Erickson9610 wrote: »

We've yet to get our first Companion who is a Werewolf (i.e. someone who has the Companion equivalent of the player's Werewolf skill line) and with the Werewolf refresh in Update 50, there are some aspects of this refresh that I'd like to comment on regarding its translation into the Companions system.

First, I'll give a brief overview of how Companions adapt Player skills. Feel free to skip over this section.

Companions have three Class skill lines, dedicated to damage dealing, healing, and tanking, respectively. They only have one Ultimate ability (which unlocks at Level 20), located in their damage dealing skill line. This Ultimate ability always costs 200 Ultimate and is unique to the Companion and is not based on an existing ability.

Companions also get skill lines for Weapon, Armor, and Guild (Fighters Guild, Mages Guild, and Undaunted) categories. The Racial skill line is just for a passive that is unique to the specific Companion (Zerith-var and Ember are both Khajiit but have different Khajiit passives). If a Companion adapts a skill line from another category (such as the World category) they'll likely implement it as their Class damage dealer line, like how Tanlorin uses the Companion adaptation of Soul Magic.

Additionally, the Class skill lines have different names than their Player counterparts, and (should they be shared between Companions, such as with Bastian Hallix and Tanlorin) may have different "morphs" and different chosen skills in the skill lines. Newer Companions have ability icons which portray the specific Companion, such as how Zerith-var's "Perigean Armor", based on the Bone Tyrant skill "Bone Armor", shows himself in the ability icon.

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So, how could the Werewolf skill line be adapted to Companions?

Here are some design challenges and considerations:

• Companions only have one Ultimate. Should this be their version of Werewolf Transformation?
  • If yes, then this would mean their Class damage dealer skill line would have (possibly up to 3) Werewolf skills (which would exclude Hircine's Bounty and Roar, as they are utility skills), which could only be used while transformed. If Werewolf form skills were spread across the Class skill lines, then Hircine's Bounty and Roar might end up in the tank skill line. Since Companions get their Ultimate at Level 20, it would be a long time until the Companion gets to use this skill line.
  • If no, then this means the Companion would need to be able to turn into a Werewolf some other way. Maybe this could be sourced from a secondary Ultimate found in the World category, if remaining as close to the Player counterpart as possible, but this would mean that you would have to choose between letting the Companion use their human form Ultimate, or their Werewolf Ultimate. I think it would be better if the transformation was triggered by a passive ability, which could transform the Companion if they fall below a Health threshold or if the player transforms, which would allow the Companion to still use their human form Ultimate or transform. Maybe the transformation could work as an Active Ability instead, so players could decide whether to allow their Companion to transform at all.
• Should the Companion's Werewolf form get a separate skill bar?
  • If yes, then it would make sense for the Companion to get Companion versions of all 5 Werewolf Active Abilities, and allow the player to rearrange their order. This would be the first Companion skill line to have 5 skills.
  • If no, then these Werewolf abilities would need to share bar space with their human form abilities, making them less effective in one form or the other.
• Should the Companion always be in Werewolf form during combat? Alternatively, should the Werewolf form be purely cosmetic?
  • If the Companion always used their Werewolf form during combat, then they'd have no need for their human form skill lines. Likewise, if the Companion never used their Werewolf form during combat, then this would negate the purpose of having a Werewolf Companion in the first place. A good solution would be to make the Companion use their Werewolf form some of the time during combat. Ideally, if the player is a Werewolf themselves, the Werewolf Companion should be, too. But for players who are not Werewolves, they should still get to see their Werewolf Companion transform sometimes.

Additionally, here are some requests I have regarding Werewolf Companions:

1. I'd love to see the Werewolf Companion use a unique fur color to give them a unique visual identity in that form. This fur color could be given to the player as a Werewolf Transformation Skill Style, similar to how we could later acquire Tanlorin's unique cosmetics for our own characters.
   • Further, the Companion Werewolf skill icons could show the fur color of the specific Companion, to emphasize that these skills are tailored to this character. This would be like how the icon for Perigean Armor uses the look of Zerith-var himself, rather than the generic icon used for Bone Armor.
2. A transformed Werewolf Companion should count toward the player's "Call of the Hunt" passive. Likewise, a transformed player Werewolf should lengthen the transformation of the Companion Werewolf.
3. Obviously, the Werewolf Companion should use the new model.

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What changed about Werewolf in Update 50 that has an impact on how a Companion would adapt Werewolf?

For starters, the way the transformation works was overhauled. Instead of relying on "werewolf resource" to determine the transformation duration, it now solely relies on the Ultimate system.

• This is good news for a Werewolf Companion, because it means that it theoretically would be possible to have them extend their time transformed, especially if their Werewolf abilities could generate Ultimate. This would mean Prolific would be an ideal trait for keeping the Werewolf Companion transformed.

Additionally, the Werewolf skill line was refreshed. Using existing Companion skills as a reference, here is how I imagine the Update 50 Werewolf abilities might be adapted:

• Pounce/Carnage
  • Pounce would be a gap closer similar to Bashing Bulwark, with a range of 7 - 22 meters. If inspired by Brutal Pounce, this could be made into an AoE skill similar to Gallant Blitz. If inspired by Feral Pounce, this ability could generate Ultimate, like Parallel.
  • Carnage (if implemented) would be a DoT used when the enemy is below 25% Health while in melee range. Or, perhaps it is used regardless of enemy health, and deals triple damage to enemies under 25% Health, the way Spinning Steel works. Brutal Carnage would be like Sunder, while Feral Carnage would again generate Ultimate like Parallel.
• Hircine's Bounty
  • This could scale off the Companion's Max Health, similar to Snow Squall. Maybe it also reduces other Ability Cooldowns by 5 seconds or so when used, like Second Wind.
• Roar
  • This could be implemented like Masque of Torment. Additionally, this could provide a unique synergy or buff to grouped allies, similar to how Penetrating Strikes works.
• Gnash
  • Presuming this Werewolf Companion isn't meant to be a Tank while transformed, this ability would be most similar to Slayer's Blade. A single target melee range direct damage ability that deals triple damage to enemies below 25% Health, or is only used when the enemy is below 25% Health.
  • If we want this ability to taunt, then maybe it only taunts when the Companion is wearing 5 or more pieces of Heavy Armor, or has a taunt slotted on their human form bar.
  • If inspired by Rip and Tear, then it could have a self heal component and a debuff applied to the enemy.
• Rending Claws
  • If implemented like Bloodclaws, this would be most similar to Crescent Scythe and Sunder. A conal attack that applies a DoT with a HoT component.
  • If implemented like Claw Fury, this would be most similar to Penetrating Strikes. A channeled conal attack.

These skills would need to have their cooldowns balanced around what they actually do, and to ensure there is the right variety of Companion Werewolf skills being used during the Companion's rotation. Situational skills like self healing and executes generally have shorter cooldowns, so I can see Gnash (as the dedicated execute) and Hircine's Bounty (as the dedicated self heal) having 8 second cooldowns. I would then make Roar have a 16 second cooldown, as it's a crowd control ability, and leave Rending Claws and Pounce/Carnage as the main damaging skills at 12 second cooldowns. I don't expect any of the Companion Werewolf skills to have 36 second cooldowns. If the Companion Werewolf toolkit is meant to be fast paced like the player's Werewolf toolkit, then every ability should have the 8 second cooldown.

Several buffs, like Major Brutality, Savagery, and Resolve, can be sourced from the Companion's Werewolf skills, as they are found on the player's Werewolf skills. Yes, these buffs are actually useful for Companions, but they're often difficult to source.

Important to note is that none of the Companion Werewolf abilities would be listed as Criminal Acts. After all, Zerith-var's "Atoning Spirit" is based on "Spirit Mender", a Criminal Act skill, but his version is not a Criminal Act.

If Rampage were to be implemented for Werewolf Companions, then they would need to generate Fury, or a resource similar to it. I imagine this would increase the Companion's damage, reduce their cooldowns, and give them a heal over time.

I don't imagine that the Blood Hunger mechanic would be necessary to translate over into the Companion Werewolf's toolkit, as it's there in the player's toolkit to encourage them to use their skills in a specific order. This is irrelevant with Companions, who always cast their skills according to the placement of the skills on their bar.

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Thank you for reading this far. I really hope we'll get a Werewolf Companion some day, and I hope this thread gives ZOS some ideas for how they could go about it.

@ZOS_PhilipDraven @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_Erin @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Wuuffyy wrote: »

keto3000 wrote: »

Erickson9610 wrote: »

We've yet to get our first Companion who is a Werewolf (i.e. someone who has the Companion equivalent of the player's Werewolf skill line) and with the Werewolf refresh in Update 50, there are some aspects of this refresh that I'd like to comment on regarding its translation into the Companions system.

First, I'll give a brief overview of how Companions adapt Player skills. Feel free to skip over this section.

Companions have three Class skill lines, dedicated to damage dealing, healing, and tanking, respectively. They only have one Ultimate ability (which unlocks at Level 20), located in their damage dealing skill line. This Ultimate ability always costs 200 Ultimate and is unique to the Companion and is not based on an existing ability.

Companions also get skill lines for Weapon, Armor, and Guild (Fighters Guild, Mages Guild, and Undaunted) categories. The Racial skill line is just for a passive that is unique to the specific Companion (Zerith-var and Ember are both Khajiit but have different Khajiit passives). If a Companion adapts a skill line from another category (such as the World category) they'll likely implement it as their Class damage dealer line, like how Tanlorin uses the Companion adaptation of Soul Magic.

Additionally, the Class skill lines have different names than their Player counterparts, and (should they be shared between Companions, such as with Bastian Hallix and Tanlorin) may have different "morphs" and different chosen skills in the skill lines. Newer Companions have ability icons which portray the specific Companion, such as how Zerith-var's "Perigean Armor", based on the Bone Tyrant skill "Bone Armor", shows himself in the ability icon.

---

So, how could the Werewolf skill line be adapted to Companions?

Here are some design challenges and considerations:

• Companions only have one Ultimate. Should this be their version of Werewolf Transformation?
  • If yes, then this would mean their Class damage dealer skill line would have (possibly up to 3) Werewolf skills (which would exclude Hircine's Bounty and Roar, as they are utility skills), which could only be used while transformed. If Werewolf form skills were spread across the Class skill lines, then Hircine's Bounty and Roar might end up in the tank skill line. Since Companions get their Ultimate at Level 20, it would be a long time until the Companion gets to use this skill line.
  • If no, then this means the Companion would need to be able to turn into a Werewolf some other way. Maybe this could be sourced from a secondary Ultimate found in the World category, if remaining as close to the Player counterpart as possible, but this would mean that you would have to choose between letting the Companion use their human form Ultimate, or their Werewolf Ultimate. I think it would be better if the transformation was triggered by a passive ability, which could transform the Companion if they fall below a Health threshold or if the player transforms, which would allow the Companion to still use their human form Ultimate or transform. Maybe the transformation could work as an Active Ability instead, so players could decide whether to allow their Companion to transform at all.
• Should the Companion's Werewolf form get a separate skill bar?
  • If yes, then it would make sense for the Companion to get Companion versions of all 5 Werewolf Active Abilities, and allow the player to rearrange their order. This would be the first Companion skill line to have 5 skills.
  • If no, then these Werewolf abilities would need to share bar space with their human form abilities, making them less effective in one form or the other.
• Should the Companion always be in Werewolf form during combat? Alternatively, should the Werewolf form be purely cosmetic?
  • If the Companion always used their Werewolf form during combat, then they'd have no need for their human form skill lines. Likewise, if the Companion never used their Werewolf form during combat, then this would negate the purpose of having a Werewolf Companion in the first place. A good solution would be to make the Companion use their Werewolf form some of the time during combat. Ideally, if the player is a Werewolf themselves, the Werewolf Companion should be, too. But for players who are not Werewolves, they should still get to see their Werewolf Companion transform sometimes.

Additionally, here are some requests I have regarding Werewolf Companions:

1. I'd love to see the Werewolf Companion use a unique fur color to give them a unique visual identity in that form. This fur color could be given to the player as a Werewolf Transformation Skill Style, similar to how we could later acquire Tanlorin's unique cosmetics for our own characters.
   • Further, the Companion Werewolf skill icons could show the fur color of the specific Companion, to emphasize that these skills are tailored to this character. This would be like how the icon for Perigean Armor uses the look of Zerith-var himself, rather than the generic icon used for Bone Armor.
2. A transformed Werewolf Companion should count toward the player's "Call of the Hunt" passive. Likewise, a transformed player Werewolf should lengthen the transformation of the Companion Werewolf.
3. Obviously, the Werewolf Companion should use the new model.

---

What changed about Werewolf in Update 50 that has an impact on how a Companion would adapt Werewolf?

For starters, the way the transformation works was overhauled. Instead of relying on "werewolf resource" to determine the transformation duration, it now solely relies on the Ultimate system.

• This is good news for a Werewolf Companion, because it means that it theoretically would be possible to have them extend their time transformed, especially if their Werewolf abilities could generate Ultimate. This would mean Prolific would be an ideal trait for keeping the Werewolf Companion transformed.

Additionally, the Werewolf skill line was refreshed. Using existing Companion skills as a reference, here is how I imagine the Update 50 Werewolf abilities might be adapted:

• Pounce/Carnage
  • Pounce would be a gap closer similar to Bashing Bulwark, with a range of 7 - 22 meters. If inspired by Brutal Pounce, this could be made into an AoE skill similar to Gallant Blitz. If inspired by Feral Pounce, this ability could generate Ultimate, like Parallel.
  • Carnage (if implemented) would be a DoT used when the enemy is below 25% Health while in melee range. Or, perhaps it is used regardless of enemy health, and deals triple damage to enemies under 25% Health, the way Spinning Steel works. Brutal Carnage would be like Sunder, while Feral Carnage would again generate Ultimate like Parallel.
• Hircine's Bounty
  • This could scale off the Companion's Max Health, similar to Snow Squall. Maybe it also reduces other Ability Cooldowns by 5 seconds or so when used, like Second Wind.
• Roar
  • This could be implemented like Masque of Torment. Additionally, this could provide a unique synergy or buff to grouped allies, similar to how Penetrating Strikes works.
• Gnash
  • Presuming this Werewolf Companion isn't meant to be a Tank while transformed, this ability would be most similar to Slayer's Blade. A single target melee range direct damage ability that deals triple damage to enemies below 25% Health, or is only used when the enemy is below 25% Health.
  • If we want this ability to taunt, then maybe it only taunts when the Companion is wearing 5 or more pieces of Heavy Armor, or has a taunt slotted on their human form bar.
  • If inspired by Rip and Tear, then it could have a self heal component and a debuff applied to the enemy.
• Rending Claws
  • If implemented like Bloodclaws, this would be most similar to Crescent Scythe and Sunder. A conal attack that applies a DoT with a HoT component.
  • If implemented like Claw Fury, this would be most similar to Penetrating Strikes. A channeled conal attack.

These skills would need to have their cooldowns balanced around what they actually do, and to ensure there is the right variety of Companion Werewolf skills being used during the Companion's rotation. Situational skills like self healing and executes generally have shorter cooldowns, so I can see Gnash (as the dedicated execute) and Hircine's Bounty (as the dedicated self heal) having 8 second cooldowns. I would then make Roar have a 16 second cooldown, as it's a crowd control ability, and leave Rending Claws and Pounce/Carnage as the main damaging skills at 12 second cooldowns. I don't expect any of the Companion Werewolf skills to have 36 second cooldowns. If the Companion Werewolf toolkit is meant to be fast paced like the player's Werewolf toolkit, then every ability should have the 8 second cooldown.

Several buffs, like Major Brutality, Savagery, and Resolve, can be sourced from the Companion's Werewolf skills, as they are found on the player's Werewolf skills. Yes, these buffs are actually useful for Companions, but they're often difficult to source.

Important to note is that none of the Companion Werewolf abilities would be listed as Criminal Acts. After all, Zerith-var's "Atoning Spirit" is based on "Spirit Mender", a Criminal Act skill, but his version is not a Criminal Act.

If Rampage were to be implemented for Werewolf Companions, then they would need to generate Fury, or a resource similar to it. I imagine this would increase the Companion's damage, reduce their cooldowns, and give them a heal over time.

I don't imagine that the Blood Hunger mechanic would be necessary to translate over into the Companion Werewolf's toolkit, as it's there in the player's toolkit to encourage them to use their skills in a specific order. This is irrelevant with Companions, who always cast their skills according to the placement of the skills on their bar.

---

Thank you for reading this far. I really hope we'll get a Werewolf Companion some day, and I hope this thread gives ZOS some ideas for how they could go about it.

@ZOS_PhilipDraven @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_Erin @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

Or... maybe your current companion could transform into werewolf form whenever you do....

Oooooh, this and a different set of skills! I’d gladly pay for that!

Between this and Overland difficult modifiers, this would be the first companion I’d personally be interested in.