Templars are knights of the purest hearts that fights against injustice, steeling their mentalities by sacrificing all earthly pursuits and celibate while upholding honor and virtue for the rest of the world.

So stop asking for buffs it dont sound right, mmkay

Metacon wrote: »

Last evening I was in Craglorn... and watched the spamming in the Zone chat:

"LFM for archives.. need DD, light armor only, no templars"

I spare myself a comment to the perceived state of class balance.

Yeah thats because our dps is crap compared to the other classes and we're super squishy to boot!

anakaki wrote: »

The only way to do that is to remove those resources for the other classes which has not been done seeing as templar is the only class with no regen.

Last trial I participated, I saw some sorc using equilibrium to regen magika with their life and then blaming me because I had no magika to heal them...
I almost broke my keyboard

It is funny indeed... Some players are really dumb (and self centered)

I play my templar with full plate, veteran 8 and two swords or sword / shield.
Veteran 8 now ...

PVP is fun
PVE is still okay, i cant rush into groups of three anymore, need to spend a thought or two before i do so.

i dont understand whats the big issue with templar now that they fixed the cooldowns everything is back to normal. actually our templar playstyle with shieldbash was quite lame

Templar healers = very good PVE and PVP.
And.... that's it basically.
You need 20x times the same effort to be almost on par with other classes (tanking and dps) and you still never reach them.
And it's a design thing.
So yes, Templars viability needs a lot of love (like NB...)

ARtChi wrote: »

As a soloer for leveling, templar (especially with heavy armor and stamina build) is a lot weaker than DK or Sorc. Still as I said in some other thread, you can still solo all quest content (with real hard time with some), but it's challenging. I would not complain about that.
When it comes to PvP. Templar in heavy armor will lost all its duel for sure. But still you can be a good healer or an average tank in a zerg.
Problem is mostly when coming to PvE raid/trial where templar utility compared to sorc and DK is pretty low except for healing (but some other classes can also do a pretty good job, like sorc with infinite magika)

well, other classes might be easier but as long as i can play the content i am fine. i solo with vet8 moost worldbosses - except the extra large ones (that are immune to my spear throwback) - i really cant complain.

in pvp i am on thin ice, my experience is limited but i had the feeling that i can fairly easy kill nightblades with my heavy armored templar and my cc options in combination with aedric spear cc possibilities. against dk's i have problems in 1 on 1 situations if my opponend is smart enough to block ...

honestly speaking i am really fairly happy with my class, i think its quite normale in a class based game that we conter a certain class and get contered by others.

Shaun98ca2 wrote: »

My Personal Belief.......
Magicka is meant to be High Damage low sustainment.
Stamina is meant to be Standard Damage high sustainment.

Stamina ALSO gains the benefit of increased survivability through Block, Dodge, Stun. ALL classes provide Magicka based abilities that doesn't scale based on points in Magicka providing much need utility to Stamina based builds.

That is if the above is correct but looking at it that way simply makes sense.

I like your theory, except it doesn't work as designed:
- Light armor characters have no problem tanking, so light and heavy attacks become trivial.
- Templars have no reliable CC. We depend on resource intensive charging and CC shield to get on melee range.
- If you're going to burn stamina to block, dodge and break CC, this stamina becomes unavailable to your survival utilities that are stamina based.
- All of our class skills are based on Magicka, including those that common sense dictates would be based on stamina. Why should a stamina based character be blocked from an effective use of his own class skills? This is particularly true to Nightblades.
- Our top tier defensive skill prevents magicka, the most important resource we need for healing and dps, from regenerating. This is completely contradictory. It should actually return magicka based on damage absorbed. Instead, that skill goes to LIGHT ARMOR, as another perk for being a caster.

Possible solutions:
- Make roll, dodge and break CC rely on a pip based system (ala Guild Wars 2)
- Increase stamina soft cap and stamina per attribute point ratio to give room to stamina based builds.
- Make all melee based trees draw from stamina.
- Move spell resistance from light armor to heavy armor. Light armor characters should be SQUISHY mana batteries. Give heavy armor SOME stamina regeneration.
- Give one handed and dual-wield elemental damage passives. (is that even working for two handed?).

If you are going 2h heavy armor, you still need to have a back up weapon, and it should be resto staff.

Your second skills should be defense and healing. This way you can buff up and heal until you can charge in with your 2h.

Your 2h set should still have a ranged spell, like vampires bane or dark flare. Using 2h for pvp, critical charge and the execution for when you can catch someone in the open. Otherwise, you need to stay at range with your spells.

I will agree that temps may need some love, and melee in general. But we aren't broken by any means, just slightly underpowered, especially in melee.

My advice is to switch to caster, either with destro staff or 1h shield. I will be leveling destro staff soon, right now I use 1h for the added defense. 2h is viable as a caster, but there is room for 1 2h ability in a build, IMO (prob critical charge).

temp_addict wrote: »

If you are going 2h heavy armor, you still need to have a back up weapon, and it should be resto staff.

Your second skills should be defense and healing. This way you can buff up and heal until you can charge in with your 2h.

Yes, that's how I have my bars. 1st one is two-handed offensive, the second one is healing-ranged defensive.
Survavibility is fine. DPS is very poor. I can handle nightblades until they escape. Skilled sorcerers will just burn all your resourcers or bolt away and DK's are simply brick walls to our puny damage.

I feel sorry for my nightblade buddy. We play together and while he quickly dispatches people, all I can effectively do is to keep him healed while tossing one or two spears to disrupt casting, along with a few DoTs. The casting time for Dark Flare and Power of the Light is ludicrous.

I feel like a butler companion. I didn't roll a priest, but it sure feels like one.

Ralph_Damiani wrote: »

For the love of god, there's still time to give Templars substantial improvements in 1.2. Most templar tweaks are minor or purely cosmetic, some of which affecting skills that are already sub-par, situational and rarely used to begin with. They have very little impact on PvP. Our survavibility means NOTHING if we don't have any firepower to fight back in non-group situations. We stand very little chances 1v1 using our class skills. Are we being officially pushed into healer builds?

As a heavy armor, two-handed weapon wielding templar, I'm at very bottom of your list. We simply cannot remain competitive unless we go full caster. Would you like everyone to have the same builds by design? Isn't this against the whole purpose of allowing people to choose their weapons?

If you're not going to redesign how stamina works, at least decrease the magicka costs of our most commonly used abilities, give us back some kind of magicka regen. Why buff only blinding lights and morphs that nobody uses for a very good reason. Pray tell, why nerf our only and already crappy CC?

Can you at least acknowledge templars are underperforming? Don't you guys keep tabs on how each class is performing in PvP and PvE?

Show me your build. Last night i saw more than one over dps'd sorcerer kill himself with my eclipse and later i purifying lighted+soul struck a handful of players who thought they were okay. Right before i logged 2 dks,an archer of some kind, and a sorcerer vr5+ were beating on me for almost a minute via blocking+sunshield and other little things before i died a slow 2% 1% 0 death. Im using 5heavy/2 light armor with 1h and shield.

Show us your 2h build. Templar is a cerebral class, you should take advantage of eclipse and backlash as an opener.

Thechemicals wrote: »

Ralph_Damiani wrote: »

For the love of god, there's still time to give Templars substantial improvements in 1.2. Most templar tweaks are minor or purely cosmetic, some of which affecting skills that are already sub-par, situational and rarely used to begin with. They have very little impact on PvP. Our survavibility means NOTHING if we don't have any firepower to fight back in non-group situations. We stand very little chances 1v1 using our class skills. Are we being officially pushed into healer builds?

As a heavy armor, two-handed weapon wielding templar, I'm at very bottom of your list. We simply cannot remain competitive unless we go full caster. Would you like everyone to have the same builds by design? Isn't this against the whole purpose of allowing people to choose their weapons?

If you're not going to redesign how stamina works, at least decrease the magicka costs of our most commonly used abilities, give us back some kind of magicka regen. Why buff only blinding lights and morphs that nobody uses for a very good reason. Pray tell, why nerf our only and already crappy CC?

Can you at least acknowledge templars are underperforming? Don't you guys keep tabs on how each class is performing in PvP and PvE?

Show me your build. Last night i saw more than one over dps'd sorcerer kill himself with my eclipse and later i purifying lighted+soul struck a handful of players who thought they were okay. Right before i logged 2 dks,an archer of some kind, and a sorcerer vr5+ were beating on me for almost a minute via blocking+sunshield and other little things before i died a slow 2% 1% 0 death. Im using 5heavy/2 light armor with 1h and shield.

Show us your 2h build. Templar is a cerebral class, you should take advantage of eclipse and backlash as an opener.

2 dk's, an archer and a sorcerer, all at once, couldnt kill you? It took them a minute?

You sir, are a liar.

For all these guys telling Templars to switch to light armor/destro, GTFO..

I personally played a Templar to be a paladin (not all of us want to be a straight healer) I wasn't expecting to do a crazy amount of damage but the Templars current state is pathetic I can CC and do some damage over time.... (If you have enough time in PvP) but....

The problem is the DK and sorc can do everything a Templar can.. They can do it just as good if not better because they can also dish out a *** ton of damage.. So whats the point of rolling Templar.. ?

Oh yeah they have the "good heals" tell that to the current trial groups or the 1v1s in cyro...

I'm still playing my Templar but I shouldn't be wanting to roll another class just to be able to stay competitive...

Fix Templars Zenimax...

Thechemicals wrote: »

Last night i saw more than one over dps'd sorcerer kill himself with my eclipse and later i purifying lighted+soul struck a handful of players who thought they were okay.
Right before i logged 2 dks,an archer of some kind, and a sorcerer vr5+ were beating on me for almost a minute via blocking+sunshield and other little things before i died a slow 2% 1% 0 death. Im using 5heavy/2 light armor with 1h and shield.

Show us your 2h build. Templar is a cerebral class, you should take advantage of eclipse and backlash as an opener.

If you rely on soul strike to kill people, that's not really a templar ultimate, is it?
I don't doubt your survavibility is impressive. So is mine, as has been stated many times here. We can take a hit, but the whole point of this topic is talking about our class-specific DPS.

Eclipse is a fine skill. But not every effective against smart/experienced players, as it can be easily dispelled. I occasionally slot it just for fun, but there are better spells.

What do you mean by "templars is a cerebral class"? Are you implying that templars are fine and we're all just dumb? Or that all other classes are easy, and therefore all other players are dumb and we're the smart ones? Either way, it doesn't come across very nicely.

Mortosk wrote: »

I noticed a pattern in the patch notes. They are buffing only under utilized skills. I assume this means they believe our kit is viable already and doesn't need real substantively meaningful changes.

Are we at least going to get skill refunds to try the new morphed skills that weren't available as a choice when we invested said skill points and are only now available through a costly skill reset?

We did last time skills were tampered with.