The best best part... The return of Quen!!

Mizael wrote: »

It was a nice stream, having thosd sneak peaks especially. I love the new passives if you are a pure class, it makes so much sense, hopefully it doesn't make me have to subclass to enjoy endgame pve

The whole point of those class mastery passives is so that you don't have to subclass.

Maitsukas wrote: »

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Was a good stream. Looking forward to the next one.

Also, were drops broken for anyone else? I watched the entire stream, I got a pop-up that there are drops for this stream, but there was no campaign when I checked and nothing that I could claim in my Twitch inventory. Did you disable the drop campaign because you are looking for a better solution? Or is this problem just with me?

That seems to a be a bug on Twitch's side, I had a similar issue while I was watching No Man's Sky streams for drops this week. A quick reload of the whole website seemed to fix this.

I did do that and it didn't fix anything though. I reloaded it the first time to be able to watch the stream in the first place. Then I opened it again when it didn't show me drops progress after a couple of minutes but nothing.

I love that the team was very responsive to the questions and that was being brought up and even though they weren't able to get to to everyone there was still a call out during the stream saying that they don't think that certain questions that can answer right now. It still gives us a sense that you guys are seeing us.

The information was presented in a way that was both informative and technical. We got to see the features that you guys were talking about being played out in real time such as the vestige mode and what you guys like to see moving forward to support it.

I love the fact that you are bringing new quest into the game that follow along the same quest pathfinding that tes3 used to have. It gives us a choice in difficulty and gives us a variety on how we want to play. I do hope we see more of these moving forward along with more complex puzzles that you showcase and maybe make one of those puzzles require us to put a banana into it. Just as a nice Easter egg or nod to the stream.

Unfortunately I had to go into a meeting during the part where you guys talked about the DK changes but overall I would like to see more of these streams moving forward.

Also some suggestions from the chat that I do want to give highlight to in this post. I saw someone ask if you guys were going to scale up the zones to accommodate the new quest that you're going to be giving to those zones. I want to go a step further and suggest that not only that you scale up the zones but also have certain quests trigger the zone to change. Similar to how you used to do with older quest. I know that puts people in different instances however I do want to see the zones build up and change with the progression of the years (ie. Such as Vivec city, I would love to see the cantons develop more than the construction that they are in right now.)

AedanHalcon wrote: »

I really don't like the class mastery stuff. It feels like a real backtrack on subclassing. Tying anything powerful to a baseclass makes me feel like I'm losing stuff if I decide to Subclass. When especially after the class reworks are done it will end up just being a buff considering I thought the whole Idea was to to balance around skill lines while providing synergy between the class skill lines. Which is exactly what I wanted as it would lead to a careful weighing of the up and downsides of swapping out a skill line while also not punishing you too hard for swapping one out for flavor. For example I have a Nord Arcanist who uses the winters embrace skill line and in my head its almost more important to her Identity than any individual Arcanist skill line so I wont remove it and she loses a benefit with no trade off as I'm not subclassing her for a meta reason.

You exactly should feel that way. Pure classes should excel in all the stuff regarding their own class, subclasses can add diversity and flavor.

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

dcrush wrote: »

I like this improvement in communication.

@ZOS_Kevin - I see this stream has additional drops. With people from all over the world playing ESO, would it be possible to have reruns of these kind of streams where drops are turned on? This particular one is, for example, 2AM in my timezone. I already missed out on the 8 crates that dropped during the special stream earlier this year simply because it was at 4AM for me. It would be nice if there’s a way for people in other time zones to be able to get things like this too.

Yeah, totally understand how missing drops due to time zone doesn't feel good. This is something we can look into. Thanks for the suggestion.

Ratzkifal wrote: »

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

dcrush wrote: »

I like this improvement in communication.

@ZOS_Kevin - I see this stream has additional drops. With people from all over the world playing ESO, would it be possible to have reruns of these kind of streams where drops are turned on? This particular one is, for example, 2AM in my timezone. I already missed out on the 8 crates that dropped during the special stream earlier this year simply because it was at 4AM for me. It would be nice if there’s a way for people in other time zones to be able to get things like this too.

Yeah, totally understand how missing drops due to time zone doesn't feel good. This is something we can look into. Thanks for the suggestion.

@ZOS_Kevin Another game that I play uses redeem codes displayed on their developer streams that are valid for 48hours so people can watch the VOD as well. Maybe that could work? Although I'm not sure if that would work with steam accounts. Also the other game company streams on youtube and ESO is on twitch so I understand if the VOD viewership is just not a priority. Still, I think it's worth considering.

Ratzkifal wrote: »

Was a good stream. Looking forward to the next one.

Also, were drops broken for anyone else? I watched the entire stream, I got a pop-up that there are drops for this stream, but there was no campaign when I checked and nothing that I could claim in my Twitch inventory. Did you disable the drop campaign because you are looking for a better solution? Or is this problem just with me?

Feels kind of ironic that I wouldn't get any drops after pointing this out and tripple checking that everything is setup correctly for me. Missing drops due to time zones doesn't feel good? Imagine watching the stream, thinking you are getting drops and only realizing afterwards that apparently nothing worked and you still didn't get drops.
I'd say that's another point in favor of using redeem codes over twitch campaigns when it comes to the official ZOS streams. It's just more reliable that way.

The rumours, favours, and sage's vault sound really interesting and are perhaps the type of content that will keep me playing for a while, depending on the implementation. I didn't listen to the class stuff, but if they're making pure classes powerful again, that's awesome. Multiclassing should always come with drawbacks, like in every other RPG that's ever been released.

I don't foresee the Class Mastery passives burying anything. They're being implemented as a mechanism to briing pure classes to be on par performance wise with subclassing. Subclass builds that are not utilizing the top skill lines wouldn't be getting buried by Class Mastery. They'll just simply fall short because of sub optimal build choices.

And they outlined their approach to make every class have role focused skill lines to eliminate the current issue only a few skill lines dominating every build. And it sounded like a reasonable approach, even if it will be a while to see it come to fruition.

Radiate77 wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

I don't foresee the Class Mastery passives burying anything. They're being implemented as a mechanism to briing pure classes to be on par performance wise with subclassing. Subclass builds that are not utilizing the top skill lines wouldn't be getting buried by Class Mastery. They'll just simply fall short because of sub optimal build choices.

The refresh that just started with Dragonknight is bringing everything to par.

Class Mastery Skill Lines are a statement.
“Make the inefficient, less efficient.”

Only partially. It's primary focus is to bring back some class identity for all classes, and to provide a consistent framework for them to work with going forward. Once all the classes are done, subclassing would still outperform pure classing. Thus the Class Mastery passives. And the few passives they gave us a peak at weren't exactly game breaking.

ZOS_Kevin wrote: »

Kallykat wrote: »

I was most interested in the things Jason talked about. I still have a lot of questions, but it was good to hear at least a little more about those upcoming features.

You can always post your questions here. Just know we may not be able to answer specifics until we are just a little closer. But we will also be able to give more clear answers once that content is up on PTS as well.

Kevin you guys are making a bad turn with Class Mastery Passives, I get that the values are subject to change, but this cannot exist post-Refresh.

Big fan of the increase in communication you guys have been doing the last month, and hoping it continues going forward! Getting bits of news as it's available, even if it's incomplete and subject to change, is great. Looking forward to figure streams of this type!

First of all I really hope these streams continue; its such a breath of fresh air to see a little of what's actively being worked on!

Secondly, I was most excited to see the class mastery passives. Subclassing doesn't appeal to me at all as someone who primarily designs my characters Around the class I chose for them, but also likes doing dungeons and trials at like, mid-levels - being de facto worse as a pure class didn't feel good - it'll be really nice to have a way to bridge the gap as a pure class.

Really really loving the changes in communication and transparency!

Radiate77 wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

Radiate77 wrote: »

DenverRalphy wrote: »

I don't foresee the Class Mastery passives burying anything. They're being implemented as a mechanism to briing pure classes to be on par performance wise with subclassing. Subclass builds that are not utilizing the top skill lines wouldn't be getting buried by Class Mastery. They'll just simply fall short because of sub optimal build choices.

The refresh that just started with Dragonknight is bringing everything to par.

Class Mastery Skill Lines are a statement.
“Make the inefficient, less efficient.”

Only partially. It's primary focus is to bring back some class identity for all classes, and to provide a consistent framework for them to work with going forward. Once all the classes are done, subclassing would still outperform pure classing. Thus the Class Mastery passives. And the few passives they gave us a peak at weren't exactly game breaking.

What? No it won’t.
The only reason Subclassing overperforms, and only on a select few builds, is because of their ability to stack role-specific skill lines.

This refresh is REMOVING role-specific skill lines.

Look at Ardent Flame with their healer skills and tank ultimate, or Draconic with actual Damage capability now.

Assassination is getting tank and healer skills.
Stormcalling is getting tank and healer skills.
Animal Companions is getting… you guessed it.

Class Mastery Passives are meant to project Starter Classes above everything else, and they will accomplish that mission. They are loaded. 😂

Here’s one.


Yeah bro, definitely gonna subclass away from loaded Templar. /s

You could interpret it as taking a different approach. With these Class Mastery passives I can see them keeping the rolespecific skill lines rolespecific. Tune these passives right and there is nothing in the way of moving some power back into Earthen Heart for example to restore its value when subclassing into it.
That said, I still disagree with your assertion that subclassing is the underpowered suboptimal playstyle. Subclassing is the equivalent of having an olympic swimmer and olympic cyclist and olympic 100m sprinter competing in the same race. Everyone is going to pick the bicycle because it's obviously the fastest option. Where there used to be 3 gold medals thanks to different classes still being invited to raids thanks to their unique group buffs, there is now only one gold medal. The number of possible builds might have gone up with subclassing but the number of optimal builds has gone down. And not to mention that peak dps has also become even more inflated.
These class mastery passives are a new tool to make it so that pure classes can compete with the top subclassed builds while at the same time allowing subclassing to remain attractive, rather than gutting most subclassed builds like their previous approach would have.

I really enjoyed the stream and hearing a little bit about what's coming up. I like that there was a variety of topics, but not so many that the developers couldn't spend a good amount of time talking about them and giving insight.

It relieved my mind of a bit of worry to find out that the upcoming quests are going to be more like main quests in length and, I hope, depth. I like the idea of adding new areas to existing zones and making them have more relevance past their initial release and I absolutely love that time will keep progressing. I think adding a pop-up letting people know if they are about to play a quest out of order is a good idea, too, particularly if it directs players to the quest arc that comes first in the timeline. Perhaps a larger list somewhere in the help or stories menus would be useful, too, in guiding players who want to know in what order to play the available content.

I'm very interested in learning more about favors, rumors, and the Sage's Vault. From what I heard, all three sound like they have a lot of potential to be interesting and immersive.