Elite gear hit with the massive nerf hammer in 1.6 nobody does trials anymore: pics

Joy_Division

KerinKor wrote: »

Joejudas wrote: »

Getting over the gear nerf is tough for me.

You seem fixated on the numbers, you never once have addressed the real issue .. is your character less able to go through content it can on live or not. I've yet to see you talk about that, instead you seem to be on an endless rant against numbers!

That is not the point the OP made. The OP disliked that the top-end gear dropped in the hardest content in 1.6 is noticeably inferior to that of 1.5. The OP thinks that the loot drops from the hardest drops should be something desirable that the person would want to go out of their way and use; in short, the player should be genuinely excited by getting a cool reward for finishing difficult end-game content.

yodased wrote: »

All this crying. If you don't like the game stop playing, I simply don't understand why you waste so much time and effort coming to a forum and making posts about things that you have been empirically proven don't matter to the developers.

Things change, deal with it or move on.

Further more, how can you expect me to take you seriously when you compare playing a video game to how much 'work' you have put into it.

This is entertainment, if you look at this as work then you need to find something you find fun, cause why would you ever PLAY A GAME and think of it as an obligation?

And quite frankly this post is just an insult. It is crystal clear from the OP and others who shared that view that they have passion for this game. It's also obvious that the reason for their passion is different from yours, but, newsflash, your passion is not somehow better or more worthy than theirs.

They make posts because they care for the game and dislike something about the PTS that is fundamentally changing the game. That is the entire point for having a PTS! Zenimax did not release 1.6 on the PTS for customers to try it and "deal with it or move on." They have this forum for customers to provide their feedback! You call them whiners and berate them for doing precisely what ZoS wants them to.

Has it ever occurred to you the challenge of completing difficult end game content, never quite being satisfied with good builds and wanting to make them great, and finishing out the top-end gear IS fun and entertaining to people such as the OP? You think they view it as work and obligation that can't possibly be fun and then berate them and tell them to GTFO because "things change." You are wrong; some people are MMO perfectionists and enjoy the constant improvement of their characters and do find it rewarding to finish SO 25 times just so they can have a 4% higher crit chance than you.

It is quite clear you don't share their mentality of what is fun about ESO. But why is somehow your perspective of fun worthy and better, whereas their perspective is elitist, contemptible, and unworthy of expression in a PTS forum, or, as you eloquently put it: "Things change, deal with it or move on."

Iselin

Good points OP. The 10X thing has never been advertised as a tool for "re-balancing." I think most of us understood it as a simple arithmetical exercise to insert more "granularity" (I think that was the word they used.)

It seems that they have used it to begin the reduction of the highest end items in preparation for the elimination of VR ranks by making VR14 top end gear not as much better than VR1 gear as it currently is in 1.5.

Does anyone have "best in slot" gear for VR1? I'd be very interested in seeing if the VR1 gear was nerfed less than VR14. My suspicion is that it probably wasn't.

Philelectric

First of all, numbers have NOT been multiplicated by 10
Second, numbers have NOT been multiplicated by 10
Third, numbers have NOT been multiplicated bu 10

Numbers have been REBALANCED.

If it was a 10x, I would have 32k HP ,15k mag and 24k stam on the pts. I was at 29k hp, 12k mag and 22k stam. I changed it a bit to get 24k hp and stam and 12k mag.

This isnt 10x

My weapon damage is less than 10x and my stam regen might be a lot lower than 10x. On the live server I have 160 stam regen (soft cap is there) and on the pts I have +/- 1650 stam regen.

If you look at the numbers and forget to use your brain, you'll think about a nerf. But in fact it isnt.

Less overall stam with the ''same'' value of stam regen= indirect buff (aka rebalance). Less weapon dmg, people have less hp overall . Its a rebalance.

People crying about shorter time to kill...Why are you running 17k hp???

Also, less weapon damage give a bigger importance to armor debuff and stuff like that.

Ethona

Big gulp of Koolaid for you?
*Pours you another*
There There it will all be alright.
Just keep gulping down the sweet Koolaid.
Are you sleepy yet?

Here's a ideal, an opinion of mines, that if our PTS chars are showing signs of being powerless with bloated numbers compare to our mains with non-bloated numbers, than perhaps a nerf took place. Despite the bloated numbers, rather it's 10x or not, our PTS chars are pour garbage compare to our live chars.

Our heros are half the heros they use to be!

Tyr

Alphashado wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

They did not nerf endgame sets. They had to rebalance crit % because they changed how impen works, and a few other things regarding crit. If you notice, you are getting more than 10x the value of some stats, particularly spell power. The sets are not nerfed at all. They simply rebalanced the value of crit %. They also rebalanced what piece of the pie of your overall character is contributed to from sets, and from enchants, etc. Enchants will not be 10x the amount, this is because of rebalancing. There is no nerfing going on. They simply rebalanced the places you get different stats from.

It doesnt take a rocket scientist to understand this. Please think more deeply and stop with these complaints! Nobody is nerfed.

This is so refreshing. The mass hysteria around perceived nerfs in 1.6 is astounding. For everything that was nerfed, something else was jacked up to compensate. This includes gear, stats, skills, monster health/resistances etc. It's just a rebalance. Is it perfect? Probably not. It will likely require adjustments.

Stop the stampede. Take a deep breath.

Yep exactly. It was a rebalance around having 30CP and they gave everybody at endgame 70 instead.

With 70CP you can increase your BASE damage by 10% without even thinking about your build and much more than that if you choose to distribute points specific to your build/gear.

Just looking at the previous sets without accomadating the 70CP you received is totally backwards. If you're running trials, you've got 70CP to consider before assessing whether overall your character is less effective.

angelyn

LonePirate wrote: »

There are certainly problems with gear stats in 1.6; but even if/when gear is fixed, your character is still going to be remarkably weaker for a very long time due to all of the rescaling that has happened.

I've done a comparison of basic stats and basic armour in this post, which shows what seems to be the rescaling situation.I've not worked out the scaling on some top sets but they could have scaled in a similar manner.Here are the summary sheets, which are also in original thread.TLDR- My calculations on a lv 3 character, on stats that affect all players. I'm not a mathematician so might not be 100%!This is only how the ratio seems to have scaled to me.

• Health scaled on 1:7 Ratio
• Magicka/Stamina scaled on 1:9 Ratio
• Health Regen scaled on 1:11.5 Ratio
• Magicka/Stamina Regen scaled on 1:11 Ratio
• Heavy/Medium Armour scaled on 1:4 Ratio
• Light Armour scaled on 1:2 Ratio

Pangnirtung

LOL @ that sig. OP

Yeah, let's keep things exactly as they were, unbalanced and over powered for a certain play style.

I one hundred percent endorse these "nerfs" because I don't see them as nerfs for the majority.

keni_harringtonb16_ESO

Frenkthevile wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

I don't think this is any kind of blanket nerf. And to be honest, I think you're theorycrafting a bit too much into these changes without considering all numbers.

You have to remember that they didn't raise all stats by a fixed factor of 10 either.

Let's take attributes as a direct example. Some other threads already did the math and the result has been something like this:

• Health is upscaled by a factor of about 8. This means before you might have gotten 125 health from something. Post-patch this should be 1,000 (rather than 1,250).
• Stamina and Magicka both scale by a factor of about 11 or 12, which means you'll see something that might seem like costs of abilities increased as well, e.g. something used to cost 200 Magicka, which will now appear as 2,200 Magicka (rather than 2,000 Magicka).
  
  The before/after of that Hunding's set item is some nice example for this:
  
  
  
  Look at the 3 items bonus. It's approximately factor 10. That's fine. Same for the 5 items bonus.
  
  The armor factor isn't factor 10, but that's acceptable as well, since they already said they'd rebalance the armor values of light and medium armor.
  
  The enchantment took a hit, I agree, but I guess this has to happen considering the fact that soft caps are gone. So it's now easier to stack attributes, add champion bonuses as well (which they said you'd need for min/maxing), and I don't think you're looking at some significant difference assuming you dedicate into this stat.
  
  Both critical hit chances reduced is fine as well (at least in this case), since you now have a higher base hit chance, too.
  
  
  
  Here's another example: They can't just push the weapon/spell damage buffs by factor 10 since soft caps are gone. Again, I don't see any nerf there.
  
  ---
  
  However, I have to agree, that the 1 % critical bonuses on some of the sets feel odd, and considering lower tier sets have better bonuses, this most likely means there's something off with them. Just /bug them and see what/if they change.

spell damage bonus is 20X insted of 10X on Soulshine items, so...

atleast some people have their eyes open ^^ not to mention that everyone starts off with a base crit value of 10% now so they have actaully gained 6% plus there is another 12% crit to be unlocked in the champ system but mind you most people complaining here have probbly not even been on the pts and are only going by what other people have said and we know how that goes...

Sharkano

The guys who played the game the longest and the hardest, and paid every month, get hosed. The guys who subscribed for a month, then quit and are now coming back F2P and are level 50 love it. Tells you everything you need to know about where this company's head is at . . . .

Joy_Division

keni_harringtonb16_ESO wrote: »

atleast some people have their eyes open ^^ not to mention that everyone starts off with a base crit value of 10% now so they have actaully gained 6% plus there is another 12% crit to be unlocked in the champ system but mind you most people complaining here have probbly not even been on the pts and are only going by what other people have said and we know how that goes...

What does this have to do with the OP's point? He doesn't care that his crit bonus will be the same as it was in 1.5 He cares that the end-game gear that provided him with better stats than people who did not complete end-game content is much less.

starkerealm

Sharkano wrote: »

The guys who played the game the longest and the hardest, and paid every month, get hosed. The guys who subscribed for a month, then quit and are now coming back F2P and are level 50 love it. Tells you everything you need to know about where this company's head is at . . . .

Does that mean I can have your unannounced reward mount?

starkerealm

keni_harringtonb16_ESO wrote: »

Frenkthevile wrote: »

Smaxx wrote: »

I don't think this is any kind of blanket nerf. And to be honest, I think you're theorycrafting a bit too much into these changes without considering all numbers.

You have to remember that they didn't raise all stats by a fixed factor of 10 either.

Let's take attributes as a direct example. Some other threads already did the math and the result has been something like this:

• Health is upscaled by a factor of about 8. This means before you might have gotten 125 health from something. Post-patch this should be 1,000 (rather than 1,250).
• Stamina and Magicka both scale by a factor of about 11 or 12, which means you'll see something that might seem like costs of abilities increased as well, e.g. something used to cost 200 Magicka, which will now appear as 2,200 Magicka (rather than 2,000 Magicka).
  
  The before/after of that Hunding's set item is some nice example for this:
  
  
  
  Look at the 3 items bonus. It's approximately factor 10. That's fine. Same for the 5 items bonus.
  
  The armor factor isn't factor 10, but that's acceptable as well, since they already said they'd rebalance the armor values of light and medium armor.
  
  The enchantment took a hit, I agree, but I guess this has to happen considering the fact that soft caps are gone. So it's now easier to stack attributes, add champion bonuses as well (which they said you'd need for min/maxing), and I don't think you're looking at some significant difference assuming you dedicate into this stat.
  
  Both critical hit chances reduced is fine as well (at least in this case), since you now have a higher base hit chance, too.
  
  
  
  Here's another example: They can't just push the weapon/spell damage buffs by factor 10 since soft caps are gone. Again, I don't see any nerf there.
  
  ---
  
  However, I have to agree, that the 1 % critical bonuses on some of the sets feel odd, and considering lower tier sets have better bonuses, this most likely means there's something off with them. Just /bug them and see what/if they change.

spell damage bonus is 20X insted of 10X on Soulshine items, so...

atleast some people have their eyes open ^^ not to mention that everyone starts off with a base crit value of 10% now so they have actaully gained 6% plus there is another 12% crit to be unlocked in the champ system but mind you most people complaining here have probbly not even been on the pts and are only going by what other people have said and we know how that goes...

Yeah, this probably has a lot to do with why I my crit rate actually seemed to be higher on PTS, while one of my sets actually had its crit bonus tanked.

Joejudas

yodased wrote: »

All this crying. If you don't like the game stop playing, I simply don't understand why you waste so much time and effort coming to a forum and making posts about things that you have been empirically proven don't matter to the developers.

Things change, deal with it or move on.

Further more, how can you expect me to take you seriously when you compare playing a video game to how much 'work' you have put into it.

This is entertainment, if you look at this as work then you need to find something you find fun, cause why would you ever PLAY A GAME and think of it as an obligation?

this coming from the guy who did this in zone chat " everyone send joejudas an in game mail and tell him hes an expletive expletive for personally ruining Haderus". yeah ok.

Joejudas

and alot of people seem to think " if you dont like it leave". well i think alot more people than you count on will take that selfish advice and this game will suffer for it...not flourish

Pyatra

Yep, unsubbed because of this!? Well I can only say one thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsaTElBljOE

Daveheart

The rebalance of the systems is incomplete right now, and I don't really have a problem with it. Do I think it's balanced? No. Someone mentioned some encounters being way too hard or way too easy. That about sums it up. Whether they're adjusting skills, enchants, the champion systems or the individual mobs, they're going to continue to work on that balance. We're still just a short way into the PTS.

That being said, the OP's point about trial gear shouldn't just be swept away. I wouldn't necessarily suggest that they should give back the crit, but perhaps changing the bonuses to be a slight positive tweak on some of the current best in slot gear would be appropriate. If previously the regular aether set was preferred with 4% crit, 4% crit, and 8 spell damage, perhaps starting with Martial knowledge and altering that a little would be good. Basically it seems like they could redesign the bonuses better to fit the new balance instead of just keeping the same exact bonus types but nerfing those values.

Also, the top-end SO and vet-DSA gear can be had from PvP. So, this doesn't only affect the PvE raiders.

Sentinel

Why would you and other endgamers decide to quit due to the info that is currently on the PTS, when it is entirely subject to change (and moreso subject to change due to players responses)?

I don't know if you overlooked it, but Zeni does listen to its players in terms of what they want. If a lot of people want the same thing or they want something to compensate them, Zeni will provide a response. Simply leaving because you don't like the stuff helps no-one at all.

Some suggestions as to how to look at this update:

• What has been changed overall? Does it apply to all sets or just my set.
• How do I feel about these changes and how has it affected me?
• What are some practical suggestions that I can provide to Zenimax to change the current features to best support all players experience?
• How have other players been affected in relation to yourself? Will it make a difference in the end? If yes, how so?

Such questions can be used to effectively provide a substantial response to Zenimax on how you can help them improve their system, as opposed to simply unsubbing which shows them nothing of your griefs or reasons or motives, and will in turn cause nothing but confusion.

Prokonto

Vahn wrote: »

Why would anyone go get 1% or 2% crit chance when they could go with a set that gives you heaps of outright spell or weapon damage instead?

this is essence of problem what zeni should realize & addres that immidietly
its not some random world drop/crafted set but let say that clear... it was your carrot-on-a-stick u served for end game raiders for more than half year to keep them paying fee for u!
u just dont have moral right to take it from them & dont give nothink EQUAL instead because they pay in time, effort, skill & money to archeve it. its not that way we demand it must be same gear as it was butx10, just take off crit bonuses at all from it & revalue to its effectiveness some others bonus like spellpower or somethink like that.
or u really wanna push out majority of raiding community from u game zeni?
who will put more effort in donig your end game content progress for gear which allow that progress if u show us that u could so ridicolous things with that gear without even blink of eye?

Joejudas

I honestly don't have any faith they care about the end game raid community with the gear changes and ult gain changes. Sorry if you think that's unconstructive.

tino.antoninieb17_ESO

Its obvious - ZOS has changed their damage maths and that change is making end game content gear obsolete. Those people who invested waste amount of time ( and skill ) in acquiring those sets are rightfully upset. I cant see reason why crafted sets should be better than looted in pve/pvp end content. To get crafted set u need like 20 k gold and that money u can earn in one hour. To get best trial sets u had to invest like 50-60 hours and bearing costs which are at least 200 k + ( and that is additional 20 hours of grinding).
New generation of gear is normal in every game and happens often. In this case problem is that doing end content is not a way to acquire that best gear ( there is no new content with best gear ).
Efficiency and bragging rights are one of most important drivers which make competitive players tick. ZOS u cant change human nature so u better make changes on gear people rightfully earned.
Change stats , change whatever u want but that gear MUST be best in the game or ofc your idea is to stop developing end game content since end game players are gone by that time and none will notice that u are cost cutting
If that was just oversight on your side - issue official statement and - all good.

Islyn

f047ys3v3n wrote: »

My apologies for the length of this diatribe. It is my last and I'm going out with a bang. Feel free to just look at the pictures of the new gear and draw your own conclusions.

Hi - so - now what? Go meet up and play something else? :-)

Islyn

pppontus wrote: »

KerinKor wrote: »

Joejudas wrote: »

Getting over the gear nerf is tough for me.

You seem fixated on the numbers, you never once have addressed the real issue .. is your character less able to go through content it can on live or not. I've yet to see you talk about that, instead you seem to be on an endless rant against numbers!

It's not about that. If you play a game for progression, and they take away progression from the game, that's bad regardless of whether you can complete content or not.. as you don't have a reason to play anymore.

We can all pretend we run SO over and over again because it looks pretty, but in all honesty, without anything resembling a reward at the end.. I don't think that you'd see many people doing it.

Well exactly - I personally mostly quit SO anyway except in case I had to help my guilds out for healing or dps because my healer build is not a crit build (and my NB is mana) and even if - I don't need any more infallible - and I reallllly don't need the ophidian. I cannot justify burning spellcrit pots for the junk that drops in there and aside from wanting a really good leaderboard time just to say I did - well. I rather run DSA - as I prefer arena type battle to SO by miiiles.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO

Sotha_Sil wrote: »

Suggestion : GET THE CRAZY RNG OUT // MAKE GEAR SELLABLE (BoP is ridiculous) // MAKE IT WITH GOOD SKINS // GET NEW LORE WRITERS FOR YOUR TRIALS AND GIVE US EPIC ES FIGHTS !

How is that difficult

Well it's pretty hard to read as you posted it, if that's what you're asking, not sure why you felt the need to bold and SHOUT, it doesn't make your suggestion any ore useful.

timidobserver

I expect that Martial Knowledge will be better DPS than any of the trials magicka sets.

I don't really care about the crit. If they think crit is OP, they could just take it off and replace it with something else. The problem is they didn't do that. They just nerfed the crit and made the sets subpar.

Joejudas

I'm willing to turn my gold Trials gear in gold mats. WTS gold crafting mats pst.

Alphashado

Sharkano wrote: »

The guys who played the game the longest and the hardest, and paid every month, get hosed. The guys who subscribed for a month, then quit and are now coming back F2P and are level 50 love it. Tells you everything you need to know about where this company's head is at . . . .

I'm confused. Many of the same people suggesting that ZoS is hosing Vet players in favor of new players... are also saying that the CS sucks because it will create too large of a disparity between new players and old players. How can it be favoring new players and screwing new players all at the same time?

Joejudas

Alphashado wrote: »

Sharkano wrote: »

The guys who played the game the longest and the hardest, and paid every month, get hosed. The guys who subscribed for a month, then quit and are now coming back F2P and are level 50 love it. Tells you everything you need to know about where this company's head is at . . . .

I'm confused. Many of the same people suggesting that ZoS is hosing Vet players in favor of new players... are also saying that the CS sucks because it will create too large of a disparity between new players and old players. How can it be favoring new players and screwing new players all at the same time?

Because it favors new players by making it a new shiny and hurts them because they wont ever possibly be able to catch up to vet players...which they could have done with the vr system. its a broken system.

Alphashado

Joejudas wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

Sharkano wrote: »

The guys who played the game the longest and the hardest, and paid every month, get hosed. The guys who subscribed for a month, then quit and are now coming back F2P and are level 50 love it. Tells you everything you need to know about where this company's head is at . . . .

I'm confused. Many of the same people suggesting that ZoS is hosing Vet players in favor of new players... are also saying that the CS sucks because it will create too large of a disparity between new players and old players. How can it be favoring new players and screwing new players all at the same time?

Because it favors new players by making it a new shiny and hurts them because they wont ever possibly be able to catch up to vet players...which they could have done with the vr system. its a broken system.

lmao! OK. So if it's screwing new players, then wouldn't that be favoring old players by default?

Your hatred has made you blind.

liquid_wolf

It looks like crits have been lowered... likely do to the increase in damage/health/armor/etc.

10% of 500 is 50 damage.
5% of 1000 is 50 damage.

At worst... I see this as more of a conservative adjustment so players are not nuking each other with crits. Perhaps they are worried that 10% on 1000 damage is simply too much for someone to handle/take with all the other adjustments.

They don't want to risk massive upset with insane criticals and damage blowing people out of the way on the first day.

by the math, players are receiving almost identical numbers to what they got before, and are upset that it isn't 10x like the rest of the stats/adjustments. Yeah... it means your enchants overall are not doing very much. But neither will anyone else's.

By this logic... in the future, these numbers will only get buffed.

Players would curse ZOS for nerfing it later, but by going at it this way, I can almost guarantee players will instead thank them.

Joejudas

Alphashado wrote: »

Joejudas wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

Sharkano wrote: »

The guys who played the game the longest and the hardest, and paid every month, get hosed. The guys who subscribed for a month, then quit and are now coming back F2P and are level 50 love it. Tells you everything you need to know about where this company's head is at . . . .

I'm confused. Many of the same people suggesting that ZoS is hosing Vet players in favor of new players... are also saying that the CS sucks because it will create too large of a disparity between new players and old players. How can it be favoring new players and screwing new players all at the same time?

Because it favors new players by making it a new shiny and hurts them because they wont ever possibly be able to catch up to vet players...which they could have done with the vr system. its a broken system.

lmao! OK. So if it's screwing new players, then wouldn't that be favoring old players by default?

Your hatred has made you blind.

because taking away end game players armor and stats is helping us how ?