Game looks totaly dead

SeaGtGruff · February 17

VoxAdActa wrote: »

CatoUnchained wrote: »

VoxAdActa wrote: »

CatoUnchained wrote: »

VoxAdActa wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Stating PvP in the subject would make it more clear what the thread is about

They know that. They just made the thread title as edgy and click-baity as possible (and then never returned to the thread, hmmm).

Or, and my experience with PvPers tells me this is fully plausible, they believe that PvP is the game, or at least the only important part of the game.

Actually it's usually the PvE community that refuses to acknowledge the importance and legitimacy of PvP; dismissing the legitimacy of PvP as you just did. And point of fact, PvP IS the end game activity along with vet trials/trifectas.

And, this thread is not just about PvP. The PvE community is bleeding players at an alarming rate too.

Gee, I wonder why the PvE community doesn't acknowledge the legitimacy of PvP, or why so many PvEers fervently hope that the PvP community will continue to quarantine themselves in their toxic bubble of slurs, sexual harassment, and exploiting. It's so strange how the PvP endeavors and pursuits are greeted with a chorus of "I'll never PvP." It's such a mystery. I guess we'll never know the answer, huh?

PvP is dying, because fewer and fewer people are willing to put up with the PvP community, much of which is stuck in the morals and ethics of late 1990s Xbox Online lobbies. And the rest of the playerbase will respond with "Oh no. ....Anyway....".

TL;DR: PvP is not "the game." It's a small subset of people who do everything they can to keep it small. Conflating PvP with "the game" is, at best, clickbait, and, at worst, shows a severe lack of insight into the root causes of the PvP community's population decline.

Go to youtube and search "Nefas toxic casuals" and you'll get your answer explained in detail.

[snip]

Not all PvPers are toxic, but it does seem like players who are primarily focused on PvP tend to have a highly competitive mindset that can encourage a certain type of attitude toward their fellow players.

I'm not even talking about enemy players, either, because they can get snarky and caustic toward other players in their own factions. And speaking as someone who's primarily a "casually serious" PvEr, but who also enjoys engaging in large-scale PvP in Cyrodiil, I know how difficult it can be to maintain a "chill" attitude towards everyone else. It frustrates me to jump off the wall into battle trying to defend a keep, only to keep getting killed and have to rez back inside the keep and see some of my fellow players just standing there inside the keep, apparently not even trying to help. For all I know, they could be AFK, but sometimes the desire to snap at them can be pretty tempting. And I'm sure it can be tempting for some of them to jump on me for not being better at it.

Anyway, if you're interested in getting into PvP but are put off by your fellow players' behavior, just shrug it off and keep at it, because it can be a lot of fun if you don't take it too seriously and just jump into the battles with the understanding that you are most likely going to die a lot.

[edited to remove quote]

Renato90085 · February 17

freespirit wrote: »

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

These threads keep popping up, yet I have not noticed any drop on PCNA.

It still fills up during NA prime time but that window keeps shrinking and it's more and more dead in the off hours. What's even more concerning is how dead it is during Asia or Oceania prime time.

PC-EU seems to currently have an extended 'prime time' maybe the Asian and Oceaniac players have switched servers?

I cannot comment about the state of PVP but on one of my accounts I am doing a playthrough trying to get all possible achievements on one character. Currently working on DC base game zones and I can honestly say regardless of time of day, I am never alone!

I see lots of low level players, might be Alt's of higher level accounts but also could be a healthy number of new players.

What I do see way too often is people in chat who are overwhelmed and have no idea what they should do next, the game is now huge but still very poorly explained, I can search online and find what I need but how a new player would even know what to search is beyond me!!

I see player retention being a huge issue these days.

two years ago(high isle), joined more asian players because zos add chinese language in game
due to many factors, and asian players play style(main pve endgame?),now i know all asian guild almost dead

EvilGoatKing · February 17

Every major system is broken what is there to stick around for? Those not heavily invested in the ip come, play solo style, see great possibilities and then get kicked in the teeth by a bunch of seemingly small issues that all add up to death by a 1000 cuts.

pve: most ppl say over land too easy
pvp: broke for a long time continually broken more each "fix"
housing: limited slots, no furnish storage, and
economy: what economy? the guild traders are a mess and extremely dated,
raid guilds: U35 death knell,etc
and all these problems feed back into the other systems in the game.

Im not gonna claim the game is gonna die or dying its seems to be a maintenance mode of keep the store online and maximize on the assets they have in place.

I think prolly there are a bunch of people waiting for what zos does as the next major thing to see if theyll come back yet again, though that was the case for the pvp(bg) update recently and I know that drove people away so...

licenturion · February 17

LadyGP wrote: »

The playerbase has been dropping like this for some time now - I think it's just starting to really show.

I'm optomistic that the upcoming changes to Cyro and (assuming they figure out what the cause is) some lag/performance improvements slowly bring people back.

I don’t know if that will do much in the grand scheme of things. Yeah maybe some PvP people return, but when PvE is neglected as they do right now, the PvE people would leave too if no major content is introduced.

I notice this pattern with myself the past months. I usually logon to do my easy endeavours, a pursuit or the occasional event ticket and that is about it. The game has become extremely static and 2 timed exclusive dungeons are not helping things either.

Luckily there are a lot of quality RPGs out that I am playing now: KCD2, Avowed and a few others are coming.

Zodiarkslayer · February 17

SilverBride wrote: »

LadyGP wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Oh, so this is about PvP.

Can it not be about both? "The Game" is both PvE and PvP is it not?

The game consists of PvP, and PvE, and Housing, and Tales of Tribute, and Trading, etc.. When "the game" is being referred to in the subject of a thread, most players aren't going to immediately think the thread is about PvP specifically. Stating PvP in the subject would make it more clear what the thread is about.

And that is not a thing on the forum, because the PvP specific sub forum is even deader (more dead?, I dont know) than the PvP part of the game.

I mean, sure, Cyrodiil feels empty, no matter when I am forced to log into it.
Imperial City is the same, only you permanently run into NPCs and mobs. But it always is like five players controlling the map, and that's it.

But as long as I have played ESO, as old this discussion is. In the past ZOS has struggled to understand that you cannot get PvP performance with PvE gear and skills. It think it must've finally sunken in sometime last year and we are seeing the results of that with the new vengeance campaign.

Will it catch on? Will it solve their problems? Only time will tell. And it'll only work if both new players and veterans give it a fair chance.
Until then every thread about the state of PvP is the 1034th repetition of the same topic from years ago. No point arguing, in my opinion.

Patience is what we need right now.

moo_2021 · February 17

VoxAdActa wrote: »

[snip]

How do you interact with people to even get targeted chat?

If you do questing or fishing, usually it's just gankers ambushing you, and there are empty campaigns to avoid them.

If you go with zerg, zergs never have 1-on-1 chat since people are busy fighting or dying.

If you're talking about the video, I don't see any point of watching.

[edited to remove quote]

ZOS_Icy · February 17

Greetings,

We have recently removed some unnecessary back and forth from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.

Thank you for your understanding.

Elsonso · February 17

VoxAdActa wrote: »

shezof wrote: »

state of pvp is not because of the players.

It's 100% because of the players. Heck, even the performance issues are caused by the players (ball groups). ZOS puts a disproportionate amount of time into pandering to the PvP community, so much so that they've nerfed multiple PvE sets into the ground because PvPers complained about them.

PVP, in general, is the hardest content that can be expected from an MMO, in my opinion. The server "AI" is not even close to being up to the task of creating the same level of challenge that a skilled player opponent will present.

As I see it, this is why it is absolutely critical that ZOS fix, really really really fix, the Cyrodiil performance and gameplay problems. It has gone on for too long. My feeling is that PVP in this game is more of a hobby than a real end game activity.

As for the current "the game is dying"... PVP has not thrived here for a long time. Until ZOS does something to fix Cyrodiil, everything else they do in Cyrodiil will, in some manner, showcase that they haven't fixed Cyrodiil.

AvalonRanger · February 17

Population is very important aspect for MMORPG contents.

ESO has already ideology confliction even in launching day of 2014.

So, developer divide them by the "meta rules", and separate them
to the each of faction. Just like treating different game title players.

It's a effective way, but poor game design idea.

Both casual and hardcore people are important for maintaining player population.
That never changes as MMO.

AScarlato · February 17

ESO did recently have it's lowest steam numbers in November 2024 that it had since 2018. That's not great. It seems to be trickling back up.

I think the longer ESO goes without major content releases that are eye catching, the more the general population will dwindle. I already thought this was going to happen when they announced cutting new content in half for "QoL" quarters.

This impacts everyone, not just PvP players.

I don't think we hit the point where it really has impacted my playstyle much since I mostly just quest and do BGs which pop fast enough, but if you are used to the Covid number of players we are less than half of what they were during those years.

It will be interesting how they will generate hype from small content patches and no chapters. I personally don't think it will bode that well, but we will see.

I think people who see no change either are a bit disingenuous or just aren't paying attention. I even see it in the RP guild listings as even the larger ones have fallen in size considerably, some losing 40 to 50% of their active players.

moo_2021 · February 17

Zodiarkslayer wrote: »

Imperial City is the same, only you permanently run into NPCs and mobs. But it always is like five players controlling the map, and that's it.

Except there are no ball groups or lag in IC and the occassional 1on1 or 2on2s are fun and meaningful. Thr problem has to be something else.

JaxontheUnfortunate · February 17

As someone who splits my time more or less evenly between both PvP and pve content I find they both have the benefits and detractors. Perhaps pve exclusive players are just not interested in PvP content or feel the skill ceiling for it to be a worthy investment in time is too high or the fights to stressfull. (I know I don't bg anymore because I have had terrible luck with groups and don't want to waste my time any longer. )

Artanisul · February 17

shezof wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Oh, so this is about PvP.

why a lot of people on forums like to pretend PvP doesnt exist? it was literally a major marketing point for ESO. long term sustain for this game isnt PvE, its PvP.

Not even close to true. In all MMOs it is well known and backed by all the data, a very small amount of people play the PvP side of the games. Same goes for trials/raids. Those people just are rather loud....so it looks like alot.
PvE has always been the fuel of any MMO.

Veinblood1965 · February 17

CatoUnchained wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Oh, so this is about PvP.

It's not just about PvP. The population over the entire game has seen a mass exodus since U35 and the trend continues today. But the exodus is most notable for the end game community with the PvP die hards and the end game PvE communities suffering the most losses due primarily to unresolved performance issues.

"there are none so blind as those who will not see"

This is true. I mainly PVP however I have been in four major trading guilds for years on PS4/5 NA. I was down to two due to lack of sales then recently the largest of the two disbanded and I quote" due to the low amount of players playing". I joined another one so am back up to two now. THAT being said sales are down to the point where i barely make enough for the guild fees due to low amount of sales and I'm selling the same things I always have. seems furnishings are the only thing that is selling for the most part and then not nearly as much as just a few months ago.

The poster is right, the zone and guild chats are dead and if you look at how many people in each guild has logged on most have not logged in for quite a while.

I've said it before. It's due to the constant combat changes. Last time it was nightblade cloak, lots of players left then. Tinkering with a core class skill? It certainly didn't bring NEW players in but many left.

The last few expansions have had numerous invulnerable phases to almost every major mob and don't get me started on the incursions in West Weald. I kid you not, I could see one pop and go into a delve, complete the daily quest and come back out and the incursion was still up, sigh....

PVP: It did not used to be a wait time week days in the evening to log into GH, for a while now there is. I don't have time in the evenings to wait in a queue. The population cap was lowered that is obvious.

The only thing not touched is housing.....

i still enjoy the game but it's getting less and less fun each time something is changed. By the time the "vision" is here the game will be dead I fear.

shadyjane62 · February 17

I am busy filling my craft bag to prepare for the coming anniversary when my sub runs out. The game has been dead for me for quite while.

However hunting heartwood has been a challenge.

Parasaurolophus · February 17

SilverBride wrote: »

shezof wrote: »

Its hard to make any PvP discussion in the forums without toxic casual players trying to derail any comments being made. Thats literally happening on this topic right now, check all the replies i got and others.

Make the subject reflect that the thread is mostly about PVP and there won't be any casual players opening the thread, let alone responding. Better yet, post this thread in the PvP forum.

I replied thinking this was about the game in general, but when I found out it was mostly PvP related I said "Oh, so this is about PvP." I was surprised that was interpreted as "pretending PvP doesn't exist", and even more surprised by the backlash.

No, this is not about PVP only.

TaSheen · February 17

shadyjane62 wrote: »

I am busy filling my craft bag to prepare for the coming anniversary when my sub runs out. The game has been dead for me for quite while.

However hunting heartwood has been a challenge.

I've been getting close to 1 or 2 heartwood per log. I'm not seeing it in surveys though IIRC.

ESO_Nightingale · February 17

These days i spend infinitely more time on the forums than i do in-game because I'm not happy with the state of the game. It's utterly stale and theres no balance changes anymore. The implosion of the content creation scene and many updates that ruined zenimax's reputation have definitely been bleeding players. The fighting between casual and endgame players helps literally no-one and the word "toxic" has been overused so much it doesn't mean anything anymore.

QueenCandy · February 17

Good thing I spotted this! I left ESO several years ago a newbie and was excited to play ESO again. I read people's comments here and have completely changed my mind! Very disappointed

SeaGtGruff · February 17

TaSheen wrote: »

shadyjane62 wrote: »

I am busy filling my craft bag to prepare for the coming anniversary when my sub runs out. The game has been dead for me for quite while.

However hunting heartwood has been a challenge.

I've been getting close to 1 or 2 heartwood per log. I'm not seeing it in surveys though IIRC.

I got 4 heartwood from a single log this afternoon, and that's not uncommon for me these days.

Sometimes I get more heartwood than ruby ash. Same with mundane runes. I don't know if I've just really good RNG or what, but I was consistently getting decent amounts of heartwood, mundane runes, and other furnishing mats before the drop rates were buffed, and now I consistently get even higher amounts than before.

TaSheen · February 17

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

TaSheen wrote: »

shadyjane62 wrote: »

I am busy filling my craft bag to prepare for the coming anniversary when my sub runs out. The game has been dead for me for quite while.

However hunting heartwood has been a challenge.

I've been getting close to 1 or 2 heartwood per log. I'm not seeing it in surveys though IIRC.

I got 4 heartwood from a single log this afternoon, and that's not uncommon for me these days. Sometimes I get more heartwood than ruby ash. Same with mundane runes. I don't know if I've just really good RNG or what, but I was consistently getting decent amounts of heartwood, mundane runes, and other furnishing mats before the drop rates were buffed, and now I consistently get even higher amounts than before.

Oh, yeah. Mundane runes are a lot more prolific than most other stuff, always have been for me. I'm really happy with the upped heartwood drop rate, though I haven't seen 4 in one log yet!

Slash8915 · February 18

All the more reason for ZoS to finally enable cross-platform play. There's really no reason for them not to when it's proven to be very successful on other MMOs.

spartaxoxo · February 18

QueenCandy wrote: »

Good thing I spotted this! I left ESO several years ago a newbie and was excited to play ESO again. I read people's comments here and have completely changed my mind! Very disappointed

@QueenCandy

I wouldn't let this thread stop you from checking it out. I won't lie and say everything is amazing, but this thread is also a vent thread. There's still plenty of fun to be had, groups to join, and awesome guilds. It's just that the game isn't as strong as it was a couple of years ago but it's far from genuinely dead.

Amottica · February 18

SilverBride wrote: »

Oh, so this is about PvP.

Well, OP mentioned PvE and PvP. Granted, queueing for a dungoen as DD can lead to a long wait having nothing to do with how many players are online. I would also suggest that experiences in PvP, especially BGs, are not a great indicator of the population overall.

TheDarkRuler · February 18

This game's PVP is not worth spending more development power into.
It was never comparative and should go out of focus for ESO. Best PVE and story MMO but PVP is ... mediocre at best.

SilverBride · February 18

QueenCandy wrote: »

Good thing I spotted this! I left ESO several years ago a newbie and was excited to play ESO again. I read people's comments here and have completely changed my mind! Very disappointed

If I had a nickel for every "ESO is dying" thread I've seen for the past 10 years... yet it hasn't happened yet.

Take these claims with a grain of salt.

Lozeenge · February 18

i personally see PVE in ESO as the "actual game" and PVP being secondary to it to get inconsequential things like cosmetics. this is not a good thing at all mind you, unless you're so averse to player vs. player that you think it's only a net positive that the focus is on PVE content while PVP sits around with no meaningful updates apart from combat sandbox changes or maybe a new set. the only time it gets well populated is during events where there's a bigger incentive to get, you guessed it, cosmetics.

there will always be a community dedicated to playing PVP for PVP's sake either because people genuinely enjoy battling with and/or against real people as opposed to the AoE dance floor that is PVE, or maybe they do get some sick satisfaction out of making others upset over an online game. but as of now there is very little incentive to ever engage with PVP in the long-term and, in fact, appeal is only lowering as everything wrong with it just worsens with time.

Lozeenge · February 18

in terms of the game being generally "dead" we are currently in the slump between updates/events that only crazy people like us would bother continuing to play the game for whatever reason it could be. i stopped caring about actual player counts a long time ago.

Jestir · February 18

Funny enough I think right now is the most low level players just absolutely skittering about since arcanist released

I also wouldn't say the game is in a boom but I can say it is the normal end/start of the year no content lull made a bit worse by the lack of the normal start of the year chapter reveal not being a thing

The game clearly is no longer in the Skyrim 2020 Covid boom but it's still doing relatively well

Elsonso · February 18

SilverBride wrote: »

QueenCandy wrote: »

Good thing I spotted this! I left ESO several years ago a newbie and was excited to play ESO again. I read people's comments here and have completely changed my mind! Very disappointed

If I had a nickel for every "ESO is dying" thread I've seen for the past 10 years... yet it hasn't happened yet.

Take these claims with a grain of salt.

I remember when I used to be like you.

What is different now is that ZOS isn't doing anything interesting. Sure, new players have a ton of content they can consume, but the it isn't like the game is begging people to stick around after that. Golden Pursuits, and all of the stuff this year, seems like fourth and long, with less than a minute left in the fourth quarter.