Still no auction house, seriously??

Ir0nB34r · November 2016

The ONLY change that I would like to see is a Zone trader. Basically a trader that has access to all the stock of every Guild Trader in the zone collected into one spot. The trader would be located in the main city area's bank or something for that zone. But all of the guild traders still operate the same separately as they do now as well.

This is only mostly because yesterday I spent a great deal of time visiting something like 30 or more guild traders across 5 or 6 zones trying to find a CP150-160 food recipe.

[Deleted User] · November 2016

Hello everyone,

Recently we've removed a few posts for some unneeded back and forth. For further discussion on the matter, do try to be civil with one another, regardless of where they stand on the matter. Please keep in mind that flaming is against the Forum Rules, as it only leads to thread derailment.

Thank you for understanding!

Korah_Eaglecry · November 2016

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

Pendrillion · November 2016

Whats better? Goldseller running in all gates and driving prices up and having the very same monopoly... Or doing this via Kiosk...

Doesnt matter much no?

AlnilamE · November 2016

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

That is entirely your choice. But anything in this game that you don't find at the first town hub would be so rare in a game with an AH that you would spend all your playing time camping the AH to get it. And that's not fun either.

Artis · November 2016

Solus wrote: »

Everyone that has commented has missed my point entirely, explaining around everything BUT what i was stating.

For example: People in ETU (one of the trade guilds I'm in) have sold sharp Spriggan's daggers for 299,999.00 I sell them for 375,000.00 (I had 3 of them)

Do their's sell out first? Yes. Would their's have still sold if they priced it exactly the same as mine? Yes. (I only have one left for sale)

My point was, if things are selling for "x" amount, why would you sell something for way less than what its actually selling for? Just to get it sold right then? You lose out on gold yourself, and you tell the people shopping with you to expect a lower price. Not that the item isn't worth what I'm posting, at all. And then its a domino effect from there as now other traders see that (as i look at local traders when determining my price as well) the price is lower so they feel the need to go even lower than that, and its just a back and forth from there where people are just destroying the economy of an item artificially, literally for no reason other than to quickly sell. Personally, when i see that, It P*sses me off. Reason being, that person that started that chain of effects has taken money out of my pocket, and also the guild... and also themselves.

I'm the kind of person to wait for my stuff to sell. My daggers didn't sell right away, but I gained 150k by waiting.

That's all i was saying.

Ok? So you want to sell them for 375k. And they want to sell one for 299k and then list and sell another one for 299k while you're still selling your 375k one. Yes, maybe they would've sold it, but what if they play a lot and need to move a lot of stuff? You know how they sometimes sell used cars really cheap just to move them so they have space for more. Each guild only has 30 slots, so...

My point is that you don't know how the price is formed. It's formed by the market, by supply and demand. Other supply the same items for cheaper price, if it works for them - it's good. They strategy might be (and is) different from you. They want to sell more stuff faster, so they can list more and sell it too. Now you either wait until the moment when their supply doesn't meet demand and customers will have to buy from you, or lower the price. That's just how the market works. That "domino" effect is the market talking. It p*sses you off? Tough beans.

They aren't destroying economy. They ARE economy. And you are just the victim of competition. Either you adapt, or sell longer and keep your slots occupied longer. IT's up to you. But they aren't missing out on gold. In fact, they are making more than you per unit time because they sell more and faster. If you play a lot or have good RNG you just get stuff. And you have to sell it to make room for more and to have space in bags.

If you like waiting - wait. But do yourself and your nervous system a favor and don't get pissed off. They do what they want and get as much gold as they think is enough for what they sell. You made 150K more on three items? Well meanwhile they sold 2 of them for your 1 and made 225k more gold . See the scale? You make 75k more per 1, but they made 225k in shorter period of time because they sold 2 while you were waiting for 1 to sell.

All I"m trying to say is that it's understandably annoying to you that you have to wait and decrease the price because of others, but that's how economy works. Why do you expect them to sell for more? Just because it's better for you? Maybe for them it's more efficient to sell faster because they get stuff faster.

It's supply and demand, so don't get all sad about it. It's just how big systems with supply and demand work.

Smashington357 · November 2016

AlnilamE wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

That is entirely your choice. But anything in this game that you don't find at the first town hub would be so rare in a game with an AH that you would spend all your playing time camping the AH to get it. And that's not fun either.

I'm not sure what platform you play on but on PS4 there are widely different selections at each hub. And no i don't spend ten seconds camping an AH its either there or it isn't rather than travel to every hub in the know world i can get that answer in ten seconds. I completely disagree with your assessment in every way.

Callous2208 · November 2016

Smashington357 wrote: »

AlnilamE wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

That is entirely your choice. But anything in this game that you don't find at the first town hub would be so rare in a game with an AH that you would spend all your playing time camping the AH to get it. And that's not fun either.

I'm not sure what platform you play on but on PS4 there are widely different selections at each hub. And no i don't spend ten seconds camping an AH its either there or it isn't rather than travel to every hub in the know world i can get that answer in ten seconds. I completely disagree with your assessment in every way.

PC has roughly the same thing in every faction hubs trader. If you're on console, you may have limited experience with mmorpg auction houses. You would not have experienced the "sniping" of items off of the market as soon as they appear. This is an issue in many MMO's with a global AH system. People, or in a lot of cases bots, camp the interface or run scripts to scoop up all the rare stuff as soon as it's posted. This leaves you to either walk away frustrated with no item, or give in and camp the AH yourself. I believe this is what the poster you quoted was referring to.

Callous2208 · November 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

Majic · November 2016

Pendrillion wrote: »

Whats better? Goldseller running in all gates and driving prices up and having the very same monopoly... Or doing this via Kiosk...

Doesnt matter much no?

At least with the current system, they get more exercise.

Smashington357 · November 2016

We should take this time to reflect back on the things ZOS and people on this forum said would never happen. Console text chat. Remember that? everyone said never yet here it is. Dropping the subscription model. People said that would never happen ye there we are. Monster sets available for purchase. Said it would never happen, yet here we are. AH needs to happen just the same. The sooner they wrap their heads around it the better it will be for all. This game will be free to play before you know it. Go ahead and say that won't happen too ill be around when it does.

Callous2208 · November 2016

Smashington357 wrote: »

We should take this time to reflect back on the things ZOS and people on this forum said would never happen. Console text chat. Remember that? everyone said never yet here it is. Dropping the subscription model. People said that would never happen ye there we are. Monster sets available for purchase. Said it would never happen, yet here we are. AH needs to happen just the same. The sooner they wrap their heads around it the better it will be for all. This game will be free to play before you know it. Go ahead and say that won't happen too ill be around when it does.

I'm confused again but really don't want another moderation. Is this still a discussion or are you making decisions for ESO as well as making our minds up for us? It will not be better for me and what I'd argue is the majority of PC players who are fine with the system as is. Also, what do your last lines add to any of what's been discussed? I believe it's time for you to just let this one go as now you've moved on to predicting the future and making sweeping generalizations.

Korah_Eaglecry · November 2016

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

Callous2208 · November 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

I apologize. I was not aware that ZoS implemented a system in which the only way to sell goods was through a guild trader system. I did not realize that a players choice to voluntarily sit out and not participate in a trader guild, instead utilizing other viable avenues of trade in game was, the same as being forced to do something. I did not pick up on the fact that competing with bots and AH barons for elite and rare gear in a global system was far more engaging than the ins and outs of the many small markets we can utilize now. A refusal to participate, inability to understand, or unwillingness to put forth any more effort than list, click, sell, does not mean the system is faulty. It also does nothing to dissuade myself or others from effectively using it and enjoying it. Trust me, there's just as much eye rolling and laughter on this end, when someone claims a global AH is ever a good system for an mmorpg.

Korah_Eaglecry · November 2016

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

I apologize. I was not aware that ZoS implemented a system in which the only way to sell goods was through a guild trader system. I did not realize that a players choice to voluntarily sit out and not participate in a trader guild, instead utilizing other viable avenues of trade in game was, the same as being forced to do something. I did not pick up on the fact that competing with bots and AH barons for elite and rare gear in a global system was far more engaging than the ins and outs of the many small markets we can utilize now. A refusal to participate, inability to understand, or unwillingness to put forth any more effort than list, click, sell, does not mean the system is faulty. It also does nothing to dissuade myself or others from effectively using it and enjoying it. Trust me, there's just as much eye rolling and laughter on this end, when someone claims a global AH is ever a good system for an mmorpg.

Alright smartass. Lets do this by the numbers then shall we? Since youre under the impression that players are just "sitting out" when their only option is to join a guild or to hock their wares to strangers in Text Chat. And you know what. Because Im a fair guy Im going to go with a small population size over all 6 servers and assume that all Guild Traders are taken and each Guild using them are full with active players. We're also going to assume that each player is only active in one Guild with a Guild Trader.

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

jedtb16_ESO · November 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

I apologize. I was not aware that ZoS implemented a system in which the only way to sell goods was through a guild trader system. I did not realize that a players choice to voluntarily sit out and not participate in a trader guild, instead utilizing other viable avenues of trade in game was, the same as being forced to do something. I did not pick up on the fact that competing with bots and AH barons for elite and rare gear in a global system was far more engaging than the ins and outs of the many small markets we can utilize now. A refusal to participate, inability to understand, or unwillingness to put forth any more effort than list, click, sell, does not mean the system is faulty. It also does nothing to dissuade myself or others from effectively using it and enjoying it. Trust me, there's just as much eye rolling and laughter on this end, when someone claims a global AH is ever a good system for an mmorpg.

Alright smartass. Lets do this by the numbers then shall we? Since youre under the impression that players are just "sitting out" when their only option is to join a guild or to hock their wares to strangers in Text Chat. And you know what. Because Im a fair guy Im going to go with a small population size over all 6 servers and assume that all Guild Traders are taken and each Guild using them are full with active players. We're also going to assume that each player is only active in one Guild with a Guild Trader.

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

the statement i put in bold is false..... anyone can offer goods for sale at any time.

Korah_Eaglecry · November 2016

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

I apologize. I was not aware that ZoS implemented a system in which the only way to sell goods was through a guild trader system. I did not realize that a players choice to voluntarily sit out and not participate in a trader guild, instead utilizing other viable avenues of trade in game was, the same as being forced to do something. I did not pick up on the fact that competing with bots and AH barons for elite and rare gear in a global system was far more engaging than the ins and outs of the many small markets we can utilize now. A refusal to participate, inability to understand, or unwillingness to put forth any more effort than list, click, sell, does not mean the system is faulty. It also does nothing to dissuade myself or others from effectively using it and enjoying it. Trust me, there's just as much eye rolling and laughter on this end, when someone claims a global AH is ever a good system for an mmorpg.

Alright smartass. Lets do this by the numbers then shall we? Since youre under the impression that players are just "sitting out" when their only option is to join a guild or to hock their wares to strangers in Text Chat. And you know what. Because Im a fair guy Im going to go with a small population size over all 6 servers and assume that all Guild Traders are taken and each Guild using them are full with active players. We're also going to assume that each player is only active in one Guild with a Guild Trader.

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

the statement i put in bold is false..... anyone can offer goods for sale at any time.

The statement is true. In the context of using the Guild Traders....At least try and follow the math if youre going to accuse me of making a false statement.

Smashington357 · November 2016

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

I apologize. I was not aware that ZoS implemented a system in which the only way to sell goods was through a guild trader system. I did not realize that a players choice to voluntarily sit out and not participate in a trader guild, instead utilizing other viable avenues of trade in game was, the same as being forced to do something. I did not pick up on the fact that competing with bots and AH barons for elite and rare gear in a global system was far more engaging than the ins and outs of the many small markets we can utilize now. A refusal to participate, inability to understand, or unwillingness to put forth any more effort than list, click, sell, does not mean the system is faulty. It also does nothing to dissuade myself or others from effectively using it and enjoying it. Trust me, there's just as much eye rolling and laughter on this end, when someone claims a global AH is ever a good system for an mmorpg.

Alright smartass. Lets do this by the numbers then shall we? Since youre under the impression that players are just "sitting out" when their only option is to join a guild or to hock their wares to strangers in Text Chat. And you know what. Because Im a fair guy Im going to go with a small population size over all 6 servers and assume that all Guild Traders are taken and each Guild using them are full with active players. We're also going to assume that each player is only active in one Guild with a Guild Trader.

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

the statement i put in bold is false..... anyone can offer goods for sale at any time.

You mean they can spam text/voice chat at anytime stand there an undetermined amount of time hoping someone wants what they have at the price they offer. Doesn't sound like a good way to spend your time over the AH system that doesn't exclude 88% of the playerbase from selling items conveniently. I'd rather go play the game and AH do the standing around for me. I get that some people like to hang in towns and that's awesome for them. It's just not for everyone and even with adding an AH they don't lose that ability.

Artis · November 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

Tbh, I"m not sure why you'd base your math on what he said. It's the same person who said there will be no paywalls and the game will be p2p and blahblahblah. Oh, and who also wrote about small incremental changes in his "Road ahead" letters, when instead they change balance completely and rarely.

For all we know, he lied, and the population of each server is like 20000-30000.

After all, why don't we see so many people complaining about not having AH? How come most player we see on forums support that system and that's considering the fact that forums are usually biased towards unsatisfied people (satisfied people mostly won't even go there cause they have nothing to complain about).

newtinmpls · November 2016

Callous2208 wrote: »

PC has roughly the same thing in every faction hubs trader. If you're on console, you may have limited experience with mmorpg auction houses. You would not have experienced the "sniping" of items off of the market as soon as they appear. This is an issue in many MMO's with a global AH system. People, or in a lot of cases bots, camp the interface or run scripts to scoop up all the rare stuff as soon as it's posted. This leaves you to either walk away frustrated with no item, or give in and camp the AH yourself. I believe this is what the poster you quoted was referring to.

Wow.

That does seem like a major flaw.

At least this way folks can only cartel a limited amount.

Korah_Eaglecry · November 2016

Artis wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

Tbh, I"m not sure why you'd base your math on what he said. It's the same person who said there will be no paywalls and the game will be p2p and blahblahblah. Oh, and who also wrote about small incremental changes in his "Road ahead" letters, when instead they change balance completely and rarely.

For all we know, he lied, and the population of each server is like 20000-30000.

After all, why don't we see so many people complaining about not having AH? How come most player we see on forums support that system and that's considering the fact that forums are usually biased towards unsatisfied people (satisfied people mostly won't even go there cause they have nothing to complain about).

He has no reason to make up 7 million unique accounts. What an odd number to choose. Why not 10 million or 15? And I wasnt actually going off of what he said. Im really not sure why people are struggling with the math in that post as its OBVIOUS that 2 million was used. A fraction of what 7 million is. And its quite a fair number considering we have 2 Servers for each Platform. ESO Plus on PS4 has been one of the most bought Add-Ons for PS4 for close to 2 years now. For that to be a thing there has to be very large and very healthy population on ESO.

And you think that they would be able to employee 30 employees with a population of something like 180,000 players? This game would be dead with those numbers.

As for people complaining...I dont know how long youve been on these forums. But its been a constant topic of debate since the game launched in 2014. As for the make up of forum goers.....I dont know where you got the idea that only unsatisfied players come to the forums. But the vast majority of players that are unsatisfied quit without so much as a peep on these forums.

jedtb16_ESO · November 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

I apologize. I was not aware that ZoS implemented a system in which the only way to sell goods was through a guild trader system. I did not realize that a players choice to voluntarily sit out and not participate in a trader guild, instead utilizing other viable avenues of trade in game was, the same as being forced to do something. I did not pick up on the fact that competing with bots and AH barons for elite and rare gear in a global system was far more engaging than the ins and outs of the many small markets we can utilize now. A refusal to participate, inability to understand, or unwillingness to put forth any more effort than list, click, sell, does not mean the system is faulty. It also does nothing to dissuade myself or others from effectively using it and enjoying it. Trust me, there's just as much eye rolling and laughter on this end, when someone claims a global AH is ever a good system for an mmorpg.

Alright smartass. Lets do this by the numbers then shall we? Since youre under the impression that players are just "sitting out" when their only option is to join a guild or to hock their wares to strangers in Text Chat. And you know what. Because Im a fair guy Im going to go with a small population size over all 6 servers and assume that all Guild Traders are taken and each Guild using them are full with active players. We're also going to assume that each player is only active in one Guild with a Guild Trader.

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

the statement i put in bold is false..... anyone can offer goods for sale at any time.

The statement is true. In the context of using the Guild Traders....At least try and follow the math if youre going to accuse me of making a false statement.

the arithmetic is trivial and the statement is true, and only true, if the only way to sell goods is via a guild trader. since a guild trader is not the only way to sell goods the statement is false..... it's called logic.

jedtb16_ESO · November 2016

double post

jedtb16_ESO · November 2016

Smashington357 wrote: »

jedtb16_ESO wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

Callous2208 wrote: »

Smashington357 wrote: »

I mean you can argue against auction house until the cows come home but the current system is flawed and a joke. Its a system of exclusion and inconvenience. There's no reason a person should have to travel all over an entire game world and spend hours to find and item they seek. That's backwards and puts a lot of people off. The trading player to player system is flawed too. All i see in chat is this guy scammed me that guy scammed me this person is a scammer. Why is it even possible to pull a scam? I won't trade player to player at all no matter what anyone says. I won't use a guild trader either no matter what anyone says. They are bad systems and I know because I've played with GOOD systems aka auction houses. You're not deterring gold sellers with this current system in the least hence all the posts about bots farming and gold sellers spamming chat. If you think you're deterring them you're delusional all this is doing is inconveniencing everyone.

I disagree, I think the system is far superior to all of the games I've played with an AH. Also I've never seen people shouting about getting ripped off in chat. Ever. At all. Since beta. Is this a console issue?

Yup Ps4 and its daily people shouting this ones a scammer that ones a scammer. Somehow they take the other persons items while withdrawing their own. And i seriously don't know how you can prefer this backwards travel all over the entire game world system to a central auction house. Why not at least have all the guild traders in one big bazaar? Why make it as inconvenient as possible then claim its better? It's not better no matter how many people claim it is. I'd love to poll players that left this game and see how many left over these reasons.

I like it better because I do. I like popping around to find deals sometimes. It's all subjective though. If I say it's better for me then it is. You stomping your feet and telling me I'm wrong won't change my mind, no matter how many tears you shed. I doubt very few people that left, did it because there was no AH. Everyone in my trade guilds, pve guild, and rp guilds likes this system better. Can I, based on this info, safely say that you are the one who is indeed in the wrong?

Would a centralized Zone Auction House harm your ability to pop around? Instead of travelling to 6 different Traders in one location all you had to do was go to 1. Youd know right away whether the item you were looking for was at that location and you could move on to another potential location. This quickens your search and allows you to get back to playing the game while allowing you to continue to play this tedious mini game of "Which Trader Has The Goods?".

Why would I pop around at all if there was one centralized spot? How would I find any good deals if everyone could see everything and it's price all on one screen at one AH location? How would I make any gold on supposedly rare items if every single player in the game was listing the same exact item in the same exact spot for all to see? Even when I'm searching traders I am playing the game, I do not feel rushed to get back to it. Besides, if the traders in the major hot spots don't have it, I move on. Takes maybe 10 minutes tops. If I really, really want that item, I might extend my search out a bit. No worries there either. Lastly, I can ask in zone. I can't recall the last time one of my "wtb" messages went unanswered in Mournhold. I like this system. It works for me and my Guildies. I never much cared for the AH in the thousands of other MMO's I played. Lucky for me I found an mmo that I enjoy that happens to have a an economic system that better suits me.

Re-read my comment. Youd still have to pop around to other zones for their Auction Houses.

I see what you're saying now, I think. So basically one open trader per zone? I could maybe see that. That's really not too far off from what we've got now. The major change of course being the guild requirements. Could work, idk. I just really am against the global AH system entirely.

Im a proponent of GAH but I know its not going to happen here. The Trade Guilds have a strangle hold on the system and many support it for whatever reasons. But I think a system that consolidates the Guild Traders and opens the door for more inclusion for players both sellers and buyers would help the game economy.

I believe those reason have been quite clearly stated in this thread by multiple people, and by many in the previous threads throughout this forums life. Inclusion is always a good thing in gaming, but total inclusion at the expense of a fair and engaging economic system like we have now, is not worth it to me. I would not be opposed to the system you suggested, with minor tweaks perhaps, but I will never support a global AH. I have not played an mmo in recent history with a GBH that I thought was even remotely a good system.

I wasnt questioning the reasons given. Just not in the mood to sit here and cover each one. As far as a fair and engaging economic system. Im going to hold back a laugh here because theres nothing fair about a system that requires you to join a Guild, bid on the opportunity to sell your wares and then cross your fingers you win. Any Guild thats been at it longer than their competition is going to be able to easily outbid them. The system is far from fair or engaging. Its the opposite. Its exclusive and demands players to participate in a tedious exercise that doesnt accomplish anything beyond exchanging goods for gold. Items are also listed at higher rates because not as many players are able to list their wares so things seem more rare than they actually are. The supply IS there its just not accessible in the current system.

I apologize. I was not aware that ZoS implemented a system in which the only way to sell goods was through a guild trader system. I did not realize that a players choice to voluntarily sit out and not participate in a trader guild, instead utilizing other viable avenues of trade in game was, the same as being forced to do something. I did not pick up on the fact that competing with bots and AH barons for elite and rare gear in a global system was far more engaging than the ins and outs of the many small markets we can utilize now. A refusal to participate, inability to understand, or unwillingness to put forth any more effort than list, click, sell, does not mean the system is faulty. It also does nothing to dissuade myself or others from effectively using it and enjoying it. Trust me, there's just as much eye rolling and laughter on this end, when someone claims a global AH is ever a good system for an mmorpg.

Alright smartass. Lets do this by the numbers then shall we? Since youre under the impression that players are just "sitting out" when their only option is to join a guild or to hock their wares to strangers in Text Chat. And you know what. Because Im a fair guy Im going to go with a small population size over all 6 servers and assume that all Guild Traders are taken and each Guild using them are full with active players. We're also going to assume that each player is only active in one Guild with a Guild Trader.

Matt Firor over the summer stated that there were 7 million unique accounts for ESO. Now we both know that 7 million accounts arent active right this moment. So lets go with a conservative 2 million players over all 6 servers. Bringing the total population per server to around 333,333 on each server. Such a low number SHOULD help you in your argument, yes?

Now we also know that theres something like 80 Guild Traders in the game. And we know that each guild can support 500 members per. So thats 40,000 active players selling wares in the Guild Traders on just one server. 240,000 players over 6 servers.

Thats 12% of the population on individual servers and 12% on all 6 total.

So on any given day or week in ESO, assuming everyone is active and all slots within these guilds are filled. A whopping 12% of the population may sell their wares to other players.

But we both know that many players are in multiple guilds that have traders and we know that multiple guilds hold multiple traders with their duplicate guilds. We also know that not every one of these guilds have filled every slot with active players. And we dont actually know the population size of all 6 servers.

But sure, the majority of players are just "sitting it out". It has nothing to do with limited space in guilds, limited guild traders and a system that benefits the few while excluding the many.

the statement i put in bold is false..... anyone can offer goods for sale at any time.

You mean they can spam text/voice chat at anytime stand there an undetermined amount of time hoping someone wants what they have at the price they offer. Doesn't sound like a good way to spend your time over the AH system that doesn't exclude 88% of the playerbase from selling items conveniently. I'd rather go play the game and AH do the standing around for me. I get that some people like to hang in towns and that's awesome for them. It's just not for everyone and even with adding an AH they don't lose that ability.

well, i can only speak of my experience and it has worked fine. oh, and i have never found it necessary to spam. if you are offering goods people are likely to want at a reasonable price in the right place it works.

Jeremy · November 2016

Glurin wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

You have to stay active and committed to a trading guild on this game just in order to do something as rudimentary as being able to sell your goods on the market. That's going to be annoying for many players - especially casual ones who take breaks from the game because it basically shuts them out the economy. I don't know what is so hard to understand about that.

What's hard to understand is why you think the economy should have to wait for you if you leave for an extended time.

You left the market. It's unreasonable to expect you can just pick up right where you left off as if nothing happened.

Except that I didn't say I think the economy should have to wait for me if I leave for an extended time. It helps if you read and reply to comments that I actually make if you want to understand them - instead of putting words in my mouth.

What I said is that requiring people to stay active and committed to a trading guild else they get shut out of the economy is going to be annoying for casual players. Many players (myself included) believe it is stupid to force players to have to stay active and committed to a guild simply to do something as basic as selling your goods on the market.

There is a reason no other MMORPG does this (or at least none I have ever played). Because it's bad design that discourages people from participating in the game's economy - especially newer players and casuals. How anyone can support such a system is something I'll never understand because it's about the dumbest economy I have ever seen on a game. Or at least one of them.

I for one have lost my patience with it and simply sell to vendors now. And I really doubt I'm the only one.

max_only · November 2016

I thought most things we pick up were trash anyway? Just decon it for the improvement mats and sell the mats in bulk no? I mean, I'm not at max level right now but just from visiting cities I can tell what pieces are actually worthwhile (worth holding on to and selling) and I don't have any of those. So selling mats in bulk by advertising in zone is my money maker. I kind of wish there was an AH but I certainly don't miss it or complain about it because I would rarely get a sale from one in games where it existed. There was always something better on sale and at a better price than what my casual butt could acquire --- except for mats. There is always a market for gathering mats, in every game with a halfway decent craft system.

Jeremy · November 2016

max_only wrote: »

I thought most things we pick up were trash anyway? Just decon it for the improvement mats and sell the mats in bulk no? I mean, I'm not at max level right now but just from visiting cities I can tell what pieces are actually worthwhile (worth holding on to and selling) and I don't have any of those. So selling mats in bulk by advertising in zone is my money maker. I kind of wish there was an AH but I certainly don't miss it or complain about it because I would rarely get a sale from one in games where it existed. There was always something better on sale and at a better price than what my casual butt could acquire --- except for mats. There is always a market for gathering mats, in every game with a halfway decent craft system.

Trade spam economies went out of style awhile ago (and for good reason). So if the developers of ESO are trying to bring that abomination back - I'm not going to support their efforts. In my opinion that system should stay dead and buried in the past where it belongs. Because the last thing I want to do when I sit down to play a game is stand around town advertising like some commercial while reading silly arguments about how much something is supposedly really worth. And don't even get me started on how annoying it was to constantly read people asking for price checks in guild chat due to the lack of a stable and centralized market since no one really knows what anything is worth.

At least you can buy stuff from guild traders now though. Used to you couldn't even do that unless you belonged to a trading guild. So things have gotten a little better at least.

Solus · November 2016

Artis wrote: »

Solus wrote: »

Everyone that has commented has missed my point entirely, explaining around everything BUT what i was stating.

For example: People in ETU (one of the trade guilds I'm in) have sold sharp Spriggan's daggers for 299,999.00 I sell them for 375,000.00 (I had 3 of them)

Do their's sell out first? Yes. Would their's have still sold if they priced it exactly the same as mine? Yes. (I only have one left for sale)

My point was, if things are selling for "x" amount, why would you sell something for way less than what its actually selling for? Just to get it sold right then? You lose out on gold yourself, and you tell the people shopping with you to expect a lower price. Not that the item isn't worth what I'm posting, at all. And then its a domino effect from there as now other traders see that (as i look at local traders when determining my price as well) the price is lower so they feel the need to go even lower than that, and its just a back and forth from there where people are just destroying the economy of an item artificially, literally for no reason other than to quickly sell. Personally, when i see that, It P*sses me off. Reason being, that person that started that chain of effects has taken money out of my pocket, and also the guild... and also themselves.

I'm the kind of person to wait for my stuff to sell. My daggers didn't sell right away, but I gained 150k by waiting.

That's all i was saying.

A- But they aren't missing out on gold. In fact, they are making more than you per unit time because they sell more and faster.

B- You made 150K more on three items?

A- I disagree with this. Take for example spriggan rings, that used to go for 30-35k. One person sells 2 @ 15k. while im selling them for, lets say 25. They arent hard to get, they arent easy to get. And they sell. What you are saying is they make more than I do selling at a lesser price than keeping pricing consistent and making more?

You're assuming that there is an over-abundance of an item for any one person and it isnt the case. (in rare cases, sure) Sometimes you get lucky. Like me getting 4 sharp daggers, (one i used), two sharp maces, 9 sharp bows.

B- two items. and two separate people sold them at 299,999.00, i sold the same two for 375,000.000, they made 599,998.00 and i made 750,000.00. (numbers before taxes) So no. I still made more, they still could have made more, my point with using the spriggan's weapons as an example is i see this happening everywhere, not only with the daggers. I only post things that sell, I dont waste my time with it. My point, still, is if pricing was kept consistent, and there are obvious sales meaning the item is desirable and there is data that shows a price there is no reason/point to completely lowball everyone, your guild and yourself.

You lost gold.

Your guild lost gold.

and now the customer base thinks a price should be set lower because they've seen it lowered. Same with other guilds. (going back to a domino effect of declining pricing.)

I farmed for a week and a half, 8-10 hour gaming sessions to get the gear that I did when the update launched, so i have a good feel for about how long it could take to get the drops that i did, sure its RNG so someone could get the same weapon over and over or ring over and over, but that is unlikely. By pricing an item so low, you've undersold your time that you invested to get that item, among other people too.

All of this is going through my head when i see people post things for way lower than necessary.

Solus · November 2016

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

Solus wrote: »

Artis wrote: »

Solus wrote: »

So i had to re-enter my items so they would sell. If they put an item for 35k i put it for 34,999k. Thats my "EFF YOU" to those people. seriously that screws the economy of what we find.

It also give you 1 more gold in profit. You always want your price to end with a 9. The listing fee becomes lower that way

Solus wrote: »

Just FYI, because by your response it sounds like you arent in a trade guild, listings stay for 30 days. Ive never had anything stay for more than half of that time. So if something sits, its not because i priced something too high, its because other people have spammed items at a lowball price.

D - Denial.

Man, the price is formed by supply and demand. The demand wasn't that high for your price to sell. Don't blame others. If people use "lowball" prices and their supply meets demand, then it's you who priced too high, not them who priced too low. That's how markets work.

Solus wrote: »

Just because someone sold a spriggan mace sharpened for 7k (yes, that did happen) doesnt mean thats what they go for.

They go for what they go for. If it goes for 7k and others don't sell, then demand is not that high. If it was high that one outlier for 7k wouldn't meet it and you would still sell.

Everyone that has commented has missed my point entirely, explaining around everything BUT what i was stating.

For example: People in ETU (one of the trade guilds I'm in) have sold sharp Spriggan's daggers for 299,999.00 I sell them for 375,000.00 (I had 3 of them)

Do their's sell out first? Yes. Would their's have still sold if they priced it exactly the same as mine? Yes. (I only have one left for sale)

My point was, if things are selling for "x" amount, why would you sell something for way less than what its actually selling for? Just to get it sold right then? You lose out on gold yourself, and you tell the people shopping with you to expect a lower price. Not that the item isn't worth what I'm posting, at all. And then its a domino effect from there as now other traders see that (as i look at local traders when determining my price as well) the price is lower so they feel the need to go even lower than that, and its just a back and forth from there where people are just destroying the economy of an item artificially, literally for no reason other than to quickly sell. Personally, when i see that, It P*sses me off. Reason being, that person that started that chain of effects has taken money out of my pocket, and also the guild... and also themselves.

I'm the kind of person to wait for my stuff to sell. My daggers didn't sell right away, but I gained 150k by waiting.

That's all i was saying.

Or maybe its you that seems to not be connecting the dots here. Or maybe your perspective isnt as coherent as you think it is. Numerous people have "explained around it".....In other words you cant accept that youre wrong or that you arent making a coherent argument so now you claim people "just arent getting it".

Of course I'm not being coherent. Apparently gold mats and the fact that pricing is consistent on those doesn't prove my point? Sure those are an expendable and desirable because of their function, but so are most of the things i sell to begin with.

I think the issue is I'm over-connecting dots, finding flaws in people's logic; their reasoning behind falsely depreciating an item value to sell quick. While too few are actually connecting any dots at all and interjecting a point that they haven't fully thought out.

The reasoning for them "explaining around it" is because they don't actually see the validity of my point, not only do they completely ignore what I'm stating, they bring up counter points inaccurately. By saying something has to have demand, would imply that it is something people want.
Spriggan's ring - 89 sales, average 28k (so its apparently something people want)

There is no reason to sell that ring for 15k. At all. People doing that are lowering the price of that particular item and screwing other people in the process. Its not only the spriggan's set, i see it happening with alot of items.

Mats are a good example of people keeping pricing consistent which is basically my whole point. It's not hard to look at sales, determine what an item is worth, and keep it in the ball park of that amount.

So how am i being incoherent?

jedtb16_ESO · November 2016

Jeremy wrote: »

max_only wrote: »

I thought most things we pick up were trash anyway? Just decon it for the improvement mats and sell the mats in bulk no? I mean, I'm not at max level right now but just from visiting cities I can tell what pieces are actually worthwhile (worth holding on to and selling) and I don't have any of those. So selling mats in bulk by advertising in zone is my money maker. I kind of wish there was an AH but I certainly don't miss it or complain about it because I would rarely get a sale from one in games where it existed. There was always something better on sale and at a better price than what my casual butt could acquire --- except for mats. There is always a market for gathering mats, in every game with a halfway decent craft system.

Trade spam economies went out of style awhile ago (and for good reason). So if the developers of ESO are trying to bring that abomination back - I'm not going to support their efforts. In my opinion that system should stay dead and buried in the past where it belongs. Because the last thing I want to do when I sit down to play a game is stand around town advertising like some commercial while reading silly arguments about how much something is supposedly really worth. And don't even get me started on how annoying it was to constantly read people asking for price checks in guild chat due to the lack of a stable and centralized market since no one really knows what anything is worth.

At least you can buy stuff from guild traders now though. Used to you couldn't even do that unless you belonged to a trading guild. So things have gotten a little better at least.

i think you are confusing guild store and guild trader there. you always had to be in the guild to access the store.