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QUESTS ARE JUST TOO EASY!
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alberichtano✭✭✭✭✭
✭alberichtano wrote: »There is no other game around such an easy storyline. Everytime a chapter comes up you just kill anyone like moises opening the red sea. Now with companions it's even more ridiculous. A boss fight takes 1.5 minutes. It´s absolutely a turn off. In SWTOR for example, any froup of mobs takes longer to kill than a boss in this game. Farming gear just for trials it's not the way to keep you in a game. Please level up difficulty
Interestingly, that is exactly why I gave up on SWTOR. Got fed up with having the worst lightsaber ever built. ;-/
I am much the same, got sick and tired of the stupidly large health bars bosses had over there especially in flashpoints you needed to progress the story, which are instanced like the base game main story quests over here(but are closer in difficulty to soloing normal dungeons in ESO), if you lose connection that long slog you were nearly over puts you right back to the start.
I wasn't the only one they got plenty of backlash on quite a few of them especially that A TRAITOR AMONG THE CHISS one and had to tone things down.
Longer harder fights are all well and good but if its just a case of them having more hit points and doing more damage without making the combat itself fun I lose interest and move on.
If you want harder content play the solo arena's or join the group Vet content.
You know, my main beef is this - if I play a Star Wars-game, and I play a Jedi, I want to feel that "better than average"-feeling. Lightsabers shouldn't be treated like throwing small rocks at people. When I had major issue with defeating sandpeople mobs with force and all, it just felt absolutely silly. Sure, bosses and special encounters must be a challange, but taking minutes to get down ONE damn sandpeople? Sheesh!0 -
alanmatillab16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭There is no other game around such an easy storyline. Everytime a chapter comes up you just kill anyone like moises opening the red sea. Now with companions it's even more ridiculous. A boss fight takes 1.5 minutes. It´s absolutely a turn off. In SWTOR for example, any froup of mobs takes longer to kill than a boss in this game. Farming gear just for trials it's not the way to keep you in a game. Please level up difficulty
while you might be right about quests being too easy, swtor is far easier since the changes that allow you to level only doing your class quests and even then you can do them only using base attacks.
Sadly many "gamers" now see any task having to be repeated for more than 2 times as "grindy", you only have to look at the whining on here and other game forums to see that. Complaints of "my staff hasnt dropped yet" or "30 world bosses are too many" "my lead hasnt dropped from shadowfen" etc etc. The expansion has not been out long and is intended to last a year but already players are on about stuff taking too long.
They are never going to make quests harder or introduce a difficulty slider. If you want a game where you actually have to pay attention to your pulls etc I can highly recommend WoW Classic: The Burning Crusade. I am having a blast there. Leave ESO for the instant gratification crowd or for when you just want to chill and play something easy.3 -
alberichtano✭✭✭✭✭
✭amm7sb14_ESO wrote: »This is exactly why I refuse to do any overland or questing content. I refuse to touch the storyline in Blackwood, I don't do zone quests, never even finished the faction storylines. The questing in this game is just so boring it's tedious. I can't bring myself to do something so mindless.
I may want relaxation, but I also want stimulation. Questing in this game is the furthest thing from stimulation.
The saddest thing about all this is that overland PvE in ESO used to be interesting, I'm even leaving out vet zones. Regular PvE was interesting and frankly I enjoyed it as a diversion, something I can do casually but not blindfolded, before One Tamriel I did Cadwell's Gold 4 times including most of the side quests in basic zones and it never got boring.
Nowadays ZOS might as well remove all mobs from overland because they serve no function, it's been a very long time since I did any overland content for fun, I don't know the storyline of Dark Brotherhood, Summerset, Blackwood and many others just because after a few minutes of playing I literally get nauseous from the level of ease of this game.
Yes I know "the game is aimed at everyone", if so why isn't it also aimed at those who want to explore the storyline of all the DLCs and chapters with a bit more difficulty? Why aren't these players allowed to play OPTIONALLY harder? So as not to hurt the feelings of someone who prefers an easier game? So the others don't count? I understand that you don't want an overall increase in difficulty but denying the introduction of OPTIONAL higher difficulty is very selfish, shame on you.
Well, you CAN do overland without armor... that'd give it some more difficulty? ;-)
Jokes aside, it is hard to do overland with different levels of challange when everyone is on the same maps. :-/
Although, I have seen the alternative in LOTRO, where every area became a bit tougher than the previous ones. It just became silly. In the end I fought crows (yes, normal crows) that were far more powerful than trolls in the beginner areas. And I mean like orders of magnitude, ESO-compared, as rats to veteran raid-bosses in comparison. Crows. Sure, at that level they were fairly challenging, but uber birds that could kill all of the shire alone? Sheesh! ;-)2 -
alberichtano✭✭✭✭✭
✭amm7sb14_ESO wrote: »This is exactly why I refuse to do any overland or questing content. I refuse to touch the storyline in Blackwood, I don't do zone quests, never even finished the faction storylines. The questing in this game is just so boring it's tedious. I can't bring myself to do something so mindless.
I may want relaxation, but I also want stimulation. Questing in this game is the furthest thing from stimulation.
The saddest thing about all this is that overland PvE in ESO used to be interesting, I'm even leaving out vet zones. Regular PvE was interesting and frankly I enjoyed it as a diversion, something I can do casually but not blindfolded, before One Tamriel I did Cadwell's Gold 4 times including most of the side quests in basic zones and it never got boring.
Nowadays ZOS might as well remove all mobs from overland because they serve no function, it's been a very long time since I did any overland content for fun, I don't know the storyline of Dark Brotherhood, Summerset, Blackwood and many others just because after a few minutes of playing I literally get nauseous from the level of ease of this game.
Yes I know "the game is aimed at everyone", if so why isn't it also aimed at those who want to explore the storyline of all the DLCs and chapters with a bit more difficulty? Why aren't these players allowed to play OPTIONALLY harder? So as not to hurt the feelings of someone who prefers an easier game? So the others don't count? I understand that you don't want an overall increase in difficulty but denying the introduction of OPTIONAL higher difficulty is very selfish, shame on you.
Since I don't know how to edit a text here, I will just write another...
My former post reminded me (a tad too late) of one of my favorite games, the first two Gothic games. They did an excellent job of this. The roads and areas closest to the starting areas are hard when you are new. Anything beyond is suicide (though Gothic is forgiving, if you run near a hostile animal, it will often warn before attacking; if you run right into them, you're dead).
As you progress in skill and equipment, you can dare ever farther out, and take out ever more difficult foes. The original beasties become ever easier to kill of course. This way, there is always a challange in every area (though the first game is fairly small in size) up until rather late in the game.0 -
nukk3r✭✭✭✭✭
✭vesselwiththepestle wrote: »
So the zone is NOT aimed at players from all skill level, players with supposedly high skill level (I am far from a hardcore gamer, definitely not dealing anywhere near that 100k+ on a dummy like those youtube guides make look easy and I actually quit trials because I came to find it boring to hell to wipe for weeks on some boss instead of actually just playing that content) are bound to do the same repeatable grinds (instances) over and over? There is no place for players who want to play an intriguing new story COMBINED with engaging gameplay, where they can show what we've got? Then this game is _not_ aimed at players of every skill.You missed the part where I said that it's a casual game, you come with an OP character to the zone aimed at new players and people playing just for the story.
If you only adress the "low bottom" of players - I don't mean this elitist, I exactly know how hard I thought quest bosses to be when I was new to the game and struggling with random overland mob groups without CP and having no gear and no clue about which skills to use when etc. - you will lose players. I don't want to repeat the same content over and over and over, I want to do all those quests and learn about the story. I am an Elder Scrolls Player since ... around ... 1996? When TES 2: Daggerfall came out? So I advocate for us to be able to chose a "veteran mode" or something for overland and quests. And no, turning off CP, wearing bad gear choices etc. is not an option, at least not to me, because this would still take away a lot from the game.
You are deliberately ignoring the natural progression of the game, how ZOS designed it: overland -> dungeons -> trials (they woudn't even be called that if the nature of the content wasn't meant for end-game characters). This game follows the same pattern every other MMO does, overland for grind and fluff quests, raids as an actual gameplay. These sets just don't intersect. You may not be the type of player this game targets, but it provides something for their core audience.
ESO had leveled zones before and it almost killed the game, so I don't think ZOS will make this mistake again.8 -
Oreyn_Bearclaw✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭vesselwiththepestle wrote: »
So the zone is NOT aimed at players from all skill level, players with supposedly high skill level (I am far from a hardcore gamer, definitely not dealing anywhere near that 100k+ on a dummy like those youtube guides make look easy and I actually quit trials because I came to find it boring to hell to wipe for weeks on some boss instead of actually just playing that content) are bound to do the same repeatable grinds (instances) over and over? There is no place for players who want to play an intriguing new story COMBINED with engaging gameplay, where they can show what we've got? Then this game is _not_ aimed at players of every skill.You missed the part where I said that it's a casual game, you come with an OP character to the zone aimed at new players and people playing just for the story.
If you only adress the "low bottom" of players - I don't mean this elitist, I exactly know how hard I thought quest bosses to be when I was new to the game and struggling with random overland mob groups without CP and having no gear and no clue about which skills to use when etc. - you will lose players. I don't want to repeat the same content over and over and over, I want to do all those quests and learn about the story. I am an Elder Scrolls Player since ... around ... 1996? When TES 2: Daggerfall came out? So I advocate for us to be able to chose a "veteran mode" or something for overland and quests. And no, turning off CP, wearing bad gear choices etc. is not an option, at least not to me, because this would still take away a lot from the game.
You are deliberately ignoring the natural progression of the game, how ZOS designed it: overland -> dungeons -> trials (they woudn't even be called that if the nature of the content wasn't meant for end-game characters). This game follows the same pattern every other MMO does, overland for grind and fluff quests, raids as an actual gameplay. These sets just don't intersect. You may not be the type of player this game targets, but it provides something for their core audience.
ESO had leveled zones before and it almost killed the game, so I don't think ZOS will make this mistake again.
I think that is over stating it to some degree. This game came out with leveled zones and did well out of the gate. ZOS released crag and then upper crag, then went cold on new DLC for a LONG time. The latter is what almost killed the game. As to your first paragraph, I don't disagree that is the intended order of events currently. The issue arguably is that overland is SO easy that the step up to dungeons becomes to big for a lot of people to make. It was much easier to get into dungeons and vet dungeons back when the game required you to actually progress your character and build when you leveled through the story.
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Iccotak✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭vesselwiththepestle wrote: »
Questing is definitely not aimed at players being able to deal more than 10k dps. Spoiler: I deal more damage just by light attacking. How much skill does that take?Do you guys take turns in making these posts? This is a casual game aimed at all levels of player skill.
I would LOVE to see engaging gameplay in questing. I am currently doing the Greymoor questline and there was a big bad quest boss WHO DIDN'T EVEN DEAL DAMAGE WHEN HE HIT ME. Literally. Zero. Damage. Although he had some cool looking mechanics. I gather if he had been dangerous, this could have been a lot of fun. But alas, it seems the game isn't actually aimed at all levels of player skill.
You missed the part where I said that it's a casual game, you come with an OP character to the zone aimed at new players and people playing just for the story. You're CP1000+, you deal 10k with LAs, good for you. There is content for your character level and skill, it's called veteran hardmode dungeons and trials. I know some elderly players who struggle with quest bosses, I don't think they should struggle more because someone wants to seek challenge in the content that wasn't designed to be challenging.
What you are missing is that the Ease of the Questing ruins the story for a lot of players. That is the core of the complaint.
A lot of people want to enjoy the story but just can't with the unengaging combat that is designed for beginners.
This is why people have requested for an OPTIONAL difficulty setting so then they can get some better combat gameplay from the Big Bad of the Expansion/Year - while new players are not put into that expectation.
Generally speaking, people are not asking for the Story Boss to be like a Trial - just an engaging & challenging encounter for players of higher skill. They don't have to be the hardest thing in the game, it would just be nice if they weren't boring and anti-climatic.
Engaging Gameplay and Engaging Story do not have to be separate.I find it funny how people have no issue asking for content to be made easier yet it's so controversial when others (like myself) ask for overland / story bosses be optionally made more challenging.
No, I understand the complaint. But what is an adequate level of difficulty for a vet player? I would like harder quest bosses too, they should be at least on par with base game world bosses to provide enough entertainment for me without being laborious. But someone may find that too hard, someone may find that too easy, there's no middle ground. Just accept that the current level of difficulty won't go anywhere, and play it like a visual novel.
If someone find that too difficult then they could play it on Normal
Really? No middle ground? I highly doubt that
I also HARD disagree with the "Visual Novel" point. This is a game with a heavy emphasis on fast paced action oriented combat - it makes no sense for the central story of such a game to have almost nothing to offer for combat. If I want a visual novel then I would go play a visual novel.
I want a Main Story Quest with Boss encounters that are engaging. If it just becomes a breeze - then that hurts the story and I am no longer invested. Sorry - Not sorry but the story is not that compelling to make up for that kind of let down which it is for long time players like myself. (this is also my experience with New players)
Prioritizing the New Player experience of Story content over the experience of longtime players just doesn't make any sense. The very least they could do is make an optional difficulty for the main narrative.alanmatillab16_ESO wrote: »There is no other game around such an easy storyline. Everytime a chapter comes up you just kill anyone like moises opening the red sea. Now with companions it's even more ridiculous. A boss fight takes 1.5 minutes. It´s absolutely a turn off. In SWTOR for example, any froup of mobs takes longer to kill than a boss in this game. Farming gear just for trials it's not the way to keep you in a game. Please level up difficulty
while you might be right about quests being too easy, swtor is far easier since the changes that allow you to level only doing your class quests and even then you can do them only using base attacks.
Sadly many "gamers" now see any task having to be repeated for more than 2 times as "grindy", you only have to look at the whining on here and other game forums to see that. Complaints of "my staff hasnt dropped yet" or "30 world bosses are too many" "my lead hasnt dropped from shadowfen" etc etc. The expansion has not been out long and is intended to last a year but already players are on about stuff taking too long.
They are never going to make quests harder or introduce a difficulty slider. If you want a game where you actually have to pay attention to your pulls etc I can highly recommend WoW Classic: The Burning Crusade. I am having a blast there. Leave ESO for the instant gratification crowd or for when you just want to chill and play something easy.
This is an excellent example of Hard being challenging but NOT punishing. A huge mass consensus amongst WoW players why they like classic over retail is that both Endgame AND Questing is engaging because things are a threat while questing. You actually have to pay attention to what you are doing. It's not Dark Souls (nor would I want it to be) but it is still engaging.
I say that ESO has better side quests (in terms of quality writing) but it is severely dampened by the ease it can be completed. Nothing in overland is a threat unless you are completely new to video games or have bad internet.
If I want anything challenging i.e stimulating and engaging then I have to go do group content / endgame.
Problem is though how little that content is in a Chapter / Zone DLC. The Story content is the majority of the questing experience and the combat is for beginner - not "All skill levels - it is for beginners. If you enjoy that level of difficulty that's ok but don't claim its for people of all skill levels. It is most definitely for beginners.
That is a great point and it's funny how no one has framed it like this in these conversations. I say stick with that idea.There is no need for increased rewards. Aside from Master, I'd only ever use the other modes for levelling a new character who would out-level all the rewards anyway. Besides, getting better loot kind of defeats the object of having a challenging experience.There is no place for players who want to play an intriguing new story COMBINED with engaging gameplay
THIS7 -
xv1_me✭✭✭How can anyone enjoy the combat in pve especially overland pve. The most those mobs can do to you is put you in perma combat bug, or snare you.
It used to be more challenging before people cried about it being challenging.
And here we are people, including myself, still complaining except we want the game more difficult.
I agree tho it is mind-numbing how tedious any combat is in this game other than 1vxing players.3 -
MirandaSharp✭✭✭✭There is no other game around such an easy storyline. Everytime a chapter comes up you just kill anyone like moises opening the red sea. Now with companions it's even more ridiculous. A boss fight takes 1.5 minutes. It´s absolutely a turn off. In SWTOR for example, any froup of mobs takes longer to kill than a boss in this game. Farming gear just for trials it's not the way to keep you in a game. Please level up difficulty
I'm on my knees begging for a boss fight that takes 1.5 minutes!!!!! Only the worst pugs ever created by the finder in a vet DLC dungeon do I get to experience this... (for all the wrong reasons!!)
In story over land content there's not a "boss" that lasts even 2 seconds. Actually I don't even know whether the fight was "the" boss fight or just some trash. Sometimes I have to hit twice, that's a good sign it was a "boss fight".0 -
Hamboot✭✭✭One my criticism of this game, questing is good but too braindead ez. They really need to tune up the difficulty of overland content of this game.1
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zelaminator✭✭✭✭✭
✭Well, majority wins.. So untill the majority wants it to change, we get to keep it as it is
And I'll enjoy every minute of it 3 -
Thechuckage✭✭✭✭✭I don't see why there cant be harder story bosses at a minimum. Instanced fights, can't possibly affect anyone else.
[snip]
[Edit for Bait.]Edited by ZOS_GregoryV on June 23, 2021 11:54PM2 -
Ken_Koerperich✭✭✭Guess most of you are to "Professional" for this game.
I think PvE content is rough. I've died multiple times already, eating my fair share of the "free" oh, f me I need a heal pot, and I'm not even through 2 of the PROLOGUE quests, and still sitting in Auridon.
Guess I'm to casual, incompetent in your eyes, YET I've been gaming since PONG on a 13" Black & White TV w/ Rabbit Ears n Dials....
Sue me....
Game is fine AS IS IMO....
Leave it alone....
Thanks!8 -
Malthorne✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Guess most of you are to "Professional" for this game.
I think PvE content is rough. I've died multiple times already, eating my fair share of the "free" oh, f me I need a heal pot, and I'm not even through 2 of the PROLOGUE quests, and still sitting in Auridon.
Guess I'm to casual, incompetent in your eyes, YET I've been gaming since PONG on a 13" Black & White TV w/ Rabbit Ears n Dials....
Sue me....
Game is fine AS IS IMO....
Leave it alone....
Thanks!
No one in any of these threads that I have seen has ever said anything remotely derogatory to any player in regards to their perceived skill level. Don’t turn this into a casual vs elitist discussion. I’m Uber casual and so are many of the players who are advocating for a more engaging questing experience. In fact, most are for various optional difficulty instances so that those who like the current easy questing retain their desired format.6 -
Castagere✭✭✭✭✭kmontywrwb17_ESO wrote: »That ship has sailed my friend. ESO long ago went the easy route, and focuses on narrative more than combat. The community here as a rule like the game the way it is, and complain loudly if anything is too difficult or takes too much time. And fair enough, IMO. The pace of ESO is different to most other MMOs in that regard.
If you want difficulty and challenge in the core game, you are in the wrong MMO.
Why can't these hardcore MMO players after 7 years not get this? They come here and complain over and over. This is a game that is focused on the stories more so the combat difficulty and the majority of the player base think it's great. If the OP left swtor over this he should have picked a different game.8 -
Ken_Koerperich✭✭✭Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Guess most of you are to "Professional" for this game.
I think PvE content is rough. I've died multiple times already, eating my fair share of the "free" oh, f me I need a heal pot, and I'm not even through 2 of the PROLOGUE quests, and still sitting in Auridon.
Guess I'm to casual, incompetent in your eyes, YET I've been gaming since PONG on a 13" Black & White TV w/ Rabbit Ears n Dials....
Sue me....
Game is fine AS IS IMO....
Leave it alone....
Thanks!
No one in any of these threads that I have seen has ever said anything remotely derogatory to any player in regards to their perceived skill level. Don’t turn this into a casual vs elitist discussion. I’m Uber casual and so are many of the players who are advocating for a more engaging questing experience. In fact, most are for various optional difficulty instances so that those who like the current easy questing retain their desired format.
Then you ARE NOT casual if you want it HARDER.
8 -
Iccotak✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭kmontywrwb17_ESO wrote: »That ship has sailed my friend. ESO long ago went the easy route, and focuses on narrative more than combat. The community here as a rule like the game the way it is, and complain loudly if anything is too difficult or takes too much time. And fair enough, IMO. The pace of ESO is different to most other MMOs in that regard.
If you want difficulty and challenge in the core game, you are in the wrong MMO.
Why can't these hardcore MMO players after 7 years not get this? They come here and complain over and over. This is a game that is focused on the stories more so the combat difficulty and the majority of the player base think it's great. If the OP left swtor over this he should have picked a different game.
Only for story content - but any other activity found in the game directly contradicts that statement. btw I play casually and I am by no means a "Hardcore MMO Player". I just find the Story Boss encounters to be mediocre & anti-climatic, which I think really hurts the overall story experience. Completely kills immersion
I have also found this to be the case for other new & casual players. Which is why a lot of my friends left the game.
To repeat what someone just saidKen_Koerperich wrote: »Guess most of you are to "Professional" for this game.
I think PvE content is rough. I've died multiple times already, eating my fair share of the "free" oh, f me I need a heal pot, and I'm not even through 2 of the PROLOGUE quests, and still sitting in Auridon.
Guess I'm to casual, incompetent in your eyes, YET I've been gaming since PONG on a 13" Black & White TV w/ Rabbit Ears n Dials....
Sue me....
Game is fine AS IS IMO....
Leave it alone....
Thanks!
No one in any of these threads that I have seen has ever said anything remotely derogatory to any player in regards to their perceived skill level. Don’t turn this into a casual vs elitist discussion. I’m Uber casual and so are many of the players who are advocating for a more engaging questing experience. In fact, most are for various optional difficulty instances so that those who like the current easy questing retain their desired format.
ESO story content does not have to be ONLY one thing. It used to be leveled and they changed that. I think it is a perfectly reasonable and fair request to allow players to at the very least have Story Boss Encounters that are engaging for people with above beginner level of skill.Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Guess most of you are to "Professional" for this game.
I think PvE content is rough. I've died multiple times already, eating my fair share of the "free" oh, f me I need a heal pot, and I'm not even through 2 of the PROLOGUE quests, and still sitting in Auridon.
Guess I'm to casual, incompetent in your eyes, YET I've been gaming since PONG on a 13" Black & White TV w/ Rabbit Ears n Dials....
Sue me....
Game is fine AS IS IMO....
Leave it alone....
Thanks!
No one in any of these threads that I have seen has ever said anything remotely derogatory to any player in regards to their perceived skill level. Don’t turn this into a casual vs elitist discussion. I’m Uber casual and so are many of the players who are advocating for a more engaging questing experience. In fact, most are for various optional difficulty instances so that those who like the current easy questing retain their desired format.
Then you ARE NOT casual if you want it HARDER.
So if I don't want beginner level of easy or if I want overland / story combat to put me in a position where I have to think about what I am doing - then I am therefore not a Casual? That's a very narrow definition, I thought ESO was all about being inclusive...
edited for grammar
Edited by Iccotak on June 24, 2021 12:25AM4 -
ectoplasmicninja✭✭✭✭✭
✭If I were arguing for questing to be harder, I would want better designed bosses with mechanics and stages to fights rather than just a larger health bar and dealing more damage. I saw some folks saying that they want quest bosses to be like base game world bosses, but IMO fighting a base game world boss is not really that engaging. Having to dodge roll here and there, bash a couple times, and block heavies is not exciting. It is tedious.
Even with the more active bosses...to each their own but I'm not really looking to fight the equivalent of Bittergreen the Wild every time I meet some slaver captain who kidnapped some villagers. A real big bad, sure, but if every random enemy we meet is a serious challenge then the Vestige is just weak.PC NA, CP2200+. Character creation is the true endgame.3 -
Chadak✭✭✭✭✭I like getting paid for working hard.
Until this game starts paying me to play it, I'd rather not be working hard here in order to get anywhere or do anything.
I like how easy a lot of things are on here. I find it to be relaxing, easy to dip in and effortless to get back into it when I've been away for a while.
If I want a stiff personal challenge, I look to assorted single-player games for that, and the chief reason why is simple - I don't have to put up with other people when I'm looking for those challenges. It can be me against the thing, and I don't have to worry about other peoples' schedules, other peoples' excuses or their bloody whinging.
When I want challenge, I find it. In greater part, because I don't look in the wrong places.5 -
AcadianPaladin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I very much like the wide range of difficulty available in ESO. When questing or farming mats, I want to focus on, well, questing or farming mats. If I want a challenge, I know where to get it. So I think the game is fine as is in that regard.
That said, I see no problem with a 'difficulty slider' that players can use to adjust their experience. Tamriel 1 introduced the concept of keeping mobs the same but 'battle leveling' low level players by buffing them. A difficulty slider that changes the player (not the mobs) should be easy to implement and it seems like many would welcome it.PC NA(no Steam), PvE, mostly solo3 -
Iccotak✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭I like getting paid for working hard.
Until this game starts paying me to play it, I'd rather not be working hard here in order to get anywhere or do anything.
I like how easy a lot of things are on here. I find it to be relaxing, easy to dip in and effortless to get back into it when I've been away for a while.
If I want a stiff personal challenge, I look to assorted single-player games for that, and the chief reason why is simple - I don't have to put up with other people when I'm looking for those challenges. It can be me against the thing, and I don't have to worry about other peoples' schedules, other peoples' excuses or their bloody whinging.
When I want challenge, I find it. In greater part, because I don't look in the wrong places.
#1. No one is advocating to take that away from you. Not a single person and we need to stop treating these discussions as if that is the goal.
You find it relaxing? All the power to you. It's great you are having fun.
These other folks want to have fun and be engaged in the story - it's really hard to do that when the story content is too easy for them.
#2 No one is saying to turn Story Bosses into something you need to get a group for. Many Solo Casual Players are saying that the Story Bosses are too easy for them and would like it so they had the option to play at a higher difficulty to make the Story Big Bad actually a Big Bad in gameplay for solo.
No one is saying to make them a dungeon or a trial. It's not that they are looking in the wrong places - it's that the story content is a let down when the gameplay doesn't support the hype.ectoplasmicninja wrote: »If I were arguing for questing to be harder, I would want better designed bosses with mechanics and stages to fights rather than just a larger health bar and dealing more damage. I saw some folks saying that they want quest bosses to be like base game world bosses, but IMO fighting a base game world boss is not really that engaging. Having to dodge roll here and there, bash a couple times, and block heavies is not exciting. It is tedious.
Even with the more active bosses...to each their own but I'm not really looking to fight the equivalent of Bittergreen the Wild every time I meet some slaver captain who kidnapped some villagers. A real big bad, sure, but if every random enemy we meet is a serious challenge then the Vestige is just weak.
Yeah, a "Harder" Story Boss would need to be better designed. The problem is not stats so much as their mechanics are very extremely simplistic because they are designed for beginning players getting into the game for the first time.
My concern is more so for the Big Bad of the Chapter/Q4 DLC/Year conclusion. These are the big bads that get put on posters, that are in the main advertisements for these expansions and base game. Making them only for beginning players is a big disappointment.
As a casual player I want to play an intriguing new story COMBINED with engaging gameplay. I want to relax but I don't want to be bored.AcadianPaladin wrote: »I very much like the wide range of difficulty available in ESO. When questing or farming mats, I want to focus on, well, questing or farming mats. If I want a challenge, I know where to get it. So I think the game is fine as is in that regard.
That said, I see no problem with a 'difficulty slider' that players can use to adjust their experience. Tamriel 1 introduced the concept of keeping mobs the same but 'battle leveling' low level players by buffing them. A difficulty slider that changes the player (not the mobs) should be easy to implement and it seems like many would welcome it.
I'm sorry but if that was an effective solution then we'd just wear trash gear and slot 0-1 skill. We've tried that and it doesn't fix the issue with boring fights.
#1. No one wants to opt to make themselves useless compared to other players in the same instance - they want enemies to be harder & tougher. They don't want to "lower themselves" but want enemies that are a challenge which they have to rise to meet.
#2 If there were to be a difficulty setting it would have to put the player in a separate instance. Just like Dungeons & Trials.4 -
Chadak✭✭✭✭✭kmontywrwb17_ESO wrote: »That ship has sailed my friend. ESO long ago went the easy route, and focuses on narrative more than combat. The community here as a rule like the game the way it is, and complain loudly if anything is too difficult or takes too much time. And fair enough, IMO. The pace of ESO is different to most other MMOs in that regard.
If you want difficulty and challenge in the core game, you are in the wrong MMO.
Why can't these hardcore MMO players after 7 years not get this? They come here and complain over and over. This is a game that is focused on the stories more so the combat difficulty and the majority of the player base think it's great. If the OP left swtor over this he should have picked a different game.
There are extremely difficult MMOs out there. These are the people that won't play those MMO's for reasons I don't care to speculate on. They're here, and they want this one to be tailored to them.
They don't want it to be tailored to the majority. They want it to be tailored to them, and for everyone else to be held to their individual standard. It isn't sufficient that ZOS has the information available to actually know what the majority is; these are the people that wouldn't care even if they had the data.
It's supposed to be all about them, in their manifest opinions. We're all supposed to suck it up and deal with how they want it, but since they're on the receiving end of their own logic in this situation...well, they don't like it. It's supposed to be the other way around. It isn't fair.
It's a form of selfishness that is unfortunately profoundly common throughout humanity, nevermind just the MMO space.
Burger King lied to them. They don't always get it their way, and you can see how mad they are about that all over the place.Edited by Chadak on June 24, 2021 3:11AM6 -
ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Guess most of you are to "Professional" for this game.
I think PvE content is rough. I've died multiple times already, eating my fair share of the "free" oh, f me I need a heal pot, and I'm not even through 2 of the PROLOGUE quests, and still sitting in Auridon.
Guess I'm to casual, incompetent in your eyes, YET I've been gaming since PONG on a 13" Black & White TV w/ Rabbit Ears n Dials....
Sue me....
Game is fine AS IS IMO....
Leave it alone....
Thanks!
No one in any of these threads that I have seen has ever said anything remotely derogatory to any player in regards to their perceived skill level. Don’t turn this into a casual vs elitist discussion. I’m Uber casual and so are many of the players who are advocating for a more engaging questing experience. In fact, most are for various optional difficulty instances so that those who like the current easy questing retain their desired format.
I agree. I understand some people want easy mode and some people want every battle to be an epic challenge. Most find overland to easy. Some would like them a little harder and some a lot harder. It would be nice if we had a choice. So people could pay at the difficulty that suits them. Since we are "adjusted" to the mobs, i don't really see this as being a huge issue. The difficulty level would just adjust your character stats to make the world easier or harder uniformly.2 -
Viewsfrom6ix✭✭✭✭✭Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Next thing that all these guys begging for harder haven't realized....
It's an MMORpg Open World, you are in game with, what, several hundred per zone???
So you want it harder, you're at the same Dolmen/Boss/Mob Farm Spot....
How does ZOS make it harder for you, yet keep it easy for others??
You don't, your slider won't do diddly squat, as you're in the same instance as the other 100 players right next to you....
That's why there are "Hard & Vet Dungeons", Trials, and what ever else...
Want "Harder" go where it's HARDER....
LMFAO!
Simple really, you all just don't like that answer....
Most people here want optional harder story or overland content like normal and vet for dungeons and trials. So relax, you won't be affected.Edited by Viewsfrom6ix on June 24, 2021 3:32AM5 -
ThorianB✭✭✭✭✭
✭Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Next thing that all these guys begging for harder haven't realized....
It's an MMORpg Open World, you are in game with, what, several hundred per zone???
So you want it harder, you're at the same Dolmen/Boss/Mob Farm Spot....
How does ZOS make it harder for you, yet keep it easy for others??
You don't, your slider won't do diddly squat, as you're in the same instance as the other 100 players right next to you....
That's why there are "Hard & Vet Dungeons", Trials, and what ever else...
Want "Harder" go where it's HARDER....
LMFAO!
Simple really, you all just don't like that answer....
Actually you are assuming the world must be made harder and ESO is actually backwards compared with other games. Mobs don't scale to you, you scale to them. You are the one that changes, they are the same difficulty at level 1, no CP that they are at level 50,3600 CP. And mobs are (mostly) the same everywhere in the game based on their class( normal, elite, etc.) You are the one that changed.
When you are new you are leveled up to the mobs level. You lose your "buffs" over time as you get closer to their level and after you reach their level you have no buffs. All of this is built in and the same system used to buff you from level 1 to CP 160 could be used to alter your difficulty. For example, the "slider" could be moved in the opposite direction so instead of getting a 20% buff to all stats you get a 20% penalty to all stats. This would make mobs more difficult for you but Ali might have his slider set on easy (OG difficulty), Ann might have hers set on Vet( 40% penalty) and Arnold might have his set on Elite (60% penalty and they might all be in the same group.
Ann might get a little better chance at more rare loot while Arnold might get an even better chance than Ann because they are playing at a higher difficulty.1 -
Chadak✭✭✭✭✭Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Next thing that all these guys begging for harder haven't realized....
It's an MMORpg Open World, you are in game with, what, several hundred per zone???
So you want it harder, you're at the same Dolmen/Boss/Mob Farm Spot....
How does ZOS make it harder for you, yet keep it easy for others??
You don't, your slider won't do diddly squat, as you're in the same instance as the other 100 players right next to you....
That's why there are "Hard & Vet Dungeons", Trials, and what ever else...
Want "Harder" go where it's HARDER....
LMFAO!
Simple really, you all just don't like that answer....
Most people here want optional harder story or overland content like normal and bet for dungeons and trials. So relax, you won't be affected.
That's just the thing though - how exactly would this even be implemented in a fashion that would matter?
Lets say they put in a difficulty toggle. Lets say you flip it on. What then?
Do you then do half damage and take 1.5x damage? How can overworld mobs have special mechanics for sophisticated difficulty without that affecting everyone else in the overworld as well?
Lets say you're doing literally anything in the overworld areas with literally anyone that doesn't have Hard Mode toggled on. Do mobs get Hard Mode mechanics that can affect you but not them? Just how long would you feel super thrilled to be doing less damage against mobs that the Normal Moders are just burning through?
Logically, you'd have to be in your own layer of the area where everything is tuned for this Hard Mode Overworld business, and where only other people with Hard Mode turned on also zoned into instead of the regular Normal Mode maps.
Very little of this game's story content is solo instanced. They could totally put difficulty options on that content in the storylines, sure, but that's a puny little smidge of content compared to all the quests and questlines there are throughout all the zones that are most definitely not exclusively instanced.
What you and others sharing your outlook want isn't particularly feasible because it literally wouldn't help anything, or it would effectively double the load on the servers to have to run twice as many iterations of every zone and public instance.
All so you can feel like you were threatened by a Guar while you were walking to Balmorra.Edited by Chadak on June 24, 2021 3:38AM5 -
Psiion✭✭✭✭Greetings,
After removing and editing some posts, we would like to remind everyone that Baiting is against the ESO Forum's Community Rules, and generally non-constructive. While debate is natural and welcome, provoking conflict, baiting, inciting, mocking, etc. is never acceptable in the official The Elder Scrolls Online community.
Moving forward, please keep the Community Rules in mind, and keep posts respectful.1 -
Ken_Koerperich✭✭✭Viewsfrom6ix wrote: »Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Next thing that all these guys begging for harder haven't realized....
It's an MMORpg Open World, you are in game with, what, several hundred per zone???
So you want it harder, you're at the same Dolmen/Boss/Mob Farm Spot....
How does ZOS make it harder for you, yet keep it easy for others??
You don't, your slider won't do diddly squat, as you're in the same instance as the other 100 players right next to you....
That's why there are "Hard & Vet Dungeons", Trials, and what ever else...
Want "Harder" go where it's HARDER....
LMFAO!
Simple really, you all just don't like that answer....
Most people here want optional harder story or overland content like normal and bet for dungeons and trials. So relax, you won't be affected.
That's just the thing though - how exactly would this even be implemented in a fashion that would matter?
Lets say they put in a difficulty toggle. Lets say you flip it on. What then?
Do you then do half damage and take 1.5x damage? How can overworld mobs have special mechanics for sophisticated difficulty without that affecting everyone else in the overworld as well?
Lets say you're doing literally anything in the overworld areas with literally anyone that doesn't have Hard Mode toggled on. Do mobs get Hard Mode mechanics that can affect you but not them? Just how long would you feel super thrilled to be doing less damage against mobs that the Normal Moders are just burning through?
Logically, you'd have to be in your own layer of the area where everything is tuned for this Hard Mode Overworld business, and where only other people with Hard Mode turned on also zoned into instead of the regular Normal Mode maps.
Very little of this game's story content is solo instanced. They could totally put difficulty options on that content in the storylines, sure, but that's a puny little smidge of content compared to all the quests and questlines there are throughout all the zones that are most definitely not exclusively instanced.
What you and others sharing your outlook want isn't particularly feasible because it literally wouldn't help anything, or it would effectively double the load on the servers to have to run twice as many iterations of every zone and public instance.
All so you can feel like you were threatened by a Guar while you were walking to Balmorra.
Thanks!
You explained better than I did...
Let's see how many "bash" you for it...
ROFL!7 -
Iccotak✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Next thing that all these guys begging for harder haven't realized....
It's an MMORpg Open World, you are in game with, what, several hundred per zone???
So you want it harder, you're at the same Dolmen/Boss/Mob Farm Spot....
How does ZOS make it harder for you, yet keep it easy for others??
You don't, your slider won't do diddly squat, as you're in the same instance as the other 100 players right next to you....
That's why there are "Hard & Vet Dungeons", Trials, and what ever else...
Want "Harder" go where it's HARDER....
LMFAO!
Simple really, you all just don't like that answer....
Actually you are assuming the world must be made harder and ESO is actually backwards compared with other games. Mobs don't scale to you, you scale to them. You are the one that changes, they are the same difficulty at level 1, no CP that they are at level 50,3600 CP. And mobs are (mostly) the same everywhere in the game based on their class( normal, elite, etc.) You are the one that changed.
When you are new you are leveled up to the mobs level. You lose your "buffs" over time as you get closer to their level and after you reach their level you have no buffs. All of this is built in and the same system used to buff you from level 1 to CP 160 could be used to alter your difficulty. For example, the "slider" could be moved in the opposite direction so instead of getting a 20% buff to all stats you get a 20% penalty to all stats. This would make mobs more difficult for you but Ali might have his slider set on easy (OG difficulty), Ann might have hers set on Vet( 40% penalty) and Arnold might have his set on Elite (60% penalty and they might all be in the same group.
Ann might get a little better chance at more rare loot while Arnold might get an even better chance than Ann because they are playing at a higher difficulty.
Here's what I would say
#1: If you have adjusted your difficulty to be higher then that puts you in a separate instance (Normal - Veteran, let's not make it more complicated) Having players on Normal decimating an enemy for another player on veteran is just not appealing. So make them two separate instances.
#2: Sure do that buff / de-buff idea, review the stats, but also make changes in mechanics - make enemies tougher (Story Bosses are the most in need for mechanics reviewed)
#3: As someone else said; "Getting better loot kind of defeats the object of having a challenging experience." So for Overland - increased difficulty does not grant increased reward. Challenge is the point, better rewards would remove an aspect of the challenge in Overland.0 -
Chadak✭✭✭✭✭Ken_Koerperich wrote: »Next thing that all these guys begging for harder haven't realized....
It's an MMORpg Open World, you are in game with, what, several hundred per zone???
So you want it harder, you're at the same Dolmen/Boss/Mob Farm Spot....
How does ZOS make it harder for you, yet keep it easy for others??
You don't, your slider won't do diddly squat, as you're in the same instance as the other 100 players right next to you....
That's why there are "Hard & Vet Dungeons", Trials, and what ever else...
Want "Harder" go where it's HARDER....
LMFAO!
Simple really, you all just don't like that answer....
Actually you are assuming the world must be made harder and ESO is actually backwards compared with other games. Mobs don't scale to you, you scale to them. You are the one that changes, they are the same difficulty at level 1, no CP that they are at level 50,3600 CP. And mobs are (mostly) the same everywhere in the game based on their class( normal, elite, etc.) You are the one that changed.
When you are new you are leveled up to the mobs level. You lose your "buffs" over time as you get closer to their level and after you reach their level you have no buffs. All of this is built in and the same system used to buff you from level 1 to CP 160 could be used to alter your difficulty. For example, the "slider" could be moved in the opposite direction so instead of getting a 20% buff to all stats you get a 20% penalty to all stats. This would make mobs more difficult for you but Ali might have his slider set on easy (OG difficulty), Ann might have hers set on Vet( 40% penalty) and Arnold might have his set on Elite (60% penalty and they might all be in the same group.
Ann might get a little better chance at more rare loot while Arnold might get an even better chance than Ann because they are playing at a higher difficulty.
And there it is. The whole point of all of this.
/thread6
This discussion has been closed.