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So what melee abilities can I spam to CC and equate the damage of Cyrstal Fragments? (Pics)
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temjiu✭✭✭✭nope. oh wait, you have Uppercut! 2h line, hits like a truck and knocks them back and down. leap, uppercut, leap, then....
...oh wait. your out of stamina at that point. right. forgot that melee skills cost so much stamina. it's gotta be because of their amazing damage an OP-ness compared to the sorcs whimpy crystal shards.
EDIT: just did a quick comarison of 2 alts I have. lower level, but i doubt the disparity changes much as you level up.
Lvl 24 Templar, average gear blue weapon
Wrecking blow I – (206 stamina) 204 damage, 3.5 second stun, 4m Knockback, melee range only.
1 second cast, Increases power of next attack by 24 (does not buff itself).
Lvl 26 Sorc, average gear blue weapon
Crystal Fragments III – (187 magicka) 269 damage, 2 second Kockdown. 30 ft range <--- seems like a small detail doesn't it....
1.5 second cast, and 35% chance to make next cast cost HALF magicka and be INSTANT...with ANY spell you cast. I could spam a 5 magick spell all day long and hit this every time it procs. Not that I have a 5 magicka spell, but it's really the point...I would SOO love to have a proc that gave me an instant and half off uppercut. But I guess we don't need it cause 2h is so amazingly OP ya know...
And this doesn't take into account the fact that stamina is triple dipped (you use it to run and dodge/block as well as swing the mighty 2h). Oh yeah, and your closing gap as a 2h player also involved stamina...you know, if they so happen to realize that the huge thing in your hand isn't a potato wedger and its really a big MELEE weapon....and they...you know...step back (or heaven forbid port away and knock you down in the process)
The execute skill with 2h is pretty nice....when your in range. Low stamina cost, decent damage returns. Nothing like that execute in the pic there...man, wish my 2h line had a passive that gave me a chance to do 1.1k damage...although it is a smaller proc, and not a guarantee...but still.
We feel your pain OP. It's not just PvP. It's the fact that almost ANY melee build is suffering right now. Well..any melee build that actually uses melee weapon skills, instead of being a light armor magicka using spec that happens to be “carrying” melee weapons.
But even then most of those players got the point, and switched to destro staff, more damage, more range..meh...just another huge thing they need to balance in the game.Edited by temjiu on 26 May 2014 18:5213 -
Nooblet✭✭✭✭1.it has a cast time.
2. You can block or roll dodge and make it laughably bad.
3. There are many spells that reflect spells back to caster.
4. It doesnt do very much dps, just spike hits that are avoidable. If you let that many crystal fragments hit you in a row, its definitely a l2p issue.
5. You died to ultimate.
I've been killed in under 2 seconds by nightblades.
Crystal fragments is good only against people who are bad or not paying attention, otherwise its junk.
Even in pve.. crystal fragments is our top dps... yet sorc is in last place for st dps.
Try not to compare class abilities to weapon abilities, they are not comparable atm.Edited by Nooblet on 26 May 2014 18:4518 -
ShintaiDK✭✭✭1.it has a cast time.
2. You can block or roll dodge and make it laughably bad.
3. There are many spells that reflect spells back to caster.
4. It doesnt do very much dps, just spike hits that are avoidable. If you let that many crystal fragments hit you in a row, its definitely a l2p issue.
5. You died to ultimate.
I've been killed in under 2 seconds by nightblades.
Crystal fragments is good only against people who are bad or not paying attention, otherwise its junk.
Even in pve.. crystal fragments is our top dps... yet sorc is in last place for st dps.
Try not to compare class abilities to weapon abilities, they are not comparable atm.
Sorcs sure are popular for PvE as wella s PvP.
And to the OP, none. Magicka based attacks can reach 1000DPS+. Yet melee gets nerfed any chance they got. The 11min trial run had 1 melee and a 6/5/1/0 class config.
Its so bad that you have to be DK or sorc to get trial groups now. If lucky, you can come as a healer if you are templar.Edited by ShintaiDK on 26 May 2014 18:5210 -
bg22✭✭✭✭✭
✭1.it has a cast time.
2. You can block or roll dodge and make it laughably bad.
3. There are many spells that reflect spells back to caster.
4. It doesnt do very much dps, just spike hits that are avoidable. If you let that many crystal fragments hit you in a row, its definitely a l2p issue.
5. You died to ultimate.
I've been killed in under 2 seconds by nightblades.
Crystal fragments is good only against people who are bad or not paying attention, otherwise its junk.
Even in pve.. crystal fragments is our top dps... yet sorc is in last place for st dps.
Try not to compare class abilities to weapon abilities, they are not comparable atm.
Sorcs sure are popular for PvE as wella s PvP.
And to the OP, none. Magicka based attacks can reach 1000DPS+. Yet melee gets nerfed any chance they got. The 11min trial run had 1 melee and a 6/5/1/0 class config.
Its so bad that you have to be DK or sorc to get trial groups now. If lucky, you can come as a healer if you are templar.
Oh I'm aware. Glad they put the leaderboard feature in there so you can see the unbalanced-ness of classes chosen for trial runs.
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joshisanonymous✭✭✭✭1.it has a cast time.
2. You can block or roll dodge and make it laughably bad.
3. There are many spells that reflect spells back to caster.
4. It doesnt do very much dps, just spike hits that are avoidable. If you let that many crystal fragments hit you in a row, its definitely a l2p issue.
5. You died to ultimate.
I've been killed in under 2 seconds by nightblades.
Crystal fragments is good only against people who are bad or not paying attention, otherwise its junk.
Even in pve.. crystal fragments is our top dps... yet sorc is in last place for st dps.
Try not to compare class abilities to weapon abilities, they are not comparable atm.
I remember playing a sorcerer in beta and thinking that Crystal Fragments was definitely not gonna stay on my bar once I leveled up more, mainly because the cast time is unbelievable long and obvious. It also makes you move very slowly while casting, which is pretty horrible if you're trying to be a ranged glass cannon type.
I think getting used to blocking and dodging lots of clearly telegraphed abilities makes an enormous difference in PvP. Crystal Fragments, chain pulls, charges, bolt escape, they all become much easier to deal with once you get used to it.0 -
Nooblet✭✭✭✭
That wasn't the point at all. But ok. Every weapon skill sucks compared to class skills, Including ranged. The post was complaining about a sorc class ability, and comparing it to weapon skills. Also not taking into account its cast time, dps, easier to block, magicka cost etc and simply focusing of the damage (not dps).
Ok.. kid.. do you think that makes you sound superior or something?
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fiachsidhe✭✭✭Is that the attack that you can literally see forming in front of them for five whole minutes?Don't have an intelligent argument? Just LOL a post!
Dire Crow - Ebonheart Pact - Dunmer Nightblade3 -
BrassRazoo✭✭✭✭✭Lvl 26 Sorc, average gear blue weapon
Crystal Fragments III – (187 magicka) 269 damage, 2 second Kockdown. 30 ft range <--- seems like a small detail doesn't it....
1.5 second cast, and 35% chance to make next cast cost HALF magicka and be INSTANT...with ANY spell you cast. I could spam a 5 magick spell all day long and hit this every time it procs. Not that I have a 5 magicka spell, but it's really the point...I would SOO love to have a proc that gave me an instant and half off uppercut. But I guess we don't need it cause 2h is so amazingly OP ya know...
.
You quote the un-morhed figures (187 Magika) and then you quote the morphed effect. Nice try.
Gives us a break.
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crislevin✭✭✭✭✭
✭its PVP, extremely chaotic situation, to see all attacks coming to you is pretty much impossible.
yeah you can dodge, yeah you can do a lot of things, but in a zerg fest?1 -
..yes, I ..see..because if something isn't OP it isn't worth the time to disagree & point out obvious misunderstandings about roles in the game genre.
People disagree on these forums about how many periods you use in a sentence & whether or not pre-20 armor appearances matter.
For that matter, people are hardly clawing. The ability has an incredibly long cast time, & it slows movement when trying to avoid other incoming effects. Would you like it to not exist?
It is unrealistic to expect a sorcerer to not be..well, a sorcerer. They have been DPS since Dungeons & Dragons, will likely stay that way, & in my opinion, CS is not overpowered as you believe it is.
You got owned by several mages spamming a power on you, not even doing heaps of damage & would have been doing less if you had been blocking them I might add.
Respawn & move on.6 -
BrassRazoo✭✭✭✭✭The picture does not even say WHO cast the spell.
It could be 3 Sorcs, could me 5 and some didn't get a spell of because of the stupid cast time.
This spell actually needs a buff.
The magika cost is way too high.
It is like almost 400 magika per cast.
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bg22✭✭✭✭✭
✭Jim_McMasterub17_ESO wrote: »
..yes, I ..see..because if something isn't OP it isn't worth the time to disagree & point out obvious misunderstandings about roles in the game genre.
People disagree on these forums about how many periods you use in a sentence & whether or not pre-20 armor appearances matter.
For that matter, people are hardly clawing. The ability has an incredibly long cast time, & it slows movement when trying to avoid other incoming effects. Would you like it to not exist?
It is unrealistic to expect a sorcerer to not be..well, a sorcerer. They have been DPS since Dungeons & Dragons, will likely stay that way, & in my opinion, CS is not overpowered as you believe it is.
You got owned by several mages spamming a power on you, not even doing heaps of damage & would have been doing less if you had been blocking them I might add.
Respawn & move on.
Bc you can block while using Invade? No. The magical rock CCs the guy charging w/ his shield up. Makes sense.0 -
IrdorathSoul ShrivenWhat I am wondering about... these are two sorcs, right?
One is Level 18 (the first two CF) and the last CF, plus VC, plus Disintegrate comes from a Veteran Rank 8?
Am I reading anything wrong here, or why does the Level 18 guy make so much more damage? Or is that PvP Rank or what does it mean?
(and no, I am not kidding or trying to flame, just trying to understand)0 -
Reevster✭✭✭✭✭BrassRazoo wrote: »The picture does not even say WHO cast the spell.
It could be 3 Sorcs, could me 5 and some didn't get a spell of because of the stupid cast time.
This spell actually needs a buff.
The magika cost is way too high.
It is like almost 400 magika per cast.
Totally agree , too frigen slow cast time, maybe .5 second would be ok but instant and lower magica cost would be the way to go.
I cant tell you how many times a Melee kills 3 mobs in the same time my sorc takes to kill just one.
Needs buffed badly.
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Reenlister✭✭✭snipped
I cant tell you how many times a Melee kills 3 mobs in the same time my sorc takes to kill just one.
Needs buffed badly.
where do ye be that the melee is strong? I need to be heading there.. If ye mean melee as in a sword? Not none of that magiky stuff, that 'taint melee. Maybe ye all be having a problem with this here magic, I dun use it, so I wont pretend to unnerstand, but I fer sure know that the magiky's sure do kill a lot around me.. 0 -
bg22✭✭✭✭✭
✭What I am wondering about... these are two sorcs, right?
One is Level 18 (the first two CF) and the last CF, plus VC, plus Disintegrate comes from a Veteran Rank 8?
Am I reading anything wrong here, or why does the Level 18 guy make so much more damage? Or is that PvP Rank or what does it mean?
(and no, I am not kidding or trying to flame, just trying to understand)
Thats pvp rank.0 -
Reevster✭✭✭✭✭Reenlister wrote: »snipped
I cant tell you how many times a Melee kills 3 mobs in the same time my sorc takes to kill just one.
Needs buffed badly. where do ye be that the melee is strong? I need to be heading there.. If ye mean melee as in a sword? Not none of that magiky stuff, that 'taint melee. Maybe ye all be having a problem with this here magic, I dun use it, so I wont pretend to unnerstand, but I fer sure know that the magiky's sure do kill a lot around me..
Well gee let me think, ....Templers with their shard jabby thingy , they have like 3 or 4 mobs at 30 percent health before I am even near close to killing just one, then you have NBs...they jump ahead and destroy one mob before I even get a chance to start a cast and then they are on too the next mob, and well DKs...they just destroy stuff..P ......
Nerf Melee I say.....
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Reenlister✭✭✭well, I have to say, yer not in the right area. That there shard thingy is not melee, its still a magiky thing. Melee would be yer weapon. NB's do a bit of damage with their trainin', or skill line as its called. weaps is pathetic.
So yer not talking about a melee, as in sword swinging knight, or tank in other words, yer talking about changing up them skill lines.
Melee would in the general sense be the tankys, or the 2handers, since we have been working on the trying to live vs the damage we be doing, and that is just not viable now.
Nay that any of that matters fer now, the question being at hand is about that shard thing, and in true melee sense, nay, there is not one.
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Slantasiam✭✭✭so you would like to nerf the only thing a sorc has now? even as weak as it is?
sorc has maybe 5 good spells ...dk has so many I cant fit them on 2 bars...0 -
Reevster✭✭✭✭✭Reenlister wrote: »well, I have to say, yer not in the right area. That there shard thingy is not melee, its still a magiky thing. Melee would be yer weapon. NB's do a bit of damage with their trainin', or skill line as its called. weaps is pathetic.
So yer not talking about a melee, as in sword swinging knight, or tank in other words, yer talking about changing up them skill lines.
Melee would in the general sense be the tankys, or the 2handers, since we have been working on the trying to live vs the damage we be doing, and that is just not viable now.
Nay that any of that matters fer now, the question being at hand is about that shard thing, and in true melee sense, nay, there is not one.
Ya I know all about Melee vs casters, I played Warriors /Rangers and Wizards/Mages/Enchanters in EQ1..
Warriors are meant to take damage and hold aggro off of the Wimpy Casters so they can stand back and "Cast"/deal damage from afar. I realize this is not EQ but as the content gets harder the"Tanks" need to be tougher but not really need to deal more damage but have solid aggro control .Well more Damage does cause arggo....P But Damage dealing is is not the prime goal of a Warrior/melee damage taker.
Aggro control is the art and work which is done by all members of a party to force the mob to attack the tank(s).
So as content gets harder not all classes are meant to take aggro but just deal damage. As a mater of fact Rouges/Rangers would deal too much damage and get aggro from the "Tank" so they had to slow down at times to lessen their damage so they wouldn't get smoked from the uber boss etc.
Anyway ESO is not EQ but when dealing with tough bosses etc , the same sort of mechanics apply.
I think there is need for changes here and there but I dont think people should be calling for a nerf on this and a nerf on that, well cept the Vamp thingy I suppose in PvP was a bit much.
Call for changes to improve a class . not to nerf another class, that is one of the biggest mistakes some people make, ya you dont like it that you cant do this or that like the other class but calling for nerfs ruins the core game play for everyone, call for improvements not nerfs.0 -
Reenlister✭✭✭Reenlister wrote: »well, I have to say, yer not in the right area. That there shard thingy is not melee, its still a magiky thing. Melee would be yer weapon. NB's do a bit of damage with their trainin', or skill line as its called. weaps is pathetic.
So yer not talking about a melee, as in sword swinging knight, or tank in other words, yer talking about changing up them skill lines.
Melee would in the general sense be the tankys, or the 2handers, since we have been working on the trying to live vs the damage we be doing, and that is just not viable now.
Nay that any of that matters fer now, the question being at hand is about that shard thing, and in true melee sense, nay, there is not one.
Ya I know all about Melee vs casters, I played Warriors /Rangers and Wizards/Mages/Enchanters in EQ1..
Warriors are meant to take damage and hold aggro off of the Wimpy Casters so they can stand back and "Cast"/deal damage from afar. I realize this is not EQ but as the content gets harder the"Tanks" need to be tougher but not really need to deal more damage but have solid aggro control .Well more Damage does cause arggo....P But Damage dealing is is not the prime goal of a Warrior/melee damage taker.
Aggro control is the art and work which is done by all members of a party to force the mob to attack the tank(s).
So as content gets harder not all classes are meant to take aggro but just deal damage. As a mater of fact Rouges/Rangers would deal too much damage and get aggro from the "Tank" so they had to slow down at times to lessen their damage so they wouldn't get smoked from the uber boss etc.
Anyway ESO is not EQ but when dealing with tough bosses etc , the same sort of mechanics apply.
I think there is need for changes here and there but I dont think people should be calling for a nerf on this and a nerf on that, well cept the Vamp thingy I suppose in PvP was a bit much.
Call for changes to improve a class . not to nerf another class, that is one of the biggest mistakes some people make, ya you dont like it that you cant do this or that like the other class but calling for nerfs ruins the core game play for everyone, call for improvements not nerfs.
Now I am a bit confused. I be following you on that there writing, until ye get to the nerf part? I don't be calling for no nerf, if anything I only keep goin on about in all the related threads that the sword is a pathetic thing as is. It does make it hard to be a tanky here when ye cant hurt em much. Let alone trying to make it on yer own in the world.
So yer writing on its own is pretty good, but all ye said under yer quoting of me has nare a thing to do with what I be saying...
So ye will pardon me fer saying.. What?0 -
Reevster✭✭✭✭✭No you didnt say "Nerf"...but
Referring to CFs...er well , sort of putting CFs in a bad light. Plus the video...hmmmm
But ya you didn't call for a nerf which is a good thing.
Improvements are better.
Edited by Reevster on 27 May 2014 02:110 -
Reenlister✭✭✭No you didnt say "Nerf"...but
Referring to CFs...er well , sort of putting CFs in a bad light. Plus the video...hmmmm
But ya you didn't call for a nerf which is a good thing.
Improvements are better.
I think ye be confusing me with someone else. I don't see me a puttin' up no video, nor do I see me puttin' no one in a bad light. I only be saying them magiky types do be doing some pretty good killing.
And answering the main question, no, there not be a melee spam fer that.
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