To Everyone Complaining About Sorcerers

Gorthax

and yet no one is complaining about dumping into weapon damage and max stamina and MELTING people with WB spam......gee go figure......shields are OP though right ROFL I will never understand any of this......

perma dodge.....much worse than shield stacking.

Teargrants

I'm still wondering as a sorc why can't I stack 3600 spell dmg, which wep dmg builds are capable of. I mean, I'm supposed to be OP as so many forum warriors claim, so I feel my stats should actually reflect that.

cozmon3c_ESO

i havent even broken 2000 spell damage yet, im at 1850.

TheBonesXXX

Vis wrote: »

Mumyo wrote: »

lol, just listen to urself.

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

It's FOTM lottery, this month its bubble stacking + hiding behind BoL and infinite dodgeroll + Wreckingblow spam with unlimited resources. Before 1.6 it was holding block + and press dragon scale, more blocking and blinking around.

To say it's balanced though.. you wouldn't see everyone doing it.

Still a better game than holding block and spamming insta-casts. Hiding behind BOL? What? Are you incapable of any melee or bow attacks?

I am not going to say L2P. Your case is more mad cuz bad.

Fire 'em off all the time, but being V2 on my DK I don't exactly expect to do entirely well. I'm not complaining either, just pointing out whats plain as day. Bubble + Bolt spam, infinite dodgeroll is the new meta. The game makes resource management pretty easy in its current state.

SafiyerAmitora

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

The game makes resource management pretty easy in its current state.

Not completely for those of us who are sticking with our hybrid builds, sadly.

Ezareth

TheBucket wrote: »

Ezareth wrote: »

TheBucket wrote: »

Usually by the second fear Sorcs are dead for me. Unless they pot. Then its 3 fears before death

Unless they are stamina regen specced specifically because of fear-bomb NBs/Petrify spam DKs as I am. I rarely run out of stamina any more. Now it's just the burst and bugs that kill me.

Yeah. Ill get you down in a few fears.

Hasn't happened yet but you're welcome to try ....who knows ( =

Stamina management is pretty easy when you have 1280 stamina regen, 637 Stamina/Dodge-roll/Break-free reduction and don't use any stamina abilities except the occasional defensive posture.

TheBonesXXX

SafiyerAmitora wrote: »

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

The game makes resource management pretty easy in its current state.

Not completely for those of us who are sticking with our hybrid builds, sadly.

I'd be playing my sorc right now if they ever gave DW or Sorcs a gap closer (Raiden style), all I truly want to play is a DW/Resto hybrid but trying to catch someone with DW is a no go.

or unless they introduce a shaman class, then Id be all about maining a shaman.

I play every class though, just haven't found the one build that jives with me perfectly.

PeggymoeXD

I didn't read anything but the original post. But I'm wondering how a SORCvSORC battle would disprove that sorcs are easy mode. Wouldn't it make sense for you to challenge a sorc as another class?

k2blader

PeggymoeXD wrote: »

I didn't read anything but the original post. But I'm wondering how a SORCvSORC battle would disprove that sorcs are easy mode. Wouldn't it make sense for you to challenge a sorc as another class?

Assuming equal skill & gear etc., sorc vs sorc would show which sorc has the better counter build, or which sorc just so happened to make more mistakes.

What I'd like to see is video of our forums best sorcs vs best NBs, templars, & DKs. I always like to see skilled sorcs come out on top but a part of me also wants to see other classes beating good sorcs, as proof it can and does happen, since too many seem to believe sorcs win all the time when other classes are as powerful in the right hands.

Septimus_Magna

Kypho wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Artemiisia wrote: »

the thing is, sorc was hard to learn because we always fall behind on dps, so we actually had to really improve our skills, so when a vr14 skilled sorc player suddenly gets some valid skills for pvp survivability, we can already adapt them into the skills we already have been harnessing for this last year.

thats why we harder to kill now, due to skill, and learning our class.

I have loved sorc for a year, and will love sorc for the next year

I couldnt agree more, people crying because they got beaten by players who have been playing sorcs since launch and think the class is OP while in fact its the players skill that makes it strong. Mainly due to the fact the class was onderpowered before 1.6 and the good players have learned to deal with those disadvantages.

The class balance is at its best point right now, if someone knows how to play his class they're hard to beat. I have NB guild mates who can beat most good sorcs for example. If you know your own class and your opponents class well, every class is defeatable. That having said, some classes work better against other classes but thats only logical.

Defending OPness pathetic....
I know a 2 year old child in RL who defeated 2 black belt karate masters in 3 sec.
As for zenifail game, the ESO: I got hit with snipe for 20023145322100000000 dmg!!!!!

Do you belive it? If you dont, then dont belive that sorcs arent OP...

Hahaha, its unbelievable that good players who have been playing an under-powered class since launch get strong when the class gets some buffs? Before 1.6 I had found ways to defeat average DKs 1v1 with my sorc and they were pretty OP in pvp compared to other classes. The thing I dont underdstand is why you still waist your time if you think the game is so terrible? Dont bother learning ways to counter other builds and classes because some classes are clearly OP and you have no chance in beating them.

Lava_Croft

Teargrants wrote: »

I'm still wondering as a sorc why can't I stack 3600 spell dmg, which wep dmg builds are capable of. I mean, I'm supposed to be OP as so many forum warriors claim, so I feel my stats should actually reflect that.

Because Stamina users have much less utility than Magicka users. Something's gotta give.

Unless you are a Sorcerer, of course.

pronkg

Lava_Croft wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

I'm still wondering as a sorc why can't I stack 3600 spell dmg, which wep dmg builds are capable of. I mean, I'm supposed to be OP as so many forum warriors claim, so I feel my stats should actually reflect that.

Because Stamina users have much less utility than Magicka users. Something's gotta give.

Unless you are a Sorcerer, of course.

This Yes,

Sorcs are fine as they are, maybe some small tweaks.

RinaldoGandolphi

The Sorc is just the best at escaping thats part of why people hate them so much.

cozmon3c_ESO

woodsro wrote: »

The Sorc is just the best at escaping thats part of why people hate them so much.

and trolling

deepseamk20b14_ESO

I've seen weapon damage up over 4000. Highest I've gotten my spell damage is to just under 2900 in PvP. In basically every game I've played, with a class setting, the most squishy player always hit the hardest. The most defensive hit the weakest. The one in the middle was.....in the middle. Its a simple system of checks and balances. This game obliterated that logic. Magicka light armor builds were FOTM pre 1.6 now stamina builds are the new FOTM. If someone using a FOTM build gets beaten by a sorc, or any other light armor build expect to hear complaining lol.

Gorthax

deepseamk20b14_ESO wrote: »

I've seen weapon damage up over 4000. Highest I've gotten my spell damage is to just under 2900 in PvP. In basically every game I've played, with a class setting, the most squishy player always hit the hardest. The most defensive hit the weakest. The one in the middle was.....in the middle. Its a simple system of checks and balances. This game obliterated that logic. Magicka light armor builds were FOTM pre 1.6 now stamina builds are the new FOTM. If someone using a FOTM build gets beaten by a sorc, or any other light armor build expect to hear complaining lol.

dont forget the terrabad people who just have no clue what they are doing. They will complain every time.

k2blader

woodsro wrote: »

The Sorc is just the best at escaping thats part of why people hate them so much.

Agree to a certain point. Other classes can be as good at escaping but they do it in a less blindingly visible way. I mean, I think there's a lot going on what with sorc-hate, but it seems many folks have just set their minds that it's "not fair" sorcs have BE, that they shouldn't be able to "run away"-- when they don't realize (or refuse to admit) without BE's mobility sorcs would be free AP. Like it or not, BE is part of the sorc playstyle which is based around ranged movement and positioning. If they want BE then they should just roll and play a sorc.

(Note I'm generally excluding "melee sorcs" or sorcs who "never" use BE from the discussion as I don't believe such builds are viable at this time, due to current game design. That could change in the future-- and it would be a good thing-- but I doubt it'll happen anytime soon.

Draehl

k2blader wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

The Sorc is just the best at escaping thats part of why people hate them so much.

Agree to a certain point. Other classes can be as good at escaping but they do it in a less blindingly visible way. I mean, I think there's a lot going on what with sorc-hate, but it seems many folks have just set their minds that it's "not fair" sorcs have BE, that they shouldn't be able to "run away"-- when they don't realize (or refuse to admit) without BE's mobility sorcs would be free AP. Like it or not, BE is part of the sorc playstyle which is based around ranged movement and positioning. If they want BE then they should just roll and play a sorc.

(Note I'm generally excluding "melee sorcs" or sorcs who "never" use BE from the discussion as I don't believe such builds are viable at this time, due to current game design. That could change in the future-- and it would be a good thing-- but I doubt it'll happen anytime soon.

Not un-true. From my perspective as an offensive support NB (off-heals, piercing mark, crippling grasp, fear, etc.) it is effectively my role on the battlefield to guard the healers from enemy NB ganks and keep any runners from getting away from our DPS. That's literally all I'm built to do, yet I can't stop Sorcs from getting away, regardless of how many DPS are with me due to the ridiculous functionality of Ball Lightning. Projectiles are a huge category of skills within the game, yet they are able to completely ignore them while being able to engage and disengage at will. It's not the teleport, or the shield (when its not bugged/abused, but thats another topic) or the damage, but rather the complete inability for a group of players if not specifically possessing a charge or teleport skill, to stop them. Sorc shields and damage could be nerfed, but if the functionality of BL remained the same I would still have a massive problem with their ability to completely ignore so many skills.

k2blader

Draehl wrote: »

k2blader wrote: »

woodsro wrote: »

The Sorc is just the best at escaping thats part of why people hate them so much.

Agree to a certain point. Other classes can be as good at escaping but they do it in a less blindingly visible way. I mean, I think there's a lot going on what with sorc-hate, but it seems many folks have just set their minds that it's "not fair" sorcs have BE, that they shouldn't be able to "run away"-- when they don't realize (or refuse to admit) without BE's mobility sorcs would be free AP. Like it or not, BE is part of the sorc playstyle which is based around ranged movement and positioning. If they want BE then they should just roll and play a sorc.

(Note I'm generally excluding "melee sorcs" or sorcs who "never" use BE from the discussion as I don't believe such builds are viable at this time, due to current game design. That could change in the future-- and it would be a good thing-- but I doubt it'll happen anytime soon.

Not un-true. From my perspective as an offensive support NB (off-heals, piercing mark, crippling grasp, fear, etc.) it is effectively my role on the battlefield to guard the healers from enemy NB ganks and keep any runners from getting away from our DPS. That's literally all I'm built to do, yet I can't stop Sorcs from getting away, regardless of how many DPS are with me due to the ridiculous functionality of Ball Lightning. Projectiles are a huge category of skills within the game, yet they are able to completely ignore them while being able to engage and disengage at will. It's not the teleport, or the shield (when its not bugged/abused, but thats another topic) or the damage, but rather the complete inability for a group of players if not specifically possessing a charge or teleport skill, to stop them. Sorc shields and damage could be nerfed, but if the functionality of BL remained the same I would still have a massive problem with their ability to completely ignore so many skills.

BoL only absorbs spell projectiles. Tell your CCers and DPSers to use non-spell abilities and wear down the sorc's stamina. If he is bolting away without causing harm to you-- chalk it up as a win.

I think the spell-only absorb is reasonable. (Don't forget sorcs themselves need to deal with opponents who use BoL.) Sorcs are still very susceptible to arrows in the back, physical damage, and anything that makes us consume stamina.

SurprisedFour91

Fairweather91 wrote: »

Buff Sorcs

Yeah

Draehl

k2blader wrote: »

BoL only absorbs spell projectiles. Tell your CCers and DPSers to use non-spell abilities and wear down the sorc's stamina. If he is bolting away without causing harm to you-- chalk it up as a win.

Unfortunately, that's the only viable outcome.

I think the spell-only absorb is reasonable. (Don't forget sorcs themselves need to deal with opponents who use BoL.) Sorcs are still very susceptible to arrows in the back, physical damage, and anything that makes us consume stamina.

Problem with that is the combination of Hardened Ward means they don't even have to block or block very little- the Ward is able to absorb enough from the incoming physical projectiles while the magical ones are taken out by BL. I'll admit, you are 100% correct if they are using Streak. They get immobilized. Spam shield/block a while, they run out a stam and evetually die with enough DPSers on them.

In any case, I know where you're coming from. I played a Warlock in WoW and know how much fear was hated on and how frustrating it was to fight against even if you ended up beating the Warlock. Nerf calls were requested even during the times when we weren't OP. Sorcs are similarly frustrating. Wrecking Blow DKs are actually more OP than you guys, but at least sufficient force can overcome them, or the at the very least you can run away if its not going your way. Sorcs can leave a fight, and keep others from leaving a fight whenever they want. I don't blame players for abusing it, but rather Zenimax for promoting what is quite honestly, trollish gameplay, OP or not.

Psilent

Sorc is now level 47 and I have fought several VR14 players and came out on top. Using Hardened Ward and Streak, not BoL, I have found I can quickly run into a situation, fire off a few Force Pulse/Crystal Fragments and usually get them low enough to use Endless Fury. In 1v1 situations I use the Restoring Twilight with Clannfear and Deadric Prey and usually the opponent is overwhelmed. While they are attacking my pets I use Power Overload to hit them for up to 10K, all the while streaking around the the fight while dodge rolling to avoid projectiles.

I also use Bound Aegis with Unbounded Storm to up my defenses for melee combat. Usually I have found with both of those abilities and hardened ward I can go into a melee situation, streak around, and get out with minimal health loss. Crit Rush is an issue, but I have found that I can turn around and streak the other way to stun lock my opponent. Usually I can pop a second streak before they get free to out range the crit rush. Thank you Galalin for showing me how it feels to die to Crit Rush, needed that experience to devise a way to counter it.

To be honest, playing a sorc is much easier than playing my DK. I CANNOT run into a situation on my DK against 10 people and live wearing medium armor and Igneous Shield. Just to note, my sorc is in 7/7 light armor for this test. I have also found out I can hit BoL sorcs by fighting them from the side, not head on, seems to avoid the BoL. Also, Hardened Ward seems to block all CC functions, maybe this a symptom of all shields, but my igneous shield drops so quickly on my DK that I just never noticed it. This prevents me from having to use Immovable.

Caltrops seem to be a nice counter to Deadric Mines as well, been seeing a lot of people surrounding me with Caltrops when I drop mines. Also volcanic runes.

Snipe is a non-issue with Hardened Ward. Tyago kept sniping me yesterday outside Chalman Keep, I just kept using ward over and over and over and ended up chasing him back into the Keep. However, during that time I was unable to really mount an assault due to my magicka being used for defenses. Just to note, Tyago has a very high damage snipe build, so he was a good test. Need to test this out against hellcane in Chillrend to see if I can escape a gank attempt.

The dragonknight class seems to be the hardest to counter. Will be skilling up 1H&S for defensive posture and running a few tests. I've noticed a lot of dragonknights are using Dragon Fire Scale and not reflective plate, so I might be able to increase my overload damage on them with posture.

Anyway, this is fun. However, I would like to point out that in other MMOs I usually play caster type characters, so this play style is more suited to me than a DK. I chose a DK for ESO because I wanted to play a in your face melee class; it felt great to get back to my bread and butter. I just wish my DK had more options for escape than just dodge roll, Quick Cloak and Charging Manuvers.

Cody

AltusVenifus wrote: »

LOL. issue a challenge, roll a class that u haven't played and fight me on the same OP class I have played for a year plus and I will show u how they are not overpowered and it is all player skill?

That is your challenge. You have to be kidding me. In what way does this even remotely prove that a sorc is not unbalanced? LOL. LOL. LOL. Very logically.

If you really wanted to prove this, your challenge; should be

Fight 10 sorcs in a duel. Record duels.

Challenge the same sorcs to duels, but you are restricted, and cannot use your class shields (and streak if you think that plays into them being considered OP). Have 10 fights in a row with continuous recording.

If you win more duels or the same amount, it will prove shields are not OP and it is player skill.

When u lose more duels that the baseline established, it will prove that OP skills are effecting the gameplay.

My prediction is you will lose a lot of duels without shields, but would love to see it.

I killed quite a few sorcs today by just spamming uppercut:/

OP my hind quarters.

SafiyerAmitora

Psilent wrote: »

Sorc is now level 47 and I have fought several VR14 players and came out on top. Using Hardened Ward and Streak, not BoL, I have found I can quickly run into a situation, fire off a few Force Pulse/Crystal Fragments and usually get them low enough to use Endless Fury. In 1v1 situations I use the Restoring Twilight with Clannfear and Deadric Prey and usually the opponent is overwhelmed. While they are attacking my pets I use Power Overload to hit them for up to 10K, all the while streaking around the the fight while dodge rolling to avoid projectiles.

I also use Bound Aegis with Unbounded Storm to up my defenses for melee combat. Usually I have found with both of those abilities and hardened ward I can go into a melee situation, streak around, and get out with minimal health loss. Crit Rush is an issue, but I have found that I can turn around and streak the other way to stun lock my opponent. Usually I can pop a second streak before they get free to out range the crit rush. Thank you Galalin for showing me how it feels to die to Crit Rush, needed that experience to devise a way to counter it.

To be honest, playing a sorc is much easier than playing my DK. I CANNOT run into a situation on my DK against 10 people and live wearing medium armor and Igneous Shield. Just to note, my sorc is in 7/7 light armor for this test. I have also found out I can hit BoL sorcs by fighting them from the side, not head on, seems to avoid the BoL. Also, Hardened Ward seems to block all CC functions, maybe this a symptom of all shields, but my igneous shield drops so quickly on my DK that I just never noticed it. This prevents me from having to use Immovable.

Caltrops seem to be a nice counter to Deadric Mines as well, been seeing a lot of people surrounding me with Caltrops when I drop mines. Also volcanic runes.

Snipe is a non-issue with Hardened Ward. Tyago kept sniping me yesterday outside Chalman Keep, I just kept using ward over and over and over and ended up chasing him back into the Keep. However, during that time I was unable to really mount an assault due to my magicka being used for defenses. Just to note, Tyago has a very high damage snipe build, so he was a good test. Need to test this out against hellcane in Chillrend to see if I can escape a gank attempt.

The dragonknight class seems to be the hardest to counter. Will be skilling up 1H&S for defensive posture and running a few tests. I've noticed a lot of dragonknights are using Dragon Fire Scale and not reflective plate, so I might be able to increase my overload damage on them with posture.

Anyway, this is fun. However, I would like to point out that in other MMOs I usually play caster type characters, so this play style is more suited to me than a DK. I chose a DK for ESO because I wanted to play a in your face melee class; it felt great to get back to my bread and butter. I just wish my DK had more options for escape than just dodge roll, Quick Cloak and Charging Manuvers.

:DDDD Grats! And lucky; wish I was as good with my sorc. I myself find playing a dk many times easier than playing a sorc.

Hmm... You can test on me with my dk! My EP one, that is. She may be lvl 25, but it should still work. :b And I need to learn how to counter Sorcs better, 'cause I suck at it. >.>

olsborg

Sorceror is definately fun to play, I play one exclusively and have since launch. I dont find the class itself OP, there are builds/classes out there that preform quite well against me. Its the majority of the playerbase that simply doesnt, and they whine. Its easier to whine then to l2p.

Shieldstacking however, that alot of sorcs do (and other classes) need to be looked at/removed. Ok thanks!

pronkg

You as A 47 sorc beating any class that's V14 only says you are a way better player. Has nothing to do with the class. I've beaten V14 sorcs with my V1 night blade.

SafiyerAmitora

pronkg wrote: »

You as A 47 sorc beating any class that's V14 only says you are a way better player. Has nothing to do with the class. I've beaten V14 sorcs with my V1 night blade.

I used to be able to kill v14 dk's when my dk was v1.

For some reason, once I got to v14 and I dueled the same dk's I beat all that long ago, I had a hard time doing so, so I don't know if it's that their build changed since then (2 1/2 months between when I was v1 to when I got to v14) or if I just laxed on trying to win or if I just lost my touch. I'd beaten Vjori a few times before as v1, I think, but as time went on, he started beating me. >.<' *is ashamed*

Psilent

pronkg wrote: »

You as A 47 sorc beating any class that's V14 only says you are a way better player. Has nothing to do with the class. I've beaten V14 sorcs with my V1 night blade.

If you had any idea who my main was, you would be eating your words. I am one of the worst players and easily killable players in this game.

SafiyerAmitora

Psilent wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

You as A 47 sorc beating any class that's V14 only says you are a way better player. Has nothing to do with the class. I've beaten V14 sorcs with my V1 night blade.

If you had any idea who my main was, you would be eating your words. I am one of the worst players and easily killable players in this game.

Nuuuuuu! You're not. I can name a few times where you've beaten me, then that one 2v2 tag team tourney Legend held where I died to the same nb that you killed. You're nowhere near as bad as you think. :b

pronkg

Psilent wrote: »

pronkg wrote: »

You as A 47 sorc beating any class that's V14 only says you are a way better player. Has nothing to do with the class. I've beaten V14 sorcs with my V1 night blade.

If you had any idea who my main was, you would be eating your words. I am one of the worst players and easily killable players in this game.

Then you must have been fighting V14 toons played by toddlers