"A few' is generally defined as three.

@Noth

"You mean the skills are no longer the best of the best and a person is stupid not to take them?"
I think that's what you meant?

"Both still have situations that they can be used well"
Never said there wasn't.

"Drain is still basically god mode in VR rank pve."
Yea, we all know that. I'm talking about pvp, as that's where I spend quite a bit of my time.

"The change simply makes them less of a no brainer and give a reason to use some skills over them as needed."
2 weapon slots. 10 abilities. 2 ultimates. And only one of them is a vampire skill. Mist. I run an AOE setup for pvp/pve with healing as a secondary. I'm squishy, so I use the reduced damage from mist to travel relatively safely from keep to keep as it usually detours the average 2-3 person gank squad. But it's not fool proof. You can root me in place with talons/dark magic and wale on me. you can disrupt mist spam with shield bashing. Any ability that stuns/reduces movement speed works.
Get vampirism, go to pvp, find an enemy group of players, get their attention, and then try to mist form to safety. Chances are you're not going to make it.

felixgamingx1 wrote: »

seriously you guys downloading this patch feels like injecting poison on my character

You should count yourself lucky that you're not a werewolf then.

Mortals will still complain when they get beat down by a superior breed. You can't nerf our skill. What excuse will you use now when we tear you apart without using mist?

JasonConstantine wrote: »

Pesonally as a Vamp i feel they went a bit too far with it. I agree the stacking had to be nerfed, but in stage 4 only having a 21% reduction is ridiculous. Their is no point at all staying in Stage 4 nowadays and its more a detriment then a bonus. They should have also nerfed how much healing reduction we get, its still the same as it was before, the detriment outweighs the benefits at this point.

As for Mist form, I think the reduction in speed was enough, we didnt need a cost increase as well. The entire class was basically just given a big slap in the face and told ....WELL YOU ARE NOT SPECIAL ANYMORE.

They went way too far and caused more problems for vampires and didn't fix a single thing of the many passive bugs.

Yes people cried and people exploited it. This was a very lazy way to correct it. I'd like to see shield bash, tons of mage skills and dragon knight skills, as well as werewolf speed taken into the same consideration of nerfing since people can spam them all day long. People would be tearing down the forums.

Since any defenses against fire damage are now rendered useless and vampire is no longer a vampire but more like..... who knows, almost as lame as twilight.... they should remove the fire damage and have fighters guild not apply to other players other than the normal damage it would do to anyone.

Was it that difficult to make the weakness to fire scale with each stage?
This way the decision would have been in each player if he takes for example 150% weakness in stage 4 and the reduction as it was 60% or he feeds to avoid this.

Right now been a vampire only means having 3 skills with passives and 50% weakness to fire.

I would have liked a bit more play with the feeding and the stages.

And the mist form...well if you are sorcerer I guess is now stupid not to take boundless storm in its place(+ armour & spell resist + deals damage on top of 30% speed) or even bolt escape. Remember that in mist form you cant use skills or receive healing...it was that game breaking having a scape skill for vampires?

JasonConstantine wrote: »

....WELL YOU ARE NOT SPECIAL ANYMORE.

actually.. that was already before the patch

Also, a proper fix would have been just to remove a way for people to exploit bat swarm but keeping all stats the same AND fixing the passives. That would have been the right thing to do. Now either they will make other changes to it sometime in the near future to redeem OR they will start their nerfs on everything else until everyone's complaining all over again.

Sunrock wrote: »

SaibotLiu wrote: »

Correction, escaping is for wussies who cant fight on anyone elses terms but their own and need to reset fights and who cant fight their way out of a hole.

You must be one of those kids who must roll with a zerg and spends the rest of your time running from 1vs1. Clearly very skilled.

Even though I agree with you in general but with the above quoted section I really do not.

Sun Tzu the author of Art of War. The grandfather of tactica military combat wrote a few this that proves that you are wrong in your assumptions.

First of he sad: If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him.

Secondly he sad: It is the rule in war, if ten times the enemy's strength, surround them; if five times, attack them; if double, be able to divide them; if equal, engage them; if fewer, be able to evade them; if weaker, be able to avoid them.

For the Third he sad: He who knows when he can fight and when he cannot will be victorious.

So saying that escaping is for wussies who cant fight on anyone else terms is not a seine tactical evaluation.

Were not talking about war, were talking about video games.

I guess if you want to apply the principle that "all is fair in love and war" well sure we can open the books on everything. Im sure Sun Tzu would not think twice about using a bot, speed hacks, or any other distinctly unfair features to gain an advantage, since thats what he was all about, using everything available to you.

If you want to justify using all available tactics, no matter how low or dog like, you cant really separate the two and remain accurate to the source material.

Devlinne wrote: »

If MIST is the "i win button" ......THEN WHAT IS BOLT ESCAPE????

The answer you are looking for is a double edged sword. It is basically an all, or nothing gambit. Either they succeed in achieving a stalemate, or they cripple themselves in the attempt. Leaving themselves defenseless, and easy prey for any player that catches them in that state.

Any sorcerer who is able to use that ability to cover vast distances is simply put a non issue on the battlefield, because they have literally dumped everything into just being able to run away. So what value is there in killing them. They are not effecting the outcome of the battle. Unless combatants allow themselves to be pulled.

I can understand the frustration, but players that are doing that are effectively on their own initiative neutering themselves out of combat. They are only in the end hurting themselves, because well lets face it they aren't getting to kill other players, and they really don't get to have a stake in the outcome. They are just basically trolling, and as with any trolling if you don't bite. Then they can't have any fun doing what they are doing.

The reality is most sorcerers only have a few bolts in them, because they don't want to trade away survivability in combat. All the magic in the world doesn't really change the fact that going into battle pretty much naked. Doesn't really work out in the long run. Most of those who abuse Bolt Escape chronically just haven't figured that out yet.

Which isn't at all surprising. I have met some pretty dense players in game. Last night I saw a guy trying to tank in light armor. He got rocked like you would not believe. Of the eight goes we had at one particular boss he only lasted longer then thirty seconds once, and he probably only lasted as long as he did. For the simple reason that I double buffed the groups armor. Before we engaged the boss.

I was the groups healer, and I still out tanked him, and out damaged him. What I am getting at is some people just don't think things out. If you build yourself into this games version of the road runner. What has that actually got you. If the guy on the other side doesn't bite on the chase. While you are running for the hills the other side is going to take your keep. It is better to be in the game. Then to place yourself firmly on the sidelines. Lamenting that you can't do squat about what is happening right in front of you.

Well said Nef. What they should nerf is the ultimate reduction in sorc and dk instead of Vamp. Going into mist and using your ultimate should be perfectly okay since an ultimate is not meant to be spammed. As a Nightblade Vamp, I can tell you... we can not spam the ultimate. We can build it back up by hitting enemies with certain attacks, but definitely not spam it like sorc and dk can.. which is where the problem is exactly, not vamps.

SaibotLiu wrote: »

Sunrock wrote: »

SaibotLiu wrote: »

Correction, escaping is for wussies who cant fight on anyone elses terms but their own and need to reset fights and who cant fight their way out of a hole.

You must be one of those kids who must roll with a zerg and spends the rest of your time running from 1vs1. Clearly very skilled.

Even though I agree with you in general but with the above quoted section I really do not.

Sun Tzu the author of Art of War. The grandfather of tactica military combat wrote a few this that proves that you are wrong in your assumptions.

First of he sad: If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him.

Secondly he sad: It is the rule in war, if ten times the enemy's strength, surround them; if five times, attack them; if double, be able to divide them; if equal, engage them; if fewer, be able to evade them; if weaker, be able to avoid them.

For the Third he sad: He who knows when he can fight and when he cannot will be victorious.

So saying that escaping is for wussies who cant fight on anyone else terms is not a seine tactical evaluation.

Were not talking about war, were talking about video games.

I guess if you want to apply the principle that "all is fair in love and war" well sure we can open the books on everything. Im sure Sun Tzu would not think twice about using a bot, speed hacks, or any other distinctly unfair features to gain an advantage, since thats what he was all about, using everything available to you.

If you want to justify using all available tactics, no matter how low or dog like, you cant really separate the two and remain accurate to the source material.

This is a bit way off topic so I will be brief.

I disagree. In massive open world PvP you can apply the teachings of art of war with grate success. I have seen it been used with grate success in several different MMOs that focus on large scall PvP.

Your comment about braking the rules of the game is irrelevant. And if you take your time and think about it I think you will see it too. In fact it's because of the game rules are enforced the teachings of Sun Tzu works in a game. Because the basic of his tactical reasoning comes from a game called Go. Its an old strategy game from China.

AlienDiplomat wrote: »

Nerfing mist speed was arguably needed but should only have been applied to PVP zones.

Or they could have adjusted it so it would have minimal impact in PvE but affect its use in PvP greatly.

Put quite simply,. PvP is being prioritized over PvE once more.. anytime an MMO balances too much for one, it hurts the other.. this is what's happened here. If you're going to nerf the vamp then FIX the bugs in their passives FIRST,.. it's called balancing. Now the game is balanced for PvP ,.. I like PvP ok, but I'm not here to PvP,. so like many others I will likely allow my subscription to expire and close the book on another in a long line of sad attempts to make a quality game.