Detection Potions

PeggymoeXD

Holy fried chicken smothered in lovely potatoes of fluffiness, why have I never used these up until now.

Seriously, these things change a NB ganker's playstyle from "invisible glass cannon" to "spamming cloak panic mode"

Kypho

PeggymoeXD wrote: »

Holy fried chicken smothered in lovely potatoes of fluffiness, why have I never used these up until now.

Seriously, these things change a NB ganker's playstyle from "invisible glass cannon" to "spamming cloak panic mode"

ZoS always hated NB. They are big fail, and they fail after every patch it seems

SurprisedFour91

Peggy OP

Sharee

I wouldn't mind a potion that prevents my cloak from working for 40 seconds if there were potions that would prevent a sorc from bolt escaping for 40 seconds, potion to prevent a DK from using GDB for 40 seconds... you get the idea.

Bahalul

It's wonderful. I make sure I have at least 2 stacks of detect pots before I step my foot into Cyrodiil. It shuts down all those NB (Nightbows) [snip] who scapper like chickens spamming cloak and thinking "WTF MY CLOAK AINT WORKING ZOS FIX CLOAK".

Feels good.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]

Bahalul

Sharee wrote: »

I wouldn't mind a potion that prevents my cloak from working for 40 seconds if there were potions that would prevent a sorc from bolt escaping for 40 seconds, potion to prevent a DK from using GDB for 40 seconds... you get the idea.

If you notice someone popping detect pot then stop spamming cloak and fight back? The range of detect pot isn't that great (I literally have to hug the NB to be able to see him). Remember when someone pops a detect pot he can't use any other pot for 1min so your best choice is to either cast rapid maneuver and cloak again to put a distance between you and the chaser, or just finish him off quick.

Dudis

Or you can use Shadow Image to leave a ghost that you can then teleport back to and escape with cloak while out of detection range if you have to.

PeggymoeXD

Of course there are ways to counter them, and I have still been ganked by the players who quickly adapt to the fact that I have them, I'm just saying the majority of the players who just disappear like cowards are quickly being weeded out lol

Sharee

Bahalul wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

I wouldn't mind a potion that prevents my cloak from working for 40 seconds if there were potions that would prevent a sorc from bolt escaping for 40 seconds, potion to prevent a DK from using GDB for 40 seconds... you get the idea.

If you notice someone popping detect pot then stop spamming cloak and fight back?

If i could fight back, i would not be spamming cloak in the firstplace.

Anyway, that's besides the point. The point was, if the nightblade survival tool is so easily negated by a potion, then the other classes' survival tools should be as well. (Or rather, if one can not be negated, then neither should be the others.)

Catching a nightblade spamming cloak should be at least as tough as catching a sorcerer spamming bolt escape. Neither should be impossible - but then neither should be trivial. Right now, catching a NB is trivial, and i am saying this as a DK who cackles with glee when he sees a NB use cloak, because i know the NB just wasted magicka for nothing.

ScruffyWhiskers

PeggymoeXD wrote: »

I'm just saying the majority of the players who just disappear like cowards are quickly being weeded out lol

You keep on expressing this sentiment that all classes should fight out in the open mano a mano like it was some type of natural law or divine code. That may be your preferred style but a lot of people like to play differently. I like to sneak around, get in over my head and then see if I can get out alive. I hate players who bounce around all the time like pogo sticks out in the open. But you know what, they have every right to play that way and if ZoS want's to give them some bouncing passives to improve that then good on them.

Varicite

I'm still waiting for my "instantly nullifies all damage shields in a 30m radius for 30 seconds" potion.

Get on it, ZOS. After all, it's completely fine that you've designed a class whose main (read: ONLY) line of defense is countered by potions and a Mage's Guild ability that every single player has access to on the cheap.

If NBs don't need damage shields, neither does anybody else, right? Right?

Bahalul

Sharee wrote: »

Bahalul wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

I wouldn't mind a potion that prevents my cloak from working for 40 seconds if there were potions that would prevent a sorc from bolt escaping for 40 seconds, potion to prevent a DK from using GDB for 40 seconds... you get the idea.

If you notice someone popping detect pot then stop spamming cloak and fight back?

If i could fight back, i would not be spamming cloak in the firstplace.

Anyway, that's besides the point. The point was, if the nightblade survival tool is so easily negated by a potion, then the other classes' survival tools should be as well. (Or rather, if one can not be negated, then neither should be the others.)

Catching a nightblade spamming cloak should be at least as tough as catching a sorcerer spamming bolt escape. Neither should be impossible - but then neither should be trivial. Right now, catching a NB is trivial, and i am saying this as a DK who cackles with glee when he sees a NB use cloak, because i know the NB just wasted magicka for nothing.

IDK about you but catching a NB is harder for me than a sorc. Maybe it has to do with me being a sorc and i can chase my own kind pretty fine.

Even with both my magelight and detect pot on i still have to hug the NB to see him. There's a passive in medium armor that reduces detect area. So there's that i have to deal with. Half the time my attacks are dodged even when the NB is popped out of stealth (he didn't roll dodge) so what's up with that eh?

I'm not one to tell you how to play your class but if you can't function out of your cloak (Snipetard mentality right here!) maybe you should reconsider your playstyle.

Also let's leave the sorc discussion for the other 19365171981 threads already in existence.

TheBull

They are out of control. I expect to see them adjusted soon.

Teargrants

Sharee wrote: »

If i could fight back, i would not be spamming cloak in the firstplace.

Are you one of the ones that keeps popping cloak in my detect pot, trying to walk away while I slowly curse you to death?

Xsorus

Its weird...I have a nightblade..so i know that detect pots will kill NBs fairly quick..

but at the same time..I know if they were removed or nerfed badly, Nightblades would be insanely stupid like Sorcs are right now for getting away from fights.

Basically if they removed detect pots right now..You'd never kill my Nightblade.

TheBull

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Its weird...I have a nightblade..so i know that detect pots will kill NBs fairly quick..

but at the same time..I know if they were removed or nerfed badly, Nightblades would be insanely stupid like Sorcs are right now for getting away from fights.

Basically if they removed detect pots right now..You'd never kill my Nightblade.

You're right. I understand why they are there. 20 meters 40 secs is a bit over the top though. As a fellow NB, I pop them more than health pots.. That should tell you something...

PeggymoeXD

Catching a nightblade spamming cloak should be at least as tough as catching a sorcerer spamming bolt escape.

actually, I've caught sorcs using bolt escape with speed potions. But the investment is not as fulfilling as you would think since most sorcs are just luring you to a horrible death.

Varicite

Bahalul wrote: »

Half the time my attacks are dodged even when the NB is popped out of stealth (he didn't roll dodge) so what's up with that eh?

That is most likely from the Blur effect (20% dodge) that NBs get, though every class has access to this exact same buff through the medium armor active, Evasion.

PeggymoeXD

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Its weird...I have a nightblade..so i know that detect pots will kill NBs fairly quick..

but at the same time..I know if they were removed or nerfed badly, Nightblades would be insanely stupid like Sorcs are right now for getting away from fights.

Basically if they removed detect pots right now..You'd never kill my Nightblade.

So I'm guessing that you are a "stealth, concealed weapon, [insert some type of spam here], stealth, repeat. build?

As a stamina DK, I just don't mess with certain builds. If a sorc is luring me to his mines, I will literally stand a decent distance from him and do nothing until he leaves them or they disappear. I don't chase unless I'm certain they're just some rando who I can kill. I don't mess with NB's who stealth around me without detect pots. If I catch him out of stealth, I'll fossilize that turd and get out of there. Stamina is my means of survival. If I'm out of it, I'm dead. A player should have the balls to face me head on if they're going to pick a fight. If they're going to camp mines, disappear, or stall me until their reinforcements arrive, IM OUT.

Sharee

Teargrants wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

If i could fight back, i would not be spamming cloak in the firstplace.

Are you one of the ones that keeps popping cloak in my detect pot, trying to walk away while I slowly curse you to death?

Nope, curses do not even budge my healthbar (playing a DK tank alt with 2300 health regen )

Teargrants

Varicite wrote: »

Bahalul wrote: »

Half the time my attacks are dodged even when the NB is popped out of stealth (he didn't roll dodge) so what's up with that eh?

That is most likely from the Blur effect (20% dodge) that NBs get, though every class has access to this exact same buff through the medium armor active, Evasion.

Um, on activation cloak force misses incoming attacks, even if they can't enter stealth due to detect. Chaining cloak every couple seconds results in most all single target skills missing said player.

Skilled NBs stack that mechanic with dodge roll & elude.

Varicite

Teargrants wrote: »

Varicite wrote: »

Bahalul wrote: »

Half the time my attacks are dodged even when the NB is popped out of stealth (he didn't roll dodge) so what's up with that eh?

That is most likely from the Blur effect (20% dodge) that NBs get, though every class has access to this exact same buff through the medium armor active, Evasion.

Um, on activation cloak force misses incoming attacks, even if they can't enter stealth due to detect. Chaining cloak every couple seconds results in most all single target skills missing said player.

Skilled NBs stack that mechanic with dodge roll & elude.

What he was describing sounded more like the dodge effect itself to me. But yes, Cloak does have this effect on many single-target attacks.

When it works.

/shrug

RinaldoGandolphi

I don't even have a NB but its BS a detect pot can see Cloak/ invis

I'm all about detect pots seeing stealthers, but only Magelight should be able to see cloak or invis

And the 40 meter range and duration is a touch much, I don't even play a stealth style, but that's just way over the top.

Bahalul

Varicite wrote: »

Bahalul wrote: »

Half the time my attacks are dodged even when the NB is popped out of stealth (he didn't roll dodge) so what's up with that eh?

That is most likely from the Blur effect (20% dodge) that NBs get, though every class has access to this exact same buff through the medium armor active, Evasion.

Ahh that might be it then, although I swear it's more than 20%! I really doubt evasion is being used though, considering the fact that these NBs wouldn't have half the brain to figure out what skills to use beside cloak and snipe, and do people really slot evasion on their bar? Isn't it more expensive than just roll dodging?

Varicite

Bahalul wrote: »

Varicite wrote: »

Bahalul wrote: »

Half the time my attacks are dodged even when the NB is popped out of stealth (he didn't roll dodge) so what's up with that eh?

That is most likely from the Blur effect (20% dodge) that NBs get, though every class has access to this exact same buff through the medium armor active, Evasion.

Ahh that might be it then, although I swear it's more than 20%! I really doubt evasion is being used though, considering the fact that these NBs wouldn't have half the brain to figure out what skills to use beside cloak and snipe, and do people really slot evasion on their bar? Isn't it more expensive than just roll dodging?

I use Evasion on a few of my characters, it's a nice buff that lasts a long time.

And if you really do think these NBs are that brain-dead, it might be what @Teargrants mentioned, the initial cast of Cloak is supposed to cause single target abilities to miss.

So if they are spamming it, even if you have popped them out of stealth, this could be why your attacks are missing.

The Blur effect is pretty easy to spot, as it turns the NB red and shimmery w/ a faint red bubble around them.

deepseamk20b14_ESO

It has nothing to do with people running away. Its a defensive skill no different than GDB, blazing shield, or hardening ward. Most NB's use it offensively. Its the only defense an NB has. While we are spamming cloak to stay alive you're spamming green dragons blood. It absolutely bewilders me that people can't understand this. Let me have a potion that prevents you from self healing or using shields, then you'll get the picture. Having a simple potion completely negates a classes skill is ridiculous. NB is fun and can be successful with cookie cutter builds and luck but its the most gimp class in the game. Just look at the constant beat a dead horse polls. They always have NB on the bottom and its been that way since launch.

Bahalul

You can still run away from the detect pot range and cloak.

Sharee

Bahalul wrote: »

You can still run away from the detect pot range and cloak.

The whole point of an escape tool is to get away. If you have to get away first to be able to use an escape tool, then it isn't much of an escape tool, is it.

Bahalul

Well getting away from a detect pot range is fairly easy. I haven't tinkered around much with my NB (only level 30 in BB), but observing some of the good NBs out there who are familiar with me (there aren't that many people who have discovered the greatness of detect pots) they would know that I have shut down myself from using a tripot for 1 minute and that I will need to bolt to chase and weed them out. The good ones will use the terrains and skills (some already mentioned in previous comments) to get away from me. The better ones will unsheathe their sword (not bow) and fight me.

If you think you should be able to lolsnipe someone from 40m away and 1hit him without any means for the enemy to find you, that's really not balanced, no?

Xsorus

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

It has nothing to do with people running away. Its a defensive skill no different than GDB, blazing shield, or hardening ward. Most NB's use it offensively. Its the only defense an NB has. While we are spamming cloak to stay alive you're spamming green dragons blood. It absolutely bewilders me that people can't understand this. Let me have a potion that prevents you from self healing or using shields, then you'll get the picture. Having a simple potion completely negates a classes skill is ridiculous. NB is fun and can be successful with cookie cutter builds and luck but its the most gimp class in the game. Just look at the constant beat a dead horse polls. They always have NB on the bottom and its been that way since launch.

There is an entire mechanic designed around stopping heals, it's called healing debuffs.. And they absolutely gut gdb
You can also use heals while still retaining cloak.. So it's not exactly on par. If they ended up changing pots they'd have to add a magicka pen like bolt escape has to cloak. I mean right now I can dark cloak across the entire map of cyrodiil if i wanted

jelliedsoup

PeggymoeXD wrote: »

Of course there are ways to counter them, and I have still been ganked by the players who quickly adapt to the fact that I have them, I'm just saying the majority of the players who just disappear like cowards are quickly being weeded out lol

Mainly because eveeyone is a dk or sorc.