Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Yes you can be aggressive but no one in their right mind is ONLY going to hit someone with a shield...
This is not strictly true. A skilled shield user can kill with just a shield. I am sure there is historical evidence of this but I don't have the dedication to dig it up.
lol well I see your point.... let me add a slightly off topic theory..... Since they "fixed" aoe capping, why not cap how many people you can block at once? surely 4 guys surrounding you can't all be blocked at the same time... if that was fixed I wouldn't care the damage of shield bash because he wouldn't be able to block enough people to survive.
Hey, so long as they don't make tanking super easy mode, I aint fussed. In lotro I can take on like 18 enemies AT ONCE [if I can find enough in a small enough area] and be like "meh, what are these flies up to *le-sigh* guess I ought to swat em" But yea, no shield user can block an attack the shield cant cover. It tends to be 180 degrees or something such as that. Have you got all 4 enemies in front, or two behind two in front? Only positioning is vital. If all are in front, a skilled shield user could foreseeably block all four.
Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Yes you can be aggressive but no one in their right mind is ONLY going to hit someone with a shield...
This is not strictly true. A skilled shield user can kill with just a shield. I am sure there is historical evidence of this but I don't have the dedication to dig it up.
Ruze is a veteran of the PC Beta, lived through the year one drought, survived the buy-to-play conversion, and has stepped foot in the hells known as Craglorn. He mained a nightlbade when nightblades weren't good, and has never worn a robe. He converted from PC during the console betas, and hasn't regretted it a moment since.
He'd rank ESO:TU (in it's current state) a 4.8 out of 5, loving the game almost entirely.
Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Yes you can be aggressive but no one in their right mind is ONLY going to hit someone with a shield...
This is not strictly true. A skilled shield user can kill with just a shield. I am sure there is historical evidence of this but I don't have the dedication to dig it up.
lol well I see your point.... let me add a slightly off topic theory..... Since they "fixed" aoe capping, why not cap how many people you can block at once? surely 4 guys surrounding you can't all be blocked at the same time... if that was fixed I wouldn't care the damage of shield bash because he wouldn't be able to block enough people to survive.
Hey, so long as they don't make tanking super easy mode, I aint fussed. In lotro I can take on like 18 enemies AT ONCE [if I can find enough in a small enough area] and be like "meh, what are these flies up to *le-sigh* guess I ought to swat em" But yea, no shield user can block an attack the shield cant cover. It tends to be 180 degrees or something such as that. Have you got all 4 enemies in front, or two behind two in front? Only positioning is vital. If all are in front, a skilled shield user could foreseeably block all four.
I was on my nightblade and I always attack from behind the enemy... they took less damage actually while blocking.
Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Yes you can be aggressive but no one in their right mind is ONLY going to hit someone with a shield...
This is not strictly true. A skilled shield user can kill with just a shield. I am sure there is historical evidence of this but I don't have the dedication to dig it up.
lol well I see your point.... let me add a slightly off topic theory..... Since they "fixed" aoe capping, why not cap how many people you can block at once? surely 4 guys surrounding you can't all be blocked at the same time... if that was fixed I wouldn't care the damage of shield bash because he wouldn't be able to block enough people to survive.
Hey, so long as they don't make tanking super easy mode, I aint fussed. In lotro I can take on like 18 enemies AT ONCE [if I can find enough in a small enough area] and be like "meh, what are these flies up to *le-sigh* guess I ought to swat em" But yea, no shield user can block an attack the shield cant cover. It tends to be 180 degrees or something such as that. Have you got all 4 enemies in front, or two behind two in front? Only positioning is vital. If all are in front, a skilled shield user could foreseeably block all four.
I was on my nightblade and I always attack from behind the enemy... they took less damage actually while blocking.
From behind? That makes no sense whatsoever, how can you take less damage while blocking while not actually blocking your opponents attacks with the shield...it only blocks frontal, or anywhere the shield user can move his shield arm to in time to block an attack. I take it you did get the jump and they had not turned before you attacked?
Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Yes you can be aggressive but no one in their right mind is ONLY going to hit someone with a shield...
This is not strictly true. A skilled shield user can kill with just a shield. I am sure there is historical evidence of this but I don't have the dedication to dig it up.
lol well I see your point.... let me add a slightly off topic theory..... Since they "fixed" aoe capping, why not cap how many people you can block at once? surely 4 guys surrounding you can't all be blocked at the same time... if that was fixed I wouldn't care the damage of shield bash because he wouldn't be able to block enough people to survive.
Hey, so long as they don't make tanking super easy mode, I aint fussed. In lotro I can take on like 18 enemies AT ONCE [if I can find enough in a small enough area] and be like "meh, what are these flies up to *le-sigh* guess I ought to swat em" But yea, no shield user can block an attack the shield cant cover. It tends to be 180 degrees or something such as that. Have you got all 4 enemies in front, or two behind two in front? Only positioning is vital. If all are in front, a skilled shield user could foreseeably block all four.
I was on my nightblade and I always attack from behind the enemy... they took less damage actually while blocking.
From behind? That makes no sense whatsoever, how can you take less damage while blocking while not actually blocking your opponents attacks with the shield...it only blocks frontal, or anywhere the shield user can move his shield arm to in time to block an attack. I take it you did get the jump and they had not turned before you attacked?
they were blocking 3 guys and I was stealthed.... no way they knew and they didn't turn around til he killed one of the guys first.
Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Yes you can be aggressive but no one in their right mind is ONLY going to hit someone with a shield...
This is not strictly true. A skilled shield user can kill with just a shield. I am sure there is historical evidence of this but I don't have the dedication to dig it up.
lol well I see your point.... let me add a slightly off topic theory..... Since they "fixed" aoe capping, why not cap how many people you can block at once? surely 4 guys surrounding you can't all be blocked at the same time... if that was fixed I wouldn't care the damage of shield bash because he wouldn't be able to block enough people to survive.
Hey, so long as they don't make tanking super easy mode, I aint fussed. In lotro I can take on like 18 enemies AT ONCE [if I can find enough in a small enough area] and be like "meh, what are these flies up to *le-sigh* guess I ought to swat em" But yea, no shield user can block an attack the shield cant cover. It tends to be 180 degrees or something such as that. Have you got all 4 enemies in front, or two behind two in front? Only positioning is vital. If all are in front, a skilled shield user could foreseeably block all four.
I was on my nightblade and I always attack from behind the enemy... they took less damage actually while blocking.
From behind? That makes no sense whatsoever, how can you take less damage while blocking while not actually blocking your opponents attacks with the shield...it only blocks frontal, or anywhere the shield user can move his shield arm to in time to block an attack. I take it you did get the jump and they had not turned before you attacked?
they were blocking 3 guys and I was stealthed.... no way they knew and they didn't turn around til he killed one of the guys first.
A defensive posture is useless when you are defending the wrong way, this is why I don't get how they could take less damage while blocking the wrong way to the attacks.
Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Requiemslove wrote: »Drazticulous wrote: »Yes you can be aggressive but no one in their right mind is ONLY going to hit someone with a shield...
This is not strictly true. A skilled shield user can kill with just a shield. I am sure there is historical evidence of this but I don't have the dedication to dig it up.
lol well I see your point.... let me add a slightly off topic theory..... Since they "fixed" aoe capping, why not cap how many people you can block at once? surely 4 guys surrounding you can't all be blocked at the same time... if that was fixed I wouldn't care the damage of shield bash because he wouldn't be able to block enough people to survive.
Hey, so long as they don't make tanking super easy mode, I aint fussed. In lotro I can take on like 18 enemies AT ONCE [if I can find enough in a small enough area] and be like "meh, what are these flies up to *le-sigh* guess I ought to swat em" But yea, no shield user can block an attack the shield cant cover. It tends to be 180 degrees or something such as that. Have you got all 4 enemies in front, or two behind two in front? Only positioning is vital. If all are in front, a skilled shield user could foreseeably block all four.
I was on my nightblade and I always attack from behind the enemy... they took less damage actually while blocking.
From behind? That makes no sense whatsoever, how can you take less damage while blocking while not actually blocking your opponents attacks with the shield...it only blocks frontal, or anywhere the shield user can move his shield arm to in time to block an attack. I take it you did get the jump and they had not turned before you attacked?
they were blocking 3 guys and I was stealthed.... no way they knew and they didn't turn around til he killed one of the guys first.
A defensive posture is useless when you are defending the wrong way, this is why I don't get how they could take less damage while blocking the wrong way to the attacks.
Even in PVE when a mob jumps over my head and start a big attack I don't even look at them and still block...
Maverick827 wrote: »Anyone who was for the shield bash nerf is a caster or doesn't mind that their weapon-using character is terrible comparatively.
It's called balancing. It's in order to make each playstyle viable compared to the others. Yes, this is something they should have had right at launch, but various tweaks will be needed and this time around it's just bash that is getting altered.First off, bash spamming is cheap and annoying. If you've gone up against someone that does this in pvp, you'd probably understand why so many people called for the nerf.
Wah, it was cheap and annoying. Like sneak attacks. Or bolt escape. Or healing faster than you can do damage. Or being snared in talon or another ability. Or any other ability you cannot immidiately counter. Wah. Cheap. Annoying. It prevents me from winning PvP. Nerf it. Wah.
Man, this kind of thing gets up my nose.
It's called balancing. It's in order to make each playstyle viable compared to the others. Yes, this is something they should have had right at launch, but various tweaks will be needed and this time around it's just bash that is getting altered.First off, bash spamming is cheap and annoying. If you've gone up against someone that does this in pvp, you'd probably understand why so many people called for the nerf.
Wah, it was cheap and annoying. Like sneak attacks. Or bolt escape. Or healing faster than you can do damage. Or being snared in talon or another ability. Or any other ability you cannot immidiately counter. Wah. Cheap. Annoying. It prevents me from winning PvP. Nerf it. Wah.
Man, this kind of thing gets up my nose.
Eventually they'll level the playing field for all skill lines, I'm sure and I know it must be more than frustrating when something like this happens.
Instead of saying "give it back!" just acknowledge that yes, this was a skill which was abused and gave the users an unfair advantage, then offer something you believe would be fair to help you. Like I said, an alternate option would be allowing sword & board users to deal more damage with their various skills so that they don't need to rely on just one. I've tried out most weapon types, so I know first hand that the offensive skills are nowhere near as tough as they should be.
ferzalrwb17_ESO wrote: »So many bashspammer threads talking about the "history" of shield use where a one-second-wiki-expert cherrypicks some info about shields they want to apply here.
Should someone tell them, for example, that, historically, it wasn't possible to protect your back by holding out your shield in front of you? Historically, shields did not have a forcefield. I'm pretty certain of that.
First off, bash spamming is cheap and annoying. If you've gone up against someone that does this in pvp, you'd probably understand why so many people called for the nerf.
Second, what I think should happen next is that 1h+shield users should have their offensive skills buffed as they're fairly weak as is so that they can be competitive in combat without having to rely on cheap tactics to have survivability.
I don't PVP, I was trying to PVE, but can't do that now because of PVPers. Couldn't they just nerf it's effect in PVP?
are you pretending that people runing around boping around with a shield wasn't incredibly cheesy and silly then you are stupid, frankly.
every time I saw someone run into a dungeon with there shield out just POP POP POPING away I facepalmed and knew as soon as it was nerfed they would have NO idea how to play.
If you want to get stupid I seriously doubt anyone in the days of sword and board went around casting lightening just like I'm sure they didn't run into caves of trolls holding there shield in there hand popping with it over and over. if that was the case why not hold two?!?!?
seriously come on... you guys knew it was pure cheese and needed a nerf.
Dual shields could be fun. and as for not knowing how to play? Of course we don't. We leveled up our play style and it was made useless. So we don't know how to play any other way yet. Clearly I should be like you and know how to play every build and every setup. We don't know how to play because we now have to respec, relevel, reset, and relearn how to play.
I'm calling your bluff, what's your new build, and how much did it cost for you to switch to it from a shield bash build?To be honest the shield bash Nerf did wonders for me. Its made a me a much better player since I had to totally rethink my class. I now have a tanky DPS DK that can kill players just as fast as I could with shield bash.
However this time there is a sequence to the attack and involves timing of abilities rather than spamming one thing.
Listening to the people cry about the nerf is hillarious. It's exactly word for word what people always said on the WOW forums when <insert FOTM build here> was nerfed.
I swear, it's like listening to an army of Daleks. Except instead of saying EX-TER-MIN-ATE they are saying NERF. Now I've got a mental image of 1000 Daleks all saying Nerf, and it's cracking me up.
Maverick827 wrote: »I'm calling your bluff, what's your new build, and how much did it cost for you to switch to it from a shield bash build?To be honest the shield bash Nerf did wonders for me. Its made a me a much better player since I had to totally rethink my class. I now have a tanky DPS DK that can kill players just as fast as I could with shield bash.
However this time there is a sequence to the attack and involves timing of abilities rather than spamming one thing.
Bash is not used to block damage. Block is used to block damage. Bash is used to do damage while blocking, or at least it did until people like you thought that my PVE style was too cheap. It is supposed to interrupt spells, but then suddenly there is a passive that turns it into Deadly bash I guess the word deadly is lost on you.
EDIT: For those saying shield bash shouldn't do as much damage as a regular attack. What are you basing this off of? Shield bash has a stamina cost, normal attack does not, so it SHOULD do more damage.