MoonPile wrote: »

...I'll forego explaining once again why 50 maps full of junk is rubbish; much has been said above already.
I've also reported in-game.

But I will add: Gold Coast Maps are a good example
Gold Coast maps, which via combo of reasonable drop rates + lower demand, can be bought for just a few hundred gold (if that) and are a dependable source of Shrine to Dibella leads. This technically drops from any source in the zone, but maps are such a good way of getting it that I got a 2nd and 3rd unlocked for my alt account just during the free ESO+ week. I still use GC maps on my main occasionally to get a free Dibella Shrine. Evergreen gameplay!

Importantly: it did NOT take 50 maps. Only a few, less than 10 or so.

I'd assume what's going on in Solstice majorly deflated drop rates to keep us in the zone longer. I just don't think that's an effective strategy at all, as already explained above by myself and others. It's frustrating, not fun, not rewarding, and makes us less likely to retain interest or keep trying (beyond the occasional experiment like this one, or the handful of housers who are willing to spend 10s of millions on an unlock).

If we must have this map system that everyone's hated for years, then can this be done:

1. Fix the drop rates to be more like Gold Coast, which is actually reasonable enough to make us want to return and use the system. There's gotta be a happy medium between "nothing desirable inside – not even worth selling" and "nothing desirable inside because the drop rate is so low – not even worth buying".
2. Make ALL 3/3 antiquities buyable, consistent with the gameplay expectations that system set up years ago: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/677582/antiquities-are-missing-from-their-vendors-for-2-3-years

[*However, Gold Coast also does not have the problem of 5+ leads per zone that are Map-only.]

MoonPile wrote: »

MoonPile wrote: »

https://moonpile.tumblr.com/post/792464909580500992/update-on-solstice-treasure-junk-map-leads-aug

UPDATE – August 26:

• TOTAL Sol maps spent ONLY on 2/3 codex = 62
• EMPTY maps = 60
• Maps since last lead: 45

...-

xencthlu wrote: »

You might know this better than I. What other furnishing in game even compares to the third treasure map antiquity furnishing? It's not the Ayleid bookcases or Fiery Brazier, because even as expensive as they are, they are a functionally infinite number of furnishings once purchased. I can't think of any individual furnishing that might cost as much, except perhaps crown furnishings purchased by converting gold to crowns?

TBH I'd compare it to furnishings in Crown Crates. Even that is more dependable.

I buy only very specific sets of crates, only with gold, and foremost to get good gem return via repeats. So I get packs I've bought before, where I like the bulk of the low-tier items, and get a lot of gems back. Spending 5-10 mil on crate packs pretty much guarantees enough gem return to get some items. ...

With crates, at no point do I actually hope to "win" anything I actually want via natural roll. It's just a numbers game to get enough gems. One could say the same about "Treasure" Maps, but IMO they're worse:

1. There's not really any way to circumvent their RNG (e.g. Endeavors, repeat pulls, etc.)
2. Maps are also a waste of time! I hate crates but at least they're instant. With maps we have to play the inventory-management game since they don't stack, then run around like a numpty only to go "oh look, garbage worth < 500 gold again" for the 50th time in a row.

...

MoonPile wrote: »

Additional reports from other players:

• Taking others ~300 maps to unlock specific leads, from Apocrypha to WW to Solstice. A Redditor said the Bismuth tower alone took them 260 maps.
• Players on Discord saying they, like me, spend dozens of maps getting zero leads.
• Screenshot: a player was running back and forth re-spawning the dirt mound so I decided to PM them and ask about it. It's sad that they agreed my numbers are accurate:

MoonPile wrote: »

... I think these will be an amazing structural piece (if only the others were buyable too): https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8355425/#Comment_8355425




I was REALLY excited about the Bismuth Tower -
https://moonpile.tumblr.com/post/786568851473219584/scattered-light-effect
Used the single one I got from 1/3 codex here -
https://moonpile.tumblr.com/post/790521269539028992/the-dressing-room-at-sugar-bowl-suite-eso





...Now I'm just a bit sad
These assets are great, it's a shame they're buried too deep to reasonably be used.

MoonPile wrote: »

I've been testing Solstice Treasure Map leads (here's the related thread) and am going to stop when my stock runs out, soon. Even my initial morbid curiosity ("Since Apocrypha and WW were both bad, let's waste some of my gold to see how awful this is too so I can report it to other players") has totally gone.

Bad enough that many players are deciding to quit engaging with this system or even Housing / ESO altogether.

Folks talk a lot about this in all the different housing communities on Discord, etc. – many don't come to the official forums. (Even those who do come here, not all are willing to comment, maybe only click "Agree".) Many are just done – we'd rather ignore those furnishings existence. Which is sad, because the Housing team did great work on a lot of these! But if we can't get them, nor buy them if we do manage to unlock, it's pointless.

It's hard to believe that this is intended.

Personally, I've stopped buying West Weald maps entirely. I don't do the Skingrad dailies anymore either: https://moonpile.tumblr.com/post/792523535558049792/

If I visit WW at all, I'm really happy to get another Ayleid Grand Tree because we can use them for smoke effects! (Likewise other easy drops I already have, like Dibella shrines, and even Spellscar Shards because they make a really great hidden light [...]

That is to say: I wish the team in charge of this system would come to understand that easier drops are a GOOD thing. Getting the items keep us building for days and weeks, instead of logging out in disappointment after yet another empty-handed run. And players who don't want more can simply let them expire or delete them.

I'm interested to learn what the Eastern Solstice "easy drop" will be.
Update – think I found it: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/comment/8374173/#Comment_8374173

But, with the possible exception of 1/3 codex which thankfully appears to be curated recently, I will be ignoring the Eastern Solstice Treasure Map system come U48. (Again, a shame, because the Housing team made some fantastic pieces available for U48. They're just wasted by this system.)

MoonPile wrote: »

...For the past couple of years I've played consistently, entirely FOR Housing. But the projects I was excited about aren't even doable. "Play the way you want" – this system won't let me. And it's not like a boss we can gear up for and learn the mechanics, we only have silly conspiracy theories that maybe kinda sorta work.

The lesson repeatedly seems to be that if you're excited about a new release, don't buy that chapter, instead cancel your sub and come back in a couple of years when the things are actually attainable I DOUBT that's the intent, or good for the game. And maybe there are way more robo-hamster types who'll grind no matter how abusive it is, than those of us who try to speak up or just quit. I'm so tired.

MoonPile wrote: »

BretonMage wrote: »

xencthlu wrote: »

Most people who aren't specifically buying maps with gold or grinding archival fortunes are simply not going to see these furnishings at all, because a threshold like "7.5 million gold worth of maps" or "30 days of dedicated grinding" are beyond the means of about 90% of the playerbase. I think they should know why this has been designed specifically to bar them, if it is, indeed, intentional.

Yes, absolutely. I'd also go so far as to say that only 0.001% of players, or those with billions in gold, will ever get the complete codex. Which is a massive shame, ...

Has there been confirmation of this? We have so far seen a lot of speculation going in various directions on whether or not the roll takes into account the leads the player has, and I have not seen any dev confirmation either way. Some players have said that the it rolls once, then if the player has the lead, it just stops and the player gets nothing.

Regarding the issue of ZOS communication, they did say the leads drop, but when players asked them about the 2nd and 3rd codices, there was no answer. So we are still unclear on how it works to get all 3 codices, or if ZOS had even tested to get all 3 codices for all WW antiquities.

Agree with all this, emphasis mine.

And re: someone else above:

It very much does work that way - take it from someone who has over 90% of all codex entries. ...
People are getting these leads, ZOS have said they get them in their tests. The evidence is the leads do drop. So why not for you? A bad RNG made worse by the skewing caused by digging up the zone lead is a distinct possibility - try without doing that.

There are years-old threads one can find here where we've discussed this "tactic" to death. I got the Apocryphal Well lead and every other unlock along the way to it: it did not matter if I held leads. I've also completed the codex for every furnishing I wanted, except –

In West Weald, I quit when I realized the only item I really wanted, a green-quality lead, was not even buyable after unlock. Dozens of maps wasted. Especially when it became clear earlier this year that West Weald wasn't included in the "increased chances of leads" for the Pan-Tamriel event.

In Solstice, I'd been testing and logging drops since July, finally quit despite non-completion. Data here at the top:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/681576/update-on-solstice-treasure-map-leads-drop-data-aug-5-2025/p1?new=1

There were times I held the W. Solstice "trash drop", the Croc Skull, for weeks at a time. Holding it did absolutely nothing. Look at the gap there: 76 empty chests over 1.75 months. Lmao.

To put it as politely as I possibly can for the Forums: that's not fun. Even when I have the means to do this, I don't want to: it's wasteful, boring and depressing.

So I don't like comments like the one quoted, blaming players as if there's a confirmed mechanic that works consistently – there isn't. Or acting like it's only OP who's having this problem – far from it.

"People are getting these leads" – sure, those who grind non-stop spending tens of millions of gold on maps, plus weeks/months/years of time. A minority apparently don't see this as an abuse of their time. While in almost every Housing community, there are dozens of comments from those who'd like to get on with our actual gameplay, but instead are being put off entirely and shelving our ideas because this system is so draining in every way: time, gold, morale. Not all are willing to come here and complain about it, but if you bring up the topic, a bunch always chime in with some variant of "yeah that sucked, it took me ### maps / OR / I gave up" and "I wish ZOS would stop doing this".

I don't get why any player would defend this system. Not even as a trader myself, because there are SO MANY more lucrative, faster and consistent ways to make gold than selling maps. Since June I've had maybe 3 Solstice maps drop naturally, even with Azandar's folios. Regular leads can be a waste of time, but Map leads also waste time, gold, and don't stack so you have to do ridiculous inventory juggling on top of it all. Come on. Send this whole thing back to Satan Molag Bal, I don't want it