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New DLC overland too dangerous!
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LunaFlora✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Four_Fingers wrote: »Running around overland in your decked out meta build isn't the way to do it either.
Go do end game content which overland is not.
I don't need any meta build to oneshot everything with a white trash weapon, everyone can do this if they have some knowledge.
what kind of white quality weapon can oneshot a world boss or a Herald's Seeker?miaow! i'm Luna ( she/her ).
🌸*throws cherry blossom on you*🌸
"Eagles advance, traveler! And may the Green watch and keep you."
🦬🦌🐰
PlayStation and PC EU.
LunaLolaBlossom on psn.
LunaFloraBlossom on pc.2 -
Kisakee✭✭✭✭✭
✭Four_Fingers wrote: »Running around overland in your decked out meta build isn't the way to do it either.
Go do end game content which overland is not.
I don't need any meta build to oneshot everything with a white trash weapon, everyone can do this if they have some knowledge.
what kind of white quality weapon can oneshot a world boss or a Herald's Seeker?
Obsiously none and that's not what this is about. It's everything else that can be killed with a Light Attack with a white weapon which is the problem. People don't see any need to upgrade their equipment so they don't care and when they run into something stronger than your regular Overland mob they struggle and complain about it. They just never learn how to fight properly.I'm but a sarcastic beef jerky. Irony and cynicism are my parents. You've been warned.5 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@SeaGtGruff, while I mostly agree with your statement at large, I think it's necessary to explain the reason for the behaviour you describe as "arrogant".
A lot of players are in fact fed up by the constant demands to unnecessarily nerf content here in the forums (I really don't witness the same issue ingame tbh). These demands usually aren't brought up by newer players, but seasoned forum veterans (quite some beta-players among them), which simply refuse to accept the combat system of this game.
Take this thread for example: A player is complaining, that they aren't able to solo a boss created for groups and immediately expect zos to nerf it.
Well, zos envisions this enemies to be done in groups, the game itself tell us to better tackle them in groups, but some entitlelists think everything should be soloable in this multiplayer game. These people are the real issue here.Never get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.6 -
Kisakee✭✭✭✭✭
✭SeaGtGruff wrote: »Erickson9610 wrote: »I wouldn't be surprised if these particular enemies were designed to be the "harder overland" content that many have asked for.
The Seekers are just pushovers if you're playing somewhat serious, nothing "hard" about them at all.
They're definitely hard if you consider that normal dungeons are 4 person contents.
Normal dungeons can be done solo, even lots of vet dungeons can. And i just tested it out and killed a Seeker within a minute all on my own without breaking any sweat.
Good for you. Congratulations.
However, not everyone has mythic gear, dungeon monster gear, perfected trial gear, and all of the other gear that goes into making most players as awesomely over-powered as they are. There's a reason why so many new players are so focused on grinding group dungeons for gear, getting into trials as quickly as possible, leveling Antiquities as quickly as possible and then grinding for leads for mythic gear, etc. And a lot of players don't even enjoy that kind of grind. They come to the forums and gripe about RNG. They come into the forums and gripe about getting kicked from group dungeons. They come to the forums and gripe about being turned down for trial groups.
And that's not even counting "issues" related to how much (or how little) CP a player has and how they've got it distributed.
And the awesomely over-powered players who've acquired the gear, CP, and overall knowledge and skills to take on vet hard mode dungeons, Hunter Seekers, wandering world bosses, harrowstorms, and dragons SOLO and clear that kind of content "without breaking any sweat" often come to the forums to gripe about how pathetically easy most of the game is and beg ZOS for some kind of difficulty slider so they crank up the game to a level that they consider to be "moderately challenging."
All of that's fine with me as long as the players are having fun. Except, hang on, the players who are grinding for gear and leads don't sound like they're having much fun, and the players who are so awesomely over-powered that they can (as I've seen some of them say in the forums) "melt world bosses just by looking at them" don't sound like they're finding 90% or more of the game much fun any more. Still, whatever... Your playtime, your choices, your "fun."
But what is saddening to me is to see how much disconnect there is between some of the awesomely over-powered players and the players who are struggling with content that is beyond them. A lot of the comments come across as dismissive and arrogant. "I can do it with incredible ease, so you can, too!" A number of humans have gone to the Moon, but that doesn't mean I'll be able to go there before I die. Some freedivers can hold their breath for over 10 minutes, but that doesn't mean the average swimmer can do that without drowning. Just because you can do something with ease, let alone at all, doesn't mean that everyone else can, too. Even if they had the exact same gear, CP, and other build particulars as you, they might not have the same computer equipment, internet speed, gaming controllers, muscle tone, eyesight, hearing, hand-eye coordination, reflexes, and everything else that you happen to have going for you.Warhawke_80 wrote: »Caligamy_ESO wrote: »Threads like these are why these forums still need a disagree button
This is an Elder Scrolls game, or rather.. its supposed to be, it's not Palia..
I never found Elder Scrolls games that challenging honestly...I don't understand why some folks say that like it's supposed to explain something...
Most of the Elder Scrolls games can be quite challenging to new players, or even to longtime players who are starting over on a new character. Some players never got out of the starter dungeon in Arena. Some players got wiped out by the imp in the starter dungeon in Daggerfall. I made it through the first level of Battlespire but am stuck on the second level because I can't get past the Spider Daedra. Many a player has met their doom to swarms of Cliffracers in Morrowind. Watch out for Ogres and Minotaurs when you're still low-level in Oblivion. Etc., etc. Sure, once you've acquired the best available gear, leveled up your attributes and skills, and acquired some nice spells and/or magical equipment, then most everything becomes a breeze. And let's not forget that those single-player games let you save and reload, which most players have to do a LOT of before they finally get the gear, skills, and other stuff which helps them breeze through the game like it's nothing.
The real problem with this is that a lot of people are not even trying to get where the high-end players are. They want everything their way and they want it as easy and as fast as possible without working on themself because it's not fun to them.
If there's someone who's really putting all their effort into it i'm more than willing to help the out but i'm completely against the "Make it so easy that i don't need to care about skills, equipment and everything else"-attitude.I'm but a sarcastic beef jerky. Irony and cynicism are my parents. You've been warned.4 -
Twohothardware✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Seekers don’t attack you unless you attack them. Just consider them a roaming group event and move along. Overland content as a whole is too easy and unrewarding which is why there’s so many calls for an overland revamp.3 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
7 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.Never get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.6 -
kringled_1✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NeuroticPixels wrote: »[definitely not expecting risk of death while traveling on overland
And that's why people complain about Overlang being too easy. You absolutely should expect death in every corner IMO, a game is no fun to me if there's no challenge.
You can just bypass those mobs as there's no need to kill them "just cause" so everything is fine.
Ugh. That's not why I play games.... I do not care to be "challenged" while out doing surveys and antiquities in overland.
I play games to get away from the extreme challenges of real life in today's world, thank you very much. I seriously have ENOUGH challenges in daily life; I do not need them in a game I play for fun.
Just go around them, no problem. Since they nerfed the Seekers i never encountered one while scrying so you're safe. But if you're up for a fight you just want to be prepared.
Yeah. I know. I still dodge the areas where I got jumped (this was back before they nerfed the HP some) because y'know? Once burned twice shy. I REALLY wish the devs would get off their - um.... nope can't say that.... and produce a harder overland for I guess everyone but me....
Have you ever done a Geyser in Summerset all on your own? That's the difficulty i'd like to have for Overland all over the place.
Omg. Heck no. That sounds super grindy and boring. I don’t want every fight to be a challenge. I hate roaming/farming around Craglorn for that reason. The mobs are many and some hit like trucks if you’re not keeping up shields or dodging like it’s a Souls game. I do 15k-25k dps depending on procs and crits, plus I play the easy-mode magplar for their damage spammable being a heal. Have yet to touch IA at all, or any arenas, because constantly fighting doesn’t sound fun whatsoever.
There’s a hundred different ways that people play video games, especially ESO. There’s no way the devs are going to make content that everyone loves.
Using a single target channeled execute ability as your spammable shows that Overland is doing a very bad job of actually teaching you a proper fighting style, that's the whole problem. Something like this shouldn't work at all.
I think neuroticpixels is referring to puncturing sweeps as their spammable, not radiant glory.3 -
Belegnole✭✭✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.
Unfortunately the discussion is about the abyss being placed in the middle of the wading pool.8 -
MidniteOwl1913✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭@SeaGtGruff, while I mostly agree with your statement at large, I think it's necessary to explain the reason for the behaviour you describe as "arrogant".
A lot of players are in fact fed up by the constant demands to unnecessarily nerf content here in the forums (I really don't witness the same issue ingame tbh). These demands usually aren't brought up by newer players, but seasoned forum veterans (quite some beta-players among them), which simply refuse to accept the combat system of this game.
Take this thread for example: A player is complaining, that they aren't able to solo a boss created for groups and immediately expect zos to nerf it.
Well, zos envisions this enemies to be done in groups, the game itself tell us to better tackle them in groups, but some entitlelists think everything should be soloable in this multiplayer game. These people are the real issue here.
Okay, but it's more the "this content is easy for me so it *should* be easy for you" with the implication that if it isn't easy for someone then there is something wrong with them. It is the implied dis that I object to.
PS5/NA7 -
MidniteOwl1913✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Twohothardware wrote: »Seekers don’t attack you unless you attack them. Just consider them a roaming group event and move along. Overland content as a whole is too easy and unrewarding which is why there’s so many calls for an overland revamp.
Yes and running away works too. For some reason, Sharp attacks Heald seekers even when I am not on the same screen. I notice that I'm in combat and then beat feet.
PS5/NA0 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.
And if someone wants to swim they should just stay in the deep end, and stop advocating for the elimination of the kiddie pool.9 -
MidniteOwl1913✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭SeaGtGruff wrote: »Erickson9610 wrote: »I wouldn't be surprised if these particular enemies were designed to be the "harder overland" content that many have asked for.
The Seekers are just pushovers if you're playing somewhat serious, nothing "hard" about them at all.
They're definitely hard if you consider that normal dungeons are 4 person contents.
Normal dungeons can be done solo, even lots of vet dungeons can. And i just tested it out and killed a Seeker within a minute all on my own without breaking any sweat.
Good for you. Congratulations.
However, not everyone has mythic gear, dungeon monster gear, perfected trial gear, and all of the other gear that goes into making most players as awesomely over-powered as they are. There's a reason why so many new players are so focused on grinding group dungeons for gear, getting into trials as quickly as possible, leveling Antiquities as quickly as possible and then grinding for leads for mythic gear, etc. And a lot of players don't even enjoy that kind of grind. They come to the forums and gripe about RNG. They come into the forums and gripe about getting kicked from group dungeons. They come to the forums and gripe about being turned down for trial groups.
And that's not even counting "issues" related to how much (or how little) CP a player has and how they've got it distributed.
And the awesomely over-powered players who've acquired the gear, CP, and overall knowledge and skills to take on vet hard mode dungeons, Hunter Seekers, wandering world bosses, harrowstorms, and dragons SOLO and clear that kind of content "without breaking any sweat" often come to the forums to gripe about how pathetically easy most of the game is and beg ZOS for some kind of difficulty slider so they crank up the game to a level that they consider to be "moderately challenging."
All of that's fine with me as long as the players are having fun. Except, hang on, the players who are grinding for gear and leads don't sound like they're having much fun, and the players who are so awesomely over-powered that they can (as I've seen some of them say in the forums) "melt world bosses just by looking at them" don't sound like they're finding 90% or more of the game much fun any more. Still, whatever... Your playtime, your choices, your "fun."
But what is saddening to me is to see how much disconnect there is between some of the awesomely over-powered players and the players who are struggling with content that is beyond them. A lot of the comments come across as dismissive and arrogant. "I can do it with incredible ease, so you can, too!" A number of humans have gone to the Moon, but that doesn't mean I'll be able to go there before I die. Some freedivers can hold their breath for over 10 minutes, but that doesn't mean the average swimmer can do that without drowning. Just because you can do something with ease, let alone at all, doesn't mean that everyone else can, too. Even if they had the exact same gear, CP, and other build particulars as you, they might not have the same computer equipment, internet speed, gaming controllers, muscle tone, eyesight, hearing, hand-eye coordination, reflexes, and everything else that you happen to have going for you.Warhawke_80 wrote: »Caligamy_ESO wrote: »Threads like these are why these forums still need a disagree button
This is an Elder Scrolls game, or rather.. its supposed to be, it's not Palia..
I never found Elder Scrolls games that challenging honestly...I don't understand why some folks say that like it's supposed to explain something...
Most of the Elder Scrolls games can be quite challenging to new players, or even to longtime players who are starting over on a new character. Some players never got out of the starter dungeon in Arena. Some players got wiped out by the imp in the starter dungeon in Daggerfall. I made it through the first level of Battlespire but am stuck on the second level because I can't get past the Spider Daedra. Many a player has met their doom to swarms of Cliffracers in Morrowind. Watch out for Ogres and Minotaurs when you're still low-level in Oblivion. Etc., etc. Sure, once you've acquired the best available gear, leveled up your attributes and skills, and acquired some nice spells and/or magical equipment, then most everything becomes a breeze. And let's not forget that those single-player games let you save and reload, which most players have to do a LOT of before they finally get the gear, skills, and other stuff which helps them breeze through the game like it's nothing.
The real problem with this is that a lot of people are not even trying to get where the high-end players are. They want everything their way and they want it as easy and as fast as possible without working on themself because it's not fun to them.
If there's someone who's really putting all their effort into it i'm more than willing to help the out but i'm completely against the "Make it so easy that i don't need to care about skills, equipment and everything else"-attitude.
Well for a lot of players, they have no interest in the end game. No real interest in perfecting a build, or doing the things needed to have resources to gold everything. It's a hobby, for fun. That's just as valid a play style as yours. Complaining that not all players have your goals and that those players are in the wrong is what I object to. I think that ZOS does try to accommodate everyone sometimes it works out better than others.
PS5/NA7 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@MidniteOwl1913 - yes, that's the issue I always have. I have no interest in pvp or pve endgame at all. I have things set for what I do for fun, and that's all I'm interested in. So when people start advocating for mega-upticks in overland difficulty (not in this thread at least so far) across the board (as in some posts in the stickied thread and in various posts elsewhere over time), I get a bit unhappy.
If for instance, @Kisakee gets her preferred level of difficult overland, and the devs choose not to do "optional" - I'll be gone. Others perhaps as well, though my age, crap reflexes, and lack of "real broadband 'net" combine to make things more difficult for me than for others.
Of course, I was looking for entertainment when I found ESO. So if it happens, I'll go find something else to play - and pay for.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....3 -
thegreeneso✭✭✭I don't get why is this even a discussion, these guys are completely optional and can be walked past.3 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »@SeaGtGruff, while I mostly agree with your statement at large, I think it's necessary to explain the reason for the behaviour you describe as "arrogant".
A lot of players are in fact fed up by the constant demands to unnecessarily nerf content here in the forums (I really don't witness the same issue ingame tbh). These demands usually aren't brought up by newer players, but seasoned forum veterans (quite some beta-players among them), which simply refuse to accept the combat system of this game.
Take this thread for example: A player is complaining, that they aren't able to solo a boss created for groups and immediately expect zos to nerf it.
Well, zos envisions this enemies to be done in groups, the game itself tell us to better tackle them in groups, but some entitlelists think everything should be soloable in this multiplayer game. These people are the real issue here.
Okay, but it's more the "this content is easy for me so it *should* be easy for you" with the implication that if it isn't easy for someone then there is something wrong with them. It is the implied dis that I object to.
No, it's more about people saying "this content is too hard for me so it is too hard for the general playerbase and needs to be nerfed. I don't have proof for that and don't need any because I want easy rewards to flex with my performance".
This kind of players do the very same thing in every part of the game, be it overland, be it IA.
I'm sure you know some of them.Never get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.1 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.
And if someone wants to swim they should just stay in the deep end, and stop advocating for the elimination of the kiddie pool.
Nobody does that. It's the kiddies, which can't stand an additional pool for the grown-ups.Never get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.2 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭It is okay for everyone to give their opinion about the game's balance on a forum specifically designated to give their opinion. "It's too hard, please nerf," is just as valid as "it's too easy, please make harder."
Edit
Personally, I think that overland should be made optionally harder. And that content that is challenging for me is generally likely to be too hard for the majority of the playerbase because devs already had to limit the companions pretty hard to ensure they didn't replace the average player. So, separate ways to interact with the content is generally ideal.Edited by spartaxoxo on December 30, 2023 12:38AM0 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭There already is dynamic scaling for characters below level 50, this could be enhanced to let's say maybe 800 CP. After this point it would be the same for everyone and you should have something that feels like a boss fight but without being unfair.
The problem with the dynamic scaling it is automatic. So, the increased difficulty would be forced on everyone who is high cp.NeuroticPixels wrote: »[definitely not expecting risk of death while traveling on overland
And that's why people complain about Overlang being too easy. You absolutely should expect death in every corner IMO, a game is no fun to me if there's no challenge.
You can just bypass those mobs as there's no need to kill them "just cause" so everything is fine.
Ugh. That's not why I play games.... I do not care to be "challenged" while out doing surveys and antiquities in overland.
I play games to get away from the extreme challenges of real life in today's world, thank you very much. I seriously have ENOUGH challenges in daily life; I do not need them in a game I play for fun.
Just go around them, no problem. Since they nerfed the Seekers i never encountered one while scrying so you're safe. But if you're up for a fight you just want to be prepared.
Yeah. I know. I still dodge the areas where I got jumped (this was back before they nerfed the HP some) because y'know? Once burned twice shy. I REALLY wish the devs would get off their - um.... nope can't say that.... and produce a harder overland for I guess everyone but me....
Have you ever done a Geyser in Summerset all on your own? That's the difficulty i'd like to have for Overland all over the place.
Omg. Heck no. That sounds super grindy and boring. I don’t want every fight to be a challenge. I hate roaming/farming around Craglorn for that reason. The mobs are many and some hit like trucks if you’re not keeping up shields or dodging like it’s a Souls game. I do 15k-25k dps depending on procs and crits, plus I play the easy-mode magplar for their damage spammable being a heal. Have yet to touch IA at all, or any arenas, because constantly fighting doesn’t sound fun whatsoever.
There’s a hundred different ways that people play video games, especially ESO. There’s no way the devs are going to make content that everyone loves.
Using a single target channeled execute ability as your spammable shows that Overland is doing a very bad job of actually teaching you a proper fighting style, that's the whole problem. Something like this shouldn't work at all.
"I play the easy-mode magplar for their damage spammable being a heal"
This is a reference to jabs not beam. That player uses the Templar spammable as their spammable. Jabs is intended to be the class spammable.Edited by spartaxoxo on December 30, 2023 12:48AM4 -
kaushad✭✭✭✭MidniteOwl1913 wrote: »
I can easily solo every group event boss from before Necrom, except for that wispmother in High Isle, who has an unbreakable hold. And even in her case, I've got by with shields and healing over time.
While I've only attempted it a few times on PTS, I have yet to complete the Gorne group event. I remember less about the Underweave bosses, but a couple of those bosses were unusually difficult too. I think one was Loremaster Trigon and I can't identify the other, but they kept disappearing somewhere and healing, so it was like fighting that mireguant in Murkmire. The mobs were no more trouble than usual as I recall.2 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »It is okay for everyone to give their opinion about the game's balance on a forum specifically designated to give their opinion. "It's too hard, please nerf," is just as valid as "it's too easy, please make harder".
While I agree in general, it's of course valid to disagree with any of the mentioned opinions.
Is it really a question of balance, if we ask for soloable group bosses for everyone?
I don't think so. Not only highly skilled players are enjoying working together in a group. That's something enjoyed by most players of an mmo, including those, which aren't interested in more challenging content at all. For these people WBs, world events and nymics were made to give them a low-thresholding possibility to play together.
On the other side we have players, which utterly despise any form of social interaction, treating this game in fact as a singleplayer game. It's only natural, that some content will be unreachable for them as eso is a multiplayer game in it's very nature. That includes of course some offer for groups also in open world. These are optional anyways.Never get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.0 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »It is okay for everyone to give their opinion about the game's balance on a forum specifically designated to give their opinion. "It's too hard, please nerf," is just as valid as "it's too easy, please make harder".
While I agree in general, it's of course valid to disagree with any of the mentioned opinions.
Is it really a question of balance, if we ask for soloable group bosses for everyone?
Yes. It's not one I agree with. But, thinking the overland should be soloable by everyone is an opinion about balance. Some people feel that challenge should come from instanced content. And running around some of the dead zones and seeing how little help people get in those zones (as opposed to the popular ones where help is easy to get), it's understandable why they feel that way.
Personally, I think the companions were good solution to that because they gave them a group mate without having to nerf the content for people who'd prefer the challenge. There's a few fights in the overland the companions are of no use that the companions should be fixed on, but that's a way to add optional difficulty changes without ruining the fun of the challenge for the rest of us.
Sometimes people are decent at identifying an issue but not why something is an issue. Game developers are used to that and ZOS has done a pretty good job of taking in all this feedback and coming up with solutions that addresses the valid parts of the concerns of all parties without ruining content for people who enjoy it.
They knocked infinite Archive out of the park for example, even if I think there's a couple of points that need addressing.
Edited by spartaxoxo on December 30, 2023 1:16AM0 -
BlueRaven✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.
And if someone wants to swim they should just stay in the deep end, and stop advocating for the elimination of the kiddie pool.
Nobody does that. It's the kiddies, which can't stand an additional pool for the grown-ups.
Nobody?katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool"?
Overland content is partly for people to learn how to play the game outside of difficult content like dungeons, trials or PvP.
But that is simply not possible at the moment because overland is so ridiculously easy in most parts that anyone with even just the most basic understanding of the game is able to beat overland content without any challenge.
So not “nobody”.5 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »spartaxoxo wrote: »It is okay for everyone to give their opinion about the game's balance on a forum specifically designated to give their opinion. "It's too hard, please nerf," is just as valid as "it's too easy, please make harder".
While I agree in general, it's of course valid to disagree with any of the mentioned opinions.
Is it really a question of balance, if we ask for soloable group bosses for everyone?
Yes. It's not one I agree with. But, thinking the overland should be soloable by everyone is an opinion about balance. Some people feel that challenge should come from instanced content. And running around some of the dead zones and seeing how little help people get in those zones (as opposed to the popular ones where help is easy to get), it's understandable why they feel that way.
Personally, I think the companions were good solution to that because they gave them a group mate without having to nerf the content for people who'd prefer the challenge. There's a few fights in the overland the companions are of no use that the companions should be fixed on, but that's a way to add optional difficulty changes without ruining the fun of the challenge for the rest of us.
Sometimes people are decent at identifying an issue but not why something is an issue. Game developers are used to that and ZOS has done a pretty good job of taking in all this feedback and coming up with solutions that addresses the valid parts of the concerns of all parties without ruining content for people who enjoy it.
They knocked infinite Archive out of the park for example, even if I think there's a couple of points that need addressing.
Well, I definitely agree regarding companions. They did a really good job by adjusting their effectiveness in IA and hit the sweet spot for difficulty rather well for the whole audience in there.
Regarding soloable group content I still disagree, although I understand your point of view. If players are annoyed by optional group content that much, that they go enrage even by just witnessing it's existence, they maybe simply picked the wrong game.
I could understand their arguments, if the content in question were mandatory for playing the game. But that's not the case. Everything is optional, so they already have what they are asking for.Never get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.0 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.
And if someone wants to swim they should just stay in the deep end, and stop advocating for the elimination of the kiddie pool.
Nobody does that. It's the kiddies, which can't stand an additional pool for the grown-ups.
Nobody?katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool"?
Overland content is partly for people to learn how to play the game outside of difficult content like dungeons, trials or PvP.
But that is simply not possible at the moment because overland is so ridiculously easy in most parts that anyone with even just the most basic understanding of the game is able to beat overland content without any challenge.
So not “nobody”.
Where exactly did @Jierdanit ask for the elimination of the ankle-deep section of the pool?
Exactly, they didn't.
On the contrary, if we read the posting in question unframed (yes, that's possible), it's a complaint about missing connecting links between overland and more challenging content, thus interested players hitting the wall as soon as they try the latter.
A starting point for a solution would be (optional) difficulty settings for example for delves and public dungeons.
But I already know which players are opposing this options with framing about "gatekeeping" and "elitism" while their beta monkey is running in circles while screaming "fix combat".
This story isn't working anymore, but I don't mind them parroting it.Edited by Braffin on December 30, 2023 1:49AMNever get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.1 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@Braffin - the problem I have is that everyone assumes that "optional" will be what the devs (if they do anything) will implement.
I have serious doubts about that. Oh sure, there are "optional" things in the game. But this ask is already out of the "optional" ballpark - because it's a HUGE ask, and my guess is (from many years of dealing with game devs.... since 1985 in fact) that what will happen will not in fact be "optional".... because increasing the difficulty across the board will be infinitely easier and much less expensive (in various ways) than actually implementing "optional harder overland".
I'm only one player. I pay 3 annual subs, but we all know that's a very small drop in a very deep bucket. I'm expecting to have to find something else to play (not really an option - the only thing I really enjoy is TES) - so, I'll be going back to Skyrim and Oblivion.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....3 -
spartaxoxo✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.
And if someone wants to swim they should just stay in the deep end, and stop advocating for the elimination of the kiddie pool.
Nobody does that. It's the kiddies, which can't stand an additional pool for the grown-ups.
Nobody?katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool"?
Overland content is partly for people to learn how to play the game outside of difficult content like dungeons, trials or PvP.
But that is simply not possible at the moment because overland is so ridiculously easy in most parts that anyone with even just the most basic understanding of the game is able to beat overland content without any challenge.
So not “nobody”.
Where exactly did @Jierdanit ask for the elimination of the ankle-deep section of the pool?
Exactly, they didn't.
On the contrary, if we read the posting in question unframed (yes, that's possible), it's a complaint about missing connecting links between overland and more challenging content, thus interested players hitting the wall as soon as they try the latter.
The post didn't give a solution at all. Just strongly implied that the difficulty should be increased for players so that they have to learn how to properly play the game. Which, imo, does sound like they think difficulty should be blanket increased to at least be hard enough to require things like knowing how to block, interrupt, and other basic mechanics.
3 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭spartaxoxo wrote: »katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool”?
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, forcing them will only drive them away from the pool.
By extension, maybe we should we eliminate all “difficult” areas so people can learn to enjoy quieter story based content. How does that sound?
Don’t worry about how others play the game, or what they even want from it. Sheesh.
If someone does not want to learn how to swim, they should avoid deep waters instead of demanding the whole sea to restrict itself to be ankle-deep.
And if someone wants to swim they should just stay in the deep end, and stop advocating for the elimination of the kiddie pool.
Nobody does that. It's the kiddies, which can't stand an additional pool for the grown-ups.
Nobody?katanagirl1 wrote: »The game is designed with difficult content in instanced areas, hm group dungeons, vet arenas, and trials. That way other players don’t accidentally stumble into these areas and possibly get frustrated and quit the game. Why is there this constant insistence on making overland so difficult I have to fight a 1 mil hp boss to get my surveys?
Complaining about overland being too easy is like standing in the ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool and saying it’s not deep enough.
How exactly is someone supposed to learn to swim properly if they are only ever in the "ankle-deep section of the kiddie swimming pool"?
Overland content is partly for people to learn how to play the game outside of difficult content like dungeons, trials or PvP.
But that is simply not possible at the moment because overland is so ridiculously easy in most parts that anyone with even just the most basic understanding of the game is able to beat overland content without any challenge.
So not “nobody”.
Where exactly did @Jierdanit ask for the elimination of the ankle-deep section of the pool?
Exactly, they didn't.
On the contrary, if we read the posting in question unframed (yes, that's possible), it's a complaint about missing connecting links between overland and more challenging content, thus interested players hitting the wall as soon as they try the latter.
The post didn't give a solution at all. Just strongly implied that the difficulty should be increased for players so that they have to learn how to properly play the game. Which, imo, does sound like they think difficulty should be blanket increased to at least be hard enough to require things like knowing how to block, interrupt, and other basic mechanics.
Yes, that's how I interpreted it as well. I do know how to do those things, but I play on "substandard" internet, so they don't always work - in fact, they work less than 20% of the time.
So I'm generally at a disadvantage.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....2 -
Braffin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭@TaSheen I get your concerns. Well, none of us players can speak for zos or predict what they are doing with the input we give.
They did a better job imo lately (for example with IA) than in the past.
That said, I for myself have no intention to force higher difficulty upon anyone not interested in it. All my suggestions are meant to provide solutions for the issues at hand.
I don't want to see players like you to be pushed away from the game, nor do I want to see players leaving because they are bored by difficulty. Unfortunately the latter happens all the time, even in a guild specifically made for newer players. They play for a few weeks, then someday ask if zones are getting harder and are never seen again after they were answered.
That's why options are needed.Never get between a cat and it's candy!
---
Overland difficulty scaling is desperately needed. 9 years. 6 paid expansions. 24 DLCs. 40 game changing updates including One Tamriel, an overhaul of the game including a permanent CP160 gear cap and ridiculous power creep thereafter. I'm sick and tired of hearing about Cadwell Silver & Gold as a "you think you do but you don't" - tier deflection to any criticism regarding the lack of overland difficulty in the game. I'm bored of dungeons, I'm bored of trials; make a personal difficulty slider for overland. It's not that hard.1 -
TaSheen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭@TaSheen I get your concerns. Well, none of us players can speak for zos or predict what they are doing with the input we give.
They did a better job imo lately (for example with IA) than in the past.
That said, I for myself have no intention to force higher difficulty upon anyone not interested in it. All my suggestions are meant to provide solutions for the issues at hand.
I don't want to see players like you to be pushed away from the game, nor do I want to see players leaving because they are bored by difficulty. Unfortunately the latter happens all the time, even in a guild specifically made for newer players. They play for a few weeks, then someday ask if zones are getting harder and are never seen again after they were answered.
That's why options are needed.
Oh, I fully agree. I just have reservations about how "expensive" options may be. Regardless, I hope that I will be able to enjoy this game for however long it takes for TES 6 to arrive (and I also hope that I will actually be able to play it if and when it does - if it turns out that it's only going to be VR, well.... I have serious vertigo - a genetic problem - and VR would make me.... um.... yeah, not going there descriptively).
I'm actually feeling as if my game playing days (outside of TES SP titles) are done. Hey, I've had a great run - nearly 40 years.... so I'm not really complaining. But the more my real life is circumscribed (and no, I don't really want to go into detail), the more I realize just how much I have relied on my.... "other life".... to keep me sane. More or less.
*shrug* I'll figure something out. I always have.______________________________________________________
"But even in books, the heroes make mistakes, and there isn't always a happy ending." Mercedes Lackey, Into the West
PC NA, PC EU (non steam)- four accounts, many alts....0
This discussion has been closed.