U51 Feedback Thread for Classes and Abilities

Chrlynsch · August 3

One thing I've noticed from the feedback is that a lot of players wanted werewolf sustain reduced because it doesn't follow the same pacing as traditional PvP. I understand that perspective. Werewolf has always forced opponents to approach fights differently.

With Update 50, though, werewolf was intentionally shifted toward a sustained pressure playstyle. If sustain is now being pulled back, it's also losing the primary tool that allows that pressure-focused design to actually secure kills.

I'm not asking for the sustain nerfs to be reverted. In fact, I think it's healthier if werewolf plays closer to the same rules as other builds. But if sustain is coming down, other parts of the kit need to be reevaluated.

The first area I'd look at is Fury. It simply takes too long to ramp up. Reducing the Fury cap from 1,000 to 500 and lowering Rampage's activation timer from 20 seconds to 10 seconds would keep roughly the same overall uptime while creating more frequent windows of counterplay. It would also help solo Berserkers reach the point where they can realistically maintain their form without dramatically increasing their overall power. Removing the global cooldown from Rampage activation would also make the mechanic feel much smoother.

From there, I'd focus on Berserker's burst potential. Pack Leader already occupies a strong defensive/utility niche, so Berserker should be the morph that leans harder into offensive burst potential. Lots of things could be done here besides increasing damage by a flat amount. LA bleed could do oblivion damage or could stack while rampage is active. Could reduce GCDs and speed up channels attacks. Lots could be done to help the flavor our here.

Berserker's Light Attack bleed and Blood Claws duration were both reduced during PTS because of the pressure made possible by the original version of the Shattered Paths mythic. Since Shattered Paths has now been significantly toned down, those earlier werewolf nerfs should be reconsidered. They were balanced around a level of external synergy that no longer exists and having to cast bloodclaws so frequently with sustain nerf will be felt.

Finally, I'd also ask the team to revisit Hircine's Rage. The repeated reductions to weapon damage passives throughout the PTS cycle have indirectly nerfed this skill multiple times since its healing scales from weapon damage. Hircine's Rage is one of the better-designed PvP abilities in the kit because it creates meaningful risk versus reward, you gain more offensive power at the cost of taking increased damage. My suggestion is to give it a big weapon damage buff instead of flat damage % while keeping the unique vulnerability mechanic. This would a precast Hircine's rage to give big damage increase while also making the wolf more vulnerable, the next Hircine's rage cast would heal for more as you would have boosted Weapon damage.

If werewolf is going to move away from sustain as its defining strength, it needs more responsive Fury mechanics and better opportunities to create burst. That preserves the identity of the transformation while bringing it more in line with the pacing and counterplay expected in modern PvP.

actosh · August 3

Please think about giving templar a unique Grp mitigation buff and Sorc a unique dmg done buff.
About 6 to 8% should do.

acanca · August 3

1 small buff to make Strife and Funnel Health usable

Funnel Health and Strife at the moment only heal when allies are almost close enough to touch, im guessing 8 metres or shorter range. This makes using funnel health as a healing option not really feasible matter how much i enjoy the idea and would love to build around it.

Please consider giving it that buff, i think the 4k magicka cost makes this a reasonable addition

acanca · August 3

acanca wrote: »

1 small buff to make Strife and Funnel Health usable

Funnel Health and Strife at the moment only heal when allies are almost close enough to touch, im guessing 8 metres or shorter range. This makes using funnel health as a healing option not really feasible matter how much i enjoy the idea and would love to build around it.

Please consider giving it that buff, i think the 4k magicka cost makes this a reasonable addition

And by that buff i mean making the heal have a 28 metre range

Leivendil · August 3

I am not happy with the werewolf nerfs to sustain. Why? Because sorc werewolf already was the best class for it. Now it will be mandatory. Just because of sorc sustain class mastery which makes the sustain infinite. I personally enjoy playing WW on my warden, even after the signet nerf. But I am not sure how can I play this combo after the doubled skill cost.

What I would suggest: Instead of increasing the cost x2, increase it by 20-30%. Additionally to this, nerf the sorc sustain class mastery or make it work only outside of WW form. This will allow more class variety for werewolfs and not limit it to sorc only. At least in PvP.

James-Wayne · August 3

Wait a second... Arcanist can use Solar Barrage from Templar to get damage and 5% class abilities buff but Templar cant use Tome-Bearer to get the damage buff from their skill.... fair fairs come on!!

And then there is the Illuminate passive that gives 2974 armor for 20 seconds. First, how does illuminating grant armor thematically? Second, how is it that Templar loses Minor buff for armor but DK retains the buff and also has a passive Heart of Stone that gives 2974 armor, permanently with no cool down!!

Im certain ZOS hates Templars, the class updates for Templar have been terribly bad these last few years, WTAF!!!

Not only that but Templars will probably also need till wait to 2028 or beyond to get the class refresh now.... <logs off>

Alchimiste1 · August 3

Don’t forget to nerf heart of flame sustain, nerf sorc sustain mastery a bit. Don’t give plar more defensive changes instead give them damage ones. Same to all the other bad pure classes like nb,arc,necro.

Wuuffyy · August 3

This is no longer the case. Remove the density and return the 30% resource scaling instead, if you are to keep this sustain model.

Magicka builds are no longer properly viable or remotely close to a 'stamina build' for werewolf, again. Change unless you are to keep this sustain model.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/691059/pts-patch-notes-v12-0-0# (reference)

Implement the same tech used for some Arcanist skills... have all current stamina abilities scale from 'highest' stat for resource pool (current stamina skills = highest resource for resource-scaling) and all current magicka abilites scale from 'lowest stat' for resource pool (current magicka skills = lowest resource for resource-scaling).

If 'you' have time to throw a whole page of blanket nerfs in the middle of a creating a PTS patch you had a gigantic restructuring during, 'you' likely have the time to properly remediate.

I had all the optimism and patience in the world- now I ask that you fix the problem @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Kyzeragon · August 3

Lykeion wrote: »

I hope the devs can remove the newly added PTS restriction that allows Insatiable Hunger to be triggered in combat only when the player has less than 200 ultimate, or refine it with more precise context-based conditions.

I previously wrote a dynamic IH Blocker addon to address the issue of IH appearing too frequently. My first attempt actually used the same approach: allowing IH to trigger only when the player's ultimate was below a certain threshold. However, during actual gameplay, I found this condition to be very clunky. In some longer encounters, the problems it caused far outweighed the benefits of blocking IH.

The most obvious example is the final boss of Lucent Citadel. During this fight, players need to spend long periods moving or waiting (such as during the necro bridge phase), without enough active combat opportunities to generate enough fury to trigger rampage and prevent ultimate decay. This can eventually result in players being unable to maintain ww form.

Additionally, this condition prevents Werewolves from participating in ulti pulls. Ulti pulls are a strategy used by prog groups in trials to build ultimate before an encounter, ensuring everyone starts the fight in the best possible state. Restricting IH to only when ult is below 200 means ww can gain only a limited amount of ultimate during an ulti pull, leaving them with a higher risk of dropping out of ww form early during the actual fight.

If this is useful as a reference for the devs, the rule I currently use in my Insatiable Hunger Blocker addon is: when the player has not dealt direct damage for 2 seconds, temporarily allow IH to be used while in combat. I believe this rule works very well in practice and is much more flexible in handling different situations.

Edit: I adjusted my feedback to better align with the new rules on the PTS. Thanks for Kazajhan's reminder

I agree with everything Lykeion said from a PvE group content perspective, having run nearly every trial on HM as a werewolf since the U50 werewolf changes, with a few trifectas. I also wrote my own addon because of accidentally activating Insatiable Hunger too often. It requires holding another key to "unlock" IH for use, to ensure all activations of it are deliberate, because I prefer having full control over it.

Taking a step back, I believe the problem that we'd like solved is that Insatiable Hunger shows up too often, getting in the way of other synergies. Even if it's not in the way of another synergy, accidental activations of IH disrupt gameplay, or the popup simply might be annoying to people. These issues apply to PvE group content and not really solo werewolf, because group content is where we actually have other synergies, while solo the only other one is Feeding Frenzy.

The PTS changes to the priority of the synergy should already handle the first issue. I don't know what the solution is to the second, but I think having it blocked, especially with no customizability, is way too heavy-handed. If I had to choose, I'd choose to... well, have the choice. I'll take accidental activations over not being able to top off when I need to.

Putting the PTS conditions here for reference:

Put 3 unique stipulations on the synergy in addition to their regular stipulations (looking at a consumable corpse, etc)
The caster is at or below 66% Health
OR the caster is at or below 200 Ultimate
OR the caster is out of combat

We can ignore caster being below 66% health for group PvE purposes, because we have healers. None of our scenarios would fall under that bucket.

200 ult is okay as a threshold if you look at it from the perspective of "I need to have at least 200 ult." However, in practice, corpses aren't available at all times, or even most times, during boss encounters. We need to be able to "stock up" on ultimate when we can, in order to sustain through phases where we cannot reliably generate ult, and I think having these Insatiable Hunger restrictions too rigidly denies these natural fluctuations.

I would argue that having IH is actually more important in combat, because in combat is when your ultimate is draining. Being able to use it outside of combat serves to top off ultimate before an encounter, which is great, but that only lasts so long.

Yes, we can still sustain werewolf form fine if we have group ultgen, use Rampage on cooldown, trigger natural ultgen, etc., but that's on the premise that things are going perfectly. When in a prog group where people are dying, bad conditions cause it to fall apart quickly. We have to spend time resurrecting, which is time spent not casting skills to generate Fury, which in turn reduces werewolf transformation sustain by reducing Rampage uptime. Not to mention, if things are going really wrong, we might have to resurrect many group members in a row, meaning core-combat-ability-ultgen falls off too (yeah, that's a little L2P, to get a light attack in before you start the next rez, but still).

Also please don't deny me having a dead group member as a snack

Wuuffyy · August 3

Kyzeragon wrote: »

Lykeion wrote: »

I hope the devs can remove the newly added PTS restriction that allows Insatiable Hunger to be triggered in combat only when the player has less than 200 ultimate, or refine it with more precise context-based conditions.

I previously wrote a dynamic IH Blocker addon to address the issue of IH appearing too frequently. My first attempt actually used the same approach: allowing IH to trigger only when the player's ultimate was below a certain threshold. However, during actual gameplay, I found this condition to be very clunky. In some longer encounters, the problems it caused far outweighed the benefits of blocking IH.

The most obvious example is the final boss of Lucent Citadel. During this fight, players need to spend long periods moving or waiting (such as during the necro bridge phase), without enough active combat opportunities to generate enough fury to trigger rampage and prevent ultimate decay. This can eventually result in players being unable to maintain ww form.

Additionally, this condition prevents Werewolves from participating in ulti pulls. Ulti pulls are a strategy used by prog groups in trials to build ultimate before an encounter, ensuring everyone starts the fight in the best possible state. Restricting IH to only when ult is below 200 means ww can gain only a limited amount of ultimate during an ulti pull, leaving them with a higher risk of dropping out of ww form early during the actual fight.

If this is useful as a reference for the devs, the rule I currently use in my Insatiable Hunger Blocker addon is: when the player has not dealt direct damage for 2 seconds, temporarily allow IH to be used while in combat. I believe this rule works very well in practice and is much more flexible in handling different situations.

Edit: I adjusted my feedback to better align with the new rules on the PTS. Thanks for Kazajhan's reminder

I agree with everything Lykeion said from a PvE group content perspective, having run nearly every trial on HM as a werewolf since the U50 werewolf changes, with a few trifectas. I also wrote my own addon because of accidentally activating Insatiable Hunger too often. It requires holding another key to "unlock" IH for use, to ensure all activations of it are deliberate, because I prefer having full control over it.

Taking a step back, I believe the problem that we'd like solved is that Insatiable Hunger shows up too often, getting in the way of other synergies. Even if it's not in the way of another synergy, accidental activations of IH disrupt gameplay, or the popup simply might be annoying to people. These issues apply to PvE group content and not really solo werewolf, because group content is where we actually have other synergies, while solo the only other one is Feeding Frenzy.

The PTS changes to the priority of the synergy should already handle the first issue. I don't know what the solution is to the second, but I think having it blocked, especially with no customizability, is way too heavy-handed. If I had to choose, I'd choose to... well, have the choice. I'll take accidental activations over not being able to top off when I need to.

Putting the PTS conditions here for reference:

Put 3 unique stipulations on the synergy in addition to their regular stipulations (looking at a consumable corpse, etc)
The caster is at or below 66% Health
OR the caster is at or below 200 Ultimate
OR the caster is out of combat

We can ignore caster being below 66% health for group PvE purposes, because we have healers. None of our scenarios would fall under that bucket.

200 ult is okay as a threshold if you look at it from the perspective of "I need to have at least 200 ult." However, in practice, corpses aren't available at all times, or even most times, during boss encounters. We need to be able to "stock up" on ultimate when we can, in order to sustain through phases where we cannot reliably generate ult, and I think having these Insatiable Hunger restrictions too rigidly denies these natural fluctuations.

I would argue that having IH is actually more important in combat, because in combat is when your ultimate is draining. Being able to use it outside of combat serves to top off ultimate before an encounter, which is great, but that only lasts so long.

Yes, we can still sustain werewolf form fine if we have group ultgen, use Rampage on cooldown, trigger natural ultgen, etc., but that's on the premise that things are going perfectly. When in a prog group where people are dying, bad conditions cause it to fall apart quickly. We have to spend time resurrecting, which is time spent not casting skills to generate Fury, which in turn reduces werewolf transformation sustain by reducing Rampage uptime. Not to mention, if things are going really wrong, we might have to resurrect many group members in a row, meaning core-combat-ability-ultgen falls off too (yeah, that's a little L2P, to get a light attack in before you start the next rez, but still).

Also please don't deny me having a dead group member as a snack

I'm assuming this places a major damper on the 'tap' method of sustaining on corpses in trials as well given no other choice?

Kazajhan · August 3

Kyzeragon wrote: »

Also please don't deny me having a dead group member as a snack

I just figured that out recently, and made comments in our Discord voice chat, and now my teammates are apologizing for rezzing too fast after a wipe.

"I only eat the ones I love."

AdonisJorge · August 3

Insatiable hunger hurts WW sustain on PVE, more so on WW berseker, make it be used while "weapons sheated', prowling or other similar condition, WW berseker gains fury when consuming corpses.

WW nerfs killed the form on magicka builds and made be a WW outside sorcerer very bad, i tested on PTS a WW Breton sorc and i can sustain (on PVE at least) but is on the edge

It is not a good idea to nerf WW when DK is so OP, have infinite sustain, burst damage, dot pressure, unkileable and so on

Buff all other classes, where are the class masteries buffs? Templar lost its unique buff for nothing, Sorcs too and they use critical surge for healing.

Please stop nerfing things before buffing the other classes, give them more tools to go against the "top 3" (DK, WW, SORC), you promissed to use the class masteries to adjust the balance, do it.

XVestigeXx · August 3

Why are we targeting stealth and Nightblade invisibility even more? Its already buggy to stay invis or to engage in it and now you are restricting it more? Rally's heal should not pull NB out of stealth, its been this way for 12 years, and it will be less fun for everyone if it pulls you out of stealth. Expert hunter being turned into a on demand stealth detect is just such a horrible change that kills my desire to spend money on this game. I am tired of all these changes to NB and its stealth and all its counters on top of the bugs and terrible interactions with it. With every single patch I feel like Nightblade is targeted more and more for no reason other than prejudice.

I genuinely feel like you zos have prejudice against the entire idea of Nightblade along with all the DK mains and hybrid tanks who don't want to die no matter what.

When will we NBs be getting an ability to turn off Dks ability to block for 5 seconds? or to turn off sorc's streak for 5 seconds? or to revert WW into human form? Thats what you are doing with NB!

Nightblade got more patch notes that amounted to more nerfs than a buff due to how you changed sneak/cloak/expert hunter/Rally meanwhile DK, the refreshed most OP and complained about class that everyone hates that now makes up probably 60% of PVP got meaningless tweaks.

Nightblade got more patch notes than DK and they were mostly nerfs

I mean seriously? We are making Expert hunter a stealth detect potion now on demand that turns off Nightblades most iconic ability 43.5 meters out and then prevents it from being used?? You've already nerfed cloak when you made mag recov turn off in cloak, and now you are gonna give everyone a ability to spam that reveals us 43.5 meters out????? So now it will be even harder to stam check them for countering us. I guess all Nightblades should just play DK huh?

Why haven't you focused on QoL changes like making Dark Vigor and magicka flood passives buff your max hp and stam/mag while an ability is slotted on EITHER bar? I lose 3k HP for swapping bars!!! Everyone would love that!

If these changes go through I am done with ESO and not supporting it anymore. I don't even think you have anyone to read this feedback anymore and I'm just astounded that you make NB worse and worse and clunkier to play every single patch while not fixing the real pain points and that you eternally make counters to NB and no other class gets this treatment. I get pulse ganking is what you may be targeting, but DK and WW were by far and away bigger pain points for the community then pulse gankers on subclassed builds which is not even an arguement because all these stealth changes to fix Pulse gankers doesn't even address the core issue! Pulse gankers will still be there!

Once again Pure NB is nerfed for existing.

Your changes have raised my BP and I just don't want to play anymore. Please, SCRAP THIS

AdonisJorge · August 3

XVestigeXx wrote: »

Why are we targeting stealth and Nightblade invisibility even more? Its already buggy to stay invis or to engage in it and now you are restricting it more? Rally's heal should not pull NB out of stealth, its been this way for 12 years, and it will be less fun for everyone if it pulls you out of stealth. Expert hunter being turned into a on demand stealth detect is just such a horrible change that kills my desire to spend money on this game. I am tired of all these changes to NB and its stealth and all its counters on top of the bugs and terrible interactions with it. With every single patch I feel like Nightblade is targeted more and more for no reason other than prejudice.

I genuinely feel like you zos have prejudice against the entire idea of Nightblade along with all the DK mains and hybrid tanks who don't want to die no matter what.

When will we NBs be getting an ability to turn off Dks ability to block for 5 seconds? or to turn off sorc's streak for 5 seconds? or to revert WW into human form? Thats what you are doing with NB!

Nightblade got more patch notes that amounted to more nerfs than a buff due to how you changed sneak/cloak/expert hunter/Rally meanwhile DK, the refreshed most OP and complained about class that everyone hates that now makes up probably 60% of PVP got meaningless tweaks.

Nightblade got more patch notes than DK and they were mostly nerfs

I mean seriously? We are making Expert hunter a stealth detect potion now on demand that turns off Nightblades most iconic ability 43.5 meters out and then prevents it from being used?? You've already nerfed cloak when you made mag recov turn off in cloak, and now you are gonna give everyone a ability to spam that reveals us 43.5 meters out????? So now it will be even harder to stam check them for countering us. I guess all Nightblades should just play DK huh?

Why haven't you focused on QoL changes like making Dark Vigor and magicka flood passives buff your max hp and stam/mag while an ability is slotted on EITHER bar? I lose 3k HP for swapping bars!!! Everyone would love that!

If these changes go through I am done with ESO and not supporting it anymore. I don't even think you have anyone to read this feedback anymore and I'm just astounded that you make NB worse and worse and clunkier to play every single patch while not fixing the real pain points and that you eternally make counters to NB and no other class gets this treatment. I get pulse ganking is what you may be targeting, but DK and WW were by far and away bigger pain points for the community then pulse gankers on subclassed builds which is not even an arguement because all these stealth changes to fix Pulse gankers doesn't even address the core issue! Pulse gankers will still be there!

Once again Pure NB is nerfed for existing.

Your changes have raised my BP and I just don't want to play anymore. Please, SCRAP THIS

I agree with you, NB need serious buffs (even if we disagree on WW nerfs)

tomofhyrule · August 3

Dragonknight sustain is entirely too strong, especially in comparison to everything else.

DK was always set up as a bursty pressure warrior, with DoTs applied though expensive skills sustained by casting ultimates. That was the purpose of the Battle Roar The Storm Voice passive skill.

Core of Flame and its morphs go directly against that, allowing essentially unlimited sustain. This also means that skill is essentially required as it removes the major drawback of being a DK.

That skill has to lose the "restores Stamina and Magicka" component. In its place, it could go back to the heal-based-on-enemies-hit from the original Inhale skill and its morphs.

---

The point of reducing the Werewolf skill costs so much was to make Magicka werewolf builds viable, but that again essentially gave Stamina werewolves infinite sustain. The costs do need to be commensurate with the skill, so I am not arguing the cost increase back to where they should be, but if the goal is for Magicka builds to be able to use werewolf, the correct option would be to make the cost based on max resource (and min resource for Hircine's Fury) is was done for most of Arcanist's skills

---

There is an inconsistency with the costs of some Dragonknight skills compared to other comparable skills.

All non-ultimate channelled attacks in the game use a cost-per-second

...except Engulfing Dragonfire, which has an upfront cost

On the contrary, ground HoT skills from other classes will have a high upfront cost

...meanwhile DK's version ticks its cost, even though it can't be cancelled partway through

Hearthfire (then Ash Cloud) was changed in U32 to have the cost-per-tick, but that was when it also had a damaging morph and could proc the Helping Hands passive (which was quickly changed because it allowed for infinite sustain). However, with the Refresh done, this just leaves that skill having a vestigial cost-per-tick that is incongruous with similar skills.

rainbowrages · August 3

Hello! My only concern is there was no mention of fixing the Fate Realigned class mastery for arcanist with it not properly providing 300 power. Is this on track for U51 as a fix?

Wuuffyy · August 3

tomofhyrule wrote: »

Dragonknight sustain is entirely too strong, especially in comparison to everything else.

DK was always set up as a bursty pressure warrior, with DoTs applied though expensive skills sustained by casting ultimates. That was the purpose of the Battle Roar The Storm Voice passive skill.

Core of Flame and its morphs go directly against that, allowing essentially unlimited sustain. This also means that skill is essentially required as it removes the major drawback of being a DK.

That skill has to lose the "restores Stamina and Magicka" component. In its place, it could go back to the heal-based-on-enemies-hit from the original Inhale skill and its morphs.

---

The point of reducing the Werewolf skill costs so much was to make Magicka werewolf builds viable, but that again essentially gave Stamina werewolves infinite sustain. The costs do need to be commensurate with the skill, so I am not arguing the cost increase back to where they should be, but if the goal is for Magicka builds to be able to use werewolf, the correct option would be to make the cost based on max resource (and min resource for Hircine's Fury) is was done for most of Arcanist's skills

---

There is an inconsistency with the costs of some Dragonknight skills compared to other comparable skills.

All non-ultimate channelled attacks in the game use a cost-per-second

...except Engulfing Dragonfire, which has an upfront cost

On the contrary, ground HoT skills from other classes will have a high upfront cost

...meanwhile DK's version ticks its cost, even though it can't be cancelled partway through

Hearthfire (then Ash Cloud) was changed in U32 to have the cost-per-tick, but that was when it also had a damaging morph and could proc the Helping Hands passive (which was quickly changed because it allowed for infinite sustain). However, with the Refresh done, this just leaves that skill having a vestigial cost-per-tick that is incongruous with similar skills.

Commensurate to what? What goal was achieved? Sorc was allowing for nearly ‘free costs’ (I suppose) with regen ticks and yet our spammable remains at 1600 with an emphasis now on running Sorc over any other class (again…).

I guess my burst heal sucks more now even though they totally should have buffed it closer to pre-rework states and removed some healing from bite instead (ya know, cause it still has a substantial cost and I can’t heavy-attack for mag).

What was achieved? Did you mean ‘I’m happy they were nerfed for the sake of being nerfed’? There’s nothing commensurate here (uh-oh, probably just signed us up for our next round of nerfs).

Oh well, thank goodness it feels worse for the sake of feeling worse without truly resolving whatever nonsense they were trying to correct (but I mean… they also added major force to a potion and did nothing substantial to DK while citing that the other whip essentially demonstrated ‘healthy gameplay’ to them… because you know, hitting a full resist player for 27k every 3-4 seconds with corro up is ‘healthy gameplay’).

‘More healthy DK gameplay here’-https://www.xbox.com/play/media/6RRgACnLZW

They clearly don’t have deep insight into PvP and the ‘nerf werewolf only’ focus came from ‘word of mouth’/forum posts alone.

Twohothardware · August 3

Please don't overnerf werewolf when it and DK are your only new class content until next year. Make small adjustments not huge fat fingered ones. The werewolf sustain nerfs need to be reduced.

You're also ignoring the biggest culprit of the infinite sustain on werewolf which is the Sorcerer class mastery skill Conservation of Energy. You received feedback even last pts that this passive needed adjusted because of it working in werewolf form and 90% of the werewolf players in the game are on Sorcerer for that reason.

With the current sustain changes you'll just make Sorcerer the 100% mandatory class you have to play on to use werewolf builds.

Erickson9610 · August 3

Disabling the option to use Insatiable Hunger while in combat even when there are no other synergies available is frustrating. I never want my Ultimate to get that low, so please consider allowing us to use Insatiable Hunger without restriction.

We can feed on corpses as a werewolf in TES V: Skyrim any time we want, so anyone coming to ESO from Skyrim will be confused why they suddenly can't eat corpses in some situations. The game doesn't tell you why the option to Devour corpses is disabled anywhere!

And that's not to mention that Werewolf Berserkers want to use Insatiable Hunger on corpses to generate Fury, even while in combat at max Health and Ultimate.

Erickson9610 · August 4

I feel that the heal from Claw Fury should scale off of offensive stats, rather than Max Health, as it is intended to be a damage dealer / low APM accessibility morph. Scaling the heal with offensive stats would reinforce that identity, and would provide damage dealers who opt for Claw Fury the support they need to finish the channel in difficult PvE encounters.

Scaling the heal with Max Health encourages Werewolf tanks and PvP specs to use it, but the channeled nature of the ability is undesirable in both of those contexts. For instance, when tanking, you can't block or taunt while channeling it, and in PvP, your target will simply walk outside of your cone and you won't deal any damage or receive any healing while you aren't hitting anything.

IZZEFlameLash · August 4

I do not support this direction of swinging nerf bats instead of giving similar minimized sustain mini game to other classes. Literally, try it and ask how people feel about their classes. They are more likely to react positively than negatively.

Also, why the Templar nerf? Makes me even less likely to take out Templar even if I love my second char.

ZhuJiuyin · August 4

Why give Sorc so many redundant abilities?

If U51 were released as it is now, Sorc would be the class with the most redundant abilities in the game (and it already is).

Sorc currently has:
1. Gaining 5-10% maximum resources across multiple passive abilities (Blood Magic, Expert Summoner)
2. Reducing resource consumption across multiple passive abilities (Unholy Knowledge, Persistence)
3. Immobilizing debuffs across multiple active abilities (Encase, Daedric Tomb)
4. Resource recovery across multiple active and passive abilities (Endless Fury, Energy Overload, Rebate)

Now, why add this unique Offensive Penetration to Sorc? Sorc could already get a similar buff from Crystal Weapon (although the skill has flaws and low values, it can be easily adjusted), and you even stripped Sorc of Critical, making Sorc's only continuous healing skill (Power Surge) unusable. This clearly demonstrates the developers' lack of understanding of the Sorc class mechanism and its pain points (even the Templars).

@ZOS_Kevin, @ZOS_Amy, @ZOS_JessicaFolsom This hybridization wasn't wrong, but it's a severe nerf to Sorc and Templars. Please at least add a corresponding buff to each of these classes on the same class line as compensation.

For example: Blood Magic: When you cast a Dark Magic ability with a cost, you heal for 1600 Health if you are not at full Health. This portion of the ability scales off your Max Health. Provides you with 6% criticality.

Enduring Rays: Increases the duration of your Sun Fire, Eclipse, Solar Flare, and Nova abilities by 2 seconds and grants you 10% weapon and spell damage.

These buffs only need to apply to Sorc and Templars, and should be used as a transition until these two classes are reworked, or simply cancel this change for Sorc and Templars until the classes are reworked. There's no need for these two classes to suffer significant losses for the sake of hybridization.

tomofhyrule · August 4

I'll also say that DK's Magma could come down quite a bit - or at least both morphs could get looked at.

Corrosive is entirely too strong. You get 100% penetration and get a major reduction to damage taken and do damage in an AoE around you? That really feels overloaded. It should either not get the full 100% penetration, or not get the massive damage reduction.

Magma, on the other hand, got effectively a nerf from the extended timer since U48. Magma now lasts for 15 seconds, but still has the "you cannot generate Ultimate in this form" stipulation, meaning that Magma builds back up even slower than Corrosive, and all you get for that is a worse Barrier for your allies. That makes it so there's really no reason to ever run Magma when you could be running Corrosive to get way more of an effect.

The two morphs really should be brought into parity with each other, basically giving a nerf to Corrosive and a buff to Magma.

Thal · August 4

I have an entire thread about this here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/697172/please-anything-other-than-armor-buff-for-templar

But to formally put this into the feedback thread, Templar thematically has an entire Class Mastery built to enhance Prophecy (Bright Harbinger). Taking that away from Templar seems like a step backwards and removes any group utility that even could be tortuously defended.

Also, without a pocket DK to give you back the group buff you’ve sourced for a decade, thus ranges from a 400-1000 spell damage nerf. Will there be a subsequent rebalancing buff to the Templar kit in coming PTS weeks? It’s already underperforming as a DPS prior to this

Thal · August 4

One final piece of commentary here. There actually isn’t a need to remove minor brutality from one or the other class (DK/Plar).

You could very easily have both classes continue to source it. If applied by BOTH, activate a new and different buff for group. Encourages group diversity and makes achieving these buffs easier in smaller groups.

xencthlu · August 4

I think the new cost for Magical Susceptibility is too high. I don't object to it having a cost, just think it's too high. Especially because it's only so potent an ability because of one mythic that not everyone will be running. I don't think you should balance an entire ability around a single piece of equipment.

IZZEFlameLash · August 4

xencthlu wrote: »

I think the new cost for Magical Susceptibility is too high. I don't object to it having a cost, just think it's too high. Especially because it's only so potent an ability because of one mythic that not everyone will be running. I don't think you should balance an entire ability around a single piece of equipment.

It is more likely that the decision was based on BG player complaints about it because this came pretty much a month after SPS removal. In BGs, things tend to hit a lot harder than you'd find in normal CP environment due to lack of extra layer of defense from CP. And it can inflate further because of things such as power sigils, which then can be used as an evidence of something being 'super duper broken OP ZOS needs to nerf ASAP omg'

Aces-High-82 · August 4

Udrath wrote: »

Major force should not go on potions unless major force and minor force are nerfed to 10% and 5%. That will create to much power creep in the future, mostly on classes that do not or will not suffer from sustain issues.

If strife and funnel are getting resource increases, then the heal needs to be at a set value regardless how hard it hits. The heal will always be low when it is blocked or highly mitigated.

Dragonknight wings are incredibly strong. They provide a stun kickback, snare removal, major expedition, and a 50% damage reduction from projectiles. Imagine a skill that did 50% damage reduction to melee damage. That’d be insane right?

Instead it should reflect the next direct attack (1). But if it’ really needs to be providing that much damage reduction, then it shouldn’t have a stun, major expedition and snare removal. It’s too much on one skill that provides that much mitigation.

Or least remove major expedition and reduce it to 10% damage reduction, or major protection.

Cant agree more on the 50% projectile damage reduction on DK Wings. The skill is already packed with effects. At least toning it down to a reasonable 20% would be very welcomed. As of now and since the rework it basically shut down almost any ranged build.

sayswhoto · August 4

Maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong here, but itsn't the +35% damage to Strife a massive buff?

If you combine that with Soulcleaver (+15% to siphoning abilities and +12% based on health) with Champion Points (ex. +6% to DOT's), isn't it then approaching base damage between Subterran Assualt and Merciless Resolve (notoriously hard hitting abilities)? And this ability will tick for that damage every 2 seconds for 10seconds and heal 40%, assuming it's morphed to Swallow Soul?

That's in addition to NB's also having Merciless Resolve. So will NB's be able to rapid fire Merciless Resolve levels of damage now?

Firstmep · August 4

A piece of positive feedback: crushing weapon is amazing now!
The patch notes don't do it justice but basically it was changed much more than was written.
The 6 second duration now also applies to the time you get to apply the damage proc and the major breach it applies.
Also it procs from both light and heavy attacks now.
This is on top of the 8% weapon skill( also applies to light and heavy attacks) damage.

Very welcome change that eliminated all the pain points I had with this skill.
The resource refund was also removed, but given the 6 sec duration that seems fair and it's a much more functional skill as a result.