With the monster set changes, which is BiS for mag dps for parsing?

naturebased · May 2020

(PTS) Is Zaan better over Domihaus and Valkyn Skoria, if:

Domihaus hits the target with the ring and you stay inside the ring during the parse.

And when using Valkyn you have 0 points in spell erosion and use those ten elsewhere? (such as elemental expert, or any damage CP where an extra 10 points will give atleast 1% more you wouldn't usually have)

And how does Maw of the Infernal compare? Seems decent but I'm not so much a fan of light attack procs (sometimes lag makes them not fire at all, which I think could make me miss out on timely procs).

I'm running a Breton Magicka Templar and am hoping for a boost in parse after the patch.

Olupajmibanan · May 2020

Ilambris with Elf Bane beats Zaan.

Otherwise it's Zaan all along which was even buffed for parsing.

Maw is decent but somewhat inconsistent due to light attack proc chance as you said. Haven't tried Domihaus tho as I find the ring size as too much of a limiting condition.

universal_wrath · May 2020

But why? You should be looking for practicle BiS instead of looking for parsing. Like, even if domihaus is BiS parsing set, how are you going to use it in combat?

Septimus_Magna · May 2020

The magsorc parses from Raiden (posted on Liko's YT channel) were using Maw of the Infernal because Deadric Prey is buffing the Daedroth's damage. Highest parse was something like 91k with vamp and Blood for Blood spammable.

Vara · May 2020

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Ilambris with Elf Bane beats Zaan.

Otherwise it's Zaan all along which was even buffed for parsing.

Maw is decent but somewhat inconsistent due to light attack proc chance as you said. Haven't tried Domihaus tho as I find the ring size as too much of a limiting condition.

Will Ilambris still be the best after they remove how this ability could stack on itself tomorrow?

Soundinfinite · May 2020

In general Zaan is still best for parsing. Domihaus, will basically equal the damage of Zaan now in my tests as long as u place yourself with the ring. As for people saying it's not functional, it has been basically BIS for Magicka dps in Sunsprie cause Zaan can't be used and the dragons hit box is so large it guarantees they are always taking the rings damage, or u go double crit on monster helms. And as long as you are not melee it is very easy to parse with and will allow you to use orbs and get their full damage affect. Nerienth hits like a frieght train, which will be very good on live, though it hits a bit less than Zaan or Domihaus. Ilambris and Nerienth are now on par with each other in damage output and both are buffed compared to live. Kjilnor is the same as before and very strong but now has no edge over easier to use helms as they hit at least as hard or harder now. Skoria is a straight dps loss compared to all options already mentioned. Maw of the Inferno is also on par with Ilambris and Nerienth, and yes can be made stronger on a sorc, but only a sorc and you must use Daedric Prey to get the damage boost, making it very limited. Any parse using the Vampire skills is a cheese parse, 91k or not.

Septimus_Magna · May 2020

Soundinfinite wrote: »

Maw of the Inferno is also on par with Ilambris and Nerienth, and yes can be made stronger on a sorc, but only a sorc and you must use Daedric Prey to get the damage boost, making it very limited. Any parse using the Vampire skills is a cheese parse, 91k or not.

Yeah, I think Blood for Blood will not be very practical but Elemental Weapon or Force Pulse will be pretty close dps-wise. Sustain is a lot easier with a health draining spammable but that also makes it dangerous to use.

Parsing on mag builds is very weird, most use Siroria which isnt used in raids so the numbers are inflated either way.

Soundinfinite · May 2020

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Soundinfinite wrote: »

Maw of the Inferno is also on par with Ilambris and Nerienth, and yes can be made stronger on a sorc, but only a sorc and you must use Daedric Prey to get the damage boost, making it very limited. Any parse using the Vampire skills is a cheese parse, 91k or not.

Yeah, I think Blood for Blood will not be very practical but Elemental Weapon or Force Pulse will be pretty close dps-wise. Sustain is a lot easier with a health draining spammable but that also makes it dangerous to use.

Parsing on mag builds is very weird, most use Siroria which isnt used in raids so the numbers are inflated either way.

Yes, all parsing is weird. Why do all Stam characters, save Stam warden, parse higher than mag, but mag is perferred on live and out perform most stam in raids. Because Stam parses with Rele which is single target and basically a dps loss in real play because there are really no fights without adds or an add phase. Cleve damAge is key and Rele sucks for it. But it hits 1 target really hard. Why do mag parse with Siroria when it can only be used effectively in 2-3 fights outside of Craglorn trials. Why do mag parse with Zaan when it is a dps loss in most situations cause it has low proc chance, long duration, and delivers the bulk of it's damage at it's end which is easily interuptable by trial mechanics, also only single target....I could go on.

It's why parsing is simply a guage of ones abilities, but not a true example of a players effectiveness in trial situations. There is, on average, a correlation between high parsing and higher raid dps, but one does not equal the other. Dummies are useful though, in learning your rotation, molding your muscle memory, and general testing....really they need to release a dummy that comes with 2 adds on each side for parsing and creating BIS gear set-ups. Or at least the dummy with 2 of those Precursor mini dummies you collect from clockwork city placed with it, to create a better trial vs dummy comparisons.

naturebased · May 2020

universal_wrath wrote: »

But why? You should be looking for practicle BiS instead of looking for parsing. Like, even if domihaus is BiS parsing set, how are you going to use it in combat?

Because guilds are demanding higher and higher parses for vet trials. Doesn't matter what DPS I do or don't do in the trial, but actually getting into those trials is the issue. Right now I'm at 63, and need to hit 70k

UnassumingNoob · May 2020

naturebased wrote: »

universal_wrath wrote: »

But why? You should be looking for practicle BiS instead of looking for parsing. Like, even if domihaus is BiS parsing set, how are you going to use it in combat?

Because guilds are demanding higher and higher parses for vet trials. Doesn't matter what DPS I do or don't do in the trial, but actually getting into those trials is the issue. Right now I'm at 63, and need to hit 70k

Feel your pain. Finally hit 70k to start getting the good gear and now it seems 75 is preferred. Goal posts keep changing.

Olupajmibanan · May 2020

naturebased wrote: »

universal_wrath wrote: »

But why? You should be looking for practicle BiS instead of looking for parsing. Like, even if domihaus is BiS parsing set, how are you going to use it in combat?

Because guilds are demanding higher and higher parses for vet trials. Doesn't matter what DPS I do or don't do in the trial, but actually getting into those trials is the issue. Right now I'm at 63, and need to hit 70k

I am the trial leader in my guild and I specificaly prohibited some things on dps tests. Our tests are done on Target Centurion Robust in full trial party while parse cheeses with little to no use in actual trial are prohibited (Siroria, Relequen, Zaan on ranged characters, at least 17k hp without ebon and minor toughness is needed so no cheese food ...). The idea behind this is that I want to see how applicants are confident with their rotations and especialy light attack weaving. You'll learn mechanics within a trial, but if you can't effectively LA weave on dummy you definitely couldn't do it in a trial.

I agree that dps tests does not show if the applicant is prepared for a particular trial, but it shows the level of general preparation.

Danksta · May 2020

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

naturebased wrote: »

universal_wrath wrote: »

But why? You should be looking for practicle BiS instead of looking for parsing. Like, even if domihaus is BiS parsing set, how are you going to use it in combat?

Because guilds are demanding higher and higher parses for vet trials. Doesn't matter what DPS I do or don't do in the trial, but actually getting into those trials is the issue. Right now I'm at 63, and need to hit 70k

I am the trial leader in my guild and I specificaly prohibited some things on dps tests. Our tests are done on Target Centurion Robust in full trial party while parse cheeses with little to no use in actual trial are prohibited (Siroria, Relequen, Zaan on ranged characters, at least 17k hp without ebon and minor toughness is needed so no cheese food ...). The idea behind this is that I want to see how applicants are confident with their rotations and especialy light attack weaving. You'll learn mechanics within a trial, but if you can't effectively LA weave on dummy you definitely couldn't do it in a trial.

I agree that dps tests does not show if the applicant is prepared for a particular trial, but it shows the level of general preparation.

Don't need to have stipulations on gear to see if someone knows their rotation or can weave. In fact, if you can't weave then using Relequen would expose that.

Olupajmibanan · May 2020

Danksta wrote: »

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

naturebased wrote: »

universal_wrath wrote: »

But why? You should be looking for practicle BiS instead of looking for parsing. Like, even if domihaus is BiS parsing set, how are you going to use it in combat?

Because guilds are demanding higher and higher parses for vet trials. Doesn't matter what DPS I do or don't do in the trial, but actually getting into those trials is the issue. Right now I'm at 63, and need to hit 70k

I am the trial leader in my guild and I specificaly prohibited some things on dps tests. Our tests are done on Target Centurion Robust in full trial party while parse cheeses with little to no use in actual trial are prohibited (Siroria, Relequen, Zaan on ranged characters, at least 17k hp without ebon and minor toughness is needed so no cheese food ...). The idea behind this is that I want to see how applicants are confident with their rotations and especialy light attack weaving. You'll learn mechanics within a trial, but if you can't effectively LA weave on dummy you definitely couldn't do it in a trial.

I agree that dps tests does not show if the applicant is prepared for a particular trial, but it shows the level of general preparation.

Don't need to have stipulations on gear to see if someone knows their rotation or can weave. In fact, if you can't weave then using Relequen would expose that.

Of course, but this way I can streamline the dps requirement (which I assure you, is very tolerant in this case) without having to study esologs for each member individualy.

Also, the guy above mentioned that he wants to farm Zaan in order to fulfill the dps requirement. That's exactly what I want to avoid. I definitely don't want people to farm sets they will never use outside of dummy parses. The dps requirement was set up with prohibited acces to parse cheeses in mind.

Septimus_Magna · May 2020

Soundinfinite wrote: »

Septimus_Magna wrote: »

Soundinfinite wrote: »

Maw of the Inferno is also on par with Ilambris and Nerienth, and yes can be made stronger on a sorc, but only a sorc and you must use Daedric Prey to get the damage boost, making it very limited. Any parse using the Vampire skills is a cheese parse, 91k or not.

Yeah, I think Blood for Blood will not be very practical but Elemental Weapon or Force Pulse will be pretty close dps-wise. Sustain is a lot easier with a health draining spammable but that also makes it dangerous to use.

Parsing on mag builds is very weird, most use Siroria which isnt used in raids so the numbers are inflated either way.

Yes, all parsing is weird. Why do all Stam characters, save Stam warden, parse higher than mag, but mag is perferred on live and out perform most stam in raids. Because Stam parses with Rele which is single target and basically a dps loss in real play because there are really no fights without adds or an add phase. Cleve damAge is key and Rele sucks for it. But it hits 1 target really hard. Why do mag parse with Siroria when it can only be used effectively in 2-3 fights outside of Craglorn trials. Why do mag parse with Zaan when it is a dps loss in most situations cause it has low proc chance, long duration, and delivers the bulk of it's damage at it's end which is easily interuptable by trial mechanics, also only single target....I could go on.

It's why parsing is simply a guage of ones abilities, but not a true example of a players effectiveness in trial situations. There is, on average, a correlation between high parsing and higher raid dps, but one does not equal the other. Dummies are useful though, in learning your rotation, molding your muscle memory, and general testing....really they need to release a dummy that comes with 2 adds on each side for parsing and creating BIS gear set-ups. Or at least the dummy with 2 of those Precursor mini dummies you collect from clockwork city placed with it, to create a better trial vs dummy comparisons.

I understand the reasons for normalizing variables (like gear and buff food) to get a test result that you can compare against other results. In my opinion this mainly works if everyone fully cheeses the parse or everyone just uses their actual raid gear, otherwise you're just comparing how good players can cheese.

If I compare dps on my magsorc vs my stamplar than the raid dummy parses on my stamplar are a lot closer to the actual trail dps. So should I bring my magsorc with high cheese parse or my stamplar with higher actual dps?