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• PC/Mac: EU megaserver for maintenance – September 9, 22:00 UTC (6:00PM EDT) - September 10, 16:00 UTC (12:00PM EDT) https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/682784
Overland Content Feedback Thread
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Deserrick✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I think the majority of users would probably find them pretty easy as a baseline. It's not all and there's certainly valid reasons why the people who struggle with it have difficulty. But I think the majority experience is that it's easy.
I think the majority that don’t grind would have an experience like the videos you posted, which is not what I think qualifies as easy.
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spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I think the majority of users would probably find them pretty easy as a baseline. It's not all and there's certainly valid reasons why the people who struggle with it have difficulty. But I think the majority experience is that it's easy.
I think the majority that don’t grind would have an experience like the videos you posted, which is not what I think qualifies as easy.
The second video isn't even in combat oriented gear and doesn't require grind. She's in night terror, night mother's embrace, and darloc brae gear. All of those are cheap overland sets that primarily focus on making a character stealthier. She does have the antiquity "Ring of the Wild Hunt," which is a bit of grind, but it just makes you faster. It doesn't change overland combat ease much at all and there are overland sets available that would add more combat power than that ring. I would classify the second video as easy, and I think it does show how easy it is to gear up to a point that overland becomes rather trivial.
I do agree the first video isn't something I'd classify as easy. I think it represents the experience many newer players have when they first hit 50 and suddenly aren't getting the below-50 buffs but are still running around in whatever gear they found while questing pretty well. It's not a perfect recreation but I think it makes the point. But that's a pretty narrow time period in the game that's simple to overcome with just a bit of coin or asking someone to craft them a set, no grind required.Edited by spartaxoxo on April 5, 2025 12:30AM1 -
Deserrick✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »I think the majority of users would probably find them pretty easy as a baseline. It's not all and there's certainly valid reasons why the people who struggle with it have difficulty. But I think the majority experience is that it's easy.
I think the majority that don’t grind would have an experience like the videos you posted, which is not what I think qualifies as easy.
The second video isn't even in combat oriented gear and doesn't require grind. She's in night terror, night mother's embrace, and darloc brae gear. All of those are cheap overland sets that primarily focus on making a character stealthier. She does have the antiquity "Ring of the Wild Hunt," which is a bit of grind, but it just makes you faster. It doesn't change overland combat ease much at all and there are overland sets available that would add more combat power than that ring. I would classify the second video as easy, and I think it does show how easy it is to gear up to a point that overland becomes rather trivial.
I do agree the first video isn't something I'd classify as easy. I think it represents the experience many newer players have when they first hit 50 and suddenly aren't getting the below-50 buffs but are still running around in whatever gear they found while questing pretty well. It's not a perfect recreation but I think it makes the point. But that's a pretty narrow time period in the game that's simple to overcome with just a bit of coin or asking someone to craft them a set, no grind required.
Getting those sets requires grind to get them from where they drop, or buying from someone who did either the farming grind or crafting grind. Perhaps we have different understanding of what entails a grind, but I think we can agree that getting the sets requires something different from natural questing and using what you come across, whether that act of interrupting questing to work towards a targeted goal is defined as grind.2 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »I think the majority of users would probably find them pretty easy as a baseline. It's not all and there's certainly valid reasons why the people who struggle with it have difficulty. But I think the majority experience is that it's easy.
I think the majority that don’t grind would have an experience like the videos you posted, which is not what I think qualifies as easy.
The second video isn't even in combat oriented gear and doesn't require grind. She's in night terror, night mother's embrace, and darloc brae gear. All of those are cheap overland sets that primarily focus on making a character stealthier. She does have the antiquity "Ring of the Wild Hunt," which is a bit of grind, but it just makes you faster. It doesn't change overland combat ease much at all and there are overland sets available that would add more combat power than that ring. I would classify the second video as easy, and I think it does show how easy it is to gear up to a point that overland becomes rather trivial.
I do agree the first video isn't something I'd classify as easy. I think it represents the experience many newer players have when they first hit 50 and suddenly aren't getting the below-50 buffs but are still running around in whatever gear they found while questing pretty well. It's not a perfect recreation but I think it makes the point. But that's a pretty narrow time period in the game that's simple to overcome with just a bit of coin or asking someone to craft them a set, no grind required.
Getting those sets requires grind to get them from where they drop, or buying from someone who did either the farming grind or crafting grind. Perhaps we have different understanding of what entails a grind, but I think we can agree that getting the sets requires something different from natural questing and using what you come across, whether that act of interrupting questing to work towards a targeted goal is defined as grind.
I would not count gear you can buy easily from the coin you make questing to be grind. I would agree putting together a set is different to using whatever is lying around.5 -
Deserrick✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I would not count gear you can buy easily from the coin you make questing to be grind.
You would not consider interrupting your quest to search potentially multiple guild traders to be a grind? That is different from what I am used to, and I appreciate your perspective. Further research tells me that "grind" has the connotation of being a significant burden on time while being a repetition of the same actions in the same area. I have come across the term "target-farming" ; is that an accurate label (both in denotation and connotation) for the actions I have been describing?0 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I would not count gear you can buy easily from the coin you make questing to be grind.
You would not consider interrupting your quest to search potentially multiple guild traders to be a grind? That is different from what I am used to, and I appreciate your perspective. Further research tells me that "grind" has the connotation of being a significant burden on time while being a repetition of the same actions in the same area. I have come across the term "target-farming" ; is that an accurate label (both in denotation and connotation) for the actions I have been describing?
Target farming is when you grind a specific location e.g. if you need exp so you grind dragonstar arena over and over rather than just letting it level up naturally over the course of normal gameplay.
Grind to me is when there is a significant time burden. So, it doesn't have to be mechanically difficult but it does need to take a relatively long time. So, I would for example, consider researching all traits to be a grind because it takes months even though it's mechanically very simple. Or farming a rare furnishing plan by killing the same mobs in a public dungeon for days or weeks on end.
Just buying stuff takes much, much less time and effort by comparison. I would consider researching a set for your needs, even it is an overland set, and buying it a part of building a character or maybe theory crafting though.Edited by spartaxoxo on April 5, 2025 2:49AM2 -
AlexanderDeLarge✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't think overland content should be made more difficult 'cause it will make it harder for newer and solo players.
If people want a challenge there's PVP and plenty of dungeons and trials specifically for that reason.
Overland is the vast majority of the content I pay for and I reject the sentiment that I should instance myself in more difficult content. If I'm forced to instance myself in a handful of repeatables, I'd rather just go play something else. Which I've been doing since the Elsweyr chapter since it was made abundantly clear that I wasn't the target audience.
Only reason I'm here is because I desperately want to play the game because I enjoy the structure of overland questing but the lack of difficulty kills any enjoyment I might have doing it.
I literally have a video of a naked level 3 AFKing in front of a bear attack for a minute and a half without dying in my signature. It's been there for years and we're still having this debate whether or not the playerbase finds overland challenging. It's a joke.Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 11 years. 8 paid expansions. 29 dungeon and zone DLCs. 45 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. Just because Cadwell Silver&Gold failed doesn't mean the game should be brain dead easy forever.
"ESO doesn't need a harder overland" on YouTube for a video of a naked level 3 character w/ no CP allocated AFKing in front of a bear for a minute and a half before dying if you don't believe me change is needed.8 -
Deserrick✭✭✭AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »
I literally have a video of a naked level 3 AFKing in front of a bear attack for a minute and a half without dying in my signature. It's been there for years and we're still having this debate whether or not the playerbase finds overland challenging. It's a joke.
A level 3 gets significant boosts in order to make up for the lack of stat and skill points. On a level 50, the results would be different.2 -
Snamyap✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I would not count gear you can buy easily from the coin you make questing to be grind.
You would not consider interrupting your quest to search potentially multiple guild traders to be a grind? That is different from what I am used to, and I appreciate your perspective. Further research tells me that "grind" has the connotation of being a significant burden on time while being a repetition of the same actions in the same area. I have come across the term "target-farming" ; is that an accurate label (both in denotation and connotation) for the actions I have been describing?
Gearing up is and has been a staple of every RPG (single or online) I played in the last 30 years. You may call it grinding but it's a core mechanic of the game. You can't seriously expect a game to be balanced around people who ignore core mechanics of the game, of the entire genre for that matter.7 -
colossalvoids✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I would not count gear you can buy easily from the coin you make questing to be grind.
You would not consider interrupting your quest to search potentially multiple guild traders to be a grind? That is different from what I am used to, and I appreciate your perspective. Further research tells me that "grind" has the connotation of being a significant burden on time while being a repetition of the same actions in the same area. I have come across the term "target-farming" ; is that an accurate label (both in denotation and connotation) for the actions I have been describing?
Gearing up is and has been a staple of every RPG (single or online) I played in the last 30 years. You may call it grinding but it's a core mechanic of the game. You can't seriously expect a game to be balanced around people who ignore core mechanics of the game, of the entire genre for that matter.
That's a fault of games like Skyrim, where you just do things and better loot just drops instead, artifacts are weak so you just temper basic stuff. It doesn't work in games with sets though or in MMOs for that matter.1 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.Edited by SilverBride on April 5, 2025 8:59PMPCNA5 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Well, WoW had considerably harder overland zones. But as a hunter main, I had REALLY GOOD TANKS in my pets. That was nearly two decades ago, when my ability to deal with harder content wasn't really a problem.
In fact, when I started WoW in January 2006, I was.... dead all the time for a while. It wasn't fun. And being quite a bit younger then, I did manage, though the gear chase with every expansion was.... wearing, and SO not fun. Which is why ESO suits me so well.
Now, I don't have the patience to deal with either "sidekicks" (as in companions), or other people in game. So.... solo is what I do, and if the overland I love goes away, well.... so will I. [In fact, I'm now playing Skyrim AE more than ESO....]
*Edited because math is hard....*Edited by TaSheen on April 5, 2025 3:31PM______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....1 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭WoW zones have level ranges, so what may seen difficult at first becomes easier as the player levels, to the point that the player can out level the enemies by so much that they no longer attack them. Their instanced content also has level ranges and difficulty modes but they also become easier as the player outlevels them.
WoW also has multiple low level range zones so if a player starts struggling when moving through the zones they can head over to the other continent and do the lower level zones there.
ESO doesn't have level ranges for overland or for instanced context. That makes it all the more important that low level players, or those with limitations are not driven out by making the game too difficult for them.PCNA1 -
AlexanderDeLarge✭✭✭✭✭
✭SilverBride wrote: »Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.
ZOS should take it as a compliment that people actually want to do the questing because the open world is structured like an Elder Scrolls game. It just sucks when you do a quest chain full of instakills and it culminates with a boss that you kill before they can even speak.
Guild Wars 2 is probably the most comparable game out there to TESO (horizontal progression) and it doesn't have this problem because it doesn't have the power creep this one does. Probably because the gear system is designed better and it scales you down to the level of a zone rather than scaling you up. Also no stat bloat due to a champion point system.AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »
I literally have a video of a naked level 3 AFKing in front of a bear attack for a minute and a half without dying in my signature. It's been there for years and we're still having this debate whether or not the playerbase finds overland challenging. It's a joke.
A level 3 gets significant boosts in order to make up for the lack of stat and skill points. On a level 50, the results would be different.
I'm aware but it's not that much of a different scenario for endgame players either. Not even talking meta players, just normal people who have blue/purple gear, stats allocated and some champion points. I was able to walk away from combat encounters to grab a drink upstairs last time I played. Doubt it's changed much.
It just seems like players having difficulty with solo content is a complete myth. I'm sure there are people out there that have never played a video game before have difficulty controlling their character but you could say that about Club Penguin and every other game in existence.
There are people with genuine accessibility concerns but you don't balance a whole game around disabilities. In fact I'd say this thread citing them in their argument to keep the game easy do them a disservice. Just because you have carpal tunnel and arthritis doesn't mean you want to kill Molag Bal in 5 hits after 15 hours of questing leading up to it. TESO's combat system is probably the most cumbersome that I've seen in 25+ years of playing MMORPGs. Instead of 'keeping the game easy' for people with motor issues, why not redirect the conversation towards minimizing the dmg output of animation cancelling or creating some sort of auto-weaving accessibility option for people who need it?Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 11 years. 8 paid expansions. 29 dungeon and zone DLCs. 45 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. Just because Cadwell Silver&Gold failed doesn't mean the game should be brain dead easy forever.
"ESO doesn't need a harder overland" on YouTube for a video of a naked level 3 character w/ no CP allocated AFKing in front of a bear for a minute and a half before dying if you don't believe me change is needed.5 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭AlexanderDeLarge wrote: ». In fact I'd say this thread citing them in their argument to keep the game easy do them a disservice.
Some of these posts are from people with the accessibility issues who picked this game because they enjoy the experience the way it is. Or from people with family members/friends that have them and play this game for that reason. So, no, it is not.
Difficulty should be optionally increased. There is no reason to chase away a loyal customer base to chase after people who already decided they don't like the game. You can literally keep both with options.Edited by spartaxoxo on April 5, 2025 4:05PM1 -
MorganaLaVey✭✭✭✭
IDK maybe in other MMO´s you still have to interact with things ( klick on stuff, press buttons, have little strategys "Mages are annoying lets kill him first" ) while in ESO you can just turn your brainactivity to .1% and keep pressing the same button while on auto walk.SilverBride wrote: »Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.2 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭MorganaLaVey wrote: »
IDK maybe in other MMO´s you still have to interact with things ( klick on stuff, press buttons, have little strategys "Mages are annoying lets kill him first" ) while in ESO you can just turn your brainactivity to .1% and keep pressing the same button while on auto walk.SilverBride wrote: »Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.
In WoW you can outlevels enemies so far that they don't even attack the player any more. Yet I never saw anyone asking to make it more difficult.Edited by SilverBride on April 5, 2025 5:35PMPCNA2 -
BasP✭✭✭✭✭SilverBride wrote: »MorganaLaVey wrote: »
IDK maybe in other MMO´s you still have to interact with things ( klick on stuff, press buttons, have little strategys "Mages are annoying lets kill him first" ) while in ESO you can just turn your brainactivity to .1% and keep pressing the same button while on auto walk.SilverBride wrote: »Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.
In WoW you can outlevels enemies so far that they don't even attack the player any more. Yet I never saw anyone asking to make it more difficult.
WoW Classic does have Hardcore realms with permadeath, among other things, which seem to be relatively popular from what I gathered. So people were looking for (and asking for) a more challenging experience, and eventually got what they wanted in that game too.Edited by BasP on April 5, 2025 5:45PM6 -
MorganaLaVey✭✭✭✭You also normaly play a zone before you outlevel it, like ESO was before OT, or not ? Its not normal to outlevel enemies this much ? I never playd WOW !Edited by MorganaLaVey on April 5, 2025 5:55PM1
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SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭SilverBride wrote: »MorganaLaVey wrote: »
IDK maybe in other MMO´s you still have to interact with things ( klick on stuff, press buttons, have little strategys "Mages are annoying lets kill him first" ) while in ESO you can just turn your brainactivity to .1% and keep pressing the same button while on auto walk.SilverBride wrote: »Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.
In WoW you can outlevels enemies so far that they don't even attack the player any more. Yet I never saw anyone asking to make it more difficult.
WoW Classic does have Hardcore realms with permadeath, among other things, which seem to be relatively popular from what I gathered. So people were looking for (and asking for) a more challenging experience, and eventually got what they wanted in that game too.
They created these realms (which my friend who still plays WoW tells me are not doing well), but left the actual game alone.
If ESO were to create some difficult servers where everything is a challenge I would fully support that. Then the rest of us wouldn't have to worry about the ESO we love being rendered unplayable.Edited by SilverBride on April 5, 2025 6:17PMPCNA2 -
sans-culottes✭✭✭✭✭
✭SilverBride wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »MorganaLaVey wrote: »
IDK maybe in other MMO´s you still have to interact with things ( klick on stuff, press buttons, have little strategys "Mages are annoying lets kill him first" ) while in ESO you can just turn your brainactivity to .1% and keep pressing the same button while on auto walk.SilverBride wrote: »Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.
In WoW you can outlevels enemies so far that they don't even attack the player any more. Yet I never saw anyone asking to make it more difficult.
WoW Classic does have Hardcore realms with permadeath, among other things, which seem to be relatively popular from what I gathered. So people were looking for (and asking for) a more challenging experience, and eventually got what they wanted in that game too.
They created these realms (which my friend who still plays WoW tells me are not doing well), but left the actual game alone.
If ESO were to create some difficult servers where everything is a challenge I would fully support that. Then the rest of us wouldn't have to worry about the ESO we love being rendered unplayable.
@SilverBride, I appreciate your engagement, but I think your recent comparisons and framing raise some contradictions worth addressing directly.
First, on WoW: pointing out that players can eventually outlevel zones there is not quite analogous to ESO’s structure. In WoW, the difficulty curve is front-loaded—you engage with meaningful threat while leveling. That the enemies later become trivial is a reward for progression. In ESO, by contrast, level scaling means that players often begin with trivial combat. The arc from “vulnerable to powerful” is flattened. That difference is why complaints are louder here: it never ramps up, and the combat experience stagnates.
Second, your invocation of WoW Hardcore servers actually undermines your argument. You say you’re fine with difficulty, but only if it’s siloed to a completely different environment. Yet in WoW, they added options (like Hardcore) without removing the existing easier content. And that’s exactly what many players are asking for here: difficulty options, not forced change.
Third, your claim that making Overland scalable or optionally more difficult would render ESO “unplayable” for some doesn’t follow. Optional systems, by definition, leave the current experience untouched. The idea that your enjoyment would be threatened by someone else toggling on a higher difficulty setting is not supported unless you’re arguing that other players’ enjoyment should be limited by yours.
The irony is that you’ve said multiple times that difficulty is subjective, but then you insisted your own experience reflects the majority and framed any challenge to the status quo as a danger to the game. If difficulty is subjective, then surely the best solution is to let players choose their preferred difficulty through an opt-in system. That way no one loses. That is the only position here that actually honors both accessibility and variety.
It’s precisely because ESO has built such an open, story-driven world that many players do want to be challenged while engaging with it—not shunted into instanced side content. The feedback exists because the passion exists. It’s not about breaking the game. It’s about wanting to feel something while playing it.
And there’s room for all of us, if ZOS designs with that variety in mind.Edited by sans-culottes on April 5, 2025 6:42PM9 -
Deserrick✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »I would not count gear you can buy easily from the coin you make questing to be grind.
You would not consider interrupting your quest to search potentially multiple guild traders to be a grind? That is different from what I am used to, and I appreciate your perspective. Further research tells me that "grind" has the connotation of being a significant burden on time while being a repetition of the same actions in the same area. I have come across the term "target-farming" ; is that an accurate label (both in denotation and connotation) for the actions I have been describing?
Gearing up is and has been a staple of every RPG (single or online) I played in the last 30 years. You may call it grinding but it's a core mechanic of the game. You can't seriously expect a game to be balanced around people who ignore core mechanics of the game, of the entire genre for that matter.
Gearing up by equipping what you come across by questing is a staple of a lot of RPGs. Looking up a guide, finding powerful gear in the guide, and going out of your way to acquire that gear is not. Questing is balanced around doing the core mechanics of questing (using what you find naturally), while other parts of the game (dungeons, trials) are balanced around core mechanics of going out of your way to hunt for much more powerful gear.0 -
AlexanderDeLarge✭✭✭✭✭
✭
You're comparing a vertical progression game (plenty of us hate those) versus a horizontal progression game (Guild Wars, Guild Wars 2, The Elder Scrolls Online). Even in WoW, you have people wanting level scaling and the ability to pause XP gain for completionist's sake. Also look at the appeal of Season of Discovery and projects like Turtle (Classic+) and hardcore modes.SilverBride wrote: »MorganaLaVey wrote: »
IDK maybe in other MMO´s you still have to interact with things ( klick on stuff, press buttons, have little strategys "Mages are annoying lets kill him first" ) while in ESO you can just turn your brainactivity to .1% and keep pressing the same button while on auto walk.SilverBride wrote: »Almost every MMO has easy overland questing with the challenges being in instanced content, yet I never hear any complaints about it except in this game. I can't figure out why that is.
In WoW you can outlevels enemies so far that they don't even attack the player any more. Yet I never saw anyone asking to make it more difficult.
Probably if ZOS continued to shut down our threads but banning the topic from being discussed doesn't mean a lack of demand. I've been talking about this long before it became a pinned topic and I'd continue to talk about it until it was adequately addressed. My opinions on the Cadwell Silver&Gold retort have been thoroughly documented.I am beginning to wonder if having this thread pinned has prolonged a topic that would have run it's course long ago if it wasn't still in our view.
Would you honestly? Because honestly a lot of this thread is fearmongering about potentially splitting overland when the reality is a lot of us aren't playing the game as a result of their inaction on this subject.SilverBride wrote: »If ESO were to create some difficult servers where everything is a challenge I would fully support that. Then the rest of us wouldn't have to worry about the ESO we love being rendered unplayable.
Most people just quit and don't say anything but I'm persistent and I've seen a lot of lapsed players citing the lack of difficulty as the reason they quit outside these forums (which are pretty difficult to join in the first place btw, I had to email support to get my invite).
World of Warcraft is 21 years old and there's tens of thousands of quests and you only need a couple hundred to hit the level cap. In fact the game had such a high level cap that they had to perform a level squish (which they're quickly approaching again because they continued to raise it afterwards). Doesn't make sense to me, that's why I prefer horizontal progression systems.MorganaLaVey wrote: »You also normaly play a zone before you outlevel it, like ESO was before OT, or not ? Its not normal to outlevel enemies this much ? I never playd WOW !
Difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 11 years. 8 paid expansions. 29 dungeon and zone DLCs. 45 game changing updates including A Realm Reborn-tier overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. Just because Cadwell Silver&Gold failed doesn't mean the game should be brain dead easy forever.
"ESO doesn't need a harder overland" on YouTube for a video of a naked level 3 character w/ no CP allocated AFKing in front of a bear for a minute and a half before dying if you don't believe me change is needed.1 -
Deserrick✭✭✭AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »
I literally have a video of a naked level 3 AFKing in front of a bear attack for a minute and a half without dying in my signature. It's been there for years and we're still having this debate whether or not the playerbase finds overland challenging. It's a joke.
A level 3 gets significant boosts in order to make up for the lack of stat and skill points. On a level 50, the results would be different.
I'm aware but it's not that much of a different scenario for endgame players either. Not even talking meta players, just normal people who have blue/purple gear, stats allocated and some champion points. I was able to walk away from combat encounters to grab a drink upstairs last time I played. Doubt it's changed much.
Right. A naked level 3 is much different from a naked level 50, and is more akin to a well-equipped level 50.
Normal people are not guaranteed to have blue/purple gear. Playing normally, questing and using what you find from enemies you come across and what you receive as rewards, results in a character with white/green gear that often is below the character level and either does not make a complete set, or can make a complete set by using more under-leveled gear. Equipped like this, questing is challenging, and delves quite often necessitate at least one other person.
Edited by Deserrick on April 5, 2025 7:12PM2 -
Jammy420✭✭✭✭✭
✭Franchise408 wrote: »
I'm not expecting anything optional. This game isn't very good at optional....
I mean, most of the content in this game has optional versions of it. Everything except overland.
Story bosses don't come with "optional" difficulties - and they've all been too hard for me since Elsweyr (I never did get past the final boss there, though I did manage the boss in High Isle, but not Galen). I don't play any group content or pvp, so those "optional difficulties" aren't something I do.
How on earth are story bosses too difficult? Just wear tanky gear, and put on a proc set. Done and done.1 -
Apollosipod✭✭✭AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »
I literally have a video of a naked level 3 AFKing in front of a bear attack for a minute and a half without dying in my signature. It's been there for years and we're still having this debate whether or not the playerbase finds overland challenging. It's a joke.
A level 3 gets significant boosts in order to make up for the lack of stat and skill points. On a level 50, the results would be different.
I'm aware but it's not that much of a different scenario for endgame players either. Not even talking meta players, just normal people who have blue/purple gear, stats allocated and some champion points. I was able to walk away from combat encounters to grab a drink upstairs last time I played. Doubt it's changed much.
Right. A naked level 3 is much different from a naked level 50, and is more akin to a well-equipped level 50.
Normal people are not guaranteed to have blue/purple gear. Playing normally, questing and using what you find from enemies you come across and what you receive as rewards, results in a character with white/green gear that often is below the character level and either does not make a complete set, or can make a complete set by using more under-leveled gear. Equipped like this, questing is challenging, and delves quite often necessitate at least one other person.
I've just been following a long this thread and, for my own part, believe that there should be an optional slider so everyone can enjoy the game they want to and that shouldn't be some hill everyone has to die on.
But to say that a player who plays through the game or just casually plays the story will end up having mismatching white or green is just disingenuous. Even starting a new character before and after level 50, I have never ended up with white or green gear that doesn't at least give me some bonus. If someone has made it to level 50 (or hell, 25) and they are in that situation then they aren't even reading the screen. Implying that people end up in that situation is just insulting7 -
Jammy420✭✭✭✭✭
✭old_scopie1945 wrote: »Franchise408 wrote: »
I'm not expecting anything optional. This game isn't very good at optional....
I mean, most of the content in this game has optional versions of it. Everything except overland.
Story bosses don't come with "optional" difficulties - and they've all been too hard for me since Elsweyr (I never did get past the final boss there, though I did manage the boss in High Isle, but not Galen). I don't play any group content or pvp, so those "optional difficulties" aren't something I do.
My God, is this real?
I beg your pardon, some folk have hurdles, eg age and physical to name but two. IMO I regard this comment as highly unacceptable.
There are quite literally easy to obtain overland sets that will kill bosses for you when you stand still and do nothing. It is by no means unacceptable. People should at the very least be expected to learn what exists in the game, and to use it.4 -
Deserrick✭✭✭Apollosipod wrote: »AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »
I literally have a video of a naked level 3 AFKing in front of a bear attack for a minute and a half without dying in my signature. It's been there for years and we're still having this debate whether or not the playerbase finds overland challenging. It's a joke.
A level 3 gets significant boosts in order to make up for the lack of stat and skill points. On a level 50, the results would be different.
I'm aware but it's not that much of a different scenario for endgame players either. Not even talking meta players, just normal people who have blue/purple gear, stats allocated and some champion points. I was able to walk away from combat encounters to grab a drink upstairs last time I played. Doubt it's changed much.
Right. A naked level 3 is much different from a naked level 50, and is more akin to a well-equipped level 50.
Normal people are not guaranteed to have blue/purple gear. Playing normally, questing and using what you find from enemies you come across and what you receive as rewards, results in a character with white/green gear that often is below the character level and either does not make a complete set, or can make a complete set by using more under-leveled gear. Equipped like this, questing is challenging, and delves quite often necessitate at least one other person.
I've just been following a long this thread and, for my own part, believe that there should be an optional slider so everyone can enjoy the game they want to and that shouldn't be some hill everyone has to die on.
But to say that a player who plays through the game or just casually plays the story will end up having mismatching white or green is just disingenuous. Even starting a new character before and after level 50, I have never ended up with white or green gear that doesn't at least give me some bonus. If someone has made it to level 50 (or hell, 25) and they are in that situation then they aren't even reading the screen. Implying that people end up in that situation is just insulting
It's not disingenuous or insulting, it is a natural result of using what you get while questing. Starting from level 3 and following the story quests, you outlevel the gear you have. Completing all zone quests before moving on, you may get enough gear to have complete sets, but the pieces would likely be at different levels, and not always with the weights, traits, and enchantments that would have been preferred. Then when you move on to the next zone in the story, entirely different overland sets are dropped and rewarded, meaning that replacing your outleveled equipment will lose your set bonuses until you get enough equipment from the new zone to fulfill new set bonuses, again with this new equipment being at different levels, weights, traits, and enchantments.2 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭People should at the very least be expected to learn what exists in the game, and to use it.
Who says they aren't?
Players have different goals and not all of them require being meta geared, or spending hours watching others play to learn mechanics, etc.. Overland should not require a lot of preparation for what they want to accomplish.
And as has been mentioned before, some players have limitations and they should be able to enjoy the game, too.Edited by SilverBride on April 5, 2025 8:24PMPCNA3 -
SilverBride✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭AlexanderDeLarge wrote: »SilverBride wrote: »If ESO were to create some difficult servers where everything is a challenge I would fully support that. Then the rest of us wouldn't have to worry about the ESO we love being rendered unplayable.
Would you honestly? Because honestly a lot of this thread is fearmongering about potentially splitting overland when the reality is a lot of us aren't playing the game as a result of their inaction on this subject.
I used to think that splitting the playerbase would be a bad thing, but the more this goes on the more I don't see it as an issue, because I don't think enough players would use a veteran overland or a challenging server to hurt the general population.PCNA2