^ Title

Would not mind if it was as a toggle option, so I would not have to run Tormentor on my PvE Werewolf tank

The OP seems to be more about overall complaints about the game than just what the title says.

They can change their role after getting in the dungeon negating any of this, as it is constructed now.

More importantly, there are trial fights that require two tanks, and having damage create significant aggro could cause a problem keeping NPCs separated.

Just pointing out it is not a perfect solution as it does have issues in more challenging content.

I am not sure what the issue is with the DPS in content. Heck, ESO is more forgivable to lower DPS (not super low) since there is not a true enrage timer where the boss wipes the group within seconds as punishment for not being good enough. Sure, a group with lower DPS will endure more mechanics but that is also an encouragement to improve. There is already several difficulty levels for players that are not interested in such a challenge which takes care of things for those that do not want much of a challenge.

As for the crafting bag, I have three mules I store my crafting items. I added some storage to them as the early upgrades are cheap. I find it easy to deal with it this way.

If this is too much trouble then just sell the items to a vendor and get some gold. This is faster than destroying them from inventory.

As for the complaint about getting item drops from doing dungeons filing up your inventory just refer to the previous sentence. If that is that much trouble for you then do not pick it up or just pick up what you want. I think there is a setting that picks up everything or allows us to choose what we pick up.

I do hope you figure things out. I have found this to be a great game and enjoy it very much.

Adding more. Varanis' post seems to be spot on about another problem with the damage = agro issue. I know when I am dps or heals I have no problem dealing with agro from some trash.

As a long time player who has left the game several times after they cut dps and therefore lengthened the amount of time it takes to complete a dungeon/trial, leave dps alone as it is. The current world we live in, most people don’t have enough time to spend hours in dungeons just trying to complete their pledges. That doesn’t leave any room for other content for those who only have a few hours to play.
As for the fake tank and healers, I like the OP’s suggestion of giving the tank role extreme aggro. For the healer role perhaps tie it to needing a restoration staff.
Maybe even a new quest line for the undaunted that explains the roles, how to play them and a test of the roles at the end. Upon completion for that character, you get a “badge” stating the role you completed the quest with. You will need that badge per role you queue for in order to even set foot in a dungeon.

"Tell me you want an AoE taunt without telling me that you want an AoE taunt."

Redguards_Revenge wrote: »

I would like to have this feature. This way Tanks can Tank and Fake Tanks can try to attempt to do whatever they do when they join.
Now if there was some way to deter Fake healers. I would say cut their damage in half but this is DPSO, mess with DPS, mess with the whole playerbase.
Let's face it 99% of you would love 3 DDs + 1 Tank groups. If 4 DPS were possible you all would jump to it. This game relies heavily on DPS. I've never seen anything like it.
In fact the now have broken their own game in order to sell more DPS. How? well there are 5 skills and with each new "set, mythic, monster helm, arena weapon, etc." They have added up to 4 FREE Skills (Skills which require no cost and break the game imo because of it) To override their five skill limitation.

For the health of the game we need to do away with the DPS Race. Otherwise this thing is going to balloon out of proportion (if it already has not) and may destroy the game. However, it's been made clear the health of the game is measured in profits rather than recruitment and retention of players. Let's not mistake retention with artificial retention. That would be to add a grindy thing into the game that forces people to waste the costliest thing in the universe, TIME.

How do I play ESO without a craftbag? I don't craft. I don't pick up anything. I destroy things that are already in the sticker book. By destroy, I mean throw out of my bag not deconstruct. I don't do any top tier PVE. Not because I don't want to or can't. It leads to acquisition of items I may not want to destroy. Since I don't deconstruct items, nor have the gold in the game to pay for those materials. I can't make sets. So I stick to cheap sets that can be bought in the guild stores. I don't PVP because I am constantly spammed with more sets that I can't deconstruct.

I've now just started playing the game 1 ever 31 days to clean my mail out. The time it takes for me to take out each set put them on auction etc. I might as well have been doing something else. I went to 2 dungeons yesterday and my bag was full and I logged out. I just can't be bothered by the stuff that constantly is bombarded in my face.

Why did I go on a tangent? Anyways yes, let's get that tank thing done!

Thats a another "Hey we have fake tanks and fake healers, lets mess up the real tanks and real healers to solve the issue for DDs".

This would be nightmarish in some fights like the Witch fight in veteran March of Sacrifices where you deliberately don't taunt certain enemies in order to have an easier time of not clumping them up.

jle30303 wrote: »

Thing is, there's TWO kinds of fake tank:

(1) The one who's really a mega powerful DPS capable of solo clearing the dungeon. Doesn't taunt the bosses, but will kill them anyway. The main annoyance here is that they have a tendency to race ahead of the party, kill the bosses before the rest get there, take short cuts, or leave straggling trash mobs in their wake that slower runners have to fight through.

(2) The wannabe-DPS guy who thinks he is (1) but isn't, who still doesn't taunt the boss, but also can't stand up to him and kill him either, and often dies to trash, who only queued as tank because of shorter queue times and refuses to accept that you have to actually pull your weight in dungeons.

I should like to point out there is a third option. Very rare, but does happen. The "fake" tank who has all the intention of skipping queues but who does actually slot a taunt. Arguably, and without getting into a huge tangent debate which derails the topic, there is a lot more to tanking than simply slotting a taunt, and intent goes a long way when considering what is or is not "fake." This is (1) but ensures that stuff stays in their AoEs rather than chasing after someone else who will kite despite taking almost no damage. Let's call them the "considerate fake" for lack of a better term. Can still die if they get a DLC dungeon they are not prepared for.

As for the topic, there's only one part that I actually agree with. People should read the main body of the post and not just the title.

Redguards_Revenge wrote: »

For the health of the game we need to do away with the DPS Race.

This part, specifically. When it comes to harder content, we should, in my opinion, get more focus on playing mechanics than purely on DPS. Whenever a mechanic comes up, it's always exclusively healers and tanks who have to play them while DDs stand there and mindlessly parse. Lokkestiiz, and to a degree hard mode, for example. Healer one goes in, and gets healed by healer two, then healer two goes in and gets healed by healer one, then you skip the third because you passed the player assigned DPS check.

In some fights, like Xalvakka hard mode, this is basically a requirement as anything short of a parse will see a wipe. More focus on DDs playing mecnahics, please. Like Twins in vMoL. If you don't play the colour swap... you all die. And then DDs go into places like Cloudrest where they need to play mechanics and... *gasp* they can't manage it. They don't know what a stack is or they forget and barswap, wiping the group. To this day, vMoL is still considered one of the hardest to clear and isn't really "puggable" because everyone has something to do and everyone has to pull their weight, and, similarly, ask almost anyone in end game and they'll probably say it's one of their favourites.

We went from just about everything around the time of Morrowind, pre-Morrowind and about a year after it, where DDs would be focusing on buffing each other, coordinating sets like Sunderflame, Night Mother's Gaze, etc. and playing mechanics (vMoL, Triplets in vHoF where knowing when not to DPS is a good thing; these days you just stack everything in middle and nuke in 40 seconds) to... well... every DD going full parse.

You queue for a random veteran and 9 times out of 10, DDs basically have the same copy-pasted build of Bahsei+Kinras/Tzogvin/Advancing Yokeda+Kilt+Slimecraw and a small selection of monster sets if Kilt cannot be used. Only a few groups out there now doing score pushing and top end trifecta clears where DDs are essentially forced to play on sets like Martial Knowledge because healers already have the sets they are required to use for buffs in an optimised setting. Lower tier groups either don't have those sets at all or they get put on healers/tanks and you lose a different buff/debuff set because no DD wants to take the personal DPS hit. Or the mentality of "I play a Khajiit magicka warden, and with my setup I'm already at crit cap, so the rest of the group shouldn't get Minor Brittle." A purely selfish mentality which is rife in the DD world.

More focus on group synergy with abilities and sets that help being used on DDs, make the abilities and sets less detrimental to the individual, maybe with unique buffs which apply to the individual, and more DD related mechanics that can't or shouldn't be played by the tanks and healers.

As for the AoE taunt, no thank you.

Troodon80 wrote: »

jle30303 wrote: »

Thing is, there's TWO kinds of fake tank:

(1) The one who's really a mega powerful DPS capable of solo clearing the dungeon. Doesn't taunt the bosses, but will kill them anyway. The main annoyance here is that they have a tendency to race ahead of the party, kill the bosses before the rest get there, take short cuts, or leave straggling trash mobs in their wake that slower runners have to fight through.

(2) The wannabe-DPS guy who thinks he is (1) but isn't, who still doesn't taunt the boss, but also can't stand up to him and kill him either, and often dies to trash, who only queued as tank because of shorter queue times and refuses to accept that you have to actually pull your weight in dungeons.

I should like to point out there is a third option. Very rare, but does happen. The "fake" tank who has all the intention of skipping queues but who does actually slot a taunt. Arguably, and without getting into a huge tangent debate which derails the topic, there is a lot more to tanking than simply slotting a taunt, and intent goes a long way when considering what is or is not "fake." This is (1) but ensures that stuff stays in their AoEs rather than chasing after someone else who will kite despite taking almost no damage. Let's call them the "considerate fake" for lack of a better term. Can still die if they get a DLC dungeon they are not prepared for.

This is what I do and how I consider myself. Feels disrespectful to call myself a real tank just because I have inner fire, when real tanking is a lot more involved and that is literally the least of what they do.

jle30303 wrote: »

Thing is, there's TWO kinds of fake tank:

(1) The one who's really a mega powerful DPS capable of solo clearing the dungeon. Doesn't taunt the bosses, but will kill them anyway. The main annoyance here is that they have a tendency to race ahead of the party, kill the bosses before the rest get there, take short cuts, or leave straggling trash mobs in their wake that slower runners have to fight through.

(2) The wannabe-DPS guy who thinks he is (1) but isn't, who still doesn't taunt the boss, but also can't stand up to him and kill him either, and often dies to trash, who only queued as tank because of shorter queue times and refuses to accept that you have to actually pull your weight in dungeons.

So much this