No children in Tamriel?

NotaDaedraWorshipper · February 2022

I can cook all manner of food and even make booze in a bowl over a fire.
The booze doesn't even make me drunk
Metal ore are just lying on the surface and just need some pokes to be mined.
The largest cities of Tamriel are just a few houses and with a population of max a dozen or so.
Imperials and bretons uses the same style on furniture, just using different coloured wood.
A bloodfiend vampire can ride a zombie horse, followed by a vampire monster dog and no one bats an eye.
There are barely any outhouses, chamber pots (except the portable ones every other npc carries) etc
Valenwood can barely count as a forest and I could find a better one by just taking a walk outside.
Something something tiny provinces
etc

It can go on. This is an MMORPG. It has a lot of limits and requires suspension of disbelief because it would be impossible to have everything that actually exist in the world. We know non-adult children exist. They are referenced a lot in the game. Children barely exist in the singleplayer games. Like Skyrim have just a few (who are considered some of the most annoying npcs in the game to boot).

Would it be nice for immersion and even in stories? Yes, but so would a lot of other things too so it doesn't bother me. There are far worse things for that. It's probably also easier and safer for ZOS not to add them, considering what players would do them even if they were unkillable, using emotes and such.

ShawnLaRock · February 2022

LalMirchi wrote: »

As a grandparent with many children, numerous pets, painful lego bits and half-chewed bones that hurts my feets I applaud this enterprise for leaving out children in the general gameplay.

Paradoxically I love my in-game pets.

Caltrops is the Lego Bits On The Floor skill of ESO - and now every time I see it used, I am going to shake my fist at the pesky whipper-snappers for cluttering the ground with it.

S.

SilverBride · February 2022

Answer: This feature could become a catalyst for inappropriate behavior and create problems for Zenimax.

Question: What is "Why aren't there any children in ESO?".

WhiteCoatSyndrome · February 2022

Dean340 wrote: »

why are there no outhouses in Tamriel?

Because the people of Tamriel use buckets instead.

(I’m serious; someone asked about bathroom facilities during a livestream a few years ago.)

Leftover_Pizza · February 2022

WoW has them since day 1. Never was a problem there, never seen one killed or digitally abused. Even has an annual weekly event; Children's Week.

I don't see why they couldn't be in ESO.

SilverBride · February 2022

Leftover_Pizza wrote: »

WoW has them since day 1. Never was a problem there, never seen one killed or digitally abused. Even has an annual weekly event; Children's Week.

I don't see why they couldn't be in ESO.

Not seeing it doesn't mean it didn't or wouldn't happen. It's a can of worms best left unopened.

Lugaldu · February 2022

It would be a lot stranger if children suddenly showed up - would they all suddenly come home from boarding school?

WhiteCoatSyndrome · February 2022

Lugaldu wrote: »

It would be a lot stranger if children suddenly showed up - would they all suddenly come home from boarding school?

No stranger than adding a new Dungeon entrance and pretending it was always there, and that happens twice a year.

etchedpixels · February 2022

Nelyawyn wrote: »

Remember when they added children to Skyrim and modders instantly made "killable children" mods? I'm guessing that may have influenced the decision process.

Not without the use of a time machine as far as I can see.

ESO has unkillable other things - it's really annoying that you can blow up goats and squirrels but I can't POTL a cat.

Kimda · February 2022

It's even more spooky having children toys, cradles, etc everywhere but no children at all. They have all just disappeared. Maybe they all have been eaten? Bosmers have found them being tasty?

Sylvermynx · February 2022

Perfectly happy with no brats in game.

spartaxoxo · February 2022

Danikat wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Even if you make the children unkillable, there always seems to be an endless supply of players that will do emotes and other movements that will look lewd "for the lulz". [snip] No one cares if you do it in a solo Skyrim instance. But children in ESO would introduce lots of opportunities for bad PR that ZOS probably does not want to deal with.

Is this a problem in other MMOs with children? Or are people who bring it up as a possibility assuming ESO players are more immature than players in other games?

I can't remember ever seeing anything like this in Guild Wars 1 or 2 (both of which have children), but there's a lot of MMOs I've never played, so maybe I've been lucky with the ones I've chosen.

[edited to remove quote]

I have never once heard of a single scandal related to having children npcs in an mmo. Can anyone even name that actually happening even once?

Because to me it sounds like a total fabrication to me.

I could see an extremely small amount of players getting suspended for isolated incidents. But a PR nightmare for having a small amount of unkillable kids? Really?

I think a lot of people just don't want kids in the game and are making that up as excuse personally. I think this pearl clutching about fake children is being greatly exaggerated.

Arunei · February 2022

Just because something isn't shown doesn't mean it doesn't exist. The game already suffers enough from different problems, we don't need a bunch of NPCs flagged as essential spouting even more annoying repetitive lines bogging down the code.

Mojmir · February 2022

Hell no, as it should be

SilverBride · February 2022

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Even if you make the children unkillable, there always seems to be an endless supply of players that will do emotes and other movements that will look lewd "for the lulz". [snip] No one cares if you do it in a solo Skyrim instance. But children in ESO would introduce lots of opportunities for bad PR that ZOS probably does not want to deal with.

Is this a problem in other MMOs with children? Or are people who bring it up as a possibility assuming ESO players are more immature than players in other games?

I can't remember ever seeing anything like this in Guild Wars 1 or 2 (both of which have children), but there's a lot of MMOs I've never played, so maybe I've been lucky with the ones I've chosen.

[edited to remove quote]

I have never once heard of a single scandal related to having children npcs in an mmo. Can anyone even name that actually happening even once?

Because to me it sounds like a total fabrication to me.

I could see an extremely small amount of players getting suspended for isolated incidents. But a PR nightmare for having a small amount of unkillable kids? Really?

I think a lot of people just don't want kids in the game and are making that up as excuse personally. I think this pearl clutching about fake children is being greatly exaggerated.

I've heard zone chat and know how vile some players can be. We don't need to introduce children to this game and open up the possibility for even more inappropriate behavior. We've gotten along for 8 years without them, and I honestly never even noticed their absence. We should leave well enough alone.

guarstompemoji · February 2022

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Even if you make the children unkillable, there always seems to be an endless supply of players that will do emotes and other movements that will look lewd "for the lulz". [snip] No one cares if you do it in a solo Skyrim instance. But children in ESO would introduce lots of opportunities for bad PR that ZOS probably does not want to deal with.

Is this a problem in other MMOs with children? Or are people who bring it up as a possibility assuming ESO players are more immature than players in other games?

I can't remember ever seeing anything like this in Guild Wars 1 or 2 (both of which have children), but there's a lot of MMOs I've never played, so maybe I've been lucky with the ones I've chosen.

[edited to remove quote]

I have never once heard of a single scandal related to having children npcs in an mmo. Can anyone even name that actually happening even once?

Because to me it sounds like a total fabrication to me.

I could see an extremely small amount of players getting suspended for isolated incidents. But a PR nightmare for having a small amount of unkillable kids? Really?

I think a lot of people just don't want kids in the game and are making that up as excuse personally. I think this pearl clutching about fake children is being greatly exaggerated.

Have personally run into the creeps. Have personally had to boot multiple ones from servers. It went beyond them say, trying to murder children--it went full on to them trying to have uhm, relations with them. Or, arguing that "this character is a fully grown woman! ...who looks like a child, acts like a child, dresses like a child, and uwu you big strong man..."

It's an issue in a variety of games--look up some of the "fun" stories around 'child-like, female halflings' and then head for the churnbucket.

Or, pass by a wall of missing children's photos, sometime. Realize how many are little girls vs little boys, and spend another few days by the churnbucket. Stuff like this is right in front of us; most don't know, or know to acknowledge, the cues.

But back to games: yeah, seen it happen. No, don't want to deal with it, and don't look up those stories if you still want some faith in humanity.

spartaxoxo · February 2022

guarstompemoji wrote: »

But back to games: yeah, seen it happen. No, don't want to deal with it, and don't look up those stories if you still want some faith in humanity.

I am not talking about a few individuals that it's good to root out and permanently ban anyway or real life kids.

I am talking about a pr nightmare for a video game company because they included kids in appropriate ways. Like people actually protesting WoW or something.

spartaxoxo · February 2022

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

Danikat wrote: »

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

Even if you make the children unkillable, there always seems to be an endless supply of players that will do emotes and other movements that will look lewd "for the lulz". [snip] No one cares if you do it in a solo Skyrim instance. But children in ESO would introduce lots of opportunities for bad PR that ZOS probably does not want to deal with.

Is this a problem in other MMOs with children? Or are people who bring it up as a possibility assuming ESO players are more immature than players in other games?

I can't remember ever seeing anything like this in Guild Wars 1 or 2 (both of which have children), but there's a lot of MMOs I've never played, so maybe I've been lucky with the ones I've chosen.

[edited to remove quote]

I have never once heard of a single scandal related to having children npcs in an mmo. Can anyone even name that actually happening even once?

Because to me it sounds like a total fabrication to me.

I could see an extremely small amount of players getting suspended for isolated incidents. But a PR nightmare for having a small amount of unkillable kids? Really?

I think a lot of people just don't want kids in the game and are making that up as excuse personally. I think this pearl clutching about fake children is being greatly exaggerated.

I've heard zone chat and know how vile some players can be. We don't need to introduce children to this game and open up the possibility for even more inappropriate behavior. We've gotten along for 8 years without them, and I honestly never even noticed their absence. We should leave well enough alone.

Permanently ban the minority of offenders, who I wouldn't want on this game interacting with actual real life minors anyway.

It wouldn't happen often because it doesn't happen often in mmos that have them.

I'm not naive enough to think it would literally never happen, but it's better those people are permanently banned anyway. And the overwhelmingly vast majority of people would be appropriate as is the case with other games. And we wouldn't keep getting this bizarre writing of characters clearly meant to be kids but they are adult npcs.

SilverBride · February 2022

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I've heard zone chat and know how vile some players can be. We don't need to introduce children to this game and open up the possibility for even more inappropriate behavior. We've gotten along for 8 years without them, and I honestly never even noticed their absence. We should leave well enough alone.

Permanently ban the minority of offenders, who I wouldn't want on this game interacting with actual real life minors anyway.

It wouldn't happen often because it doesn't happen often in mmos that have them.

I'm not naive enough to think it would literally never happen, but it's better those people are permanently banned anyway. And the overwhelmingly vast majority of people would be appropriate as is the case with other games. And we wouldn't keep getting this bizarre writing of characters clearly meant to be kids but they are adult npcs.

I can't think of a single character I've run into that are meant to be kids but are adults.

Sylvermynx · February 2022

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I've heard zone chat and know how vile some players can be. We don't need to introduce children to this game and open up the possibility for even more inappropriate behavior. We've gotten along for 8 years without them, and I honestly never even noticed their absence. We should leave well enough alone.

Permanently ban the minority of offenders, who I wouldn't want on this game interacting with actual real life minors anyway.

It wouldn't happen often because it doesn't happen often in mmos that have them.

I'm not naive enough to think it would literally never happen, but it's better those people are permanently banned anyway. And the overwhelmingly vast majority of people would be appropriate as is the case with other games. And we wouldn't keep getting this bizarre writing of characters clearly meant to be kids but they are adult npcs.

I can't think of a single character I've run into that are meant to be kids but are adults.

Me either. But then, I don't do every quest in every zone....

guarstompemoji · February 2022

spartaxoxo wrote: »

guarstompemoji wrote: »

But back to games: yeah, seen it happen. No, don't want to deal with it, and don't look up those stories if you still want some faith in humanity.

I am not talking about a few individuals...

I wish that it was, and I agree with you. People like that need perma-banned. Unfortunately, many seem to think it's a small issue

...and I don't blame you, or anyone else who thinks so. At all. Stuff like this is, at its core, so awful that to protect us, the mind doesn't want to deal with twisted stuff like this. We naturally downplay it and shut it down. A certain well-known photo wall of missing children is walked by every day by hundreds of people, but who truly looks at it enough to notice the trend? This is a tiny minority, isn't it?

Within a certain unnamed place, a report of child abuse is made every 10 seconds. There are over 4 mil referrals made each year to protection agencies as a result of abuse.

It's true too, someone might argue, "but that's RL; it doesn't mean there's that many in just a game." Well, I ran gaming communities for two decades. Communities where a person wouldn't expect to run into things like that.

The mind so much doesn't want to deal with the reality that I could quote a dad whose brain was in full denial mode, who argued, "Well, he's better...he should get another chance."

"...he logged in to use a kid's gaming community as essentially a dating service, and he has a police record. We also have testimony."

"Still...I heard he's improved. We should give him a chance. Surely it wasn't that bad?"

The creeps aren't a majority, but...there are unfortunately more than we like to realize, or the brain likes to process.

It is also one of the least fun things to have to mod within a game.

If anything else, we ought to think of the mental, emotional health of any mods forced to deal with this. It's scarring, and when you boot one, there's another creepo taking their place.

spartaxoxo · February 2022

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I've heard zone chat and know how vile some players can be. We don't need to introduce children to this game and open up the possibility for even more inappropriate behavior. We've gotten along for 8 years without them, and I honestly never even noticed their absence. We should leave well enough alone.

Permanently ban the minority of offenders, who I wouldn't want on this game interacting with actual real life minors anyway.

It wouldn't happen often because it doesn't happen often in mmos that have them.

I'm not naive enough to think it would literally never happen, but it's better those people are permanently banned anyway. And the overwhelmingly vast majority of people would be appropriate as is the case with other games. And we wouldn't keep getting this bizarre writing of characters clearly meant to be kids but they are adult npcs.

I can't think of a single character I've run into that are meant to be kids but are adults.

For example in Murkmire there's an Argonian woman that wants to be a mom and lets another woman do experiments on eggs that won't hatch. The result is they quickly turn into adult zombies and die and are a danger. But at the end of the quest you find a one who isn't as affected by the serum and she decides to raise it. She vows to be a good mother and raise her child well, even though it has special needs.

The serum sped up developers so the character definitely shouldn't be a little kid but it definitely shouldn't have been an adult zombie corpse like all the other ones either.

Then there's the mom you help find her lost son, but he's a grown man and she's just being overprotective.

The Dragonguard girl sounds and acts like she's around 16-17 but she's a grown woman, so does that ambition girl Callia in Blackwood. But the latter is more acceptable as an adult since she was a shut-in.

We also gather stuff for orphans for writs but there are no actual children anywhere.

estelrandir · February 2022

Hey, Siri, play No Children by The Mountain Goats.

But honestly, until reading this thread, I never even noticed the absence of the children. It's really not that big of a deal. I'm ambivalent on adding them back in, but it sounds like there's a good argument against it.

spartaxoxo · February 2022

guarstompemoji wrote: »

if anything else, we ought to think of the mental, emotional health of any mods forced to deal with this. It's scarring, and when you boot one, there's another creepo taking their place.

Again, I am not trying to discuss real world child abuse. It's just not an appropriate topic for this forum and there's no way I could discuss that topic with the severity it deserves on here.

And we're not talking about predation of real children, we are talking about people being openly and obviously this type of evil to npcs. That is much more rare than actual child abuse, because the power over a real child is not there. And because a lot of those creeps hide who they are. The ones that can't even do that are easily banned for life and it's better these creepy sick pieces of garbage aren't a part of our community anyway. Kick them out. They don't belong here. They shouldn't be around the actual minors they are interacting with now. Get rid of each and every person that did that. Delete their account and throw away any restoration key.

SilverBride · February 2022

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I've heard zone chat and know how vile some players can be. We don't need to introduce children to this game and open up the possibility for even more inappropriate behavior. We've gotten along for 8 years without them, and I honestly never even noticed their absence. We should leave well enough alone.

Permanently ban the minority of offenders, who I wouldn't want on this game interacting with actual real life minors anyway.

It wouldn't happen often because it doesn't happen often in mmos that have them.

I'm not naive enough to think it would literally never happen, but it's better those people are permanently banned anyway. And the overwhelmingly vast majority of people would be appropriate as is the case with other games. And we wouldn't keep getting this bizarre writing of characters clearly meant to be kids but they are adult npcs.

I can't think of a single character I've run into that are meant to be kids but are adults.

For example in Murkmire there's an Argonian woman that wants to be a mom and lets another woman do experiments on eggs that won't hatch. The result is they quickly turn into adult zombies and die and are a danger. But at the end of the quest you find a one who isn't as affected by the serum and she decides to raise it. She vows to be a good mother and raise her child well, even though it has special needs.

The serum sped up developers so the character definitely shouldn't be a little kid but it definitely shouldn't have been an adult zombie corpse like all the other ones either.

Then there's the mom you help find her lost son, but he's a grown man and she's just being overprotective.

The Dragonguard girl sounds and acts like she's around 16-17 but she's a grown woman, so does that ambition girl Callia in Blackwood. But the latter is more acceptable as an adult since she was a shut-in.

We also gather stuff for orphans for writs but there are no actual children anywhere.

I appreciate that you took the time to point those out but I don't see any of these as children. What is being suggested is that we should have children, obvious children, playing in the towns etc.. I cannot agree to this.

Tenthirty2 · February 2022

Oh there's children in Tamriel, just watch the zone chat scroll. Some days there are many...

SpacemanSpiff1 · February 2022

the game is rated M. no kids allowed

spartaxoxo · February 2022

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

spartaxoxo wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I've heard zone chat and know how vile some players can be. We don't need to introduce children to this game and open up the possibility for even more inappropriate behavior. We've gotten along for 8 years without them, and I honestly never even noticed their absence. We should leave well enough alone.

Permanently ban the minority of offenders, who I wouldn't want on this game interacting with actual real life minors anyway.

It wouldn't happen often because it doesn't happen often in mmos that have them.

I'm not naive enough to think it would literally never happen, but it's better those people are permanently banned anyway. And the overwhelmingly vast majority of people would be appropriate as is the case with other games. And we wouldn't keep getting this bizarre writing of characters clearly meant to be kids but they are adult npcs.

I can't think of a single character I've run into that are meant to be kids but are adults.

For example in Murkmire there's an Argonian woman that wants to be a mom and lets another woman do experiments on eggs that won't hatch. The result is they quickly turn into adult zombies and die and are a danger. But at the end of the quest you find a one who isn't as affected by the serum and she decides to raise it. She vows to be a good mother and raise her child well, even though it has special needs.

The serum sped up developers so the character definitely shouldn't be a little kid but it definitely shouldn't have been an adult zombie corpse like all the other ones either.

Then there's the mom you help find her lost son, but he's a grown man and she's just being overprotective.

The Dragonguard girl sounds and acts like she's around 16-17 but she's a grown woman, so does that ambition girl Callia in Blackwood. But the latter is more acceptable as an adult since she was a shut-in.

We also gather stuff for orphans for writs but there are no actual children anywhere.

I appreciate that you took the time to point those out but I don't see any of these as children. What is being suggested is that we should have children, obvious children, playing in the towns etc.. I cannot agree to this.

I mean to me that first one especially is so obviously meant to be a kid, around 12 or so. It is bizzare to hear how she needs to raise this kid and how she's finally a mother while looking at an adult's corpse.

MasterSpatula · February 2022

The Tamriel we see in the games is always an "abridged" version of what we're supposed to understand is really there. Even Daggerfall, which remains the larges landmass in a video game to this day, still lacks detail essential for a nation to actually work.

In other words, there are children there. They're just not relevant to the story you're living. Your character probably poops, too. But it's not a story point.

kargen27 · February 2022

They are all playing hide and seek and are really good at it.