Werewolf Timer

Skoomah · May 2023

In keeping with the spirit of letting you play as you want, I propose that the werewolf timer be eliminated so that us wolves can freely Rome around in Cyrodiil without interruption of the RP.

Rematin · May 2023

yes please make WW permament, timer is just annoying.

Amarthiul · May 2023

Absolutely. Not just Cyrodiil, trying to be a WW in a dungeon or trial is frustrating. You have to speed run between trash pulls, any time someone finds a chest or is on a quest your timer runs out and it's a painful process to build enough ultimate. In addition, porting in/out of a dungeon pulls you out of WW form, as does some dungeon mechanics like the skeevaton phase in Frostvault.

Two other ideas for changes (instead of the infinite timer which would be simplest) I had were:

Refund ultimate (up to 100%) based on how full your timer bar is when you untransform.
Allow you to generate ultimate in WW form, so if you manage to stay in it long enough you can instantly transform again when it runs out, or at least be well on the way to another ultimate.

Tommy_The_Gun · May 2023

Currently as a WW, you are inferior in almost every way to non-WW build in both PvE & PvP. I can not think of any niche scenario in which WW would have an edge over non-WW. So why not ?

It would require some WW skills & passive to be adjusted as some of them increase your WW timer, so it would be kinda redundant to have them.

Soarora · May 2023

The timer drives the player to truly act as a werewolf. One must devour all in their path with great fervor to fulfill their endless appetite (aka keep the bar full).

Liguar · May 2023

Soarora wrote: »

The timer drives the player to truly act as a werewolf. One must devour all in their path with great fervor to fulfill their endless appetite (aka keep the bar full).

Then one should also be able to snack a little on the player lollygagging at a chest, or whatever. Fair is fair, and Altmer are tasty little chickens.

Amarthiul · May 2023

Soarora wrote: »

The timer drives the player to truly act as a werewolf. One must devour all in their path with great fervor to fulfill their endless appetite (aka keep the bar full).

So when I pull a boss while the trial lead is explaining mechanics I'm not being toxic I'm just RPing a WW? Good to know.

tsaescishoeshiner · May 2023

Maybe instead of a timer that ends werewolf form, there could be a meter that drains and debuffs you? Like if you don't fight, eat, kill things, use abilities, you lose some of the movement speed and damage. So they can keep the identity with a more manageable mechanic

Panderbander · May 2023

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

Maybe instead of a timer that ends werewolf form, there could be a meter that drains and debuffs you? Like if you don't fight, eat, kill things, use abilities, you lose some of the movement speed and damage. So they can keep the identity with a more manageable mechanic

This seems like a pragmatic approach to encouraging devouring things to fulfill the RP while removing the timer.

Jaraal · May 2023

Rematin wrote: »

yes please make WW permament, timer is just annoying.

A toggle would be better, so that we can actually mount up and only take 10 minutes to get across Cyrodiil rather than requiring 15 mins to run in form.

Skoomah · May 2023

I think the werewolf timer should just be eliminated without conditions. The absence of a timer would introduce additional play styles like wait for the perfect moment to pounce on your prey vs the current state where you have to keep attacking to keep the timer going to stay in werewolf form. Different prey and scenarios require different hunting tactics. The elimination of a timer would allow for these different scenarios to play out more naturally.

Tommy_The_Gun · May 2023

The other issue imho is how ww transformation is coded. If you port to a different zone or change location (enter delve or dungeon etc) - then WW ulti gets cancelled. You can have maximum WW time left, but as soon as you change zone - WW gets cancelled. I don't really remember if it was always like that or they changed at some point. I always find that weird that when werewolf enters a cave *poof* - werewolf is human again. Is this some kind of allergic reaction or something ?!

I think that they would need to change that in 1st place if they were to change WW ulti from timed one to toggle one with ulti cost.

huskandhunger · May 2023

Definitely a toggle form would be great for accessibility for new players and allow greater enjoyment overall instead of constantly looking down at the timer.

Soarora · May 2023

Amarthiul wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

The timer drives the player to truly act as a werewolf. One must devour all in their path with great fervor to fulfill their endless appetite (aka keep the bar full).

So when I pull a boss while the trial lead is explaining mechanics I'm not being toxic I'm just RPing a WW? Good to know.

Just don’t WW in training runs, or only WW in trash OR boss.

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

Maybe instead of a timer that ends werewolf form, there could be a meter that drains and debuffs you? Like if you don't fight, eat, kill things, use abilities, you lose some of the movement speed and damage. So they can keep the identity with a more manageable mechanic

This would be a cool alternative. Definitely down for this.

Drako_Ei · May 2023

Soarora wrote: »

The timer drives the player to truly act as a werewolf. One must devour all in their path with great fervor to fulfill their endless appetite (aka keep the bar full).

Except when you need to wait for the NPCs to finish roleplaying and open the door in your dungeon

Erickson9610 · May 2023

TES V: Skyrim is the game which introduced the werewolf timer system, which was the primary inspiration for its implementation in the Elder Scrolls Online. However, player werewolves in TES did not always have the timer — take, for instance, the implementation of werewolves in the Bloodmoon DLC for TES III: Morrowind.

In TES III, you were forced into a transformation every night, which lasted the entire night. Instead of losing your form if you did not kill anyone within the time limit, you instead suffered a penalty to your health the following morning when you transform back.

While I do not think ESO should implement werewolves exactly the way that TES III did, I do think that there is some merit to the idea that werewolves can have some driving force other than the transformation timer to encourage them to fulfill the "werewolf fantasy".

I do appreciate the werewolf timer for what it does, but a key difference between Skyrim's implementation and ESO's implementation is that Skyrim allowed you to keep adding time to your timer, giving you a functionally infinite timer — provided you feed on enough bodies — while ESO's werewolf timer caps the time and forces you to always be on your feet, which is great from a thematic standpoint but poor from a user experience standpoint.

Erickson9610 · May 2023

tsaescishoeshiner wrote: »

Maybe instead of a timer that ends werewolf form, there could be a meter that drains and debuffs you? Like if you don't fight, eat, kill things, use abilities, you lose some of the movement speed and damage. So they can keep the identity with a more manageable mechanic

This sounds like a reasonable approach. How about instead of debuffing player werewolves for not feeding, they are instead buffed for a short time for feeding? That would allow the timer minigame to still exist, while not forcing player werewolves out of form.

A common concern about player werewolves versus player vampires in ESO is that while vampires have to constantly live with their curse, having their buffs and debuffs active at all times, werewolves only deal with their curse when they're transformed. This is jarring thematically, because many NPCs in Tamriel "cannot control" their werewolf curse, while players have no problem forgetting that the transformation exists.

If players never want to use their transformation, then they're essentially mortals with an extra skill line. To encourage player werewolves to utilize their skill line, I think that feeding on a corpse while in werewolf form should buff their human forms for a time, rather than debuff them for not feeding.

Erickson9610 · May 2023

Skoomah wrote: »

I think the werewolf timer should just be eliminated without conditions. The absence of a timer would introduce additional play styles like wait for the perfect moment to pounce on your prey vs the current state where you have to keep attacking to keep the timer going to stay in werewolf form. Different prey and scenarios require different hunting tactics. The elimination of a timer would allow for these different scenarios to play out more naturally.

I agree. ZOS is going to have to give us the ability to crouch so we can utilize these new playstyles effectively. There are already werewolf sneaking animation in the game, and you can even see some of them when utilizing invisibility potions while in werewolf form. I really want to be able to build a stealthy werewolf, and I think others would like to play as one, too.