Blow, Two Handed is still better for every other class who wants to do melee physical damage in PvP. Well, unless you want to count in Biting Jabs, but I'm not the expert on Templars. You are.

Soris

Yeah I meant that thanks for clarifying.
So in practise, Ambush + Surprise Attack combo from stealth grants you 1) Immobilize, stun and damage multiplier via stealth bonus, 2) 20% empower for your next attack through Ambush, 3) 15% dmg bonus from Ruffian and 4) Armor reduction
Right?
That's a really good combo. I never thought in this way and it explains my death recaps quite a lot. And I will use this knowledge in Blackwater Blade on my lvl 10 nb

DeanTheCat

Soris wrote: »

Yeah I meant that thanks for clarifying.
So in practise, Ambush + Surprise Attack combo from stealth grants you 1) Immobilize, stun and damage multiplier via stealth bonus, 2) 20% empower for your next attack through Ambush, 3) 15% dmg bonus from Ruffian and 4) Armor reduction
Right?
That's a really good combo. I never thought in this way and it explains my death recaps quite a lot. And I will use this knowledge in Blackwater Blade on my lvl 10 nb

It gets even better when you add in the CP passive "Exploiter". Which increases damage vs off balanced targets by 10%. One nice thing about Surprise Attack stealthed stun is that the Off-Balance that comes along with it cannot be CC-Broken. Which means even if someone CC-breaks the stun, he will still be off-balance, which means with that passive along with Ruffian, you'll do an additional 25% damage towards targets instead of 15%. (Also the name of that passive is fitting, because I have been constantly accused of exploiting because of my high damage. I think you of all people should know that .And I don't even have that passive yet!)

Also, welcome to the world of Nightblades.

Soris

Oh and before all these, add that bugged dual sharpened maces armor ignore thingy. LOL. My hat is off to you nightblades.

DeanTheCat

Soris wrote: »

Oh and before all these, add that bugged dual sharpened maces armor ignore thingy. LOL. My hat is off to you nightblades.

It's not our fault that ZoS can't code penetration mechanics after don't know how many revisions (Seriously, how many times have they tried to fix that bit of code now? 6 times?). I'd say this is just natural synergy with a touch of buggy code. Other classes have similar synergies as well.

Example: DK Dark Elf with SnS and Inferno Staff.

chevalierknight

I you sure that supprise attack works with that passive i cant find anywhere on google does all say only works with dw abiltys

DeanTheCat

ZoS never writes clear tooltips, and it does work. Add that to the fact that dual wield allows for max weapon damage and you'll be looking at 14k damage (Not joking) Surprise Attacks.

chevalierknight

DeanTheCat wrote: »

ZoS never writes clear tooltips, and it does work. Add that to the fact that dual wield allows for max weapon damage and you'll be looking at 14k damage (Not joking) Surprise Attacks.

Wow i use daggers for the crit should i go swords or can i reach that damage with daggers

DeanTheCat

You need 4k+ Weapon Damage, along with 28k+ stamina. Then either use maces, or Mark your target and use swords. But on the other hand you'll be about as durable as wet tissue paper, and you'll disintegrate if someone sneezes on you. Also, pathetic regen values. May or may not be your cup of tea.

chevalierknight

DeanTheCat wrote: »

You need 4k+ Weapon Damage, along with 28k+ stamina. Then either use maces, or Mark your target and use swords. But on the other hand you'll be about as durable as wet tissue paper, and you'll disintegrate if someone sneezes on you. Also, pathetic regen values. May or may not be your cup of tea.

Im imp with 20k health 15k stam but im only vr1 4cp so with gear should have nice stam what enchant for my swords?

chevalierknight

Do you know if the tool tip for supprise attack is wrong says if attack from stealth or invis it debuffs enemy but in game any supprise attack stealth or not cracks enemys health bar

DeanTheCat

Armor debuff only applies from stealth/invis. Are you sure you don't have any sets/enchants that also rend armor? Also, do yourself a favor and install some addons, with combat text, a combat log and buff tracker. If you are on console... Well... Good luck?

chevalierknight

Yeh im on xbox i did some tests with a friend supprise attack debuffes with out stealth or invis