Radiant Destruction better then Soul Assault??????

cozmon3c_ESO

danno8 wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

So, wtf is this. i go from full life to dead all the time in less then a second from soul assault, oh wait i mean radiant destruction. whats wrong with this picture, did zos really make an execute that works from full life to zero in less then a second, i cant be the only person experiencing this bs. as a stam sorc there is no counter to this s*** and for anyone else there wouldnt be either.

ZoS Jesus beam is broken as hell, make it do crap damage until less then 20%. right now its the best ultimate, oh wait, i mean skill in the game.

Your post defies all the facts of what the skill actually does. If you are going to post things like " i go from full life to dead all the time in less then a second from [RD]", then at least show a screenshot from CLS or FTC (not the stupid recap which lumps several seconds of damage all into one). It should be easy since it happens "all the time". I expect you should have a video by the end of today then , no?

Until you do this, people will simply ignore you.

I have used RD a thousand times and had it used on me hundreds of times and never seen anything like 100--> 0% in "less than a second"

I seriously am beginning to think that all the complaining about RD is from all the perma-dodge builds out there trying to eliminate one of the last few counters to their perma-dodge builds.

i thought i recorded it but my video software wasnt running at the time, this *** happens 3 times every 5 or so hours of playing. the scenerio where it happened i was fighting a single templar and he opened with a jesus beam in the middle of my dodge roll and before i stood up again, befor i could even react, i was dead, less then a second and the only thing on my death recap was 21k radiant destruction and it was the only thing that hit me. if you guys havent experienced this then kudos to you but this skill has some serious issues.

it needs to act like mages fury imo, if you want to hit it on a dodge roller you must wait for the window between dodges like fury has too.

i did not have an issue with this as a magicka sorc because hey, you cant crit on hardened ward so jesus beam didnt do *** to it. but when you are stamina sorcerer, there is no defense to this skill like hardened ward, that wouldnt cause the bleed over crit bug because the shield is 3k. especially when it acts like that one up there did, 21k in less then a second? must of had some crazy crits or something. but my guess its a bug.

an execute should only be an execute to low health targets imo, and jesus beam seems to be way more then that. when i was a magicka sorc, mage's furry only goes of below 20% health targets, and you have to hit the target 2-3 times with the execute for them to die (remember below 20% health). but jesus beam seems way way way more powerful then mages fury which is in a way comparable because they both have long range. hell executioner takes about 2 hits on low health targets to take them out and thats at melee range.

jesus beam Must do crap damage like all other executions in the game until the target is low life. thats all i have to say on this. balance please?

david31741

LOL - RD is a homing beacon for people to go beat on a Templar. Also, Sorcs of all classes are able to easily shutdown RD spam. Shield spamming streak class complaining about other class skills in pvp - mmmhmmm.

Also, on your death re-cap that 21k is the total damage done by RD in the the 3 second channel time.

cozmon3c_ESO

david31741 wrote: »

LOL - RD is a homing beacon for people to go beat on a Templar. Also, Sorcs of all classes are able to easily shutdown RD spam. Shield spamming streak class complaining about other class skills in pvp - mmmhmmm.

Also, on your death re-cap that 21k is the total damage done by RD in the the 3 second channel time.

in the less then one second cast

OdinForge

david31741 wrote: »

LOL - RD is a homing beacon for people to go beat on a Templar. Also, Sorcs of all classes are able to easily shutdown RD spam. Shield spamming streak class complaining about other class skills in pvp - mmmhmmm.

Also, on your death re-cap that 21k is the total damage done by RD in the the 3 second channel time.

My other opinions of Sorc aside, did you even read his posts? He's running a stamina based Sorc, which might be the one class / build style that has no viable counter to RD. Magicka Sorc has hardened ward, stamina Sorc can only bash. But to bash you need to be next to the person, the other half of the issue is the instant death. A Templar puts RD on you and they (beforehand, or someone next to them) only needs to do about 8k damage to put you in serious danger, good luck getting to a bash like that.

technohic

I think one who goes into playing a stam sorc knows the deck is stacked against them but still; not buying the 1 second thing without proof and have been given nothing but hyperbole to lead me to believe anything.

SturgeHammer

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

So, wtf is this. i go from full life to dead all the time in less then a second from soul assault, oh wait i mean radiant destruction. whats wrong with this picture, did zos really make an execute that works from full life to zero in less then a second, i cant be the only person experiencing this bs. as a stam sorc there is no counter to this [snip] and for anyone else there wouldnt be either.

ZoS Jesus beam is broken as hell, make it do crap damage until less then 20%. right now its the best ultimate, oh wait, i mean skill in the game.

I also play stam sorc, and there are a few options to deal with this: Streak will interrupt the cast, venom arrow will interrupt the cast, gap closer + bash will interrupt the cast, using crazy stam sorc mobility to break line of sight, and invisible pots may also do it too (could be wrong about that one). That being said though, all of those methods get harder to utilize if the casting Templar is buried in a group where they are not easily targetable or in a hard to reach location like the top of an outpost. Also stam sorc's hardest counters are abilities that can't be roll dodged (curse, beam, soul assault, etc), so dying to those types abilities will happen, frequently.

RD probably still needs some balancing, but even with a severe nerf it would still counter stam sorcs as long as the mechanics of it remained unchanged.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

david31741

OdinForge wrote: »

david31741 wrote: »

LOL - RD is a homing beacon for people to go beat on a Templar. Also, Sorcs of all classes are able to easily shutdown RD spam. Shield spamming streak class complaining about other class skills in pvp - mmmhmmm.

Also, on your death re-cap that 21k is the total damage done by RD in the the 3 second channel time.

My other opinions of Sorc aside, did you even read his posts? He's running a stamina based Sorc, which might be the one class / build style that has no viable counter to RD. Magicka Sorc has hardened ward, stamina Sorc can only bash. But to bash you need to be next to the person, the other half of the issue is the instant death. A Templar puts RD on you and they (beforehand, or someone next to them) only needs to do about 8k damage to put you in serious danger, good luck getting to a bash like that.

Yeah, I read the post - so he has excluded two of the most OP skills from his build. However, he has played a build 99% of the time that does nothing but streaks when his shield gets to 50% as most sorcs do.

RD is problematic in a zerg on zerg fight as mentioned above due to not being able to target the temp easily. But that isnt a skill problem.

RD does not hit harder than the other classes skill options - snipe , wrecking, shards etc. Most of the time RD is worthless against a player who has decent spell resist/ward/shield. It only melts unprepared pvpers from greater than 30% health. Using RD on a player who is at 100% health is going to end badly for the temp.

OdinForge

technohic wrote: »

I think one who goes into playing a stam sorc knows the deck is stacked against them but still; not buying the 1 second thing without proof and have been given nothing but hyperbole to lead me to believe anything.

This isn't me, i have my own example in my latest PvP video through the link on my sig.

https://gfycat.com/BelovedNeighboringAmbushbug

But this is a fine example nonetheless.

pkb16_ESO2

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

So, wtf is this. i go from full life to dead all the time in less then a second from soul assault, oh wait i mean radiant destruction. whats wrong with this picture, did zos really make an execute that works from full life to zero in less then a second, i cant be the only person experiencing this bs. as a stam sorc there is no counter to this [snip] and for anyone else there wouldnt be either.

ZoS Jesus beam is broken as hell, make it do crap damage until less then 20%. right now its the best ultimate, oh wait, i mean skill in the game.

Hmm a sorc complain about a templar... can only be trolling or maybe the worst sorc ever....

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Soris

OdinForge wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I think one who goes into playing a stam sorc knows the deck is stacked against them but still; not buying the 1 second thing without proof and have been given nothing but hyperbole to lead me to believe anything.

This isn't me, i have my own example in my latest PvP video through the link on my sig.

https://gfycat.com/BelovedNeighboringAmbushbug

But this is a fine example nonetheless.

Deadly. Both crits. Totally legit combo. Reminds me Snipe+Ambush

See the damage of RD ticks. 3385 + 7636. One is outside of execute threshold, one is not which did x2 more damage than first tick.

But this is something I'm strictly against in this game. None of the combos should kill someone in a second.

cozmon3c_ESO

pkb16_ESO2 wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

So, wtf is this. i go from full life to dead all the time in less then a second from soul assault, oh wait i mean radiant destruction. whats wrong with this picture, did zos really make an execute that works from full life to zero in less then a second, i cant be the only person experiencing this bs. as a stam sorc there is no counter to this s*** and for anyone else there wouldnt be either.

ZoS Jesus beam is broken as hell, make it do crap damage until less then 20%. right now its the best ultimate, oh wait, i mean skill in the game.

Hmm a sorc complain about a templar... can only be trolling or maybe the worst sorc ever....

hmm or stamina sorcs dont have access to hardened ward because its magicka based, hmm. well cant say your a genious even though i said it in both my posts. gg.

pkb16_ESO2

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

pkb16_ESO2 wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

So, wtf is this. i go from full life to dead all the time in less then a second from soul assault, oh wait i mean radiant destruction. whats wrong with this picture, did zos really make an execute that works from full life to zero in less then a second, i cant be the only person experiencing this bs. as a stam sorc there is no counter to this [snip] and for anyone else there wouldnt be either.

ZoS Jesus beam is broken as hell, make it do crap damage until less then 20%. right now its the best ultimate, oh wait, i mean skill in the game.

Hmm a sorc complain about a templar... can only be trolling or maybe the worst sorc ever....

hmm or stamina sorcs dont have access to hardened ward because its magicka based, hmm. well cant say your a genious even though i said it in both my posts. gg.

well playing a stamina sorc makes you surly one of the worst sorc ever...
and a guy that defends sorc opness in every threat cant be taken too serious.
Stop kicking someone when hes down and telling BS.
Never seen that happen and i play temp, so pics or it never happend.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Ashanne

darkflare and RD are just as good of a combo as snipe and poison arrow are, except RD is an execute..Dark flare is a very slow skill so you can start the RD 1 sec before it even lands...after it landed you are already at 30-40% hp...
In the gif:
The dark flare hits for 12.8k (players is at 35%) ,the first RD tick is of 3300 (player is at 19%, execute phase) the folowing RD tick is of 7.6k. He didn't get the 7.6k damge from the last tick cuz his remaining life was of 3.6k
so its not like what the sorc is stating 100%->0% (in 1 sec?) only with RD

Plus the player in the gif is v1 and the death recap tips say's the gear is heavily damaged

cozmon3c_ESO

pkb16_ESO2 wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

pkb16_ESO2 wrote: »

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

So, wtf is this. i go from full life to dead all the time in less then a second from soul assault, oh wait i mean radiant destruction. whats wrong with this picture, did zos really make an execute that works from full life to zero in less then a second, i cant be the only person experiencing this bs. as a stam sorc there is no counter to this [snip] and for anyone else there wouldnt be either.

ZoS Jesus beam is broken as hell, make it do crap damage until less then 20%. right now its the best ultimate, oh wait, i mean skill in the game.

Hmm a sorc complain about a templar... can only be trolling or maybe the worst sorc ever....

hmm or stamina sorcs dont have access to hardened ward because its magicka based, hmm. well cant say your a genious even though i said it in both my posts. gg.

well playing a stamina sorc makes you surly one of the worst sorc ever...
and a guy that defends sorc opness in every threat cant be taken too serious.
Stop kicking someone when hes down and telling BS.
Never seen that happen and i play temp, so pics or it never happend.

wow so hostile, my kill to death ratio is pretty much the same on my stam sorc as my magicka one, 300 kills to 30 deaths last night. there is some crap in this game that seems to be out of balance and im just bringing it to attention again. death by instant RD does happen, maybe not to you because you can just sun shield and be fine. maybe its like the snipe health desync bug and the damage delays before you see the animation so you cannot react and just fall over dead. the people doing it dont know they are doing it because on their screen it looks like 3 seconds of RD but on the recieving end there is absolutely no damage taken, no animation, then there is an animation for less the a second and instant dead.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Soris

Ashanne wrote: »

darkflare and RD are just as good of a combo as snipe and poison arrow are, except RD is an execute..Dark flare is a very slow skill so you can start the RD 1 sec before it even lands...after it landed you are already at 30-40% hp...
In the gif:
The dark flare hits for 12.8k (players is at 35%) ,the first RD tick is of 3300 (player is at 19%, execute phase) the folowing RD tick is of 7.6k. He didn't get the 7.6k damge from the last tick cuz his remaining life was of 3.6k
so its not like what the sorc is stating 100%->0% (in 1 sec?) only with RD

Plus the player in the gif is v1 and the death recap tips say's the gear is heavily damaged

So he took 7k damage exactly from RD. Remaining 4k damage is wasted because he died in the middle of the second tick of RD. But death recap shows as he took full damage (11k) It is just a death recap bug since PTS. That's what I was pointing in previous page.

Second darkflare is wasted also. What a wastage of magicka

david31741

Soris wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I think one who goes into playing a stam sorc knows the deck is stacked against them but still; not buying the 1 second thing without proof and have been given nothing but hyperbole to lead me to believe anything.

This isn't me, i have my own example in my latest PvP video through the link on my sig.

https://gfycat.com/BelovedNeighboringAmbushbug

But this is a fine example nonetheless.

Deadly. Both crits. Totally legit combo. Reminds me Snipe+Ambush

See the damage of RD ticks. 3385 + 7636. One is outside of execute threshold, one is not which did x2 more damage than first tick.

But this is something I'm strictly against in this game. None of the combos should kill someone in a second.

Yes, I agree the damage is too high for all classes - this is not a templar/RD issue tho.

I use Dark Flare combo with RD all the time in a sneak attack or zerg off situation. The only time it takes people out like in the gif is when they are a stamina build with no spell resist. A player who is geared for pvp doesn't go down like in the gif. That guy would have been taken down by a geared sorc in just as many hits. Just like stamina builds wreck anyone under 10k phys resist in 2 hits - magicka builds wreck anyone under 10k spell resist.

Docmandu

The problem with radiant destruction is that every noob in a zerg spams it and it's a homing beacon for the rest of the zerg to target you, causing you to come into "execute" range rather fast.

In essence the spell in itself is no worse than all the other executes.. it's just that it's very obvious to see and makes "assisting" the beamer very easy.

tplink3r1

Alexander Powerkill wrote: »

Lol @Joy_Division show me another skill in the game that u can spam with no we a ing and pull 5k dps

I can get to 10~12k dps spamming jabs alone.

technohic

Ashanne wrote: »

darkflare and RD are just as good of a combo as snipe and poison arrow are, except RD is an execute..Dark flare is a very slow skill so you can start the RD 1 sec before it even lands...after it landed you are already at 30-40% hp...
In the gif:
The dark flare hits for 12.8k (players is at 35%) ,the first RD tick is of 3300 (player is at 19%, execute phase) the folowing RD tick is of 7.6k. He didn't get the 7.6k damge from the last tick cuz his remaining life was of 3.6k
so its not like what the sorc is stating 100%->0% (in 1 sec?) only with RD

Plus the player in the gif is v1 and the death recap tips say's the gear is heavily damaged

You can have an execute with poison arrow as well. Poison injection is no joke. I've actually played around with a stam build using snipe, poison injection and RD at full magicka. Pretty nasty once they hit low health. Still; that is a problem with a lot of the burst in this game not limited to any of these abilities alone or in combo.

Aside from that, your observation on the GIF is spot on. Sitting there watching the numbers popping up and notice they don't match the recap because of how the recap does a sum of the damage rather than break it down by tick, and it failed to draw RD.

AngersRevenge

Lyzaaa wrote: »

The problem is htat theres nearly no counter apart from cleansing or NB dark cloak. If you're in a 1vX scenerio, or hell, in a group scene, theres not much time to rush the spamming templars to prevent them from RDing you. By the time u can interrupt them they alrdy done 10k (per person ) AT LEAST. Multiple targets RDing you has no counter this way.

you can LoS it.

danno8

OdinForge wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I think one who goes into playing a stam sorc knows the deck is stacked against them but still; not buying the 1 second thing without proof and have been given nothing but hyperbole to lead me to believe anything.

This isn't me, i have my own example in my latest PvP video through the link on my sig.

https://gfycat.com/BelovedNeighboringAmbushbug

But this is a fine example nonetheless.

About the GIF video, the guy should really zoom out. If he did he would have seen the dark flare coming.
So yah the Dark Flare critted for 12k which brought his health down to 36%. He then got critted for 3.6k RD pulse which brought him down to around 3k health (around 17% health) which he then got hit for a 7k RD. Most people would not think a 7k RD at 17% health is too powerful.

If you look closely the guy casting the Dark Flare actually casts 2 of them before even starting to cast RD. There was plenty of warning if the maker of the video was paying attention. Unlike say Stealth snipe+ambush.

edit: I also looked at your video at the :50 seconds mark? I agree with you the TTk is way too low in this game. All damage should be lowered, all heals should be lowered, BUT you can not use an example of you being nailed on your horse to make the point

cozmon3c_ESO

AngersRevenge wrote: »

Lyzaaa wrote: »

The problem is htat theres nearly no counter apart from cleansing or NB dark cloak. If you're in a 1vX scenerio, or hell, in a group scene, theres not much time to rush the spamming templars to prevent them from RDing you. By the time u can interrupt them they alrdy done 10k (per person ) AT LEAST. Multiple targets RDing you has no counter this way.

Anyone can roll dodge and it breaks RD. simple enough. Every class in the game has a counter that is easy to use and can be spammed just as much as RD.

Not to mention you can LoS it.

um its not roll dodgeable

AngersRevenge

Templars get something to be a little more competitive in PvP and people scream nerf. The was a post with a poll the other day that asked "What is the worst class in PvP?". Overwhelmingly more than 50% of the responses was Templar being the worst. The other 50% was splint between the last 3 classes.

PainfulFAFA

Soul Assault, which is an ULTIMATE, i find very easy to break since all i have to do is 1 roll dodge away and it breaks.
Radiant Destruction on the other hand i find it not so easy to avoid and yet its an ability anybody can spam over and over again.....

OdinForge

danno8 wrote: »

OdinForge wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I think one who goes into playing a stam sorc knows the deck is stacked against them but still; not buying the 1 second thing without proof and have been given nothing but hyperbole to lead me to believe anything.

This isn't me, i have my own example in my latest PvP video through the link on my sig.

https://gfycat.com/BelovedNeighboringAmbushbug

But this is a fine example nonetheless.

About the GIF video, the guy should really zoom out. If he did he would have seen the dark flare coming.
So yah the Dark Flare critted for 12k which brought his health down to 36%. He then got critted for 3.6k RD pulse which brought him down to around 3k health (around 17% health) which he then got hit for a 7k RD. Most people would not think a 7k RD at 17% health is too powerful.

If you look closely the guy casting the Dark Flare actually casts 2 of them before even starting to cast RD. There was plenty of warning if the maker of the video was paying attention. Unlike say Stealth snipe+ambush.

edit: I also looked at your video at the :50 seconds mark? I agree with you the TTk is way too low in this game. All damage should be lowered, all heals should be lowered, BUT you can not use an example of you being nailed on your horse to make the point

The horse issue is separate, if i was off my horse in that 1v1 scenario i would have survived that. But now if I'm in a group of people and / or there is some chaos going on, this is just as bad as someone sitting in the back using snipe etc. I'm also fully geared for PvP, with investment into spell resistance (but I'm not wearing any nirn).

Part of the perceived problem with RD is how easy it is to cheese people. People dodge my killer's blade all day, no one is shooting killers blade off a keep wall for an instant kill.

Soris

cozmon3c_ESO wrote: »

AngersRevenge wrote: »

Lyzaaa wrote: »

The problem is htat theres nearly no counter apart from cleansing or NB dark cloak. If you're in a 1vX scenerio, or hell, in a group scene, theres not much time to rush the spamming templars to prevent them from RDing you. By the time u can interrupt them they alrdy done 10k (per person ) AT LEAST. Multiple targets RDing you has no counter this way.

Anyone can roll dodge and it breaks RD. simple enough. Every class in the game has a counter that is easy to use and can be spammed just as much as RD.

Not to mention you can LoS it.

um its not roll dodgeable

This is the only think you said truth today ^^

Armitas

Sypher wrote: »

The first tick of radiant isn't visible. By the time you see the beam you've already taken 2 ticks.

Just putting that out there.

^ this. The garbage kills you for 25k before the game even has time to animate the silly string. So freaking broken.

Draxys

My only problem with RD (other than the graphics not showing up for a tick or two, which is not the fault of the skill itself), is that it is an undodgable, channeled execute. I just don't understand how someone thought that was a good idea.

Awe

once got over 20k from RD (was low m def, doesn't matter)
checked damage log
from full HP (around 19k) damage was 3 times 3.5k crits, then 1x 6k crit, then 9k not crit
so ticks were 2k above 50% hp, 4k at little below 50%, and 9k at very low health

so don't let them hit you with low health, and it's not that scary

Imdrefan

Man throw Templars a freaking bone... This ability isn't balanced, add it to the list.

Perma dodge rolling builds that get destroyed by radiant destruction can suck it up like everyone else has been doing with the completely out of hand wrecking blow crit charging.