a queue for trials is a bad idea, mechs alone would destroy a random group, but so is spending a LOT of time in Belkarth in order to partecipate to something that's already very long. Not a lot can be done about it, maybe something like this: add another mandatory tier to trials, like "newcomers" with obviously less loot and less punishing bosses so people can try them out and understand how to play around the various mechs. Once you cleared that and hopefully learned how to play it, you can queue for normal or vet. A bit like casual and comp in Overwatch. It would at least give those who don't belong to a trial guild a chance to enjoy the content

Zuboko wrote: »

I can very much see the reason for people's concern about a group finder for trials ... [shudders at the idea of 11 DPS who know nothing about the game queuing into a trial with a single healer and then get mad because they keep dying] ... but that does not mean it will not help people.

Take for example myself. I have been playing this game since 2016 and have maybe ran one or two trails in that time. And I do not see that number increasing anytime soon, because I do not care to stand around waiting for a group of people who leave me wondering if they use the game as a glorified chat engine to get enough people together to run a trial. Sure, I would also likely need to wait for a group finder, but I could at least quest while waiting and then if I get in before I am done for the night then great. And I would just have to go in expecting there to be a grab bag of skill levels and such.

And technically, having a group finder for the trials would not stop those who like to stand around for hours talking to people in chat from doing that.

For DPS and this may sound a bit unfair to some but trials are not easy things generally speaking unless experienced but;

They could just tether your ability to Queue for Trials with parses you do on Raid Dummies. (For DPS queueing only)

If you exceed 30-40k You can queue for normal. If you exceed 60k you can queue for Veteran.

They could also add some check box (So it would split it into 4 queues) so;

1) Queue for people on Normal who know what they're doing.
2) Queue for people on Veteran who know what they're doing.
3) Queue for people on Normal who haven't done it before.
4) Queue for people on Veteran who haven't done the veteran mechanics before.

Number 3 could be removed as its just fluff really, however having this kind of system would encourage sherpering people through runs and there are quite a few people who would be willing to do it honestly, plenty of nice people in game at least EU.

They could also lock you out of some options if you've never done the trial before.

I grow tired of competing with other group leaders for players in Craglorn for farming runs, I also dislike the fact there is a large swath of people who ask for "achievements" basically gatekeeping content. People could do it with guilds of course and things like that but there are a great many people who just cant get into their guild runs because of turnout. A queue would solve so many problems. There would of course be other problems, that would likely crop up but it becomes a matter of do the positives out way the negatives and in my opinion they do.

They must let groups of people fill as well though.

Jeremy wrote: »

Grega wrote: »

The3sFinest wrote: »

Grega wrote: »

HollowDreams wrote: »

I dont know about you, but i am pretty fed up that i wont be able to ever complete trials in this game unless i waste my time and energy pretending to be social just to find a damn group to run a stupid trial, are you kidding me? Just let us queue for trials same way we do for dungeons, and dont come up with that bs saying trials is different because i dont care if no one in the group knows mechanics, you gotta start somewhere and this is just stupid that we have to go trough so much non sense just to play the game...I am 100% confident more people share the same opinion as me..Just please let us queue for trials.

There are many dungeons you can do while ignoring mechanics and not being social with the group. There are 0 trials you can complete with that mentality.

I have heard opposite of this many times. It just is not true. It is funny to see so many people against it like they will be forced to use the feature.

I’m not against it, I just provided information on why it wouldn’t work.

Also, to say “it’s just not true” is actually really rude. Trials are known to be heavy on cooperation. It’s not an unknown thing. The person who started this thread would not start one of what you said were accurate, because it would be easy to get into trials then.

Also, many more people guild-pug group outside of group finder rather than use the built in group finder. Primarily because of bad experiences with people being not good enough to complete content or fake rolling.

So to that point, I am saying not to implement it because it will be underused feature and instead divert effort into something else in the game that would be used more or into fixing many issues that need fixing.

To say "it's just not true" isn't really rude. Come on now.

Many trials, especially on normal, are way easier than current dungeon content (especially the DLC variety) that is already available through the activity finder. So if it's good enough for those I don't see why it shouldn't be good enough for trials also.

I also disagree with you about it being a "underused feature". I think people would use the ____ out of it. A lot of people would like to be able to experience that content without having to go through all the headaches of maintaining a guild schedule or advertising in chat.

This this this

Amottica wrote: »

I personally do not take any issue with such an idea as I would avoid the train wreck it would bring about. Considering the angst we have seen in the forums concerning the dungeon GF I would expect a lot of entertaining thread from a trial GF.

In saying that, I see very valid reasons why Zenimax would not offer it and it would start with that same constant flow of threads complaining about the dungeon GF groups for one reason or another. They would probably want to avoid the headache that would come with it.

I have to disagree purely because of how people are generally.

The game has many different kinds of players, most of which will do their own thing but is typically structured in a specific way so you have the Speed runners, the people who are purely about efficiency because of time, then you have the immersion crowd who want to take in the content, then you have the people just running around having fun doing whatever.

So regardless of whether there would be a queue or not, there will always be people making complaint threads. No matter the issue especially when it comes to other people complaining about other people. We're all good at that I think.

So I actually think thats enough reason to do it anyway, because you cannot please everyone but there is nothing wrong with giving people options.

The only caveat I can take with it really is that it probably would give people less incentive to join guilds, but thats neither here nor there really as people will join guilds if they want to and wont if they dont want to regardless.

I am curious if any of the naysayers have a true reason for their dissent? I am not seeing many if any notable drawbacks presented by those that oppose. Maybe the devs don’t want to deal with complaints? Idk that doesn’t seem like a strong indictment for the aforementioned reasons. I am in a few guilds, and they run trials! Just not at the times I can play, because ya know. I have a life outside of ESO. Don’t get me wrong, I spend my weekends in Tamriel, but that means choosing between PVP or PVE. I love both equally.

I shouldn't be gated out of content because I can’t quit my job, neglect my family, and play ESO all day. I keep my 3 month subscription fresh, but I can’t choose when and how I play the content I pay for? As ridiculous it may sound to some I enjoy PUGs and all the randomness that comes with it, minority I know- story of my life. I should be able to PUG without obstruction. LFG in Zone chat is an obstruction to PUGs.

What is the real reason something like a GF would not serve a large portion of the player base? I imagine, most if not all of the solo PvE population, myself included, would greatly appreciate something like a GF. Hailing a trial group for the trial you want in Belkarth SUUUUUCCCCKKSS!! I am really tired of typing DPS LF NRG. I really liked the idea of “registering your interest” someone mentioned earlier. I could see this being a boon to prog guilds struggling with turnout and PUGs alike!

Sheezabeast wrote: »

atherusmora wrote: »

I am curious if any of the naysayers have a true reason for their dissent? I am not seeing many if any notable drawbacks presented by those that oppose. Maybe the devs don’t want to deal with complaints? Idk that doesn’t seem like a strong indictment for the aforementioned reasons. I am in a few guilds, and they run trials! Just not at the times I can play, because ya know. I have a life outside of ESO. Don’t get me wrong, I spend my weekends in Tamriel, but that means choosing between PVP or PVE. I love both equally.

I shouldn't be gated out of content because I can’t quit my job, neglect my family, and play ESO all day. I keep my 3 month subscription fresh, but I can’t choose when and how I play the content I pay for? As ridiculous it may sound to some I enjoy PUGs and all the randomness that comes with it, minority I know- story of my life. I should be able to PUG without obstruction. LFG in Zone chat is an obstruction to PUGs.

What is the real reason something like a GF would not serve a large portion of the player base? I imagine, most if not all of the solo PvE population, myself included, would greatly appreciate something like a GF. Hailing a trial group for the trial you want in Belkarth SUUUUUCCCCKKSS!! I am really tired of typing DPS LF NRG. I really liked the idea of “registering your interest” someone mentioned earlier. I could see this being a boon to prog guilds struggling with turnout and PUGs alike!

I'll tell you a true reason. That ring stam characters run that makes them unable to take heals, and they don't take it off, then don't tell the healer they're running it, and they die because they can't self-heal through the dots in a trial boss fight. You have people in PVP armor wearing all impen, which is useless in PVE because mobs don't critically hit. You have people using ice staff not knowing about the taunt. All these things make for a trial pug finder NIGHTMARE. At least pugging in Craglorn you have to have some idea about what you want to do before you join.

Vote to kick player from the group. Democracy works. “Registering interest” would you give you that same “idea” before you join.

Amottica wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Amottica wrote: »

I personally do not take any issue with such an idea as I would avoid the train wreck it would bring about. Considering the angst we have seen in the forums concerning the dungeon GF I would expect a lot of entertaining thread from a trial GF.

In saying that, I see very valid reasons why Zenimax would not offer it and it would start with that same constant flow of threads complaining about the dungeon GF groups for one reason or another. They would probably want to avoid the headache that would come with it.

I have to disagree purely because of how people are generally.

The game has many different kinds of players, most of which will do their own thing but is typically structured in a specific way so you have the Speed runners, the people who are purely about efficiency because of time, then you have the immersion crowd who want to take in the content, then you have the people just running around having fun doing whatever.

So regardless of whether there would be a queue or not, there will always be people making complaint threads. No matter the issue especially when it comes to other people complaining about other people. We're all good at that I think.

So I actually think thats enough reason to do it anyway, because you cannot please everyone but there is nothing wrong with giving people options.

The only caveat I can take with it really is that it probably would give people less incentive to join guilds, but thats neither here nor there really as people will join guilds if they want to and wont if they dont want to regardless.

I see very few people making complaint threads about their core raiding team or raid guild. Heck, cannot recall a thread from someone complaining about their group that they formed before entering the dungeon.

So while I agree that there are all different kinds of players, it is clear when you get some of them in the mix, speedrunners who could care less about the rest of the group or low DPS players that stand in red and add in some that are doing the story then it is clear it can lead to a train wreck. We have the proof of that in plain sight.

I was just pointing out that regardless of what zos do or dont do there will always be complaint threads about other players at some point some where (the pvp section lol) so they're somewhat damned if they do and damned if they don't which Is why I suggested they just do it anyway.

As for the train reck aspect, when I form pug runs for gear (non-perfected) I take anyone, I dont ask for DPS I dont ask for achievements. We just clear it, get our loot and restart. While I can imagine there will be some problems, if the pug runs i've done forming or simply participating as over the last few years are anything to go by. People will be fine, we always end up imagining the worst case scenario. It is the easiest scenario to imagine after all.

I also shouldn't have to remind you of all people (you've been here long enough) just how ..... uninspired .... forum threads can be or simply the fact we're citing the forum here at all really considering how few people likely use the board actively compared to the larger population. I suppose if we had some form of data analysis going for the boards maybe it would matter more. There wont be much story experience in trials anyway, there's no NPCs to wait for, no real dialogue that cannot be enjoyed while fighting and so forth. It will just be a case of experienced vs inexperience like with all things.

For 160cp players min on normal? Maby. But I doubt it. For vet? NO, thank you.

Trials are my least favourite part of the game and i just go there to farm the sets i need and will never go back and a trial finder wouldn't change it for me because i just don't like 12 men content but i have a genuine question for the nay sayers. What is the difference between a trial finder and spamming chat in craglorn? You are still gathering random people from craglorn hell when i think about it even my guild runs are with randoms. I see the "just join a guild bruh" too much. I'm in multiple guilds and they reguarly run trials but they are still random because every one of them have 500 members and every single member can join so we get all kinds of players in the team like first timers, subpar dds,people that are not in the voice chat, people that don't speak english etc. So unless you are in a sweaty guild that is dedicated to run trials, you are still pugging the trials even if you are in a casual social guild. On the other hand nobody would force you to use it, you can still go to craglorn and spam the chat like a lot of people that are using the chat to get a group for daily pledges instead of activity finder. So tell me, what is the harm in a trial finder?

P.S: the "but what about the resources that can be used somewhere else" is not a valid response, come up with something better.

Xuhora wrote: »

Seminolegirl1992 wrote: »

atherusmora wrote: »

I am curious if any of the naysayers have a true reason for their dissent? I am not seeing many if any notable drawbacks presented by those that oppose. Maybe the devs don’t want to deal with complaints? Idk that doesn’t seem like a strong indictment for the aforementioned reasons. I am in a few guilds, and they run trials! Just not at the times I can play, because ya know. I have a life outside of ESO. Don’t get me wrong, I spend my weekends in Tamriel, but that means choosing between PVP or PVE. I love both equally.

I shouldn't be gated out of content because I can’t quit my job, neglect my family, and play ESO all day. I keep my 3 month subscription fresh, but I can’t choose when and how I play the content I pay for? As ridiculous it may sound to some I enjoy PUGs and all the randomness that comes with it, minority I know- story of my life. I should be able to PUG without obstruction. LFG in Zone chat is an obstruction to PUGs.

What is the real reason something like a GF would not serve a large portion of the player base? I imagine, most if not all of the solo PvE population, myself included, would greatly appreciate something like a GF. Hailing a trial group for the trial you want in Belkarth SUUUUUCCCCKKSS!! I am really tired of typing DPS LF NRG. I really liked the idea of “registering your interest” someone mentioned earlier. I could see this being a boon to prog guilds struggling with turnout and PUGs alike!

^

i will give you my reasoning but first i have to adress the bolded part. Im sorry, but you are not gated out of any content, you just dont want to search for a PUG via Zonechat because of whatever reasons. Its a hyperbole.
you want to press at max 5 buttons and then be hooked up with 11 others and i guess automaticly portet into the trial itself.

to start i want to point out the many threads about fake tanks, faker healers, fake DDs, afkler in groupfinder and what not, you know it that it is a problem and i know it. this threads will be even more frequent with a trial finder. its not that a normal crag trial cannot be completed with very low DPS, but there are mechanics. imagine the AA teleport plates, the split up section in HRC, the poison circles in SO.

furthermore if you allow raids to be joined via GF-tool there will sooner or later be an urge to cater existing raids as well as new raids to this GF-groups, because you dont want too much backlash in forums and via the playerbase to non-players about idiotic mechanics or too hard. i dont want future raids to be adjustet to the 11 headless chickens from the GF-tools.

to end: if only for normal trials i guess i would be fine with an enlistment like the premade groups from WoW, but even that would need some sort of indication about the player that enlists to my group. in WoW i can see the itemlvl (or raid.io score with an addon) so i know what the player is capable of.
in ESO i dont have that option and i know that the most people calling for a GF-tool are against that because they dont like beeing spied on.
If vet trials would be included be sure that most capapble players still would use zone chat, because then they can ask for achivement to have an indication (but cannot be for sure) that the PUG raid wont become a 2 hour wipefest 2 players leaving after every wipe.

i think you romantice the possibilities of a trial finder, it will be a chaotic nightmare with a lot of frustration and a lot of waiting (if the tank leaves the group because he realised that 5 out of the 11 other players dont know how to use WASD) and a lot of typing in groupchat for little yuri over there to finally get on that "&*%)(/?% plate over there so the group can advance.

What I want is to be able to group for trials without standing in Belkarth for hours hoping to be grouped in a trial I want to play through. Nothing hyperbolic or lofty about that. Playing the vet trial you want becomes even more unlikely as a PUG for many reasons least of which being absent of some type of GF, it becomes a gate when it hinders other players from accessing the content. Even being in a trials guild doesn’t guarantee you a spot on the raid team. Idk why this is offered as a solution. LFG for an unplanned trial in a guild with 400 players is tantamount to LFG in zone chat, and often less effective. Nothing hyperbolic or lofty about that either.

Your nightmare scenario assumes the worst, and is very much hyperbolic. As I stated before democracy works!! Vote to kick player from the group. Comparing dungeons to trials is like apples to oranges. I’ve been fortunate enough to have PUGd every normal trial multiple times, and the grouping process has sucked every time. Nothing hyperbolic about that either. The vet trials I’ve PUGd aren’t as relevant to my point because most of those groups were started by a friend or a guildee struggling with turnout.

I’ve never run into a trial troll that didn’t end up kicked from the group, and I’ve been playing the game for near 6 years now. I’ve also never PUGd a trial where someone wasn’t calling out mechanics in voice chat, and if you ask nicely they will put it in chat too. Typically the person that starts the PUG assumes there is a player in the group that has never run x trial, and are ready willing and able to teach mechanics. ESO has the kindest most supportive players I’ve ever met in an MMO. That said, Dungeon trolls are a thing, but they too get kicked from group when I am around. I agree a Trial GF should probably be regulated to normal trials only. Leave the vet content to the vets!

As for the struggle with WASD, I play on PS4 NA server. We use controllers. PC players can do the same if they want to. No need to struggle. Your argument makes the PC player base seem very snobby and unwilling to help his/her/their fellow player. Sucks for you I guess? As I said in my initial response, I do not see “more complaint threads” as a valid reason not to implement a tool that a good portion of the player base is and has been requesting for as long as I’ve been playing this game. More complaint threads happen for no reason and great reasons all the time. There is no data to support Trial GF breaking or not breaking the forums. Knee jerk opinions are not a stable form of data. We are all speculating here.

Anyone against queues for trials doesn't have to queue. Let the people that do take their chances. I know what I'm getting into. Give me the queue!

They could for starting just make it a option for Normal Trials and make every Que require the same same 2 Tanks 2 Healers 8 DPS. Then if it works good after a few months make it a option for Vet Trails also.

This would most likely work really well, since we all know that no player's ever set their roles to one they are not able to fulfill.

I remember when dungeons were toxic and elitist cesspool. Then they fixed dungeon finder...

Too some extend we need something for trials. It will help diversity in game and finally stop on only class x can do things. It will also make it easier to fixed things if there's actually a problem with class x doing such a role.