FlopsyPrince wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

OtarTheMad wrote: »

heaven13 wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

I suspect they thought the Coldharbour tutorial is too closely tied to the base game's main story and they don't think that's the best part of the game any more so they want to funnel new players into newer stuff instead.

When Morrowind came out it had a new, Morrowind specific tutorial that dropped you on Vvardenfell. If you owned the chapter that completely replaced the base game tutorial and (as now) you had to go to a base game city and pick up the quest to go to Coldharbour.

They did new chapter-specific tutorials for all the ones up to Greymoor, then with Blackwood they added the current tutorial which was designed to be universal (it's not tied to any part of the game) and gave you a choice of where you end up.

ZOS have never said why they did that, but we can speculate. If they just wanted to change what you're taught in the tutorial they could do that (they'd already adjusted the Coldharbour one a few times). If they wanted to change the end -point they could do that too (add a step where the Prophet asks where you want to go or several portals or something).

Considering they've made other efforts to funnel new players into the newest areas of the game right away (like putting difficult to ignore quest givers in starter cities) I suspect they think the older areas of the game are not their best work and they want to show off the newest stuff first because they think it will be more appealing to new players.

I'm not convinced it works like that, new players typically seem to want to do one of 3 things:
1) Play the entire game in chronological/release order
2) Play whatever their friends tell them to play
3) They have their own plan - e.g. they got ESO specifically for trials or PvP or something and want to go straight there

I think the Coldharbour tutorial would work best for group 1 and what/where the tutorial is will be irrelevant for group 2 and 3, but it's not my decision.

I really miss the intro areas, particularly the Morrowind one. They should have left them in as the start to the zone and just removed the skyshard/skillpoint.

You can still go to the Vvardenfell tutorial, or at least part of it, via a quest. Same with the Summerset one.

I am sad that we lost Deepwood Redoubt/Barrow though when Greymoor year was over. Such a big area to lose, and it was one of my favorite places to go in Skyrim so it was nice to run around it again.

No, you cannot do the Summerset one. The place where the tutorial dumps you is just a locked gate now. The zone quest is different and starts with Razumdar, but that is different than the tutorial.

I think we might be talking about different quests maybe. I’ve never gotten the quest that replaces the tutorial for Summerset from Razum-dar.

https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Online:Whispers_from_the_Deep

This is the quest I am talking about. It’s like the second half of the tutorial kind of. Maybe I’m mistaken, it’s been a while since I’ve done anything Summerset related.

I do not see how you can start that in the game now. Though I guess I do not go to that area much now, so perhaps something is there that I have either bypassed or never seen since whatever came after Summerset replaced the tutorial.

Now I only get the guy at the Shimmerene Wayshrine that leads to Razumdar. (SP? for both names.)

Alastrine wrote: »

vsrs_au wrote: »

Kalle_Demos wrote: »

The Coldharbour introduction should return. The game is enormous and it's probably better for new players to have some sense of direction. The way it is now, some are unaware that there is a main story at all.

Yes, many new players (including myself when I started playing ESO 3 years ago) have no idea what all these references to the "vestige" actually mean.

Exactly this.
Lots of new players aren't even aware of the Cold Harbor / Molag Bal storyline.
I still do it on all my new toons - just for the skill points and xp. I can blow through it now quickly since I've done it so many times but for new players to ESO? I absolutely think it should put them there with their first character.

Sabre wrote: »

The fact that the character does not have a soul, it should somehow be made to play into character creation.

The initial Coldharbor start introduces the player to Lyris Titanborn and Cadwell. When you think about it, both are somewhat annoying. The start of this heroic adventure and you run into the comic relief cadwell character. It is lackluster and not their best work. Lyris is heroic, but disappointingly not attractive and of course, they had to put make the big nord girl have a romance with the Redguard Sai. All of the coldharbor part is disappointing. The original story is ok, but again, Cadwell turns it into a joke...I don't get what they were trying to do there. The whole thing should be rewritten, and more drawn out and turned into a solo dungeon -and where Molag Baal is a badass one has to defeat with solo dungeon difficulty (like maelstrom) and not delve difficulty. The way the original story interwines the guilds is a nice feature - but the comic relief and disappointing anti-heroic characters as the first thing one meets is a flop.

Sabre wrote: »

The fact that the character does not have a soul, it should somehow be made to play into character creation.

The initial Coldharbor start introduces the player to Lyris Titanborn and Cadwell. When you think about it, both are somewhat annoying. The start of this heroic adventure and you run into the comic relief cadwell character. It is lackluster and not their best work. Lyris is heroic, but disappointingly not attractive and of course, they had to put make the big nord girl have a romance with the Redguard Sai. The original story is ok, but again, Cadwell turns it into a joke...I don't get what they were trying to do there. The whole thing should be rewritten, and more drawn out and turned into a solo dungeon -and where Molag Baal is a badass one has to defeat with solo dungeon difficulty (like maelstrom) and not delve difficulty. Besides an achievment to the story, what benefit does one get for defeating Molag Baal? The way the original story interwines the guilds is a nice feature - but the comic relief and disappointing anti-heroic characters as the first thing one meets is a flop.

barney2525 wrote: »

The Coldharbor Start FORCED every character to begin at their Faction Starting Zone.

With the advent of DLCs they wanted to give the Players More Options and more freedom to progress as the Player wanted to.

Although something I found interesting. I have abrand new account for Gold Road, so first character is forced into the tutorial. At the end of the tutorial, instead of being able to choose any of the Zones I Have access to, everything except my Faction Starting zone was chained off.

I imagine this is because it was the first character ever, on the account.

jle30303 wrote: »

Still... Even with the whole Coldharbour thing... Even if you get pointed towards your main faction... There is the issue of the starter zones versus the main zones within the faction quest.

Like, you go to the starter islands... you get through the starter islands... you get to the main zone... you meet The Prophet... You get soul shriven in Coldharbour... You get dumped back on the starter island, where there is now nothing to do because you did it already.

No. Coldharbour and Soul Shriven should start BEFORE your faction quests, and dump you INTO your faction quests.

So... From the new tutorial, assuming the new tutorial is kept... Once you get to the final chamber... For those who want the original zones and the game's main quest: Instead of 3 separate gates to the faction starter zones, there should be 1 gate, and it leads to "Soul Shriven in Coldharbour" DIRECTLY, and completing this should then drop you in your faction starter zone (as it does now!): so you learn to start both Soul Shriven and Your Own Faction's Questline simultaneously.

And this should be THE MOST OBVIOUSLY SIGNPOSTED GATE even if there are options of others (depending on whether the player has any or all of Morrowind, Summerset, Elsweyr, Greymoor, Blackwood, High Isle, Necrom, Gold Road.) Like, flashing, glowing, larger than the others, different colour, whatever makes it more visible and more signposted. But, ONE, not THREE, and it leads to Soul Shriven In Coldharbour, not to any Faction zone.

The one thing you shouldn't have the option of, is going straight to an enemy faction to start there, with no indication of which is even yours. (Like, a new player who has chosen a Pact race, is not even told which of the starter zones is the Pact zone, and if not knowing where to go, could just as easily choose a Dominion or Covenant zone. People should be OPENLY DIRECTED to their OWN faction if they are choosing that part of the game at all.)

Gates to alternative Chapters... If you take those, it's assumed you know what you're doing: and you can later pick up "Soul Shriven in Coldharbour" the current way, if you want to pick it up at all.

Choosing to "auto-complete the tutorial" should put the player, not in the newest zone, but in the choice chamber with a selection of equipment that one could have picked up during the tutorial, at level 3 and with whatever skills or skill points could have been picked up during the tutorial.