Update 49 is now available for testing on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/categories/pts
Maintenance for the week of January 19:
• [COMPLETE] NA megaservers for patch maintenance – January 21, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 10:00AM EST (15:00 UTC)
•[COMPLETE] EU megaservers for patch maintenance – January 21, 9:00 UTC (4:00AM EST) - 15:00 UTC (10:00AM EST)
• [COMPLETE] NA megaservers for patch maintenance – January 21, 4:00AM EST (9:00 UTC) - 10:00AM EST (15:00 UTC)
•[COMPLETE] EU megaservers for patch maintenance – January 21, 9:00 UTC (4:00AM EST) - 15:00 UTC (10:00AM EST)
Cyrodiil Healing Nerf!!
-
Artisian0001✭✭✭✭ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.Edited by Artisian0001 on January 14, 2026 1:02AM2 -
Adamus✭✭✭@ZOS_GinaBruno
I get that you're not the one directing this effort, but please forward this on to those that are spearheading this effort.ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
Please consider reverting this revert... Follow through with this effort, please. This happens every time there is an attempt to change the game in a way that will balance ballgroups, getting killed in the forums before it even makes it to live everytime. It happened with Snake in the Stars, it's how Azureblight got nerfed, how group size got cut to 12 (hurting zone generals and organic groups ability to fight these groups effectively), among other countless adjustments over the past 4-5 years. I read a few posts from this yesterday and had already planned to put my two cents in, I did expect the flooding of the forums to attack this effort, I just didn't expect the effort to cave so quickly.
Having battled a number of ballgroups over the past decade, I don't think you're going far enough, I have a number of suggestions for directions that can challenge these groups and create a balance. The issue with healing isn't exclusively with ballgroups, it's with smaller groups, permablock tanks and "LoS" players as well. Much of this mentioned in my post in 2024 (https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/666573/no-clear-counter-play)
What I mean by 'not far enough'
Currently suggesting a 50% reduction on all heals if you have 3+ HoTs. AWESOME! run with it. It's going to affect everyone equally, and any group concerned it's going to nerf their current play style hasn't taken into consideration that perhaps their playstyle needs to be nerfed. Why not 75% reduction for 6+ HoTs, 100% reduction for 10+ HoTs... How about 200% reduction for 14+ HoTs, players start taking damage from having too many HoTs? Friendly fire from purging was already introduced with plaguebreak, just take it a step further.
Alternative Healing Reduction Directions.
Have a Battlespirit exclusive Debuff that activates when a player has been overhealed too much over a period of time and gives them a 'Healing Sickness' Debuff, one that reduces healing by X% amount for 5+ minutes and progressively gets worse based on the amount of continued overhealing/HoTs, even to a point that heals start to inflect additional debuffs or damage. (once again, friendly fire is already in the game) Yes, 5+ minutes. The groups in question run around a keep for 30-60+ mins, a 30s debuff is a jog around the corner to reset.
The side that agrees in an adjustment in this effort
The current issue isn't heal stacking alone, there are many (will add some at the end) but I'm going to focus on the one that should be addressed, in my opinion, before heal stacking and that's Shield Stacking.
Address Shield Stacking before Heal Stacking? (if there has to be an order)
Most healing isn't even being challenged due to shield stacking, HoTs are almost a safety cushion the help in-between shields, if there ever is one. Most of the time all players see are a series of (xxxx), (xxxx), (xxxx) shielded damage that never hits and a soon as anything does start to land, the players run around a corner and reset.
Possible solutions for shield stacking
Something similar to healing sickness mentioned above, having X number of shields over a length of time gives a debuff, 'lead shield' (naming isn't my day job) where shields start to reduce speed of the player (make you heavy), shields don't last as long, weaker to debuffs, or even shield exhaustion, shields no longer can be applied for X amount of minutes. Anything but a healing reduction, heals don't come into play until the shield is gone, so if the shield never goes down adjustments to healing won't be a factor.
The Debuff to rule them all
Defile (reducing healing received and damage shield strength)
Buff this Debuff. It attacks both problems since it's last update, was nerfed when CP amplified it. CP was removed with the new system but the nerfed debuff remained, introducing the shield aspect but an additional % nerf. Battlespirit can reduce numbers, can it increase numbers, particularly those related to debuffs like Major/Minor Defile?
Final notes
This is going to be a difficult issue to tackle, you're looking to make changes to the part of the community that is willing to invest as much time as they can to win, in and out of game. Flooding the forums with discontent will probably be part of that effort, it's worked for them in the past. I main PvP, roles of healer & disruptor tanks, raid leading groups from 12-36+ players, these changes are going to hurt our group too. It may not be the best direction, but at least it's an alternative direction than the one we've been on for the past few years. Reverting this effort IS the same direction, and I've already seen too much of this community walk away from the game because of that direction. I'm advocating for you to not step back from this effort, push forward instead. Worst case scenario, adjustments need to be made next patch, and the next few months are a little challenging. Like I said, sure it's going to be challenging as a player, but doing nothing is worse. JUST DO IT.
Other issues to address:
The power gap between meta and play the way you want.
Charmed doesn't seem to act or count like any other CC.
All in one builds: Permablock level tanky, speed cap, immune to all CCs, CCs immune to cool down or counter, and ganker level burst damage.
No downsides to being at speed cap.
P.S. There's no place to siege on the front door of the PTS Alessia, was already the worst place on the map to hit the front door, it's worse now and no other keep comes close.Adamus
Army of the Pact (AP) - GM | NA-PC7 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Artisian0001 wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.
No I don't think I did. Is friendly fire active in Cyrodiil? How are pugs blowing up ballgroups "when they are on the same faction"? How is a pug "blowing up" a ballgroup in any context? VD requires a kill to trigger its effect and one proc is not enough to take out an entire group. You need to get a chain reaction going. Good luck with that. And Plaguebreak is a joke now.This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.0 -
Artisian0001✭✭✭✭Artisian0001 wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.
No I don't think I did. Is friendly fire active in Cyrodiil? How are pugs blowing up ballgroups "when they are on the same faction"? How is a pug "blowing up" a ballgroup in any context? VD requires a kill to trigger its effect and one proc is not enough to take out an entire group. You need to get a chain reaction going. Good luck with that. And Plaguebreak is a joke now.
.... because when the pug inside the ballgroup dies he causes them to take damage? There is friendly fire from VD and plague... that's how the set works?Edited by Artisian0001 on January 14, 2026 1:20AM1 -
Stridig✭✭✭✭✭
✭Artisian0001 wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.
Exactly. Thank you. Like I said earlier, most people that talk about ball groups have no clue what they're talking about.Enemy to many
Friend to all2 -
Teeba_Shei✭✭✭✭✭
✭What I mean by 'not far enough'
Currently suggesting a 50% reduction on all heals if you have 3+ HoTs. AWESOME! run with it. It's going to affect everyone equally, and any group concerned it's going to nerf their current play style hasn't taken into consideration that perhaps their playstyle needs to be nerfed. Why not 75% reduction for 6+ HoTs, 100% reduction for 10+ HoTs... How about 200% reduction for 14+ HoTs, players start taking damage from having too many HoTs? Friendly fire from purging was already introduced with plaguebreak, just take it a step further.
This is the best suggestion I've heard in this thread. If you have 14+ hots then you should be able to kill your teammates. I'm surprised they didn't take your advice.Edited by Teeba_Shei on January 14, 2026 1:33AM5 -
Artisian0001✭✭✭✭Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Bro don’t even. I am not some newbie that doesn’t know better that some ball group players on these forums like to talk down to. Beta player and played large scale at launch with some of the best guilds out there. It’s a joke now to anyone that didn’t play back then. Of course ball groups play away from others. That’s the whole damn point of farming. Then they leave to go steal a tick at actual contested keeps.
You missed his point again, though.
He is saying that a big component of ballgrouping is and has always been organized GvGs out in the middle of nowhere where it is just a 12v12 fight between two groups with nobody else around.
That isn't farming and has nothing to do with killing zone players; it's literally a "duel" between groups to see who is better that day. IMO, it's also the most fun content that you can experience in a ballgroup.
Most zone players never see that, though, and so we get the same tired tales about ballgroups only farm pugs, etc..
I don't know where the narrative started that ballgroups don't fight each other. Ballgroups almost exclusively fight other ballgroups, unless others are not on, but so many people here say they avoid each other. The forum has unironically become a place for people to just lie to push what they want.
You keep pushing this narrative that “oh well everyone is just lying.” But are you actively playing on all 3 platforms? I play on PS and I’m not going to sit here and doubt PC and Xbox players since I don’t experience their gameplay. Do BG’s fight each other? Sure, it’s pretty rare but it happens. Example would be last night with not one but two EP ball groups camping DC home keep together. I watched a DC ball group roll up and tried to get them to drop from the keep for a fight, did they? Nope. Would’ve been cool to watch but it is what it is. Just because you don’t like what others are saying here and they go against your narrative doesn’t exactly mean we’re all lying, 😂
This doesn't happen on there either, just like you never substantiated a single claim about a 4 man fighting multiple 3 bar factions, I know because I have been there and have friends who still play there.
So you actively play on all 3 factions? That’s some wild stuff. Also, you ignored my comment when I asked you if you really think I’m recording every single fight that involves a ball group. If you’d like to keep pushing your narrative of “well I know what it’s like on all 3 platforms and everyone is lying” then keep going I guess but it’s really ruining your credibility 🤷🏼♂️
Actively? Within the last 2 weeks I have played on all 3. I don't think you are always recording but I also KNOW that doesn't happen. Just like the other person who suggested 2 people who weren't even in group were 2v40ing. Even if you aren't recording at all times, you should have at least a single video of this, but you don't because it's not real.1 -
master_vanargand✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
Is it really that hard to make HoT non-stackable?
Damage shield non-stackable solves the problem.
3 -
Nerhesi✭✭✭✭This is a really good move in the right direction. We need to stop incentivizing fire and forget healing, as well as the "play the way you want-do everything meta". No issue if PvP goes from unkillable to fights no lasting more than 30 or 45 seconds.
Maybe that will be the next iteration... just a constant attrition of a % reduction per second based on how much healing you've taken over time. Fights need to have a hard stop, not this ridiculous rubber-banding counterstrike/fps with resetting health bars.
You need drastic changes if PvP is to be of interest to more than the couple of hundred that play it today (which includes me).2 -
Teeba_Shei wrote: »What I mean by 'not far enough'
Currently suggesting a 50% reduction on all heals if you have 3+ HoTs. AWESOME! run with it. It's going to affect everyone equally, and any group concerned it's going to nerf their current play style hasn't taken into consideration that perhaps their playstyle needs to be nerfed. Why not 75% reduction for 6+ HoTs, 100% reduction for 10+ HoTs... How about 200% reduction for 14+ HoTs, players start taking damage from having too many HoTs? Friendly fire from purging was already introduced with plaguebreak, just take it a step further.
This is the best suggestion I've heard in this thread. If you have 14+ hots then you should be able to kill your teammates. I'm surprised they didn't take your advice.
Next can we make it so Vicious Death procs if your healing kills your allies?3 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.
No I don't think I did. Is friendly fire active in Cyrodiil? How are pugs blowing up ballgroups "when they are on the same faction"? How is a pug "blowing up" a ballgroup in any context? VD requires a kill to trigger its effect and one proc is not enough to take out an entire group. You need to get a chain reaction going. Good luck with that. And Plaguebreak is a joke now.
.... because when the pug inside the ballgroup dies he causes them to take damage? There is friendly fire from VD and plague... that's how the set works?
As I mentioned before, even without being part of the ballgroup, as an ally you are effectively immortal when standing inside "the ball" because you are still being hit with Echoing Vigor and Healing Burst just like the other ballgroup members. You are not dying. VD won't proc on you if you aren't dying. And plaguebreak isn't dealing enough damage either. A ballgroup that starts a Plaguebreak chain reaction because they are spamming cleanse is a bad ballgroup. They don't need to spam cleanse if they can spam healing instead. If your point is "don't nerf ballgroups, some ballgroups are bad" then all I can say to that is - skill issue. When has that ever been a valid argument? "Don't nerf Sorc shields. Some sorcs are forgetting to cast it!" That's just silly. That cannot honestly be your position.This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.2 -
Artisian0001✭✭✭✭Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.
No I don't think I did. Is friendly fire active in Cyrodiil? How are pugs blowing up ballgroups "when they are on the same faction"? How is a pug "blowing up" a ballgroup in any context? VD requires a kill to trigger its effect and one proc is not enough to take out an entire group. You need to get a chain reaction going. Good luck with that. And Plaguebreak is a joke now.
.... because when the pug inside the ballgroup dies he causes them to take damage? There is friendly fire from VD and plague... that's how the set works?
As I mentioned before, even without being part of the ballgroup, as an ally you are effectively immortal when standing inside "the ball" because you are still being hit with Echoing Vigor and Healing Burst just like the other ballgroup members. You are not dying. VD won't proc on you if you aren't dying. And plaguebreak isn't dealing enough damage either. A ballgroup that starts a Plaguebreak chain reaction because they are spamming cleanse is a bad ballgroup. They don't need to spam cleanse if they can spam healing instead. If your point is "don't nerf ballgroups, some ballgroups are bad" then all I can say to that is - skill issue. When has that ever been a valid argument? "Don't nerf Sorc shields. Some sorcs are forgetting to cast it!" That's just silly. That cannot honestly be your position.
I mean, do you just not play ESO? Random players die inside a ballgroup all the time as a person outside of group. This is pretty obvious considering ballgroups of 12 kill each other and killing the person outside of the group is even easier than killing one of the 12 inside the actual group that is being prioritized. The easiest way for ballgroups of equal skill to kill each other would be to blow up a pug inside the other group and VD+Plague the rest.
Ballgroup players will even say in chat, in yell or say and ask the random pugs next to them to go away because they don't want that happening.Edited by Artisian0001 on January 14, 2026 1:45AM2 -
heimdall14_9✭✭✭Artisian0001 wrote: »heimdall14_9 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »YandereGirlfriend wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Bro don’t even. I am not some newbie that doesn’t know better that some ball group players on these forums like to talk down to. Beta player and played large scale at launch with some of the best guilds out there. It’s a joke now to anyone that didn’t play back then. Of course ball groups play away from others. That’s the whole damn point of farming. Then they leave to go steal a tick at actual contested keeps.
You missed his point again, though.
He is saying that a big component of ballgrouping is and has always been organized GvGs out in the middle of nowhere where it is just a 12v12 fight between two groups with nobody else around.
That isn't farming and has nothing to do with killing zone players; it's literally a "duel" between groups to see who is better that day. IMO, it's also the most fun content that you can experience in a ballgroup.
Most zone players never see that, though, and so we get the same tired tales about ballgroups only farm pugs, etc..
I don't know where the narrative started that ballgroups don't fight each other. Ballgroups almost exclusively fight other ballgroups, unless others are not on, but so many people here say they avoid each other. The forum has unironically become a place for people to just lie to push what they want.
You keep pushing this narrative that “oh well everyone is just lying.” But are you actively playing on all 3 platforms? I play on PS and I’m not going to sit here and doubt PC and Xbox players since I don’t experience their gameplay. Do BG’s fight each other? Sure, it’s pretty rare but it happens. Example would be last night with not one but two EP ball groups camping DC home keep together. I watched a DC ball group roll up and tried to get them to drop from the keep for a fight, did they? Nope. Would’ve been cool to watch but it is what it is. Just because you don’t like what others are saying here and they go against your narrative doesn’t exactly mean we’re all lying, 😂
This doesn't happen on there either, just like you never substantiated a single claim about a 4 man fighting multiple 3 bar factions, I know because I have been there and have friends who still play there.
guess they never been to KC on PSN NA GH as it happens often so often EP wont even care to defend or get it back lol 😂
Okay, it happens so often, surely there is a single video of this supposed 2v40 if it happens so often... right?
we dont game cap on PS takes up to much space , but anyone whos been playing on PS for the last year can tell you how badly KC is farmed and YES when it comes down to it MAINLY by 4-6 players v 40-50 to get them out small groups get ate for lunch and big groups stop caring about it because they just come right back attack from safety of wall from resource happens like clock-work
PS ill try to capture an SS when the DC guild " KC belongs to DC" owns it lolEdited by heimdall14_9 on January 14, 2026 1:47AMNordic-Knights (PSN)/Sir-A-Crowley (PSN)/Sir_Crowley ( PC) 16 account holder !!!!!!!!!!!!! 19x emperor , 98% full game all vet HM SR ND release day ESO VET !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!2 -
Stridig✭✭✭✭✭
✭Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.
No I don't think I did. Is friendly fire active in Cyrodiil? How are pugs blowing up ballgroups "when they are on the same faction"? How is a pug "blowing up" a ballgroup in any context? VD requires a kill to trigger its effect and one proc is not enough to take out an entire group. You need to get a chain reaction going. Good luck with that. And Plaguebreak is a joke now.
.... because when the pug inside the ballgroup dies he causes them to take damage? There is friendly fire from VD and plague... that's how the set works?
As I mentioned before, even without being part of the ballgroup, as an ally you are effectively immortal when standing inside "the ball" because you are still being hit with Echoing Vigor and Healing Burst just like the other ballgroup members. You are not dying. VD won't proc on you if you aren't dying. And plaguebreak isn't dealing enough damage either. A ballgroup that starts a Plaguebreak chain reaction because they are spamming cleanse is a bad ballgroup. They don't need to spam cleanse if they can spam healing instead. If your point is "don't nerf ballgroups, some ballgroups are bad" then all I can say to that is - skill issue. When has that ever been a valid argument? "Don't nerf Sorc shields. Some sorcs are forgetting to cast it!" That's just silly. That cannot honestly be your position.
You win. I admit ball groups usually hang out in one spot long enough for random pugs to " stand inside the ball". We'll played.Enemy to many
Friend to all2 -
Ratzkifal✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Ball groups engage each other all the time. What are you even talking about? They fight away from the rest of the population to keep pugs from blowing them up. So many people on this forum have no clue what they're talking about when they mention ball groups.
Fascinating. I'm not sure what game you've been playing where PUGs are blowing up ballgroups and ballgroups are fighting away from the rest of the population, but it's certainly not ESO. A pug is sieging a keep and the only thing that can stop that is a well timed bomber when there is no camp up or a ballgroup arriving on the scene and immediately cleaning up every pug that's there. Ballgroups can easily take outnumbered fights against pugs because there are no healers in pugs 99% of the time and even when there is one, a ballgroup has every member run Healing Burst and Echoing Vigor (that's 24 hots btw). It's gotten to the point where even well timed bombers cannot take out ballgroups anymore because it requires one-shotting the target in a single damage instance as those 24 running hots will simply heal away the first 15k damage before the second 15k damage can connect and secure a kill. It is that crazy. Don't believe me? Find a friendly ballgroup and just run next to them, then post combat metrics of your healing received. Outside of other ballgroups, major misplays and possibly multiple bombers with perfect timing, nothing is scratching ballgroups nowadays, certainly not "PUGs".
You're right, so many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about when they mention ballgroups. Were you counting yourself there?
You misunderstood what he was saying. Pugs blow up ballgroups when they are on the same faction. A pug can VD or plaguebreak someone during a GvG so groups who GvG often do it away from keeps. It has nothing to do with the pug killing someone on the opposite side, though if they are smart, they can deal a decent amount of damage to a single target during a burst window when a group is hitting.
No I don't think I did. Is friendly fire active in Cyrodiil? How are pugs blowing up ballgroups "when they are on the same faction"? How is a pug "blowing up" a ballgroup in any context? VD requires a kill to trigger its effect and one proc is not enough to take out an entire group. You need to get a chain reaction going. Good luck with that. And Plaguebreak is a joke now.
.... because when the pug inside the ballgroup dies he causes them to take damage? There is friendly fire from VD and plague... that's how the set works?
As I mentioned before, even without being part of the ballgroup, as an ally you are effectively immortal when standing inside "the ball" because you are still being hit with Echoing Vigor and Healing Burst just like the other ballgroup members. You are not dying. VD won't proc on you if you aren't dying. And plaguebreak isn't dealing enough damage either. A ballgroup that starts a Plaguebreak chain reaction because they are spamming cleanse is a bad ballgroup. They don't need to spam cleanse if they can spam healing instead. If your point is "don't nerf ballgroups, some ballgroups are bad" then all I can say to that is - skill issue. When has that ever been a valid argument? "Don't nerf Sorc shields. Some sorcs are forgetting to cast it!" That's just silly. That cannot honestly be your position.
I mean, do you just not play ESO? Random players die inside a ballgroup all the time as a person outside of group. This is pretty obvious considering ballgroups of 12 kill each other and killing the person outside of the group is even easier than killing one of the 12 inside the actual group that is being prioritized. The easiest way for ballgroups of equal skill to kill each other would be to blow up a pug inside the other group and VD+Plague the rest.
Ballgroup players will even say in chat, in yell or say and ask the random pugs next to them to go away because they don't want that happening.
I mean clearly your idea of a ballgroup is completely disconnected from reality. Your ballgroups never fight where the action is because they are avoiding pugs (for some reason). Your ballgroups spam cleanse and die to plaguebreak (for some reason). Your ballgroups never capture Kings Crest just to run around in there without ever taking the flags (until the pugs and zerglings get tired of getting killed and leave, which prompts the ballgroup to capture the keep to draw attention back onto themselves). I never claimed that ballgroups don't fight each other, but that's also entirely irrelevant to our discussion.
It feels like the last time you stepped into Cyrodiil you were playing at the height of the plaguebreak meta and that has forever shaped your view of what ballgroups and being in a ballgroup are like. We have scribing now. We have subclassing now. Things are a lot different than they were. Sticky multitarget healing is abundant and Ballgroups are a problem.
I have nothing against coordinated group PvP, but I can recognize a balance issue (and honestly performance issue) when I see one. Excessive heal stacking is such an issue.This Bosmer was tortured to death. There is nothing left to be done.2 -
hoangdz✭✭✭This change bouta create an army of fresh 1vXers since nobody can stick together anymore 😂1
-
KaltivaelSoul ShrivenZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
Can we just limit the # of Heal over Time abilities and damage shields someone can have on them with Battlespirit?
Doesn't seem like too hard of something to try to put in place.....5 -
Lagzee✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
Wait, what? So the answer is to do nothing? For another update? An update that comes out in april?? In 3 months?? And you said future update so who even knows if it will be the one after april or even further down the road. I cant even describe how much of a massive mistake this is. You guys cant claim to be changing but then do nothing for another 6 months, about an issue you have let get wildly out of control for the last few years.
I thought the point of seasons was to be able to make these changes faster?? Not in 6 months to a year. Many people, myself included, gave you the same feedback. Stop HoTs, and even shields, from stacking from the same source. But even if thats not something that can be done right away, at least try this before you just write it off. To do nothing is just more of the same zenimax. And to be honest, at least for me, it completely reverses any good faith i felt about this team from this update.
Things were really looking good, but if your answer is to do nothing for god knows how long, for an issue like this, then clearly nothing has changed. At least try this before writing it off. And then down the road maybe try another way. This should be a top priority for zos, but clearly it just isnt.2 -
heimdall14_9✭✭✭
DC left KC alone tonight and farmed elsewhere 😂😂😂Nordic-Knights (PSN)/Sir-A-Crowley (PSN)/Sir_Crowley ( PC) 16 account holder !!!!!!!!!!!!! 19x emperor , 98% full game all vet HM SR ND release day ESO VET !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 -
Teeba_Shei✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
Wait, what? So the answer is to do nothing? For another update? An update that comes out in april?? In 3 months?? And you said future update so who even knows if it will be the one after april or even further down the road. I cant even describe how much of a massive mistake this is. You guys cant claim to be changing but then do nothing for another 6 months, about an issue you have let get wildly out of control for the last few years.
I thought the point of seasons was to be able to make these changes faster?? Not in 6 months to a year. Many people, myself included, gave you the same feedback. Stop HoTs, and even shields, from stacking from the same source. But even if thats not something that can be done right away, at least try this before you just write it off. To do nothing is just more of the same zenimax. And to be honest, at least for me, it completely reverses any good faith i felt about this team from this update.
Things were really looking good, but if your answer is to do nothing for god knows how long, for an issue like this, then clearly nothing has changed. At least try this before writing it off. And then down the road maybe try another way. This should be a top priority for zos, but clearly it just isnt.
Why should it be a top priority? PvP is not a top priority. On top of that ball groups are not that big a deal and there aren't even that many. On Friday and Saturday there might be 2-3 groups on, but for the rest of the week there is 0-1 groups on a night. Pugs still kill these groups.
Lastly, this change would have affected everyone not just ball groups. Ball groups probably would've had the most potential to mitigate this change and be unaffected by it while most normal players wouldn't have a way to work around it.Edited by Teeba_Shei on January 14, 2026 4:53AM2 -
Lagzee✭✭✭Teeba_Shei wrote: »ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
Wait, what? So the answer is to do nothing? For another update? An update that comes out in april?? In 3 months?? And you said future update so who even knows if it will be the one after april or even further down the road. I cant even describe how much of a massive mistake this is. You guys cant claim to be changing but then do nothing for another 6 months, about an issue you have let get wildly out of control for the last few years.
I thought the point of seasons was to be able to make these changes faster?? Not in 6 months to a year. Many people, myself included, gave you the same feedback. Stop HoTs, and even shields, from stacking from the same source. But even if thats not something that can be done right away, at least try this before you just write it off. To do nothing is just more of the same zenimax. And to be honest, at least for me, it completely reverses any good faith i felt about this team from this update.
Things were really looking good, but if your answer is to do nothing for god knows how long, for an issue like this, then clearly nothing has changed. At least try this before writing it off. And then down the road maybe try another way. This should be a top priority for zos, but clearly it just isnt.
Why should it be a top priority? PvP is not a top priority. On top of that ball groups are not that big a deal and there aren't even that many. On Friday and Saturday there might be 2-3 groups on, but for the rest of the week there is 0-1 groups on a night. Pugs still kill these groups.
Lastly, this change would have affected everyone not just ball groups. Ball groups probably would've had the most potential to mitigate this change and be unaffected by it while most normal players wouldn't have a way to work around it.
You are simply not playing the same game. Or you are not playing on PC NA, which is fine maybe its different wherever you play. Ball groups are on every night. Ofc there are more on the weekends, there are more players in general. Pugs are only killing these groups when they outnumber them by a ridiculous amount, it always involves a ton of siege, and even then a lot of the time its because there is another coordinated group in the mix.
Ball groups ARE a massive problem to both server performance and gameplay. Do you imagine its fun for 40 people to just get insta killed by a 10 man over and over at a keep? From a group that has endless healing and their health bars completely shielded almost all of the time? And you can always feel performance go down the gutter when there is more than one ball group in the same area. The fact that this playstyle impacts performance is not even a question at this point.
And ya pvp isnt a top priority but this issue should be a top priority for pvp. Oh and silly me to think pvp deserves any meaningful changes, i know they happen so frequently. Better to just wait another year or two.
Tbh this isnt even a conversation worth having, and im not gonna argue with you. If you cant see why heal/shield stacking, like we mostly see in ball groups, is a problem then we are just playing different games. I play solo/duo. I dont fight ball groups, i dont interact with ball groups, i have friends that ball group, this is not an issue that impacts my gameplay other than lag. But im also not blind to what is obvious. Heal stacking/shield stacking is a problem, and unfortunately its most prevalent in ball groups.4 -
Turtle_Bot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
Thanks for sharing, hopefully some of the ideas presented here can help the team find a viable solution.
Just to add though that the complaints being put forward about stacked HoTs also includes stacked damage shields (mostly due to scribings many group shield options) and stacked group buffs (mostly from the countless group buff sets that all provide unique or new "named" bonuses) and these complaints mostly stem from the ability of organized groups to stack all of this power bloat to such a degree that the existing systems (siege, negate, crowd control, etc.) the team put in place to counter these groups no longer do their job.
The key takeaway here is that stacking mechanics have become a huge issue in the game, especially in PvP where players are in direct competition with each other, so that is where I personally (and I'm sure many others as well) hope the team will focus their efforts on when trying to find a suitable fix.2 -
Turtle_Bot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭CameraBeardThePirate wrote: »@ZOS_Kevin
Just want to add that I know the team is probably getting some mixed signals from past PTS requests ("scrap bad changes before they hit live!!!") and the feedback in this thread since Gina's announcement that this was getting reverted.
I think the important distinction here is whether the change is something that has been requested or not. In the past, changes like the Stalking Blastbones removal or the Jabs change seemingly came out of nowhere; changes like that are much safer to scrap before they hit live.
With something like this, that's been a highly requested hot button topic for years, I think people would much rather seem something be done in the short term rather than nothing, even if it's a stop-gap solution. A change this huge likely needs some live server testing anyways to really understand how it would affect the meta.
Hope that's somewhat useful for the team, because this communication from the team has been so much better than prior cycles and I would hate for the hot and cold messaging of this thread to prevent that communication from continuing.
Wish I could give this one multiple "Agree". @ZOS_Kevin I really hope the team understands this distinction and pushes forward with something sooner rather than putting it off.4 -
Lord_Hev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ShadowProc wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »Artisian0001 wrote: »A sweeping change this large just shows how unserious the devs are. It's actually just an insult to anyone who PvPs and plays with just 2 friends or more. Saying "oh well it's a work in progress" is a joke. You don't start from some insane position and slowly bring it to normality, it would be the other way around.
Sweeping change? To be fair I would prefer a hard cap at 3 HoTs so absolutely no HoT more than that. So for me that 50% is not even enough yet. Also that would reduce server calculations by a lot and with that lag. Its absolutely insane to me that you can stack 12 RR and 12 Vigor plus any other heal you please. And thats something people complain about since years, and now finally they address it.
50% isn't enough? Okay go play another game lol The opinion of people whose PvP consists of staring down from inside a keep sieging and dying to every other person isn't something I take serious.
Funny enough ball group play is as difficult to play as sieging is right now compared to the first 5 years. How anyone has fun knowing they are basically immortal is crazy to me. Anything that makes it to where a group can be taken down is a big positive for the health of the game. Now, a group can’t be killed until they get bored and decide to move on. Ball groups don’t engage with each other because the skill gap is gone and you can’t kill each other.
I agree. This isn’t enough but a good start.
Yea no kidding. Whenever I'm out solo and things are getting hectic but I see an ally ballgroup, I immediately look for one of their dps/pullers and mark them. Then I just follow them and I know I'm basically invulnerable to any and all damage as long as I pay attention to block enemy pulls. As long as I don't stray too far behind, I'm basically a lone fish that just latched onto a speeding shark rushing through the ocean tearing at other things. And I'm completely safe from all other enemies lol. That's me being completely ungrouped and just leeching off their 14x echo vigors and radiating regens I don't even have to worry about myself, just make sure I have my own snare removal and can keep up.1 -
amiiegee✭✭✭✭✭This thread is a bit derailed by people who think they should be able to solo kill 20 people, because they are able to kite arround rocks, towers and trees & think they can have a good time now farming clips and push their ego in a wizard game.
1vxers think they should be immortal as one army and able to kill people with acuity / null arca bursts, when they forget to buff them self for one second and cry over less skilled people grouping up and DARE to heal each other.
Im a warden healer and i like to heal pug groups or randoms. Why should my healing be nerfed into the ground and the point of playing a healer be gone for me?
I life the support role in cyrodiil, it´s all i enjoy.
Take this and im gone, easy as that.5 -
Yudo✭✭✭✭For those pushing that this was a good idea, it is not. I know we want a solution for stacking heals in PvP desperately but we cannot break everything else for it. Very glad it is being reverted.
I also understand that the team may not have the bandwidth to immediately fix it, but as many have said, changing the condition to apply on hots, or somehow limiting number of hots would hopefully be worthwhile exploring because the healing state in PvP does need to be addressed.
If we were "happy" to accept a brute -50% healing reduction. Then we can accept other brute solutions like, limiting hots to 3, or -90% healing from HOT if more than 3, or similar, without affecting everything else.9 -
Wolfshade✭✭✭✭✭
✭The best about this thread is the player population that gives Feedback and that ZOS reacts to that Feedback.
For now +1 on the 2026 intensions.3 -
MJallday✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Hi everyone,
First, thanks to everyone for providing so much feedback in this thread, and especially for those that were able to hop on the PTS this week to try out this change in real time. We’ve heard your feedback loud and clear – both from this thread and other sources – and we’d like to let you know we are planning to revert the Heal over Time on Battlespirit in next week’s PTS patch.
For additional context, the initial reasoning behind this change was to help with a common complaint we’ve seen over the years that healing feels too strong, most notably with stacked HoTs. Transparently, we simply don’t have the time or bandwidth to fully change healing capabilities without significantly affecting future class reworks, which is why we landed with this option, but it clearly missed the mark.
We’ll explore other options to address concerns around healing and damage shields in PvP to be released in a future update, and we’ll share some ideas prior to it hitting the PTS so you can be more involved in the process. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts here, and again, you can expect the revert to occur in next week’s PTS patch.
This is one of the best actions ZOS have done - ever. actually listened before something hits live.
credit where credit is due. stuff like this goes a REALLY long way to restoring trust to the player base.
1 -
xylena✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wow they went back on a bad idea. Cool. Now do the DK Spike Armor animation
They used to be pretty good about responding to obviously bad ideas, like that one PTS they went back on a proposed 1.3sec cast time on damage shields. Good to see again.PC/NA || Cyro/BGs || solo/smallscale || retired until Dagon brings a new dawn of PvP0
This discussion has been closed.