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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
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• ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – November 19, 9:00AM EST (14:00 UTC) - 6:00PM EST (23:00 UTC)
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https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/668861
Nirnhoned + Roll Spamming
-
Stikato✭✭✭✭✭OP = Healing ward, Nirnhoned, Stam / Magicka Regen, and Block in general
Pretty much the rest of the OP stuff is based on this.Mordimus - Stam Sorc0 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭OP = Healing ward, Nirnhoned, Stam / Magicka Regen, and Block in general
Pretty much the rest of the OP stuff is based on this.
On wich one is the lag based? Let's nerf it!
DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU0 -
Sanct16✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Said the guy that is permadodging with nirnhoned armor... let me give you a LOL.I'm a stamina nightblade and all my attacks are dodge able with the ability and the major buff, still I kill all perm rolling players and barely anyone is able to escape. One good placed stun and they die cause rolling is the only defense they have.
Also you're able to hit between those rolls, so use animation cancel to increase your chances.
Seriously, I got more problems with Shield stacking or perm blocking players, just cause shields stay active even if you're stunned and blocking people got too much defense to get bursted.
Dodge is strong, especially if you're only on range, but it got enough counters and is totally fine in my opinion.
»LOL«
- EU - Raid Leader of Banana Zerg Squad
AD | AR 50 | Sanct Fir'eheal | ex Mana DK @31.10.2015
EP | AR 50 | Sanctosaurus | Mana NB
AD | AR 44 | rekt ya | Mana NB
AD | AR 41 | Sanct Thunderstorm | Mana Sorc
EP | AR 36 | S'na'ct | Mana NB {NA}
AD | AR 29 | Captain Full Fist| Stam DK
AD | AR 29 | Sanct The Dark Phoenix| Stam Sorc
EP | AR 16 | Horny Sanct | Stam Warden
EP | AR 16 | Sánct Bánáná Sláyér | Mana DK
DC | AR 13 | ad worst faction eu | Stam Sorc
DC | AR 13 | Lagendary Sanct | Mana NB
>320.000.000 AP1 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭How on earth do you sprint perpetually if you have no stam regen while sprinting?
I have 2500 stam regen with my NB and I cannot dodge roll perpetually, I can roll maybe 13 times in combat, without using any skills, a little more if I use a potion. But I'll run out of stamina before I can chug the second potion.
Also Sorc survivability has little to do with Healing Ward, because Healing Ward only becomes very strong if you are near dead, and if you can get a Sorc to near death, then you can kill him as well. Sorc survivability is 90% dependant on having a strong Hardened Ward. Most times a sorc never has to use Healing Ward, because he never gets so low in health, at least not against the average player.
The only way to use Healing Ward without Hardened Ward, is letting the enemy beat you almost to death each time before you use the Healing Ward, this makes no sense. Healing Ward when your hp is full is like 1-2K points.
I use 5 piece skirmishers with it's 5 pieces of sprint reduction. I do the double take->dodge roll and sprint thing all the time and I can do it forever. It nearly keeps up with max speed mounts. It's basically right out of Sypher's nightblade stamina video, and it works just as he advertised it would. Obviously I use tripots on cooldown, but I don't even have nearly as much stamina regen as I could.
Sorc surviveability is due to healing ward and how hardened ward can be used with it. Yes non sorcs have to rely on other means to survive with it, but los and other shields or invis work fine, probably not as well as a hardened ward and bolt escape though.
In some cases, yes you don't even have to use healing ward. Truth be told, in many of those "cases" I probably don't even need hardened ward because the target just doesn't have enough damage to be a threat nor the defenses to survive long enough to be a threat if they did.
As for the usage of healing ward... it would probably work just fine on a stamina build where you go into your dodge roll routine waiting for it to proc it's heal. Might have to give up bow though haha.1 -
Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Said the guy that is permadodging with nirnhoned armor... let me give you a LOL.I'm a stamina nightblade and all my attacks are dodge able with the ability and the major buff, still I kill all perm rolling players and barely anyone is able to escape. One good placed stun and they die cause rolling is the only defense they have.
Also you're able to hit between those rolls, so use animation cancel to increase your chances.
Seriously, I got more problems with Shield stacking or perm blocking players, just cause shields stay active even if you're stunned and blocking people got too much defense to get bursted.
Dodge is strong, especially if you're only on range, but it got enough counters and is totally fine in my opinion.
»LOL«
Perm- dodge, shield, block, cloak, heal, streak, beam, talons, fear
We all spam something, what does it matter?
Nirn will get his nerf, wait for it.
Yes, Nirn grants me some nice defense against magicka users, but doesn´t change anything that you get as much defense using shields, at least in a 1v1, after that shields are mostly crap, right. You can´t balance them for that unfortunatly otherwise zos would have done something i think.
Other Stamina Builds are so easy to kill compared to most of the magicka builds, that´s what i mean.
As Magicka Build you only have a "small" Problem thanks to Nirnhoned, but it get nerfed in the future anyway.
It will increase your dmg against most of the players out there, which is a good thing for you, isn´t it?
They will start balancing everything soon anyway, i wouldn´t bother with making such threads here since zenimax DOESNT care.Edited by Soulac on 16 May 2015 07:44R.I.P Dawnbreaker / Auriel´s Bow
Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 502 -
Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.R.I.P Dawnbreaker / Auriel´s Bow
Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -0 -
Saft✭✭✭Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.
There is like minimal time, and with skills using traveling distance or animation or channeled, erm lets just put it dodge rollers are almost immune to all type of damage apart from a few skills. Like Whip and RD not sure if more? We need more tools to handle with dodge rolls imo. More that does damage.
0 -
Saft✭✭✭Especially dodge rolling with 2h + momentum heal and them bow users taking advantage of bow dodge passive + even rapid manevours are very very very powerful.
0 -
Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.
There is like minimal time, and with skills using traveling distance or animation or channeled, erm lets just put it dodge rollers are almost immune to all type of damage apart from a few skills. Like Whip and RD not sure if more? We need more tools to handle with dodge rolls imo. More that does damage.
- Curse
- Jesusbeam
- Whip
- Teleport Strike
- Petrify / Fear
- Heavy Lightning / Resto Attack
- Concealed Weapon
- Soul Strike
- Templar Healdebuff
- Caltrops
- any other ground target aoe (Talons, VoB, etc.)
- Meteor
- ALL dodgeable Skills if correctly TIMED
plenty of tools to handle with dodge.
There are so many ways to handle with dodge, pls stop whining about it.
R.I.P Dawnbreaker / Auriel´s Bow
Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -1 -
Saft✭✭✭Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.
There is like minimal time, and with skills using traveling distance or animation or channeled, erm lets just put it dodge rollers are almost immune to all type of damage apart from a few skills. Like Whip and RD not sure if more? We need more tools to handle with dodge rolls imo. More that does damage.
- Curse
- Jesusbeam
- Whip
- Teleport Strike
- Petrify / Fear
- Heavy Lightning / Resto Attack
- Concealed Weapon
- Soul Strike
- Templar Healdebuff
- Caltrops
- any other ground target aoe (Talons, VoB, etc.)
- Meteor
- ALL dodgeable Skills if correctly TIMED
plenty of tools to handle with dodge.
There are so many ways to handle with dodge, pls stop whining about it.
And still, with all this counters, dodge rollers is a problem. Tho trying to put ground effects on dodge roller is stupid suggestion. Dodge bow + rapid maneuver is stupidly OP. Especially as Nightblade as you can toss in cloak that render invis and cure.
1 -
Vis✭✭✭✭✭
✭Think about how annoying it is to kill someone roll tanking.
Think of all the available counters to a roll spammer.
Now think how more and more of them are beginning to run full stamina dps while maintaining capped spell resistance.
Enough said.
Is this honest, or trolling? I can't tell. Certain skills hit past roll. Try them!
This is a learn to read issue. @Cthalion You failed to grasp the issue: most roll counters are magicka based and thus a roller with Nirnhoned becomes a super tank.
Rolling is not attacking, or doing anything useful, besides staying alive, often just briefly. I really can't understand the pathetic whining about this. First of all the only people who "perma roll" are bosmer with their broken racial, and even then to do so they sacrifice damage. Other races don't have "perma roll", or even close. Are you a sorc? You sound like one. OMG a guy rolled a few times, but I can BE 100 times. LOL.
I mean, FFS it really, really is a L2P issue in this case if you are so terrorized by dodge roll.
Whoops, looks like you need to play more. Other races can and do perma-roll without any problems. These perma-rollers also have some of the best burst dps in the game and unlike shield stackers who devote skill slots to shields, these perma-rolling nirnhoned tanks can stop and three shot you in between rolls.
BE can only cancel out a fraction of the dps a perma-roller can (imagine if BE made all sorcs immune to all stamina damage) and is ten times easier to kill. Go out and pvp some more. You sound like you lack the experience to know what you're talking about.Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.
There is like minimal time, and with skills using traveling distance or animation or channeled, erm lets just put it dodge rollers are almost immune to all type of damage apart from a few skills. Like Whip and RD not sure if more? We need more tools to handle with dodge rolls imo. More that does damage.
- Curse (Magicka Damage)
- Jesus Beam (Magicka Damage)
- Whip (Magicka Damage)
- Teleport Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Petrify / Fear (Magicka Damage)
- Heavy Lightning / Resto Attack (Magicka Damage)
- Concealed Weapon (Magicka Damage)
- Soul Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Templar Healdbuff (Magicka Damage)
- Caltrop (Laughable Damage)
- any other ground target aoe (Talons, VoB, etc.) (Almost All Magicka Damage)
- Meteor (Magicka Damage)
- ALL dodgeable Skills if correctly Timed (Hahahahaha)
plenty of tools to handle with dodge.
There are so many ways to handle with dodge, pls stop whining about it.
Fixed that for you.
Question, do you even bother reading the subject before you post? Let me help you out:
Nirnhoned + Roll Spammingv14 Sorc Vae Exillis
v14 DK Costs
v14 NB 'Vis
v14 Temp Fiat Lux2 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭Think about how annoying it is to kill someone roll tanking.
Think of all the available counters to a roll spammer.
Now think how more and more of them are beginning to run full stamina dps while maintaining capped spell resistance.
Enough said.
Is this honest, or trolling? I can't tell. Certain skills hit past roll. Try them!
This is a learn to read issue. @Cthalion You failed to grasp the issue: most roll counters are magicka based and thus a roller with Nirnhoned becomes a super tank.
Rolling is not attacking, or doing anything useful, besides staying alive, often just briefly. I really can't understand the pathetic whining about this. First of all the only people who "perma roll" are bosmer with their broken racial, and even then to do so they sacrifice damage. Other races don't have "perma roll", or even close. Are you a sorc? You sound like one. OMG a guy rolled a few times, but I can BE 100 times. LOL.
I mean, FFS it really, really is a L2P issue in this case if you are so terrorized by dodge roll.
Whoops, looks like you need to play more. Other races can and do perma-roll without any problems. These perma-rollers also have some of the best burst dps in the game and unlike shield stackers who devote skill slots to shields, these perma-rolling nirnhoned tanks can stop and three shot you in between rolls.
BE can only cancel out a fraction of the dps a perma-roller can (imagine if BE made all sorcs immune to all stamina damage) and is ten times easier to kill. Go out and pvp some more. You sound like you lack the experience to know what you're talking about.Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.
There is like minimal time, and with skills using traveling distance or animation or channeled, erm lets just put it dodge rollers are almost immune to all type of damage apart from a few skills. Like Whip and RD not sure if more? We need more tools to handle with dodge rolls imo. More that does damage.
- Curse (Magicka Damage)
- Jesus Beam (Magicka Damage)
- Whip (Magicka Damage)
- Teleport Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Petrify / Fear (Magicka Damage)
- Heavy Lightning / Resto Attack (Magicka Damage)
- Concealed Weapon (Magicka Damage)
- Soul Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Templar Healdbuff (Magicka Damage)
- Caltrop (Laughable Damage)
- any other ground target aoe (Talons, VoB, etc.) (Almost All Magicka Damage)
- Meteor (Magicka Damage)
- ALL dodgeable Skills if correctly Timed (Hahahahaha)
plenty of tools to handle with dodge.
There are so many ways to handle with dodge, pls stop whining about it.
Fixed that for you.
Question, do you even bother reading the subject before you post? Let me help you out:
Nirnhoned + Roll Spamming
obviously not
Edited by Tankqull on 16 May 2015 15:53spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"2 -
Ancile✭✭✭Think about how annoying it is to kill someone roll tanking.
Think of all the available counters to a roll spammer.
Now think how more and more of them are beginning to run full stamina dps while maintaining capped spell resistance.
Enough said.
Is this honest, or trolling? I can't tell. Certain skills hit past roll. Try them!
This is a learn to read issue. @Cthalion You failed to grasp the issue: most roll counters are magicka based and thus a roller with Nirnhoned becomes a super tank.
Rolling is not attacking, or doing anything useful, besides staying alive, often just briefly. I really can't understand the pathetic whining about this. First of all the only people who "perma roll" are bosmer with their broken racial, and even then to do so they sacrifice damage. Other races don't have "perma roll", or even close. Are you a sorc? You sound like one. OMG a guy rolled a few times, but I can BE 100 times. LOL.
I mean, FFS it really, really is a L2P issue in this case if you are so terrorized by dodge roll.
Whoops, looks like you need to play more. Other races can and do perma-roll without any problems. These perma-rollers also have some of the best burst dps in the game and unlike shield stackers who devote skill slots to shields, these perma-rolling nirnhoned tanks can stop and three shot you in between rolls.
BE can only cancel out a fraction of the dps a perma-roller can (imagine if BE made all sorcs immune to all stamina damage) and is ten times easier to kill. Go out and pvp some more. You sound like you lack the experience to know what you're talking about.Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.
There is like minimal time, and with skills using traveling distance or animation or channeled, erm lets just put it dodge rollers are almost immune to all type of damage apart from a few skills. Like Whip and RD not sure if more? We need more tools to handle with dodge rolls imo. More that does damage.
- Curse (Magicka Damage)
- Jesus Beam (Magicka Damage)
- Whip (Magicka Damage)
- Teleport Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Petrify / Fear (Magicka Damage)
- Heavy Lightning / Resto Attack (Magicka Damage)
- Concealed Weapon (Magicka Damage)
- Soul Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Templar Healdbuff (Magicka Damage)
- Caltrop (Laughable Damage)
- any other ground target aoe (Talons, VoB, etc.) (Almost All Magicka Damage)
- Meteor (Magicka Damage)
- ALL dodgeable Skills if correctly Timed (Hahahahaha)
plenty of tools to handle with dodge.
There are so many ways to handle with dodge, pls stop whining about it.
Fixed that for you.
Question, do you even bother reading the subject before you post? Let me help you out:
Nirnhoned + Roll Spamming
Yeah, it seems as though he missed the obvious.DK FOR LIFE1 -
Soulac✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Think about how annoying it is to kill someone roll tanking.
Think of all the available counters to a roll spammer.
Now think how more and more of them are beginning to run full stamina dps while maintaining capped spell resistance.
Enough said.
Is this honest, or trolling? I can't tell. Certain skills hit past roll. Try them!
This is a learn to read issue. @Cthalion You failed to grasp the issue: most roll counters are magicka based and thus a roller with Nirnhoned becomes a super tank.
Rolling is not attacking, or doing anything useful, besides staying alive, often just briefly. I really can't understand the pathetic whining about this. First of all the only people who "perma roll" are bosmer with their broken racial, and even then to do so they sacrifice damage. Other races don't have "perma roll", or even close. Are you a sorc? You sound like one. OMG a guy rolled a few times, but I can BE 100 times. LOL.
I mean, FFS it really, really is a L2P issue in this case if you are so terrorized by dodge roll.
Whoops, looks like you need to play more. Other races can and do perma-roll without any problems. These perma-rollers also have some of the best burst dps in the game and unlike shield stackers who devote skill slots to shields, these perma-rolling nirnhoned tanks can stop and three shot you in between rolls.
BE can only cancel out a fraction of the dps a perma-roller can (imagine if BE made all sorcs immune to all stamina damage) and is ten times easier to kill. Go out and pvp some more. You sound like you lack the experience to know what you're talking about.Well soulac to be fair - stamina builds are easy to kill for a NB because when you fear someone who´s dodgerolling they get a HUUUGE delay before they are able to to cc break.
I don´t have to explain that this means certain death against NB stam burst in most of the cases.
Or with all other stuns.
No, there is a time in which you're able to hit your enemy even if he's dodging, no fear needed.
There is like minimal time, and with skills using traveling distance or animation or channeled, erm lets just put it dodge rollers are almost immune to all type of damage apart from a few skills. Like Whip and RD not sure if more? We need more tools to handle with dodge rolls imo. More that does damage.
- Curse (Magicka Damage)
- Jesus Beam (Magicka Damage)
- Whip (Magicka Damage)
- Teleport Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Petrify / Fear (Magicka Damage)
- Heavy Lightning / Resto Attack (Magicka Damage)
- Concealed Weapon (Magicka Damage)
- Soul Strike (Magicka Damage)
- Templar Healdbuff (Magicka Damage)
- Caltrop (Laughable Damage)
- any other ground target aoe (Talons, VoB, etc.) (Almost All Magicka Damage)
- Meteor (Magicka Damage)
- ALL dodgeable Skills if correctly Timed (Hahahahaha)
plenty of tools to handle with dodge.
There are so many ways to handle with dodge, pls stop whining about it.
Fixed that for you.
Question, do you even bother reading the subject before you post? Let me help you out:
Nirnhoned + Roll Spamming
Nirn get nerfed in the future, anddodge is counterable by magicka skills.
Where is your problem then? You ignore the defense mechanic of a stamina user and without nirn you should do some good dmg, or not?
If Nirn is nerfed what´s the problem? That you don´t want to use these skills? Please tell me.
They already confirmed that nirn gets nerfed.
Im Stamina User, my dmg gets dodged but not mitigated so much and for me it´s fine against other Stamina User
Soon you´re a Magicka User, using skills which are NOT dodgeable and are probably not mitigated so much either.
Just wait for the Nirn nerf.
Edited by Soulac on 16 May 2015 16:15R.I.P Dawnbreaker / Auriel´s Bow
Member of the Arena Guild and the overpowered Banana Squad.
Nathaerizh aka Cat - Nightblade V16 - EU
- Meow -0 -
Vanzen✭✭✭✭✭Add rally and vigor, and some people are just unkillable now. We were ten trying to kill a "roller", we couldnt even put a dent in his health.
Something has to be done. Some issues have at least to be acknowleged.1 -
Varicite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Add rally and vigor, and some people are just unkillable now. We were ten trying to kill a "roller", we couldnt even put a dent in his health.
Something has to be done. Some issues have at least to be acknowleged.
All I read here is that TEN people did not slot a single move that goes through roll dodge, of which every single class has at least one.0 -
Vanzen✭✭✭✭✭Add rally and vigor, and some people are just unkillable now. We were ten trying to kill a "roller", we couldnt even put a dent in his health.
Something has to be done. Some issues have at least to be acknowleged.
All I read here is that TEN people did not slot a single move that goes through roll dodge, of which every single class has at least one.
Oh but we did, thats the problem. Am a DK I spammed invasion + whip. Others damaged him as well. He didnt give a damn, kept rolling and healing.
Nirnoned + infnitedodge+rally+Vigor....
Edited by Vanzen on 17 May 2015 21:031 -
Varicite✭✭✭✭✭
✭Add rally and vigor, and some people are just unkillable now. We were ten trying to kill a "roller", we couldnt even put a dent in his health.
Something has to be done. Some issues have at least to be acknowleged.
All I read here is that TEN people did not slot a single move that goes through roll dodge, of which every single class has at least one.
Oh but we did, thats the problem. Am a DK I spammed invasion + whip. Others damaged him as well. He didnt give a damn, kept rolling and healing.
Nirnoned + infnitedodge+rally+Vigor....
Well, I completely agree that Nirnhoned needs a fix.0 -
Just to toss around the minds of everyone being so sure of themselves, I'm gonna post this video.
I'm still very new to the game, so I know nothing. What I do know is that fotm builds often make people overlook the things that also works but are underused.0 -
trimsic_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Nirn and dodge roll are the last reason why we're not falling into a full world of magicka in ESO. With 4 pieces of nirn on my stamina build and 30k resist spell i'm still hit for 20k+ dmg by radiant destruction, or for 8k+ by a crystal fragment.
I currently have no more fun playing my DK with a medium armor in small scale combat: magicka skills still deal too much damage and offer too many amazing support abilities, and stamina NB are out of control.
When I started ESO more than one year ago, I wanted to play a melee DPS character and I chose a DK to have some support skills. The "play as you want" promise of ZOS encouraged me in that direction, but I quickly realized that only magicka builds were viable at that time, and it's still the case today, at least for a DK. Only NBs can perform very well with a stamina build.
So I now play a tank build, because this is the only viable build. I still have a stamina build, because I refuse to be forced to play a magicka build despite the fact that a magicka tank build is much better than a stamina one for a DK. This is not my play style, nor what I wanted to play when I started ESO but what should I do? Quit the game? Reroll?
Nerfing the nirn trait without nerfing magicka builds would drive us back to where we were one year ago, i.e. in a game where the only choice would be to play a magicka build, once again. It would be a terrible failure for the game.0 -
Zsymon✭✭✭✭If you don't have Nirnhoned, magicka builds crush you in seconds, if not instantly in one combo shot. There is just no chance as a stamina build, the damage is insane and the healing and shields of magicka builds are far too powerful to out-damage them.
So is Nirnhoned too strong now? I don't know, I wouldn't completely nerf it the way they nerfed Impenetrable though, else the pendulum swings right back out of balance towards magicka builds. Some equilibrium needs to be found, I hope they test and experiment with this on PTS before they rush in some change that just makes things worse.
They also need to improve non-NB stamina builds before nerfing Nirnhoned. Improve Biting Jabs, make it uninterruptible and without the free CC-immunity, give Sorcerers more and better stamina morphs, maybe a stamina Clannfear/Twilight for hunter types, and turn Flame Lash into a stamina morph, that shoulda been done in 1.6. Right now stamina DKs are garbage, just like stamina Sorcs and Templars.
Stamina builds right now are still very weak compared to magicka builds, only NBs can pull a stamina build off because of stamina recovery and synergy. If any other class tries to go stamina, they hit a rock of out-of-stamina, easily avoidable damage and a total lack of defense. Most people don't have Vigor, many people PvP for months in the weekends and still don't have it. Only game addicts with no job or people who've been playing the same character since launch, get to use Vigor. It is ridiculous how often Vigor gets thrown around here in arguments as if anyone automatically gets it. 99% of people don't have Vigor and won't get it for months.Edited by Zsymon on 18 May 2015 08:120 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭If you don't have Nirnhoned, magicka builds crush you in seconds, if not instantly in one combo shot. There is just no chance as a stamina build, the damage is insane and the healing and shields of magicka builds are far too powerful to out-damage them.
So is Nirnhoned too strong now? I don't know, I wouldn't completely nerf it the way they nerfed Impenetrable though, else the pendulum swings right back out of balance towards magicka builds. Some equilibrium needs to be found, I hope they test and experiment with this on PTS before they rush in some change that just makes things worse.
They also need to improve non-NB stamina builds before nerfing Nirnhoned. Improve Biting Jabs, make it uninterruptible and without the free CC-immunity, give Sorcerers more and better stamina morphs, maybe a stamina Clannfear/Twilight for hunter types, and turn Flame Lash into a stamina morph, that shoulda been done in 1.6. Right now stamina DKs are garbage, just like stamina Sorcs and Templars.
Stamina builds right now are still very weak compared to magicka builds, only NBs can pull a stamina build off because of stamina recovery and synergy. If any other class tries to go stamina, they hit a rock of out-of-stamina, easily avoidable damage and a total lack of defense. Most people don't have Vigor, many people PvP for months in the weekends and still don't have it. Only game addicts with no job or people who've been playing the same character since launch, get to use Vigor. It is ridiculous how often Vigor gets thrown around here in arguments as if anyone automatically gets it. 99% of people don't have Vigor and won't get it for months.
Stamina DKs and stamina Templars are at least as powerful as their magicka couterparts. Nirnhoned needs to be nerfed/fixed/adjusted rather sooner than later. I just started playing my Sorc as stamina the first time since 1.6 - it's hands down the weakest setup right now because it has nothing special to offer anymore, but stamina can deal a lot more damage than magicka, and that's because of a lot of reasons, not just nirnhoned. Champion passives, skills like Harness Magicka/Defensive Stance/Ball of Lightning, or the pretty random itemization come in mind. And I refuse to use nirnhoned armor.
Stamina is not in a weak spot compared to magicka, rather the other way around.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU1 -
Zsymon✭✭✭✭Stamina DKs and stamina Templars are at least as powerful as their magicka couterparts.
Templars don't have a single viable class skill to support a stamina build in PvP. If they're viable in any way it'll be purely because of weapon skills, and you don't need to be a Templar if none of your class skills are useful in any way. The only skill Templars have that is remotely useful in PvP is Purifying Ritual, but any class can use Purge. Templars are even in a worse place than Sorcs when it comes to stamina builds, because at least Sorcs have a decent method of getting Major Resolve/Ward. Casting Rune Focus every 8 seconds just to get those buffs is a major and unacceptable interruption in PvP. DKs get Fossilize, which makes a powerful combination with Wrecking Blow in case of inexperience or lag.Edited by Zsymon on 18 May 2015 20:220 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Stamina DKs and stamina Templars are at least as powerful as their magicka couterparts.
Templars don't have a single viable class skill to support a stamina build in PvP. If they're viable in any way it'll be purely because of weapon skills, and you don't need to be a Templar if none of your class skills are useful in any way. The only skill Templars have that is remotely useful in PvP is Purifying Ritual, but any class can use Purge. Templars are even in a worse place than Sorcs when it comes to stamina builds, because at least Sorcs have a decent method of getting Major Resolve/Ward. Casting Rune Focus every 8 seconds just to get those buffs is a major and unacceptable interruption in PvP. DKs get Fossilize, which makes a powerful combination with Wrecking Blow in case of inexperience or lag.
That's BS.
Blazing Shield > Hardened Ward on a stamina build.
Rune Focus is not an unacceptible interruption because it costs nearly nothing and gives you a lot of magicka back.
Not everyone will use Biting Jabs, but they're not bad either.
Repentance is awesome.
Purifying ritual.
Binding Spear.
Please tell me how Sorc is in a better place for stamina builds. Seriously, that simply doesn't make any sense.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU2 -
trimsic_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Stamina DKs and stamina Templars are at least as powerful as their magicka couterparts.
Templars don't have a single viable class skill to support a stamina build in PvP. If they're viable in any way it'll be purely because of weapon skills, and you don't need to be a Templar if none of your class skills are useful in any way. The only skill Templars have that is remotely useful in PvP is Purifying Ritual, but any class can use Purge. Templars are even in a worse place than Sorcs when it comes to stamina builds, because at least Sorcs have a decent method of getting Major Resolve/Ward. Casting Rune Focus every 8 seconds just to get those buffs is a major and unacceptable interruption in PvP. DKs get Fossilize, which makes a powerful combination with Wrecking Blow in case of inexperience or lag.
That's BS.
Blazing Shield > Hardened Ward on a stamina build.
Rune Focus is not an unacceptible interruption because it costs nearly nothing and gives you a lot of magicka back.
Not everyone will use Biting Jabs, but they're not bad either.
Repentance is awesome.
Purifying ritual.
Binding Spear.
Please tell me how Sorc is in a better place for stamina builds. Seriously, that simply doesn't make any sense.
I agree with you on one point: stamina builds do not work for a sorc. But this is also true for templars: if you ever find one, you can manage him/ her quite easily.
I know two versions of the stamina DK in small scale combat: one is a DPS with a bow, and one is a tank. The DPS build is fun to play, but against a NB or a sorc who knows how to play his/her class, you're dead meat. The tanky build is very solid, even against NB and sorcs, but the magicka versions of the tank build are much more viable.
In large scale combat, stamina builds are viable owing to the tornado PBAOE skill.
No seriously, despite all their efforts, ZOS did not really manage to balance the game yet and there are still out there in Cyrodiil more magicka builds than stamina builds. At least this is what I can see when I look at my death recap window or when I talk to the people of my alliance. The only class who performs well with a stamina build is the NB. Having more stamina versions of existing class skills would surely help in this domain. Ideally, there should be one stamina morph and one magicka morph of every class skill.
I can understand that the nirn trait may need a nerf, but this cannot be done without balancing the magicka builds at the same time.Edited by trimsic_ESO on 19 May 2015 06:070
