New Sorcerer Build- Assistance

Fruity_Ninja · May 2014

Hey guys

I am basically after advice at the moment. I'm currently playing a dragonknight, and at around level 30 was forced to reset my skills and attributes in order to get my build right. Obviously you unlock abilities on your first playthrough and they don't all work as well as you thought they do

I am about to start a new character, this time a Sorcerer and have spent a fair bit of time researching the tree to get some ideas. I'd like to avoid making mistakes and then having to reroll my skills.

My plan is to choose an Altmer, and to play a Battlemage style character (tanky, able to solo most PVE content, melee capabilities instead of casting ranged spells)- and preferably one that summons (for RP purposes I am somewhat obsessed with summoning and interested in necromancy). Can anyone give me ideas? My specific questions are as below:

1). Heavy armor is what I am leaning towards. But is light armor feasible for a tanky character with melee capabilities?

2). Main weapon I am leaning towards 2-Handed or Sword n Board. What are the benefits of each and is there anything I should take into consideration? Any 'must have' skills from these weapons?

3). Secondary weapon- I have no idea on this at all. Is using one of the above weapons enough? Or am I hindering my build by avoiding having a staff? If so, do I invest skill points into the staff?

4). Main active and passive skills to come from Daedric Summoning. My plan is to have this as my main school of skills- is this feasible or is it a little underpowered? Which actives and passives are 'must haves' from this set of class skills?

5). If Daedric Summoning is not enough, what do I boost it with? Dark Magic, Storm Calling or some weapon skills? If so, what are the best options? Are there any 'must have' abilities in Dark Magic or Storm Calling? (I was thinking Dark Exchange in Dark Magic might be handy for healing)

Sorry I know it is long winded. But truthfully so many of the class skills sound really good, so I just want to narrow it down a bit rather than wasting skill points in what would largely be a trial and error process.

Any assistance from experienced Sorcerers is much appreciated, thanks!

P.S.- I am concerned here mostly with solo PVE play, and then obviously eventually the PVE vet content, dungeons etc. PVP is of little interest to me at this stage.

jbrenston · May 2014

*******WALL 'O TEXT BELOW**********

I currently have a lvl 22 Altmer War Wizard (sorcerer). Although I don't consider mysylf a tank, I've come to realize that my set up is gear more towards crowd control and AoE damage. That being said, I don't have a LOT of expirence tanking with a Sorc, but I am familiy with some of the machanics of the class.

I wear all heavy armor and have to very distinct load outs. One load out is my casters load out. I has both summmon, lightning spash, mages fury, and encase (morphed so that it explodes when finished). Because I'm casting at a distance I use a bow as my weapon. Its kinda like a hunter or ranger class, utilizing pets and traps and what not.

My typical method of attack is to encase a set of mobs (CC), then drop lightning splash (DoT), encase explodes causing burst damage, drop encase again, (more CC) and finish off whoever is remaining with either mages fury or my arrows.

In the event that I'm out of mana and still have mobs to deal with I switch to my second weapon which is a big ass sword. This load out primary uses stamina with the exception of my cannfear summon (which I normally have summoned at all times). One thing to note, if you summon your cannfear and swap load outs, your summon will remain. In this oad out I normally have, the rushsword rush attack (I can't think of the name at the moment), cleave, reverse slash, and silverbolt from the Fighters Guild skill line. At the moment this load out is used so I can continue to cause damage while my mana recharges. That may change as I get highter in level.

In your case I would advise using a sword and shield simply because that weapon combo has (at least one) skill(s) used to taunt mobs. From what I can tell there really aren't that many 'agroo holding' weapon skills. As for as class abilities, I'd say use anything that ofers CC and boosts you defense or armor rating. There are things like Lightning Form that briefly increases your armor as well as Bound Armor, which is a toggled skill at also increases armor. There are also many traps and stuns in both dark magic and summoning that can be used for CC. Also look into using some of the Undaunted and Fighter Guilds skill that are gear towards boosted defense and mitigating damage.

Like I said, I'm by no means an expert. These are just my thoughts. I hope they were useful.

Solomon_Cato · May 2014

Here was something I would go with if I were to go 2H on a sorc:

http://esohead.com/calculator/skills#mMkzxxMV9MW9M8AIUM8wABe8AIQ18AIOU8NUmo8AISu8wAlB8wAvz8Niqz8AIPN8NUmo8Nikc8L7rcdoQr6MdoQC6MdoQF8p7JMdBvT6MdBvj6MdBEp6cdBET8T7r68x7Hrsfd6msfr6Lsff6Lsfw6msfi6MwGN16MwGAR6MwGAs6MwGAa6MwGAb8H7JrzfQ6Lzf26LzwM6Lzwm6LbHm6MNieh6MNieA6MNieT6MNiey8J7xLziB6rziO6LziY6MNUIz6MNUIN8K7JLkg6Lzuu6rzuN6Lzuj6Lzun6MANRQ6MANRZ847pzxLCe6cxLDm6cxLDo6cxLDs8zf7zzNbo8zu7zzHfYE6zHfZd8zG7zzHQ3F8zI7zzJIoX6zJIkL8zN7zzJZcY8zA7zzKpUN8zL7zzK4EX

Obviously there are a couple set ups here. The first bar I have set up is more of the single target dps look, although Energy/Power Overload can be used for AoE as heavy attacks have splash damage. The second Bar you have is for your AoE trash mobs. I personally like plain old restraining prison, I like the additional snare that it provides, but if you prefer the Shattering version then by all means go for it. I am not sure how well the damage scales with it though. Absorption field is very powerful for AoE as well, as not only do you get the healing from the field it self, but it also procs Blood Magic as well for effect it dispels. Sadly it does not share the healing with your group, but none the less still very useful.

A few tips:

1. From what I can understand (and I still need to test or have someone test it for me) Rally and Surge will stack, which Is why I slotted each on different bars. You can put them on the same bar if you do not favor weapon switching, but I find it more convenient to have it this way. As far as persisting through weapon swap, Critical Surge will always persist, no matter if your second weapon is the same type or a different type, because it is a class ability. Rally, however, will persist ONLY if your second weapon is a 2H due to the fact it is a weapon specific ability. So, if you are rolling with two 2H weapons, with everything active you are looking at a 21% increase to weapon damage + Critical Surge increase to weapon damage + an additional 2% every two seconds, for about 20 seconds. Seems legit. Not to mention, decent self healing with a respectable amount of critical rating.

2. What's with Boundless Storm/Ball of Lightning? Think of these as your "OH POO" buttons. If you prefer one over the other, I see no problem slotting that one skill on both bars. I like having both slotted, Boundless Storm for AoE to allow you re-position your self easily for a properly placed Restraining Prison or Absorption. Ball of Lightning so you can easily escape getting hit with what would feel like a wet bag of hammers by a boss.

3. Endless/Mage's Fury vs. Crystal Fragments: This is a personal choice really. I slotted Fury, but honestly I would probably go with Crystal Fragments, simply because it can Proc off of Ball of Lightning, offering DPS for you while you are at range and closing in. Also, the Fury is best for a low health target, which if you are smart, you will be spamming Executioner anyways. Morale of the story, I am an idiot, just go with Crystal Fragments.

I realize this isn't a summon heavy build. I am just not a huge fan of the pets truly (this is just from a play style standpoint, not whether or not they are under-powered). Just wanted to offer you something that might catch your eye.

If anyone reading this has a disagreement or evidence that something I mention will OR will not work, please please please feel free to post your thoughts.

Happy Hunting!

Halrloprillalar · May 2014

As a VR2 "glass cannon" mage sorc, I will offer my tips (but obviously I don't have 'battlemage' experience):

-pets: AI and scaling is terrible, other than restoring twilight (magika regen) they are not really useful in high end content. Early on, the clannfear can be handy to offtank things for you, but otherwise it's a waste of skillpoints. Sadly you need them to level the tree so you can get bound armor - a must if you want to be a 'melee sorc' in at least part light armor.

-armor: heavy is obviously best for survival, but it gives you crap for regen/max magika. You can either mix and match, or rely on various buffs (bound armor and lightning form, although the latter is temporary and expensive to maintain constantly), depending on how much magika regen you need.

-abilities... this is a matter of choice, but if you are going to use a lot of weapon damage you can't not pick up surge (stormcalling), which is pretty amazing, but again, expensive to maintain up all the time. Aoe, again is all in the storm calling tree, with a minor option (daedric curse) in summoning.

-weapons... again lots of choices, but not many are all that viable. You may want to use a destro staff with pulsar to synergize your elemental damage buffs and spell pen etc. Sword and board, while giving nice survivability, does nothing in terms of skill synergy with sorc abilities. A resto staff as your off-weapon is near essential since sorcs have almost no self-healing. I have also seen bow sorcs, which is fairly viable but you won't be able to make the most of your spells in medium armor, or the most of your weapon damage in light armor - again a matter of picking what you like more. Lastly, there are also 2h and dw sorcs - I haven't played either so can't say much other than that surge, again, is your best friend for weapon damage, but light armor is counter productive for it and medium will gimp your regen.

So, TL;DR, a melee sorc is possible and probably viable, but you will not be able to maximize BOTH weapon and class skill damage with a single build. Choose what you like more and go from there.

LadyChaos · May 2014

We can do quite a bit of damage mitigation light armor with bound armor and lihtning form, even the light armor active (I don't think it's worth it IMO for 3rd def slot), but If MT type roll you are aiming at I've seen most sorcy recomend heavy for it... IDK how they manage their Mag and DD without light armor to keep aggro, but they seem to do it.

I tried full heavy for 2 days in my 20s I was miserable swore to never attempt again. I do a bit of OT in light armor but I cannot advise on vet dungeon content for it, only able to say in PvP and vet overland PvE the light armor is plenty IMO with lightning form/bound.

Fruity_Ninja · May 2014

jbrenston wrote: »

In your case I would advise using a sword and shield simply because that weapon combo has (at least one) skill(s) used to taunt mobs. From what I can tell there really aren't that many 'agroo holding' weapon skills. As for as class abilities, I'd say use anything that ofers CC and boosts you defense or armor rating. There are things like Lightning Form that briefly increases your armor as well as Bound Armor, which is a toggled skill at also increases armor. There are also many traps and stuns in both dark magic and summoning that can be used for CC. Also look into using some of the Undaunted and Fighter Guilds skill that are gear towards boosted defense and mitigating damage.

Thankyou for your response. Definately very helpful

One question. Lightning Form and Bound Armor? Which one is better and why? Do they make light armor feasible for a tanky character, or their armor boost isn't that substantial?

Fruity_Ninja · May 2014

Solomon_Cato wrote: »

A few tips:

1. From what I can understand (and I still need to test or have someone test it for me) Rally and Surge will stack, which Is why I slotted each on different bars. You can put them on the same bar if you do not favor weapon switching, but I find it more convenient to have it this way. As far as persisting through weapon swap, Critical Surge will always persist, no matter if your second weapon is the same type or a different type, because it is a class ability. Rally, however, will persist ONLY if your second weapon is a 2H due to the fact it is a weapon specific ability. So, if you are rolling with two 2H weapons, with everything active you are looking at a 21% increase to weapon damage + Critical Surge increase to weapon damage + an additional 2% every two seconds, for about 20 seconds. Seems legit. Not to mention, decent self healing with a respectable amount of critical rating.

2. What's with Boundless Storm/Ball of Lightning? Think of these as your "OH POO" buttons. If you prefer one over the other, I see no problem slotting that one skill on both bars. I like having both slotted, Boundless Storm for AoE to allow you re-position your self easily for a properly placed Restraining Prison or Absorption. Ball of Lightning so you can easily escape getting hit with what would feel like a wet bag of hammers by a boss.

3. Endless/Mage's Fury vs. Crystal Fragments: This is a personal choice really. I slotted Fury, but honestly I would probably go with Crystal Fragments, simply because it can Proc off of Ball of Lightning, offering DPS for you while you are at range and closing in. Also, the Fury is best for a low health target, which if you are smart, you will be spamming Executioner anyways. Morale of the story, I am an idiot, just go with Crystal Fragments.

I realize this isn't a summon heavy build. I am just not a huge fan of the pets truly (this is just from a play style standpoint, not whether or not they are under-powered). Just wanted to offer you something that might catch your eye.

That's fantastic, thankyou so much for your response

I like point number 1. I actually love weapon switching, as part of my current DK build I use Igneous Weapons on one bar and Spiked Armor on the other. It allows me to always have both activated, no matter what bar I use, and still have 4 other skills to play with on each bar. I will look at this and consider more in depth. The idea of a 2H for both bars is what I was initially leaning towards in the first place.

Fruity_Ninja · May 2014

Halrloprillalar wrote: »

-pets: AI and scaling is terrible, other than restoring twilight (magika regen) they are not really useful in high end content. Early on, the clannfear can be handy to offtank things for you, but otherwise it's a waste of skillpoints. Sadly you need them to level the tree so you can get bound armor - a must if you want to be a 'melee sorc' in at least part light armor.

-armor: heavy is obviously best for survival, but it gives you crap for regen/max magika. You can either mix and match, or rely on various buffs (bound armor and lightning form, although the latter is temporary and expensive to maintain constantly), depending on how much magika regen you need.

-abilities... this is a matter of choice, but if you are going to use a lot of weapon damage you can't not pick up surge (stormcalling), which is pretty amazing, but again, expensive to maintain up all the time. Aoe, again is all in the storm calling tree, with a minor option (daedric curse) in summoning.

-weapons... again lots of choices, but not many are all that viable. You may want to use a destro staff with pulsar to synergize your elemental damage buffs and spell pen etc. Sword and board, while giving nice survivability, does nothing in terms of skill synergy with sorc abilities. A resto staff as your off-weapon is near essential since sorcs have almost no self-healing. I have also seen bow sorcs, which is fairly viable but you won't be able to make the most of your spells in medium armor, or the most of your weapon damage in light armor - again a matter of picking what you like more. Lastly, there are also 2h and dw sorcs - I haven't played either so can't say much other than that surge, again, is your best friend for weapon damage, but light armor is counter productive for it and medium will gimp your regen.

Thanks for your input

I was worried about the pets being a little underpowered. It just seems like the other 2 skill trees are the better ones in general. So ideally, use the clanfear to level up Daedric Summoning until I unlocked Bound Armor? I guess that would require a move away from actually summoning pets...sort of does kill the RP I was trying to do. But at the same time I really really don't want a crap build that makes it impossible to solo hard bosses on...

Just regarding your point on the heavy armor. I had a thought pop into my head yesterday. Originally I thought I could go 5 bits of heavy armor and 2 bits of light armor. But then I thought- what about if I go 2 bits of heavy armor, and I make that heavy armor the body and legs? This would provide the most maximal armor for 2 bits of heavy armor. I could then still get all the light armor bonuses and passives for wearing 5 bits of light armor? Coupled with Bound Armor and/or Lightning Form, would that then make me tanky enough?

Solomon_Cato · May 2014

As for bound armaments, from a dps standpoint it will definitely add survivability to your build. I'm not sure if armaments will soft cap you with 5m/2l, I know bound aegis will. Definitely should be soft capped with armaments plus lightning form active. Expensive to maintain, but you should pick and choose your spots to use lightning form anyways, as with any skill really.

LadyChaos · May 2014

Fruity_Ninja wrote: »

jbrenston wrote: »

In your case I would advise using a sword and shield simply because that weapon combo has (at least one) skill(s) used to taunt mobs. From what I can tell there really aren't that many 'agroo holding' weapon skills. As for as class abilities, I'd say use anything that ofers CC and boosts you defense or armor rating. There are things like Lightning Form that briefly increases your armor as well as Bound Armor, which is a toggled skill at also increases armor. There are also many traps and stuns in both dark magic and summoning that can be used for CC. Also look into using some of the Undaunted and Fighter Guilds skill that are gear towards boosted defense and mitigating damage.

Thankyou for your response. Definately very helpful

One question. Lightning Form and Bound Armor? Which one is better and why? Do they make light armor feasible for a tanky character, or their armor boost isn't that substantial?

IMO Lightning armor > bound

(VR2) Thundering pres IV (240mag-full mag redux + 7 piece light armor) =
- 1751 armor AND spell resists for 9s +AoE 39 shock damage/second (stacks with altmer)
(VR2) Bound Armor III (Toggle) =
- 650 Armor

I'm overmaxed with just the lightning. With Bound you have to have 1 slot per bar if you always want it up, but if you run out of mag you lose your resist with Lightning. With just bound you are in orange for both in most cases, just lightning puts you WAY over. I went with short term resist burst for short periods of time tanking ie lightning. If I need to tank something much longer than 9-18s... I'm likely already working on my exit strategy.

Fruity_Ninja · May 2014

Wow...that's some massive armor boost there. So technically a full light armor load out can be tanky, with these skills?. That's good to know...

Does anyone have thoughts on my idea about the chest/legs being the 2 heavy pieces of armor. And the other 5 pieces being light for all the passive magicka boosts. Is that a good idea, or am I totally off the mark?

LadyChaos · May 2014

Fruity_Ninja wrote: »

Wow...that's some massive armor boost there. So technically a full light armor load out can be tanky, with these skills?. That's good to know...

Does anyone have thoughts on my idea about the chest/legs being the 2 heavy pieces of armor. And the other 5 pieces being light for all the passive magicka boosts. Is that a good idea, or am I totally off the mark?

I played with this for a while too. I personally could not trade the ~30% magicka cost reduction (which has no soft cap that we know of atm), nor the bypass enemy resistance (final light armor passive) for dps because I use a lot of bolt, and lightning form, which both can be magica pigs without that full reduction (when used heavily). I think if you do not need/use bolt so heavily nor have a problem with a higher cost of lightning it would be very viable IMO. It wasn't for me. Others might have different opinions of course.

Fruity_Ninja · May 2014

Nice, thankyou for the info.

What sort of stat breakup Mag-Health-Stam do you guys go for?