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DK's Inhale's sustain change needs to be reverted
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hoangdz✭✭✭MXVIIDREAM wrote: »MXVIIDREAM wrote: »MXVIIDREAM wrote: »It’s missing resources not max if I have 30k max mag and I’m missing 20k it’s 15% of 20k I get back not 15% of 30k
I think that’s why when I was testing it at realistic levels it seems fair
Also why I think testing it at 0 is silly because how many of us are casually running around or fighting at 0% stam or mag
I was testing it the results seemed not so great now I’m going to guess many people haven’t tested it themselves and have mistaken the wording
That is why I suggested a cap on page 1 of this thread, because anyone with the ability to do basic math can figure out the recovery potential for resource based builds. It wouldn't even affect most of the people that are crying about nerfs and jealousy.
Yeah this is going to attract all the right attention for all the wrong reasons most of the about 3 people saying it’s over powered QQ meanwhile the other 80 odd people are fine with it, happy with the change or saying balance it IF NEEDED AT THE TIME !after! all the classes have been done
Butas they say, there’s always one 😂
You don't even play on PTS lol. ZOS isn't going consider your opinion as much as mine, even if you think I'm wrong.
Try reading my other posts you’ll find yourself pretty wrong
I also don’t think zos really has a bias to whose opinion is better I’d like to think they value everyone’s opinions
Strange really as it was my pts feedback that sparked the big thread about the armour buff visuals being changed, but you keep doing you bud
Wow you sparked the big thread about armour visual change. Very impactful for PvP lol.0 -
MXVIIDREAM✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »No, it doesn't... You can achieve the very same results with Siphoning Attacks or Dark Deal/Conversion (if you want to do the latter while blocking, just get Light Weaver passive from Restoring Light).
Inhale is a strong sustain skill as well now, I see nothing wrong with that.
If anything, they should introduce something similar to other classes too that are still missing sustain abilities and make them thematically different.
Itd be nice if darkdeal went back to its flat resource return. The overtime ruined the point of the skill and was a sad attempt at copying warden's netch.
Inhale needs to be adjusted BADLY. Any build is going to be able to permablock with this one skill. "Strong" is a vast understatement.
15% every 2s is insane though just some rough meta pvp numbers from one of my builds.
31khp == 4650hp == 2325hpPvP
16.5kmag == 2475 return/2s
22.2kstam == 3330 return/2s
In total over 3 ticks thats 24390 resources from paying 3370
Even darkdeal trades 2700 for 8560 combined resources over that same 4s period. Except darkdeal is bashable and leaves you open, not to mention on a janky long cast time. Oh and I can't maintain permablock with darkdeal.
Then that’s a dark deal issue that should be resolved not slapping a big nerf on this skill
You’ve over read the part about missing resources not max aswell
Hope this helps
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tye77732145✭✭no its fine but need to increase the damage of the ability 100% and reduce the duration to 2 sec because the damage is joke.
thank you, i agree the damage isnt good, the bit of sustain is fine. And for thoese who actually duel and pvp would notice that flames of oblivion increasing in cost balances out a bit with heart of flame, the cost form flames of oblvion iss actually quite a bit and he probably doesnt use it thats why hes probably saying that.0 -
MXVIIDREAM✭✭✭I used ai to run the numbers and it surprised me aswell as it being pretty blunt but here’s the numbers for what the skill does assuming 25k pool of your dominant resource hope this clears up the confusion
• Without factoring in the skill’s cost, it’s stronger than Dark Deal below ~33% resources.
• Factoring in the 3,400 Magicka cost per cast, it’s only better at ~5% resources, basically when you’re nearly empty.
Also, the skill’s second tick is smaller than the first, so the total return isn’t even a full 30% of missing resources. Meanwhile, in the same 4 seconds, you could cast two Dark Deals, getting flat resources plus a heal.
This isn’t infinite sustain — it’s just a panic button when you’re almost dead, and claiming otherwise is just wrong.1 -
tye77732145✭✭No, it doesn't... You can achieve the very same results with Siphoning Attacks or Dark Deal/Conversion (if you want to do the latter while blocking, just get Light Weaver passive from Restoring Light).
Inhale is a strong sustain skill as well now, I see nothing wrong with that.
If anything, they should introduce something similar to other classes too that are still missing sustain abilities and make them thematically different.
Amen to this
W decimus. 1 -
MXVIIDREAM✭✭✭MincMincMinc wrote: »No, it doesn't... You can achieve the very same results with Siphoning Attacks or Dark Deal/Conversion (if you want to do the latter while blocking, just get Light Weaver passive from Restoring Light).
Inhale is a strong sustain skill as well now, I see nothing wrong with that.
If anything, they should introduce something similar to other classes too that are still missing sustain abilities and make them thematically different.
Itd be nice if darkdeal went back to its flat resource return. The overtime ruined the point of the skill and was a sad attempt at copying warden's netch.
Inhale needs to be adjusted BADLY. Any build is going to be able to permablock with this one skill. "Strong" is a vast understatement.
15% every 2s is insane though just some rough meta pvp numbers from one of my builds.
31khp == 4650hp == 2325hpPvP
16.5kmag == 2475 return/2s
22.2kstam == 3330 return/2s
In total over 3 ticks thats 24390 resources from paying 3370
Even darkdeal trades 2700 for 8560 combined resources over that same 4s period. Except darkdeal is bashable and leaves you open, not to mention on a janky long cast time. Oh and I can't maintain permablock with darkdeal.
Yeah, because you'll constantly be at 0% resources lmao. You want about 5.2k stam left at all times in PvP, otherwise you're outside break free range and you definitely die. Even if you're EXACTLY at the min threshold where u wanna stay that's 17k stam for 17k our of 22.2k is 76%. You'd recover 15% of 76% which is 2.5k. Siphoning Strikes gives 2.6k on cast and also lots of passive sustain. You'll also get ~4k stam back from sustain and the 1st tick by the time this effect finished. Oh no. In the BEST CASE SCENARIO I got 4k stam back over 4s. Surely a nightblade doesn't get 2600 + 4x 200 for 3400 in a 4s interval from a single cast as well, right?
BuT WhAt AbOuT MaG? You get both resources!!!!!!!
16.5k mag. you need 3.5k to cast the skill so you have 13k missing mag. that's 1.95k mag return on 1st tick. 3.5-4k mag goes up after 2s from sustain and the restore -> 9k missing mag. You get 3.3k mag back, again, IN THE BEST CASE SCENARIO.
Therefore, rather easy conclusion. It's the same as Siphoning Strikes.
Dark deal gives 4560 stam over 4s btw. Dark Deal also heals a ton AND insantly, just saying Only about half your health really, which is not worth mentioning I guess, but let's assume 10k. And you can cast it multiple times in a row, with diminishing returns obviously - the same which applies here. Oh and did I mention that Minor Berserk is pretty rare since Camo Hunter is a rather bad skill? A strong free buff is not something we mention, do we? Might skew our mental gymnastics if we did.
Did I also mention that a class rework is not supposed to make the class trash? No? Maybe it's worth mentioning this, and also the fact that eventually every class will get a refresh.
So we have:
A skill that gives back ~14000 resources instantly and another 1440 over the last 6s without you having to do anything. That would be 4450 stam over 4s + a big burst heal AND a nice buff.
A skill that gives back 5200 resources, than another 400/s indefinitely without doing anything ( which is 4000/10s ) for a total of 6.8k over 4s. A
A skill that gives 3.3 and 3.5 over 4s In the BEST case scenario, for a total of 6.8.
Oh my Godd! Would you look at that. They're balanced
Just to add to this each tick restores less by the way it’s 15% of the current tha you have so if you restore and don’t consume that resorce then you get less next tick obviously
Edit
Sorry no you did factor that in
Edited by MXVIIDREAM on January 20, 2026 5:41PM1 -
MXVIIDREAM✭✭✭tye77732145 wrote: »hoangz buddy ... i know your trolling, stop it. It doesnt give too much sustain, the cost of flames of oblivion is actually bonkers ,making the sustain worse. You think its alot of sustain cuz you run alot of recovery glyphs and haunch food knowing you and how you duel and play? you wanna end matches quick by out sustaining DKs. You legit barely play DK especially on Live, and ever since subclassing ive never seen you on a DK, me, meap, and sometimes frizzy and gundii and 1 other i know have been playing only DK everyone else meta assasination. To you its alot of sustain, but its interesting how you didnt mentioned corrosive or onslaught because i saw you use thoese, when all these players are crutching waiting to use that to win duels. I understand the sugar skulls but even with that the sustain is mid, Next time you make a post legit get the facts straight. If you think its too much "sustain" dont use it, and then tell me if you have sustain, when i see you on PTS i want you not to use it and tell me how your sustain is doing. Many players in the rift would tell you the sustain is mid and some say its "okay" your the first and only person i hear complaining that it's "too much". The heart of flame breathe doesnt even have too much damage compared to the other morph which is a bit more but doesnt heal instead. Ive been playing since PTS came out till now, Do me a favor and spend a week more or 2 before you come up with such conclusion.
Well this explains a whole lot about his approach to this 😂😂😂 been outed there
So he’s made this whole troll post to try make dks weaker ?
That’s crazy behaviour hope a dev sees this and closes the thread at this pointEdited by MXVIIDREAM on January 20, 2026 5:45PM3 -
hoangdz✭✭✭Okay, let's say I wanna be a stamDK for some reason. Inhale ticks 3 times over 4s, restoring both resources. Here are some stat numbers before calculations:
Inhale's base cost: 3500
Stamina recovery: 750
Magicka recovery: 550
Max stam: 30000
Max mag: 20000
Here are the resources restored over 4s at different percentages of missing stam/mag:
At 100% mag and 100% stam: 20000 mag and 30000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 3500
Missing stam: 0
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 525 + 364 + 309 = 1198
Stam: 0 since we're at full stam
At 90% mag and 90% stam: 18000 mag and 27000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 5500
Missing stam: 3000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 825 + 618 + 526 = 1969
Stam: 450 + 338 + 287 = 1075
At 80% mag and 80% stam: 16000 mag and 24000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 7500
Missing stam: 6000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1125 + 872 + 741 = 2738
Stam: 900 + 713 + 606 = 2219
At 70% mag and 70% stam: 14000 mag and 21000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 9500
Missing stam: 9000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1425 + 1127 + 957 = 3509
Stam: 1350 + 1088 + 925 = 3363
At 60% mag and 60% stam: 12000 mag and 18000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 11500
Missing stam: 12000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1725 + 1382 + 1173 = 4280
Stam: 1800 + 1463 + 1244 = 4507
At 50% mag and 50% stam: 10000 mag and 15000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 13500
Missing stam: 15000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2025 + 1637 + 1389 = 5051
Stam: 2250 + 1838 + 1563 = 5651
At 40% mag and 40% stam: 8000 mag and 12000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 15500
Missing stam: 18000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2325 + 1892 + 1604 = 5821
Stam: 2700 + 2213 + 1882 = 6795
At 30% mag and 30% stam: 6000 mag and 9000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 17500
Missing stam: 21000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2625 + 2147 + 1819 = 6179
Stam: 3150 + 2588 + 2201 = 7939
At 20% mag and 20% stam: 4000 mag and 6000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 19500
Missing stam: 24000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2925 + 2402 + 2034 = 6179
Stam: 3600 + 2963 + 2520 = 9083
At minimum mag (3500) and 0% stam: 3500 mag and 0 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 16500
Missing stam: 30000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2475 + 2002 + 1702 = 6179
Stam: 4500 + 3713 + 3158 = 11371
You will break even with mag sustain when at 70% max mag. At 50% for both resources, you will net 1551 mag and 5651 stam over 4 seconds, which amounts to 775 mag recovery and 2825 stam recovery. At 30% for both resources, you will gain an equivalent of 1339 mag recovery and 3969 stam recovery over 4 seconds. All of this is coming from ONE ability. I have not considered sustain from Combustion which gives 225 mag and stam when you proc Burning, which has a 1s cooldown, Battle Roar, or Helping Hands.
Dark Deal on the other hand, restores 3600 stam up front and another 2400 stam over 10s. When converted to recovery, that's a total of 2280 stam recovery. Some people will be eager to say that Dark Deal can be casted multiple times during the 4s window of Inhale, but that's a short-sighted view. You need to consider the GCD efficiency of these abilities. Dark Deal is a channel and requires you to spend a GCD per cast, while Inhale only requires 1 initial cast.
This means that when you're busy casting 3 Dark Deals in that 4s window, I can either:
1) Perform an offensive combo on you
2) Restore additional resources via Battle Roar or Helping Hands
3) Recast my buffs
If you cannot see this difference, then we aren't really arguing on common grounds, and there's literally no point in continuing further discussion lol.Edited by hoangdz on January 21, 2026 5:20AM3 -
MXVIIDREAM✭✭✭Okay, let's say I have 20k mag and 30k stam cause I wanna be a stamDK for some reason. Inhale ticks 3 times over 4s, restoring both resources. Here are some stat numbers before calculations:
Inhale's base cost: 3500
Stamina recovery: 750
Magicka recovery: 550
Here are the resources restored over 4s at different percentages of missing stam/mag:
At 100% mag and 100% stam: 20000 mag and 30000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 3500
Missing stam: 0
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 525 + 364 + 309 = 1198
Stam: 0 since we're at full stam
At 90% mag and 90% stam: 18000 mag and 27000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 5500
Missing stam: 3000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 825 + 618 + 526 = 1969
Stam: 450 + 338 + 287 = 1075
At 80% mag and 80% stam: 16000 mag and 24000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 7500
Missing stam: 6000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1125 + 872 + 741 = 2738
Stam: 900 + 713 + 606 = 2219
At 70% mag and 70% stam: 14000 mag and 21000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 9500
Missing stam: 9000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1425 + 1127 + 957 = 3509
Stam: 1350 + 1088 + 925 = 3363
At 60% mag and 60% stam: 12000 mag and 18000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 11500
Missing stam: 12000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1725 + 1382 + 1173 = 4280
Stam: 1800 + 1463 + 1244 = 4507
At 50% mag and 50% stam: 10000 mag and 15000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 13500
Missing stam: 15000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2025 + 1637 + 1389 = 5051
Stam: 2250 + 1838 + 1563 = 5651
At 40% mag and 40% stam: 8000 mag and 12000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 15500
Missing stam: 18000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2325 + 1892 + 1604 = 5821
Stam: 2700 + 2213 + 1882 = 6795
At 30% mag and 30% stam: 6000 mag and 9000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 17500
Missing stam: 21000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2625 + 2147 + 1819 = 6179
Stam: 3150 + 2588 + 2201 = 7939
At 20% mag and 20% stam: 4000 mag and 6000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 19500
Missing stam: 24000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2925 + 2402 + 2034 = 6179
Stam: 3600 + 2963 + 2520 = 9083
At minimum mag (3500) and 0% stam: 3500 mag and 0 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 16500
Missing stam: 30000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2475 + 2002 + 1702 = 6179
Stam: 4500 + 3713 + 3158 = 11371
You will break even with mag sustain when above 62% max mag. At 50% for both resources, you will net 1551 mag and 5651 stam over 4 seconds, which amounts to 775 mag recovery and 2825 stam recovery. At 30% for both resources, you will gain an equivalent of 1339 mag recovery and 3969 stam recovery over 4 seconds. All of this is coming from ONE ability. I have not considered sustain from Combustion which gives 225 mag and stam when you proc Burning, which has a 1s cooldown, Battle Roar, or Helping Hands.
Dark Deal on the other hand, restores 3600 stam up front and another 2400 stam over 10s. When converted to recovery, that's a total of 2280 stam recovery. Some people will be eager to say that Dark Deal can be casted multiple times during the 4s window of Inhale, but that's a short-sighted view. You need to consider the GCD efficiency of these abilities. Dark Deal is a channel and requires you to spend a GCD per cast, while Inhale only requires 1 initial cast.
This means that when you're busy casting 3 Dark Deals in that 4s window, I can either:
1) Perform an offensive combo on you
2) Restore additional resources via Battle Roar or Helping Hands
3) Recast my buffs
If you cannot see this difference, then we aren't really arguing on common grounds, and there's literally no point in continuing further discussion lol.
Give up you’ve been outed all ready for what you’re trying to do
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hoangdz✭✭✭MXVIIDREAM wrote: »Okay, let's say I have 20k mag and 30k stam cause I wanna be a stamDK for some reason. Inhale ticks 3 times over 4s, restoring both resources. Here are some stat numbers before calculations:
Inhale's base cost: 3500
Stamina recovery: 750
Magicka recovery: 550
Here are the resources restored over 4s at different percentages of missing stam/mag:
At 100% mag and 100% stam: 20000 mag and 30000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 3500
Missing stam: 0
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 525 + 364 + 309 = 1198
Stam: 0 since we're at full stam
At 90% mag and 90% stam: 18000 mag and 27000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 5500
Missing stam: 3000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 825 + 618 + 526 = 1969
Stam: 450 + 338 + 287 = 1075
At 80% mag and 80% stam: 16000 mag and 24000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 7500
Missing stam: 6000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1125 + 872 + 741 = 2738
Stam: 900 + 713 + 606 = 2219
At 70% mag and 70% stam: 14000 mag and 21000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 9500
Missing stam: 9000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1425 + 1127 + 957 = 3509
Stam: 1350 + 1088 + 925 = 3363
At 60% mag and 60% stam: 12000 mag and 18000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 11500
Missing stam: 12000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 1725 + 1382 + 1173 = 4280
Stam: 1800 + 1463 + 1244 = 4507
At 50% mag and 50% stam: 10000 mag and 15000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 13500
Missing stam: 15000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2025 + 1637 + 1389 = 5051
Stam: 2250 + 1838 + 1563 = 5651
At 40% mag and 40% stam: 8000 mag and 12000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 15500
Missing stam: 18000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2325 + 1892 + 1604 = 5821
Stam: 2700 + 2213 + 1882 = 6795
At 30% mag and 30% stam: 6000 mag and 9000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 17500
Missing stam: 21000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2625 + 2147 + 1819 = 6179
Stam: 3150 + 2588 + 2201 = 7939
At 20% mag and 20% stam: 4000 mag and 6000 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 19500
Missing stam: 24000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2925 + 2402 + 2034 = 6179
Stam: 3600 + 2963 + 2520 = 9083
At minimum mag (3500) and 0% stam: 3500 mag and 0 stamMissing mag after casting Inhale: 16500
Missing stam: 30000
Resources restored after accounting for 1 recovery tick:
Mag: 2475 + 2002 + 1702 = 6179
Stam: 4500 + 3713 + 3158 = 11371
You will break even with mag sustain when above 62% max mag. At 50% for both resources, you will net 1551 mag and 5651 stam over 4 seconds, which amounts to 775 mag recovery and 2825 stam recovery. At 30% for both resources, you will gain an equivalent of 1339 mag recovery and 3969 stam recovery over 4 seconds. All of this is coming from ONE ability. I have not considered sustain from Combustion which gives 225 mag and stam when you proc Burning, which has a 1s cooldown, Battle Roar, or Helping Hands.
Dark Deal on the other hand, restores 3600 stam up front and another 2400 stam over 10s. When converted to recovery, that's a total of 2280 stam recovery. Some people will be eager to say that Dark Deal can be casted multiple times during the 4s window of Inhale, but that's a short-sighted view. You need to consider the GCD efficiency of these abilities. Dark Deal is a channel and requires you to spend a GCD per cast, while Inhale only requires 1 initial cast.
This means that when you're busy casting 3 Dark Deals in that 4s window, I can either:
1) Perform an offensive combo on you
2) Restore additional resources via Battle Roar or Helping Hands
3) Recast my buffs
If you cannot see this difference, then we aren't really arguing on common grounds, and there's literally no point in continuing further discussion lol.
Give up you’ve been outed all ready for what you’re trying to do
You are actually obsessed with this thread. Not even a minute after I posted that comment and you already commented. Actually hilarious lol0 -
tye77732145✭✭MXVIIDREAM wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »hoangz buddy ... i know your trolling, stop it. It doesnt give too much sustain, the cost of flames of oblivion is actually bonkers ,making the sustain worse. You think its alot of sustain cuz you run alot of recovery glyphs and haunch food knowing you and how you duel and play? you wanna end matches quick by out sustaining DKs. You legit barely play DK especially on Live, and ever since subclassing ive never seen you on a DK, me, meap, and sometimes frizzy and gundii and 1 other i know have been playing only DK everyone else meta assasination. To you its alot of sustain, but its interesting how you didnt mentioned corrosive or onslaught because i saw you use thoese, when all these players are crutching waiting to use that to win duels. I understand the sugar skulls but even with that the sustain is mid, Next time you make a post legit get the facts straight. If you think its too much "sustain" dont use it, and then tell me if you have sustain, when i see you on PTS i want you not to use it and tell me how your sustain is doing. Many players in the rift would tell you the sustain is mid and some say its "okay" your the first and only person i hear complaining that it's "too much". The heart of flame breathe doesnt even have too much damage compared to the other morph which is a bit more but doesnt heal instead. Ive been playing since PTS came out till now, Do me a favor and spend a week more or 2 before you come up with such conclusion.
Well this explains a whole lot about his approach to this 😂😂😂 been outed there
So he’s made this whole post to try make dks weaker ?
Correct, I’ve known him for a while, as have many people in the Stormhaven and PvP/dueling community, and they will all back up what I’m saying. I’m going to let the entire PvP community know that he said the above, so don’t be surprised when they come to the forums on this post.
Also, the people above are not wrong about Dark Deal. I always tell others to spend at least a week, around 8–15 hours a day on the PTS before drawing any conclusions and I’ve done that and more. I haven’t logged into Live at all because I’ve been testing so extensively on the PTS.
It’s unfortunate that some players, in an attempt to gain an advantage, will criticize an ability not to help improve it, but simply to secure an edge over others so they don’t lose. That isn’t constructive criticism, it’s predatory criticism.2 -
hoangdz✭✭✭tye77732145 wrote: »MXVIIDREAM wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »hoangz buddy ... i know your trolling, stop it. It doesnt give too much sustain, the cost of flames of oblivion is actually bonkers ,making the sustain worse. You think its alot of sustain cuz you run alot of recovery glyphs and haunch food knowing you and how you duel and play? you wanna end matches quick by out sustaining DKs. You legit barely play DK especially on Live, and ever since subclassing ive never seen you on a DK, me, meap, and sometimes frizzy and gundii and 1 other i know have been playing only DK everyone else meta assasination. To you its alot of sustain, but its interesting how you didnt mentioned corrosive or onslaught because i saw you use thoese, when all these players are crutching waiting to use that to win duels. I understand the sugar skulls but even with that the sustain is mid, Next time you make a post legit get the facts straight. If you think its too much "sustain" dont use it, and then tell me if you have sustain, when i see you on PTS i want you not to use it and tell me how your sustain is doing. Many players in the rift would tell you the sustain is mid and some say its "okay" your the first and only person i hear complaining that it's "too much". The heart of flame breathe doesnt even have too much damage compared to the other morph which is a bit more but doesnt heal instead. Ive been playing since PTS came out till now, Do me a favor and spend a week more or 2 before you come up with such conclusion.
Well this explains a whole lot about his approach to this 😂😂😂 been outed there
So he’s made this whole post to try make dks weaker ?
Correct, I’ve known him for a while, as have many people in the Stormhaven and PvP/dueling community, and they will all back up what I’m saying. I’m going to let the entire PvP community know that he said the above, so don’t be surprised when they come to the forums on this post.
Also, the people above are not wrong about Dark Deal. I always tell others to spend at least a week, around 8–15 hours a day on the PTS before drawing any conclusions and I’ve done that and more. I haven’t logged into Live at all because I’ve been testing so extensively on the PTS.
It’s unfortunate that some players, in an attempt to gain an advantage, will criticize an ability not to help improve it, but simply to secure an edge over others so they don’t lose. That isn’t constructive criticism, it’s predatory criticism.
Really, who am I in Stormhaven?0 -
tye77732145✭✭tye77732145 wrote: »MXVIIDREAM wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »hoangz buddy ... i know your trolling, stop it. It doesnt give too much sustain, the cost of flames of oblivion is actually bonkers ,making the sustain worse. You think its alot of sustain cuz you run alot of recovery glyphs and haunch food knowing you and how you duel and play? you wanna end matches quick by out sustaining DKs. You legit barely play DK especially on Live, and ever since subclassing ive never seen you on a DK, me, meap, and sometimes frizzy and gundii and 1 other i know have been playing only DK everyone else meta assasination. To you its alot of sustain, but its interesting how you didnt mentioned corrosive or onslaught because i saw you use thoese, when all these players are crutching waiting to use that to win duels. I understand the sugar skulls but even with that the sustain is mid, Next time you make a post legit get the facts straight. If you think its too much "sustain" dont use it, and then tell me if you have sustain, when i see you on PTS i want you not to use it and tell me how your sustain is doing. Many players in the rift would tell you the sustain is mid and some say its "okay" your the first and only person i hear complaining that it's "too much". The heart of flame breathe doesnt even have too much damage compared to the other morph which is a bit more but doesnt heal instead. Ive been playing since PTS came out till now, Do me a favor and spend a week more or 2 before you come up with such conclusion.
Well this explains a whole lot about his approach to this 😂😂😂 been outed there
So he’s made this whole post to try make dks weaker ?
Correct, I’ve known him for a while, as have many people in the Stormhaven and PvP/dueling community, and they will all back up what I’m saying. I’m going to let the entire PvP community know that he said the above, so don’t be surprised when they come to the forums on this post.
Also, the people above are not wrong about Dark Deal. I always tell others to spend at least a week, around 8–15 hours a day on the PTS before drawing any conclusions and I’ve done that and more. I haven’t logged into Live at all because I’ve been testing so extensively on the PTS.
It’s unfortunate that some players, in an attempt to gain an advantage, will criticize an ability not to help improve it, but simply to secure an edge over others so they don’t lose. That isn’t constructive criticism, it’s predatory criticism.
Really, who am I in Stormhaven?
what's known dont need to be said, you go find out, we not doing this here on forums, especially not here, you be safe fam. When you spend a week 8-13+ hours a day plus on PTS then we can talk.2 -
hoangdz✭✭✭tye77732145 wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »MXVIIDREAM wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »hoangz buddy ... i know your trolling, stop it. It doesnt give too much sustain, the cost of flames of oblivion is actually bonkers ,making the sustain worse. You think its alot of sustain cuz you run alot of recovery glyphs and haunch food knowing you and how you duel and play? you wanna end matches quick by out sustaining DKs. You legit barely play DK especially on Live, and ever since subclassing ive never seen you on a DK, me, meap, and sometimes frizzy and gundii and 1 other i know have been playing only DK everyone else meta assasination. To you its alot of sustain, but its interesting how you didnt mentioned corrosive or onslaught because i saw you use thoese, when all these players are crutching waiting to use that to win duels. I understand the sugar skulls but even with that the sustain is mid, Next time you make a post legit get the facts straight. If you think its too much "sustain" dont use it, and then tell me if you have sustain, when i see you on PTS i want you not to use it and tell me how your sustain is doing. Many players in the rift would tell you the sustain is mid and some say its "okay" your the first and only person i hear complaining that it's "too much". The heart of flame breathe doesnt even have too much damage compared to the other morph which is a bit more but doesnt heal instead. Ive been playing since PTS came out till now, Do me a favor and spend a week more or 2 before you come up with such conclusion.
Well this explains a whole lot about his approach to this 😂😂😂 been outed there
So he’s made this whole post to try make dks weaker ?
Correct, I’ve known him for a while, as have many people in the Stormhaven and PvP/dueling community, and they will all back up what I’m saying. I’m going to let the entire PvP community know that he said the above, so don’t be surprised when they come to the forums on this post.
Also, the people above are not wrong about Dark Deal. I always tell others to spend at least a week, around 8–15 hours a day on the PTS before drawing any conclusions and I’ve done that and more. I haven’t logged into Live at all because I’ve been testing so extensively on the PTS.
It’s unfortunate that some players, in an attempt to gain an advantage, will criticize an ability not to help improve it, but simply to secure an edge over others so they don’t lose. That isn’t constructive criticism, it’s predatory criticism.
Really, who am I in Stormhaven?
what's known dont need to be said, you go find out, we not doing this here on forums, especially not here, you be safe fam. When you spend a week 8-13+ hours a day plus on PTS then we can talk.
I'm not actually hoangdz btw. I just used that name to meme. I'm someone else you probably also know, but I play stamsorc0 -
tye77732145✭✭MXVIIDREAM wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »hoangz buddy ... i know your trolling, stop it. It doesnt give too much sustain, the cost of flames of oblivion is actually bonkers ,making the sustain worse. You think its alot of sustain cuz you run alot of recovery glyphs and haunch food knowing you and how you duel and play? you wanna end matches quick by out sustaining DKs. You legit barely play DK especially on Live, and ever since subclassing ive never seen you on a DK, me, meap, and sometimes frizzy and gundii and 1 other i know have been playing only DK everyone else meta assasination. To you its alot of sustain, but its interesting how you didnt mentioned corrosive or onslaught because i saw you use thoese, when all these players are crutching waiting to use that to win duels. I understand the sugar skulls but even with that the sustain is mid, Next time you make a post legit get the facts straight. If you think its too much "sustain" dont use it, and then tell me if you have sustain, when i see you on PTS i want you not to use it and tell me how your sustain is doing. Many players in the rift would tell you the sustain is mid and some say its "okay" your the first and only person i hear complaining that it's "too much". The heart of flame breathe doesnt even have too much damage compared to the other morph which is a bit more but doesnt heal instead. Ive been playing since PTS came out till now, Do me a favor and spend a week more or 2 before you come up with such conclusion.
Well this explains a whole lot about his approach to this 😂😂😂 been outed there
So he’s made this whole troll post to try make dks weaker ?
That’s crazy behaviour hope a dev sees this and closes the thread at this point
oh they absolutely will see it no doubt, its a childish thing to do, and notice what he said to you "You are actually obsessed with this thread. Not even a minute after I posted that comment and you already commented. Actually hilarious lol" ... bro just trolling and its lowkey toxic, its why he got banned and instead of learning to be polite and decent and not be such a troll he continues with said approach, but thats on him, im not spending anymore time on em. People like that is why many do leave the game.2 -
tye77732145✭✭tye77732145 wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »MXVIIDREAM wrote: »tye77732145 wrote: »hoangz buddy ... i know your trolling, stop it. It doesnt give too much sustain, the cost of flames of oblivion is actually bonkers ,making the sustain worse. You think its alot of sustain cuz you run alot of recovery glyphs and haunch food knowing you and how you duel and play? you wanna end matches quick by out sustaining DKs. You legit barely play DK especially on Live, and ever since subclassing ive never seen you on a DK, me, meap, and sometimes frizzy and gundii and 1 other i know have been playing only DK everyone else meta assasination. To you its alot of sustain, but its interesting how you didnt mentioned corrosive or onslaught because i saw you use thoese, when all these players are crutching waiting to use that to win duels. I understand the sugar skulls but even with that the sustain is mid, Next time you make a post legit get the facts straight. If you think its too much "sustain" dont use it, and then tell me if you have sustain, when i see you on PTS i want you not to use it and tell me how your sustain is doing. Many players in the rift would tell you the sustain is mid and some say its "okay" your the first and only person i hear complaining that it's "too much". The heart of flame breathe doesnt even have too much damage compared to the other morph which is a bit more but doesnt heal instead. Ive been playing since PTS came out till now, Do me a favor and spend a week more or 2 before you come up with such conclusion.
Well this explains a whole lot about his approach to this 😂😂😂 been outed there
So he’s made this whole post to try make dks weaker ?
Correct, I’ve known him for a while, as have many people in the Stormhaven and PvP/dueling community, and they will all back up what I’m saying. I’m going to let the entire PvP community know that he said the above, so don’t be surprised when they come to the forums on this post.
Also, the people above are not wrong about Dark Deal. I always tell others to spend at least a week, around 8–15 hours a day on the PTS before drawing any conclusions and I’ve done that and more. I haven’t logged into Live at all because I’ve been testing so extensively on the PTS.
It’s unfortunate that some players, in an attempt to gain an advantage, will criticize an ability not to help improve it, but simply to secure an edge over others so they don’t lose. That isn’t constructive criticism, it’s predatory criticism.
Really, who am I in Stormhaven?
what's known dont need to be said, you go find out, we not doing this here on forums, especially not here, you be safe fam. When you spend a week 8-13+ hours a day plus on PTS then we can talk.
I'm not actually hoangdz btw. I just used that name to meme. I'm someone else you probably also know, but I play stamsorc
you realize i have you added on steam right? the fact that you even know who the supposed other "hoangdz" is tells me all i need to know. Telling me that out of all possible names in the universe you chose that one? we werent born yesterday my guy. you have a good one.1 -
tye77732145✭✭@hoangdz if you want to be recognized change your forum @.
To any average person you won’t get StaticWave from that keyboard smash of a name.
exactly, he chose it cuz he knows its him, he has 3,881 hours in elder scrolls and he's played recently. I dont get why lie, do things right and clean the name up and go from there. worse part i saw him on PTS, and plays EXACTLY like hoangdz lol, like my boy stoooopp it we know its you. The fact that your old forums account got banned tells us all we need to know, youve hit yourself in the foot with that one.Edited by tye77732145 on January 20, 2026 6:07PM1 -
hoangdz✭✭✭tye77732145 wrote: »@hoangdz if you want to be recognized change your forum @.
To any average person you won’t get StaticWave from that keyboard smash of a name.
exactly, he chose it cuz he knows its him, he has 3,881 hours in elder scrolls and he's played recently. I dont get why lie, do things right and clean the name up and go from there.
I'm so confused lol. I'm not hoang0 -
tye77732145✭✭imm make this even better
on king david, it aint bad at all LOOOOL! there you go "Hoang pro", now you are HoangWaveXEdited by tye77732145 on January 20, 2026 6:13PM2 -
MXVIIDREAM✭✭✭Down bad when you have to troll on the forums to try gain an advantage and nerf a class, crazy work
Hope they read this and buff it too 20%Edited by MXVIIDREAM on January 20, 2026 6:17PM3 -
hoangdz✭✭✭MXVIIDREAM wrote: »Down bad when you have to troll on the forums to try gain an advantage and nerf a class, crazy work
Hope they read this and buff it too 20%
??? DK is overperforming on PTS0 -
xylena✭✭✭✭✭
✭
So you acknowledge sustain is already busted without HOF. If sustain is good enough to not need DD, then it's good enough to not need HOF, you can slot something higher damage. HOF might be an enabler in degenerate one shots with charged whip + subclass jav + null arca etc, the far bigger problem is the proc sets and subclassing, nerfing HOF would accomplish nothing here.So if my build is tanky enough and has a burst heal to recover from damage, my sustain is good enough to not really need DD, and the buffs DD bring are already covered by other sources, then what is the point of DD? When you compare it to Inhale, I hope you see why I am bringing up this issue.PC/NA || Cyro/BGs || solo/smallscale || retired until Dagon brings a new dawn of PvP2 -
hoangdz✭✭✭
So you acknowledge sustain is already busted without HOF. If sustain is good enough to not need DD, then it's good enough to not need HOF, you can slot something higher damage. HOF might be an enabler in degenerate one shots with charged whip + subclass jav + null arca etc, the far bigger problem is the proc sets and subclassing, nerfing HOF would accomplish nothing here.So if my build is tanky enough and has a burst heal to recover from damage, my sustain is good enough to not really need DD, and the buffs DD bring are already covered by other sources, then what is the point of DD? When you compare it to Inhale, I hope you see why I am bringing up this issue.
If using certain sets, yes, but people are still going to slot HOF because it's a strong burst. How are you going to address that?0 -
xylena✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Making all the abusable proc sets "against monsters only" could be a good start.If using certain sets, yes, but people are still going to slot HOF because it's a strong burst. How are you going to address that?
I like the way Warframe handles its version of subclassing. The designated skills are full strength on their original "pure class" analogue, and nerfed when subclassed. Maybe ESO could've made subclassed spec bows do less damage, subclassed javs no longer bypass block, etc.
Dunno what the technical limitations of Battle Spirit are, but I've always thought that it should be used to affect block cost in PvP, they could do a flat increase, they could make it ramp like dodge or Streak, whatever, so long as it doesn't interfere with PvE tanking.
There are mountains on mountains of problems to address, but if the new devs are giving themselves 2 years to do a full drastic rework, and are finally prioritizing feedback and communication, maybe full build PvP isn't irreparable. Either way, Inhale isn't ruining anything.PC/NA || Cyro/BGs || solo/smallscale || retired until Dagon brings a new dawn of PvP1 -
Radiate77✭✭✭✭✭
✭The objective of this refresh is for everything to feel strong, you can’t really say that this needs a nerf when there’s nothing to even compare it to.
None of the other classes have been reworked yet, so when we get Warden and Sorcerer, we will finally have enough of a sample size to measure the classes in respect to one another.Edited by Radiate77 on January 20, 2026 7:31PM5