timestamp? Or could someone run a TL;DW?

This was a very good video I was watching it while I was writing my forum post he hit the nail on the head and I personally applaud him and all the content creators because if they weren’t here then I wouldn’t be the player that I am today they take the time to educate the player base and he is exactly correct with big sweeping changes like this they have to spend their time to update everything and still have time to play the game and I completely understand this kills their joy of the game

Drammanoth wrote: »

vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »

drsalvation wrote: »

timestamp? Or could someone run a TL;DW?

The largest PC carry discord has ceased operations due to the mass exodus of end-game players which is a result of the ridiculous U35 changes.

And also because Nefas is tired of being called names, slurs, as well as the outright stupidity and - uh, hate this word, as it has become a cliche of sorts, but... - toxicity of some people who can't see beyond what is written.

Yup and thats on ZOS. He says that hes always gotten hate but the last week has been on a level he has never seen before. And honestly it can be traced back to that U35 preview blog. They made the endgamers scapegoats.

chessalavakia_ESO wrote: »

Generally speaking, for longer videos it would be helpful to provide a summary so people can decide if it's something they want to invest the time in and view in full.

From the text I skimmed, the video might be the best promotion for Update 35 I've seen yet.

Either people (myself included) are wrong about the update or, it will take out most of the Carry Services which screw up the economy and makes a dent in raiding which may not be large enough to survive said dent.

He actually goes over this in the video. The constant churn of changes to the game, the nerfs and such. Its burnt out the endgamers. Theyre tired of working hard to adapt to the changes every 3-6 months only for their work to be undone as short as 2-3 months later. Nefas talks about another content creator giving up on making build videos because by the time the poor guy got the video out (after countless hours of testing and recording) ZOS had already undone the work in the next patch. Its just not feasible to keep an active and healthy endgame community constantly churning like that.

This change also effectively neuters these carry services the endgamers were offering to low skilled players. These carry services were already begging to disappear because of the constant churn but this recent update will shutter one of the last two carry groups that remained.

p00tx wrote: »

Carry services are actually really good for the economy. It's one of the few ways to provide a gold sink for massive amounts of gold so you don't get people just sitting on insane amounts of ingame wealth with nothing to spend it on. It's good for Zos too because those of us who do the carries turn around and dump the gold we earn into buying from crown sellers who have to initially buy their crowns from Zos.

That not how gold sinks work.Gold sinks are ways to make gold disappear from server completely,like buying from NPC vendor,list cost,part of the "sales taxes",etc.You are just talking about shifing gold from one person to another,not really helping the economy.

watch the whole video, he makes some really good points, comes off as someone who really just enjoys the game for what it is, he's just speaking from his heart....Cheers Mate

vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »

The largest PC carry discord has ceased operations due to the mass exodus of end-game players which is a result of the ridiculous U35 changes.

So, a carry discord ceased operating?

I call that a great thing.

If you want to improve yourself, great. If you want to pay for someone to carry you, as a commercial enterprise within the game, I call that bad.

YMMV.

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Whether you agree with people paying for carries or not, an Entire Community are helping people (Even transactionally) do endgame Content, that community is disbanding, which means even less people will be getting those sweet sweet clears.

But it's ok because Zos is making the End Game more Accessible right? That's whole point of this Patch Right?

Your 'logic' is falling on deaf ears. I hate the 'carry' guilds/groups/whatever in every MMO, including ESO. I think it's bad for the game in every instance. Period.

You are allowed to have your opinion, and I can have mine.

When is Starfield coming out?

mavfin wrote: »

Mr_Stach wrote: »

Whether you agree with people paying for carries or not, an Entire Community are helping people (Even transactionally) do endgame Content, that community is disbanding, which means even less people will be getting those sweet sweet clears.

But it's ok because Zos is making the End Game more Accessible right? That's whole point of this Patch Right?

Your 'logic' is falling on deaf ears. I hate the 'carry' guilds/groups/whatever in every MMO, including ESO. I think it's bad for the game in every instance. Period.

You are allowed to have your opinion, and I can have mine.

I know I won't convince you, but I do feel moved to say that I think that binary thinking is limited and often doesn't consider nuanced scenarios.

ESO is an older, mature MMORPG that pumps out content. Back when Craglorn was released, newer players could spend hours or weeks or months beating the new trials, and that that was a good thing, because there was no more 12 man content after that. Carries arguably would not have been great for the game, because people would advance through the content without learning how to play the game, and then have nothing else to keep their interest. They'd leave before ZOS could release more content to keep them playing (and hopefully subscribing). Today, there are eleven 12 man trials to complete, and we get a new one every year. Is it so bad that talented and skilled players are kept engaged in the game and can earn gold through those skills by helping other players, most of whom will NEVER invest the years of time it would take to tackle the trials on their own? People who want to hone their skills and play at that level, will still do so, but I'm not sure who it's harming to have a community of folks who like to challenge themselves by carrying others. While performing the carries they are also teaching others, exposing folks to content, discovering bugs in content which they may report, serving as role models for some of the folks being carried who might see the skill and decide to try and learn how to play that well....

To me, it's sad if we can't find value in all the different kinds of ESO players. Some people try to play all content, and some people only like certain things. ESO is an MMORPG that requires, over all else, a community to thrive, so the absolute worst thing for the game is people quitting. The world becoming a ghost town. The servers will not be maintained if five players are left running around in it. The world of carries grew in ESO as ESO grew and expanded, as many nuanced layers of skill between "brand new player" and "leaderboard end game player" emerged. Players with true skill (like Nefas!) are known by their deeds. That some folks are carried through content he's beaten many times doesn't detract from his accomplishments or skill. He knows that. The story here is that members of the community are leaving. Again. And, the thing to keep in mind is that ESO community members are not in buckets like some weird Venn diagram with no intersections. Some people who do carries... also create content. Participate in the random dungeon queue. Play in non-carry trials and mentor newer players. Play PvP. Jump in Elsweyr and slay dragons. Check out ToT. It is bad for ESO - bad for all of us - if a segment of the community has a mass exodus. Regardless of whether those folks are primarily tagged as "role players" or "PvP'ers" or "end gamers who run carries." Because labels are too simple and divisive and a person can do more than one thing in our community. If they all go, we'll have no community left.

mavfin wrote: »

vivisectvib16_ESO wrote: »

The largest PC carry discord has ceased operations due to the mass exodus of end-game players which is a result of the ridiculous U35 changes.

So, a carry discord ceased operating?

I call that a great thing.

If you want to improve yourself, great. If you want to pay for someone to carry you, as a commercial enterprise within the game, I call that bad.

YMMV.

To clarify for those that did not watch the video. The largest carry service (OMC) shut down, meaning both the customers and carriers will have to use the 2nd largest (and last big one remaining). Nefas happens to be the leader of this guild, Semp, and stands to make millions if not billions of gold from this situation, but he clearly cares more about players and the community than about profit.

Carries will undoubtedly continue. There will be more demand as progression groups give up hope, and less supply as fewer groups are able to perform carries. I'm sure prices will increase, and those looking for gear or achievements will need to wait longer for the service. I don't really see any winners in this scenario.

p00tx wrote: »

Mixalis966 wrote: »

Pve carry ceasing to exist will be a good minor cleanse for the community.No more people having achievements they dont deserve and no more content being so easy people can carry others for money.Most of them were doing account sharing so i do not feel anything for them.If they need damage disproportionately high and left because of a patch that didn't make it to live yet whatever.The community won't be blackmailed by people that look after their own interests.

So, speaking as someone who actually has all of the trial achievements, I've never had an issue with seeing buyers wear the titles. It doesn't diminish my own accomplishments in the slightest. If you have that much gold, you're endgame in some capacity, even if it's not trials, so you've earned it. I don't understand the nastiness toward carriers though. Seems really harsh for no reason.

Couldn't agree more. Don't understand people gatekeeping content from others, helping people and getting paid, what's to complain about.

And the implications of the video are much bigger than the headline. It indicates a massive brain drain, thousands of hours of concentrated veteran experience evaporated from the game. Who is going to help the next generation of end-gamers?

People who get their undies in a wad over carries annoy the heck out of me to such an unfathomable degree. It reinforces a false idea that there's only one endgame is it's PvE DPS. What if I'm a PvP player with maxed PvP achievements, wearing grand overlord rank next to my Merciless BG title, but I don't care about PvE? What if I don't care to get good at PvE because that's not why I play ESO? Do I need to get good and spend months getting gear and perfecting PvE DPS to get a skin from, say Scalecaller Peak? No. I don't. I may have millions of gold sitting around from converting AP and Tel Var to gold and I'd like to pay people who are good enough at what they do to be able to monetize it, I walk away with a skin that covers up my vampirism and they walk away 4mil gold richer (or however much they charge now).

What if I'm an RP player who's invested hundreds of hours writing and stylizing my character and participating in and creating unique player and community driven stories for my characters? Do I need to invest months of time to learn how to PvE DPS and spend time farming sets in dungeons and trials so that I can earn my Worm Wizard personality? No. I don't. I may have millions of gold sitting around from selling furnishing recipes and flipping items on guild traders and I'd like to pay people who are good enough at what they do to be able to monetize it, I walk away with a personality that fits my necromancer OC and they walk away 4mil gold richer (or however much they charge now).

There's more than one endgame and I have the ability to do with my gold and my time what I want to, and people who can sell carries should absolutely be able to. There's absolutely nothing about PvE that really excites me. I strive to get my dps as high as I can so that my group clears fast when I queue for a random normal for transmutes, but nothing about whacking dummies and pushing 100k to scorepush or earn PvE achievements really entices me and that's not why I play ESO. I will gladly, and have on many occasions, patronize carriers if I really want or need something from content that I can't complete with a PUG because I don't have a group I run PvE with because that's not the area of the game I invest my time in.