Who else is prepared to cure their vampire characters after Greymoor goes live?

technohic · May 2020

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Before y'all cure yourselves; someone give me a bite. I'm stuck in combat and am frustrated enough to take the 50% sprint cost reduction alone just to get around

Use Race Against Time from the Psijic Order skill line. Its additional speed and immobilization/snare immunity without the penalties of -100% health regeneration, 20% flame, 12% additional ability costs, and 20% more damage from Fighter's guild abilities. Can also make speed pots that restore stamina.

I think question is about maintaining speed cap for long periods and not just major expedition for 4 seconds for 3k+ magicka.

And you disappear! Great way to help not get run down by a zerg that sees the poor *** stuck running out there.

Vevvev · May 2020

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

I think question is about maintaining speed cap for long periods and not just major expedition for 4 seconds for 3k+ magicka.

Oh right, stamina builds don't have Race Against Time discounted and can't keep it up forever. Thing about speed pots still stands though.

technohic · May 2020

I will say though; sprinting while invisible aside as kind of a possible gimmick, it does seem like there is a lot of curse in the "kiss-curse" nonsense. The design seems heavily flawed.

MartiniDaniels · May 2020

technohic wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Before y'all cure yourselves; someone give me a bite. I'm stuck in combat and am frustrated enough to take the 50% sprint cost reduction alone just to get around

Use Race Against Time from the Psijic Order skill line. Its additional speed and immobilization/snare immunity without the penalties of -100% health regeneration, 20% flame, 12% additional ability costs, and 20% more damage from Fighter's guild abilities. Can also make speed pots that restore stamina.

I think question is about maintaining speed cap for long periods and not just major expedition for 4 seconds for 3k+ magicka.

And you disappear! Great way to help not get run down by a zerg that sees the poor *** stuck running out there.

Yes, I think it will be fun as hell, especially with new perfected master's bow backbar and something like torc of tonal constancy. Just rotate roll-dodge, mist, sprint into invisibility, occasional stealth and run utter glass cannon, relying only on active protection+undeath. I think something like 7k WD without gathering stacks is achievable that way

Of course magDK will hurt vampires, but I'll see how they can keep up against such mobility.

Vevvev wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

I think question is about maintaining speed cap for long periods and not just major expedition for 4 seconds for 3k+ magicka.

Oh right, stamina builds don't have Race Against Time discounted and can't keep it up forever. Thing about speed pots still stands though.

RAT is nice ability, but it is only 30% speed boost which is achievable in many ways. And with 30% speed bonus you won't get away from anybody. From my experience, zergs/smallscales start to give up if your average speed is ~80-85%, so you need to have high sprint uptime for kiting/flanking in open world.

MartiniDaniels · May 2020

technohic wrote: »

I will say though; sprinting while invisible aside as kind of a possible gimmick, it does seem like there is a lot of curse in the "kiss-curse" nonsense. The design seems heavily flawed.

But you will have ~400-450 (buffed) WD each you time you leave that invisibility.
Overall, I'll start with stage 3, and if there will be no problems with sustain then try stage 4. Of course health recovery is very important for S&B builds which run around the tower weaving block and gathering stacks... but for glass cannon kite builds it's not so critical and that 20% fire susceptibility softened by undeath will be barely noticeable from non-magDK sources... dawnbreaker... when I use non S&B build, all I see is how dawnbreakers hit ground... with that cast time and if you move fast, it is very rare that you'll be hit by one. Only stamsorcs can land it consistently with streak stun into double cc, but stamsorcs are rare fish now...
Cost is again compensated by mobility, if you can kite, your magicka will recover when you sprint, and stamina when you mist.

I think vampire will be changed a lot, most probably nerfed on offense but with reduced cost penalty... but I don't think vampire is bad. It opens possibilities for new builds and stops working in old builds... so instead of advantage vs 11 specs and huge disadvantage against 1 spec, it will have personal niche builds, like it should be. Now 50% of PVP-ers are vampires, and in endgame PVE, probably 90%. This is simply stupid and in-immersive situation. Vampirism is a curse, it should have own builds and applications and not some generic buff to recovery/mitigation for everyone like it used to be.

technohic · May 2020

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I will say though; sprinting while invisible aside as kind of a possible gimmick, it does seem like there is a lot of curse in the "kiss-curse" nonsense. The design seems heavily flawed.

But you will have ~400-450 (buffed) WD each you time you leave that invisibility.
Overall, I'll start with stage 3, and if there will be no problems with sustain then try stage 4. Of course health recovery is very important for S&B builds which run around the tower weaving block and gathering stacks... but for glass cannon kite builds it's not so critical and that 20% fire susceptibility softened by undeath will be barely noticeable from non-magDK sources... dawnbreaker... when I use non S&B build, all I see is how dawnbreakers hit ground... with that cast time and if you move fast, it is very rare that you'll be hit by one. Only stamsorcs can land it consistently with streak stun into double cc, but stamsorcs are rare fish now...
Cost is again compensated by mobility, if you can kite, your magicka will recover when you sprint, and stamina when you mist.

I think vampire will be changed a lot, most probably nerfed on offense but with reduced cost penalty... but I don't think vampire is bad. It opens possibilities for new builds and stops working in old builds... so instead of advantage vs 11 specs and huge disadvantage against 1 spec, it will have personal niche builds, like it should be. Now 50% of PVP-ers are vampires, and in endgame PVE, probably 90%. This is simply stupid and in-immersive situation. Vampirism is a curse, it should have own builds and applications and not some generic buff to recovery/mitigation for everyone like it used to be.

Yeah; I was playing around with it on PTS on a stamplar template, without any set, and hadn't set CP and was able to sustain sprint with our resource management and look forward to playing with that sort of style. Only thing that feels kind of weird, yet I feel I have to do it, is run both shuffle and mist form. Mist form to get the damage buff and provide active tankiness when needed, but shuffle so you can sprint for 3 seconds without getting snared along with having that covered while fighting outside of form.

mavfin · May 2020

When a skill line is added by most players who use it solely just for 2 passives, and not the active skills, then it's good that they're making it more active, and not a 'get two buffs FREE!!!!' deal.

Werewolf does have a stam recovery if slotted, but, otherwise the skills are active, and the passives affect WW form only.

Vampire will become more active. Sure, some are butthurt that they are losing their easy near-zero-risk passive boosts, but, that needed to go away.

I ran into a guy last night who was curing all his vampires, which he had *only* for the passives. He as asking for WW bites, so my WW bit him.

Lord-Otto · May 2020

technohic wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Before y'all cure yourselves; someone give me a bite. I'm stuck in combat and am frustrated enough to take the 50% sprint cost reduction alone just to get around

Use Race Against Time from the Psijic Order skill line. Its additional speed and immobilization/snare immunity without the penalties of -100% health regeneration, 20% flame, 12% additional ability costs, and 20% more damage from Fighter's guild abilities. Can also make speed pots that restore stamina.

I think question is about maintaining speed cap for long periods and not just major expedition for 4 seconds for 3k+ magicka.

And you disappear! Great way to help not get run down by a zerg that sees the poor *** stuck running out there.

Nightblades will happily tell you that invisibility breaks on a cricket's fart.

technohic · May 2020

Lord-Otto wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Vevvev wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Before y'all cure yourselves; someone give me a bite. I'm stuck in combat and am frustrated enough to take the 50% sprint cost reduction alone just to get around

Use Race Against Time from the Psijic Order skill line. Its additional speed and immobilization/snare immunity without the penalties of -100% health regeneration, 20% flame, 12% additional ability costs, and 20% more damage from Fighter's guild abilities. Can also make speed pots that restore stamina.

I think question is about maintaining speed cap for long periods and not just major expedition for 4 seconds for 3k+ magicka.

And you disappear! Great way to help not get run down by a zerg that sees the poor *** stuck running out there.

Nightblades will happily tell you that invisibility breaks on a cricket's fart.

I have a NB and realize how easy it breaks, but lets not pretend like it never helps at all. Especially if you are invisible to begin with. Even better is sprinting while doing so.

MartiniDaniels · May 2020

technohic wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

I will say though; sprinting while invisible aside as kind of a possible gimmick, it does seem like there is a lot of curse in the "kiss-curse" nonsense. The design seems heavily flawed.

But you will have ~400-450 (buffed) WD each you time you leave that invisibility.
Overall, I'll start with stage 3, and if there will be no problems with sustain then try stage 4. Of course health recovery is very important for S&B builds which run around the tower weaving block and gathering stacks... but for glass cannon kite builds it's not so critical and that 20% fire susceptibility softened by undeath will be barely noticeable from non-magDK sources... dawnbreaker... when I use non S&B build, all I see is how dawnbreakers hit ground... with that cast time and if you move fast, it is very rare that you'll be hit by one. Only stamsorcs can land it consistently with streak stun into double cc, but stamsorcs are rare fish now...
Cost is again compensated by mobility, if you can kite, your magicka will recover when you sprint, and stamina when you mist.

I think vampire will be changed a lot, most probably nerfed on offense but with reduced cost penalty... but I don't think vampire is bad. It opens possibilities for new builds and stops working in old builds... so instead of advantage vs 11 specs and huge disadvantage against 1 spec, it will have personal niche builds, like it should be. Now 50% of PVP-ers are vampires, and in endgame PVE, probably 90%. This is simply stupid and in-immersive situation. Vampirism is a curse, it should have own builds and applications and not some generic buff to recovery/mitigation for everyone like it used to be.

Yeah; I was playing around with it on PTS on a stamplar template, without any set, and hadn't set CP and was able to sustain sprint with our resource management and look forward to playing with that sort of style. Only thing that feels kind of weird, yet I feel I have to do it, is run both shuffle and mist form. Mist form to get the damage buff and provide active tankiness when needed, but shuffle so you can sprint for 3 seconds without getting snared along with having that covered while fighting outside of form.

Yes, this double snare protection bothered me too before... but now Mist became toggle! This is imo most awesome change (in combination with SD/WD buff when leaving it). Now we'll be able to use mist as cheap block and immobilization removal/stun prevention and for snare immunity shuffle/roll-dodge. Let's say you know pattern of that tryhard magsorc and expect when he will streak to prevent jabs/dizzy? Just keep using mist each 6 seconds (when you are not cc-immune) for 1 second and it will be a hell to time streaking both for offense and defense! And for stamina with 500 magregen that block of magicka regeneration for 1-2 GCD means absolutely nothing.

Neoauspex · May 2020

I'm prepared to cure my ESO disease once New World goes live

Katahdin · May 2020

I dont have any vampires to cure because I always hated what being a vamp did to the apperance of my characters.
Apperance that I put a lot of thought into. I know its changing with this revamp of vamps but Im not really interested in vamps. I did make one of my characters a vamp once so I could at least do that part of the story and for the achievement. Cured it as soon as it reached level 10.

I dont plan on making any of them vampires at this point either unless I want the achievement on another character.
MIght try it just to see what its like on one but right now, I dont plan to.

I am also very glad that they are no longer a "must have" for anything and everything.
Have been told more than once that if youre DPS, you have to be vamp, if youre at tank, you have to be vamp.
Nope, not gona do it.

.

xF1REFL1x · May 2020

Gonna cure all my dps... sad to see them go but there is no need anymore to be one.

Kolzki · May 2020

I think I'll cheese the thieves guild and dark brotherhood achievements and then cure it.

Tandor · May 2020

As usual with the QQ posts that accompany Updates, people always seem to me to make it sound as if responding to the offending changes by in this case curing vampirism is a game changing once and forever decision that will reject that particular path and thereby destroy their enjoyment of the game for all time.

However, isn't it the case that when the first incremental patch makes a slight tweak to whatever it is that forced them down that road they'll switch back with no loss of xp or skills from their previous vampiric incarnation?

Vicinia · May 2020

I gave it some thought, I'm mass curing except for my NB bomber. I'll see if I can make it work, if not I'll cure. I can always get a bite if they make changes in the future 🤷🏾‍♀️

I can't imagine staying fugly paired with that cost increase to abilities in PvP

Shardaxx · May 2020

As a stam nb what I've read doesn't look good, so might cure depending on how things go.

preevious · May 2020

Ah ! hell no ! I'll reign supreme atop my stage 4 vampirism.
The cost increase is nothing I can't handle.

MartiniDaniels · May 2020

Shardaxx wrote: »

As a stam nb what I've read doesn't look good, so might cure depending on how things go.

You have access to 1400+ WD for your burst plus stealth at full speed without stage 4 harsh penalties plus undeath was buffed two times, so you stack it with grim focus and shade and you'll be tanky AF in 6 medium+1 heavy and 3 damage sets. All of that for 8% cost increase. "Doesn't look good"
New Vampire is a boon from ZOS for PVP nightblades.

Shardaxx · May 2020

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Shardaxx wrote: »

As a stam nb what I've read doesn't look good, so might cure depending on how things go.

You have access to 1400+ WD for your burst plus stealth at full speed without stage 4 harsh penalties plus undeath was buffed two times, so you stack it with grim focus and shade and you'll be tanky AF in 6 medium+1 heavy and 3 damage sets. All of that for 8% cost increase. "Doesn't look good"
New Vampire is a boon from ZOS for PVP nightblades.

Ah ok, I've not looked at all the details figured I'd just see what it looks like on the day, but I saw people saying that vamps are really just for magicka chars now and no good for stam. Where is that extra weapon damage coming from is that a vamp skill?

MartiniDaniels · May 2020

Shardaxx wrote: »

MartiniDaniels wrote: »

Shardaxx wrote: »

As a stam nb what I've read doesn't look good, so might cure depending on how things go.

You have access to 1400+ WD for your burst plus stealth at full speed without stage 4 harsh penalties plus undeath was buffed two times, so you stack it with grim focus and shade and you'll be tanky AF in 6 medium+1 heavy and 3 damage sets. All of that for 8% cost increase. "Doesn't look good"
New Vampire is a boon from ZOS for PVP nightblades.

Ah ok, I've not looked at all the details figured I'd just see what it looks like on the day, but I saw people saying that vamps are really just for magicka chars now and no good for stam. Where is that extra weapon damage coming from is that a vamp skill?

You get 300 unbuffed each time you leave steath, cloak or mist (stage 2)
Also you get 660 from toggle ability which consumes your health, but this is not a problem to activate it just before the burst...
so 960*1.45 is roughly 1400.

Dr_Ganknstein · May 2020

Glurin wrote: »

Sange13 wrote: »

Glurin wrote: »

I'd say they were quite successful in achieving what they set out to do.

Think about it. If you've got a ton of people just taking vampire by default for the recovery passive and ignoring the rest of it, then it's only natural that there would be a lot of them curing themselves after the rework and the passive goes away. It essentially reset the decision of being a vampire. So think of it more like making that decision for the first time. Do you want your character to be a vampire?

What an arbitrary and asinine thing for a dev team to do. That's like saying that too many people take Light Armor for the passive spell pen, so we're going to rework it and remove that so now people have to "reset their decision" about playing magicka dps. Completely horrible grounds for making these changes.

Sure, except that people taking the spell pen passive are probably wearing light armor. You know, because it doesn't work unless you are wearing five pieces of light armor. That wasn't really the case with vampirism. You got the regen because, well, because you put a point in it and that was it really. It would be like getting that spell penetration even though there's not a single stitch of light armor on you.

You also get more damage from fire damage and fighters guild abilities and horrible health recovery, or did you forget all the draw backs?

Bucky_13 · May 2020

My PvP NB will stay at stage 2, still not gonna bother with any vampire skills though.

bentmer · May 2020

They should add a new skill line that provides the 3 passives that everyone was a Vampire for (Supernatural Recovery, Undeath, Dark Stalker) but amplifies the reason alot of people didn't want to be a Vampire. (How ugly they looked)

I'll call it the Min-Max line which grants you the above 3 passives but your character will have one impossibly tiny arm and another grotesquely large arm that you cannot hide with costumes, morphs, etc.

And it'll nerf your health recovery -50% so when you fall off a cliff and are too lazy to heal yourself with a spell/skill and don't want to use a potion, you will live in fear for the next 30 seconds that a skeever might kill you.

Somers23 · May 2020

Why would I log in to cure them? Is the better answer

Somber97866 · May 2020

Stupid and hate it! Why must there always be a sh*tty drawback to everything good and positive that they do!
Revamping vampires was a wonderful idea .........taking the reason they were viable ( in my opinion) just killed the whole thing for me!
They never ceases to amaze me with the BS!

Nova_J · May 2020

Djeriko wrote: »

Updates to vampires have been needed for a while. Cool animations are great. New abilities are very welcome. But at what cost? Some players became vampires mainly to assist with sustain on certain builds as vampires came with an increase in recovery on a passive. With the loss of the Supernatural Recovery passive, I've lost my reason to have any vampires. When Greymoor drops, instead of a tradeoff for lost health recovery but receiving increased magic and stamina recovery, I'll just lose health recovery. So I'll be cutting my losses. The priest in Bankorai will get a boom in business for a while. Cool story and new abilities aside, I've made it obvious that I think ZOS dropped the ball here. Feel free to disagree but I suspect I'm not alone in saying losing Supernatural Recovery is a bad idea.

This is the new bloodfiend skill line lol not the new Vampire skill line.

Paradisius · May 2020

Ill be keeping my Vampirism, I dont agree with alot of changes to it (Especially the Blood Frenzy and Vampire Cost Reduction changes in 6.0.3) But I do like Vampires and Blood Magic of any kind, and Ive tested enough on the PTS to make something that works for me. But I do hope they actually follow their word on "Monitoring Vampires" because it has alot of serious problems, and I am not surprised so many want to cure.

Varana · May 2020

Icky wrote: »

You also get more damage from fire damage and fighters guild abilities and horrible health recovery, or did you forget all the draw backs?

Don't matter in PvE.

TragedyOA · May 2020

tomofhyrule wrote: »

I dunno. I've never really been into vampires; the only one I have is a mule alt now. Werewolves are cooler.

Still, I can kinda see where they're coming from for this. It seems that almost every endgame build recommended online either recommended or required vampirism solely for Supernatural Recovery. Vampirism became this thing that everyone had to have since the pros (the passives) significantly outweighed the cons of washed out tattoos and fire weakness (which itself was mostly mitigated by the Undeath passive). You rarely saw anyone using the vampirism skills, and you never saw anyone going around feeding since there was no reason to not be stage 4.

OP said it yourself: some people get infected only for sustain, and your entire reason to have vampires was one passive. Now considering the lore is all "vampires are rare creatures who accepted this horrible curse for power," it is a bit more aligned now that it's not a mandatory thing for every endgame build.

Based on the patch notes, vampirism is now being made into something that you need to choose to use, what with the decrease in cost of vamp abilities/increase of others. Of course that's throwing a wrench into everyone's builds now since nobody was really playing vampires before, they were playing their normal build with a bonus to recovery. Now vampirism's got some drawbacks to it and expects you to play as a vampire.

I may test it out a bit, and I do like the RP aspect so I may have a reason to play it for a bit - I can see where it would fit into my story. But vampirism will be a lot rarer in game, focused around the RPers and people who want to play a vampire instead of the latest min-maxed class. And now with them in the justice system too, that adds another fun layer of RP (imagine that, RPing in an RPG...).

I will say that the NPC animations look loads better than what we're getting though. I've also never been a huge fan of the Blood Scion form - I'd have rather kept an ultimate like the Bats and include the Scion as a morph thereof - but I'll have to see how it plays. The changes don't affect any of my characters though, so I'm not mad about it.

But werewolves are still cooler.

lol