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You need to buff weaponskills. They are terrible.
Crescent
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I'm looking at skills like Volley with the fire field morph. 3 second AoE does 252 damage total, 6 second dot does an additional 102 damage at softcap. So a cast nets 352 damage, over 6 seconds. Poison arrow is outright bad, why have you made DoT's in this game so pathetic, 192 damage over 10 seconds DoT that's 19 damage ticks on a weak initial 190 damage attack, when there are class skills instantly doing 350-400+ damage tooltips.
Meanwhile Impulse with Light Armor (you actually nerfed leather and plate by increasing its mana costs instead of nerfing light armor cost reduction passives) does about 240 tooltip damage at the SOFTCAP INSTANTLY. Sorcerers stacking around 2500 magicka, well over the softcap, are doing easily 300+ tooltip damage in one cast, plus either pulsar or elemental ring.
Same goes for Cleave and Steel Tornado (Steel Tornado needs 50% lower health mobs to start doing anywhere close to Impulse).
Then you have a ranged snare attack like Hidden Blade doing the highest damage of the stamina skills, and still several points behind magicka attacks like fire lash and crystal shards and biting jabs.
Why have you allowed stamina based weaponskills get so bad? It's been well over a month of release and you should realize everyone besides the tank is going light armor class/destro AoE spam.
Edited by Crescent on 25 May 2014 18:05 Meanwhile Impulse with Light Armor (you actually nerfed leather and plate by increasing its mana costs instead of nerfing light armor cost reduction passives) does about 240 tooltip damage at the SOFTCAP INSTANTLY. Sorcerers stacking around 2500 magicka, well over the softcap, are doing easily 300+ tooltip damage in one cast, plus either pulsar or elemental ring.
Same goes for Cleave and Steel Tornado (Steel Tornado needs 50% lower health mobs to start doing anywhere close to Impulse).
Then you have a ranged snare attack like Hidden Blade doing the highest damage of the stamina skills, and still several points behind magicka attacks like fire lash and crystal shards and biting jabs.
Why have you allowed stamina based weaponskills get so bad? It's been well over a month of release and you should realize everyone besides the tank is going light armor class/destro AoE spam.
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Gisgo✭✭✭✭✭
I got it as high as 475 (the screenshot is with 1900 stamina).
The problem of (most) stamina skills isnt the damage they do.
Its being on the same pool with sprint, block and dodge rolls, and costing too much.
Ironically they just raised the cost of flying blade.Edited by Gisgo on 25 May 2014 18:253 -
Crescent✭✭✭✭
I got it as high as 475 (the screenshot is with 1900 stamina).
The problem of (most) stamina skills isnt the damage they do.
Its being on the same pool with sprint, block and dodge rolls, and costing too much.
Ironically they just raised the cost of flying blade.
At that same weapon damage level you have to boost it to 474 the sorcerer's crystal shard is already doing 600+ damage in similar gear levels. And he can maintain that crystal shard spam indefinitely due to spell symmetry whereas you cannot.
It has nothing to do with sharing same pool with dodge. My dodge costs nothing in full leather. And magicka users also use storm form for defense and surge to buff their weapon, so their magicka is also used for something other than offense.
The issue is how little stamina recovery that is, and that Hidden Blade is the only skill doing close to competitive damage. And that's single target, because all stamina AoE's suck really bad.Edited by Crescent on 25 May 2014 18:304 -
Gisgo✭✭✭✭✭Yes but i can deal with a spell doing 600+ damage when i can do 450 by throwing a dagger, Blinding flurry obliterates targets.
Again, with the right build, the damage isnt bad.
DPS is terrible because you run out of stamina by breaking CCs, rolling... basically by just fighting.Edited by Gisgo on 25 May 2014 18:300 -
Gisgo✭✭✭✭✭/brag
But i understand what you mean, playing a stamina build, yes stamina skills need some love, but if you buffed the damage, people would be oneshotted by any stealthing meleer and this isnt exactly balanced.
First thing they should do is to buff Balance and Controlled fury to save more stamina (like 30%), this alone would help a lot.0 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭what about adding a third resource pool dedicated for anti cc/dmg.
every slotted stamina weaponskill will add 300points to the max pool of it (thus capped at 1500points) and will generate 15 points per slot => 75 max regeneration. if that bar is emptied the normal stamina bar will be used.
that way stamina based builds wont be that ineffective as they are now as they would not rely on their stamina with dmg and anti cc from the beginning.
and magica builds wont get any benefit from it.spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"2 -
Gisgo✭✭✭✭✭Lets be realistic, i doubt they will ever add a third resource pool.
We got stamina and magicka and they need to be somewhat balanced.2 -
Tankqull✭✭✭✭✭
✭
you cant balance two pools while having 3 terms of usage.Lets be realistic, i doubt they will ever add a third resource pool.
We got stamina and magicka and they need to be somewhat balanced.
its the same issue why 2 realm openworld games will never have population balance...
spelling and grammar errors are free to be abused
Sallington wrote: »Anything useful that players are wanting added into the game all fall under the category of "Yer ruinin my 'mersion!"0 -
Crescent✭✭✭✭/brag
But i understand what you mean, playing a stamina build, yes stamina skills need some love, but if you buffed the damage, people would be oneshotted by any stealthing meleer and this isnt exactly balanced.
First thing they should do is to buff Balance and Controlled fury to save more stamina (like 30%), this alone would help a lot.
You realize that the cast time of that isn't actually 1.3 seconds, right? And that heavy attack chains outDPS's Rapid Strikes... While doing Rapid Strikes you are also not autoattacking as you would with hidden blade since you can just clip autoattacks in between hidden blade animations, so spamming hidden blade actually does more damage than Rapid Strikes.
And the difference between armor and spell resist for mobs (basically most mobs have no spell resist whatsoever).
And I don't care about stealthing melee since I PvE, and things don't die in PvE anywhere near as quick as they do in broken PvP. Remove the stealth bonus damage if that becomes a problem, stealth is good enough anyways by giving you an opener.Edited by Crescent on 25 May 2014 19:431 -
lets not forget my crystal blast hits for600, and hits anythng near that target for 200. it also knocks the target down and heals me
i have a weapons master/werewolf build.( all 4 stam weapons at 50). and even with 0 points in magika. my magika skills do damage on par with my stamina skills. and thanks to leeching strikes. i can spam them nearly as much.
Edited by Jeremy_gelber_ESO on 25 May 2014 20:371 -
Gisgo✭✭✭✭✭Ok sounds like you dont like people discussing in your thread, if they arent agreeing entirely with you, which makes discussing pointless.
Goodbye, have fun hitting for *** damage without understanding why.1 -
Crescent✭✭✭✭Have fun wasting your points in flurry and then wonder why you get kicked out of trials.2
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demonlkojipub19_ESO✭✭✭✭✭tankqullb16_ESO wrote: »
Sure we can. Take 50% of the cost of dodging, sneaking, blocking, roll dodging, Bashing, and CC breaking and make it a magicka cost.
Even if they do that (and they wont) there are still weaponskills that need some love.1 -
dastone✭✭I DW. I was thinking about this today. You could double the damage on the weapon skills and they still would not be OPed. And still I doubt I would have more then 2 DW skills on my hard bar. Weapon skill don't compare at all. Look at the numbers. Only reason to have one is cause you have sta pool to use some damage is better then no damage.
As nothing to do with roll or dodge using stamina if anything that is a reason to make the better the magic skill. But they are so far behind it is apples and organges and currently a spell magic. Weapon skills are so bad and far behind makes one wonder it had to be intentional but why??0 -
EnOeZ✭✭✭✭... and "Balance" 2H passive skill (-20% stamina cost) is now not working - at least on character sheet
And 2H is indeed way more stamina heavy than DW. 1 -
RangerChad✭✭✭I think the sword and board taunt should be an AoE, the character can do a spin move and anything within 5 meters is agro'd on the tank. Also the morph for the armor gain should apply as well so that the tank won't get stomped for having all the agro.0
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LordTareq✭✭✭✭✭Completely agree with the OP, weapon skills are massively lagging behind class skills. Each skill line should be competitive when you slot all of its skills. Try slotting every one-handed & shield ability and you will instantly notice that it's not competitive: you'll be out of stamina after 10 seconds of fighting. And its not even close in survivability to some of the defensive class skills. For example Dark Cloak (nightblade shadow ability) easily beats anything in the one-handed & shield line defensively speaking.
And even when comparing skills side by side the difference is obvious to all but the developers apparently. Invested in stamina and no magicka at all my Pierce Armor (one handed & shield skill that taunts and debuffs armour) still does 20% less damage than my Conceiled Strike (nightblade shadow ability that also stuns when used from stealth/invisibility, when morphed increases stealth movement, and boosts stamina regen after its use) which in addition to doing higher damage, consumes magicka which leaves me more resources for blocking/sprinting/dodging1 -
Gisgo✭✭✭✭✭
I dont see the connection between posting on these same boards you are reading and having to worry about being kicked from a pve group i dont want to join anyway.
Edited by Gisgo on 2 June 2014 06:480 -
Still_Mind✭✭✭
There's no PvP skill lines discussion forum. The only section in the PvP forum is the Alliance War.Edited by Still_Mind on 2 June 2014 13:08"I'm not *giving* him cake, I'm *assaulting* him with cake!"3 -
Crescent✭✭✭✭
Who cares about ESO PvP it's hardly competitive and full of cheesy builds. I mean, as far as any PvP gaming community is concerned you're just a scrub if you think ESO PvP means anything compared to games that actually have a tournament scene.
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demonlkojipub19_ESO✭✭✭✭✭demonlkojipub19_ESO wrote: »
More accurately, Cleave, uppercut, and overhead slice dont seem to be getting the full 20% stamina cost reduction and instead get 10%. Critical charge and momentum seem to get 20%.1 -
ZOS_AlanGadminHi everyone, just a quick reminder to keep your conversations civil and constructive. It's perfectly fine for people to disagree and debate, but flaming others is not acceptable per the forum rules.Forum Rules | Promoting Constructive Discussion | Code of Conduct | Terms of Service | Help Site
I’ve moved to a new position and I am no longer active on this forum. For assistance, please check the resources linked above2 -
khele23eb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Stop making people think threads have ZOS replies worth reading -_-Edited by khele23eb17_ESO on 4 June 2014 14:33P2P offered you 'hell yeah!' moments. F2P offers you 'thank god its over' moments.10 -
LariahHunding✭✭✭✭khele23eb17_ESO wrote: »Stop making people think theres a ZOS reply worth reading in a thread...
Yep, I'm disappointed all time. Jump in a thread, maybe learn something. Nope, t's a "Y'all play pretty with each other" reply, like my grandma use to tell us as children.
"Give a man a sweet roll, he only has one to steal. Give him a sweet roll recipe, he have bunches to steal."
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temjiu✭✭✭✭Stamina skills ARE under-performing. Your right OP. Doesn't matter what the situation, they need a boost, and some serious rethinking of their resource objectives. Period. But I think we need to be a bit more pro-active on our threads now. ZOS is getting the point. We aren't happy. we need to instead be constructive, and offer ideas. Think I'll start a post to consolidate ideas. might as well...not really playing the game at this point because VR is nigh unplayable with my preferred builds (mostly melee...go figure).3
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demonlkojipub19_ESO✭✭✭✭✭Stamina skills ARE under-performing. Your right OP. Doesn't matter what the situation, they need a boost, and some serious rethinking of their resource objectives. Period. But I think we need to be a bit more pro-active on our threads now. ZOS is getting the point. We aren't happy. we need to instead be constructive, and offer ideas. Think I'll start a post to consolidate ideas. might as well...not really playing the game at this point because VR is nigh unplayable with my preferred builds (mostly melee...go figure).
Not the point enough since there isn't anything in 1.2 to balance stam vs magicka either.Edited by demonlkojipub19_ESO on 4 June 2014 17:200 -
steinernein✭✭I think you guys may be missing a view point as to why they are either hesitant to buff stamina based abilities or very slow at it.0
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Shaun98ca2✭✭✭✭✭Well I believe Stamina is currently where they want it at. I think its really people are missing the point of a Stamina Build.
A full on Stamina Build gains excessive damage in Light/Heavy Attacks. IF you figure that's where the majority of your damage is coming from then having Stamina PLUS the increased survivability of Stamina using Block, Dodge, Stun starts to put the reduced damage into perspective.
Also looking at most Stamina Hotbar abilities they don't really seem like they are meant to be "spammed" more like situational bonuses to your strong Light/Heavy Attack.
WHY does it seem like Stamina builds are weaker than Magicka build because inherently they are SUPPOSED to be. As a Stamina build can sustain its damage infinitely, while a Magicka build is SUPPOSED to run out of Magicka and then once that happens their DPS would PLUMMET bellow that of a Full Stamina users DPS.
Full Magicka users have High Damage Low Sustainment - This theory WORKS if you look at a Templar with NO Magicka Management and realize NightBlades Magicka Management is getting screwed in patch 1.2.
Full Stamina users have Standard Damage Low Sustainment, High Survivability.
Full Magicka user runs out of Magicka their DPS becomes lower than a Stamina users, thus creating the balance. But Magicka users ARENT running out of Magicka but it looks like Devs ARE addressing that issue.4
