Cathexis wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Langeston wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

mav1234 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

mav1234 wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Speed is good vs melee because they have to be in melee range to hit you, and most melee are using dizzy. It has nothing to do with the current patch.

Things are different this patch.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIzNq2exFHs
edit:
this one too, although some duplicate from the above
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXX0G6N424k

Well the only real difference I see is how animation cancelling effects abilities. The way he’s describing abilities has been that way for a long time, that’s why there are so many rock humpers.

There are a large number of abilities where animation cancelling's changes have altered the positional checks timing in such a way that gameplay is different, and more speed has become more important to avoid the latency effect he describes, esp with executioner. Pay attention on a 5m range melee the amount of out of range messages you get now compared to how it used to be - it is markedly different. Something has changed, and running speed now has become more important on stam than last patch.

I don’t play stam really so haven’t noticed any difference as mag. Best solution would be to remove the 2nd check, remove the need to ani cancel in the first place.

People have cried like crazy to leave it in, but especially in pvp I’m noticing a huge gap between top end players and average players. People have lobbied to keep ani canceling as is to keep their advantage, but all this patch has really done is remove the benefit from ani canceling.

I’m not top tier, but decent, but I’m noticing the top end players are just wrecking people. Removing the benefit of ani canceling might help even the playing field and make pvp more competitive.

A little tangent to the point, but I think the devs trying to work around the ani canceling benefit is why they made the change. Not everyone wants to min-max that much. The whole block change was never about block imo, block is just the mechanic to cancel and they want to leave the animation so there’s counter play.

Yes a top tier player should wreck an average player. That's not a problem. That's a natural outcome between two players of different skill level. Your suggestion does not make the playing field even. You are just dumbing gameplay down even further instead of learning to play. And what you most definitely don't do is make the game more competitive. Removing player skill from the game is the exact opposite of making gameplay competitive.

You want to advocate for the removal of ani canceling then feel free to hop on the train with the rest of them. But please spare us from the nonsense about even playing field and making the game competitive.

The problem with animation cancelling is that many players don't even know it exists. ZOS doesn't even adequately explain mechanics that it has implemented intentionally — the only mention I've seen of animation cancelling is a single loading screen.

I think that if animation cancelling were explained in detail in-game (maybe even a brief tutorial) it might go a long way towards making the mechanic a bit more palatable for the newly initiated. As it stands right now, I'd imagine it seems more like an exploit to them than anything. Of course that will never happen, just like a proper explanation of jump points (which would literally require just one sentence) will never happen.

Many players dont even know about status effects either. Should we remove them too to "make the playing field even and more competitive"?

I think if they intended to keep weaving as an unintended mechanic, then they should be teaching players to weave in the introductory mechanics, not making them root through YouTube videos after they hear about it vaguely from a third party.

Because that's what creating an even playing field is. You don't make highschool football players play against NFL teams without teaching them the basics of the game.

well technically they do tell you in the tutorial about weaving. its part of the advises the game gives you while u level up. Here is the thing tho. When u talk about top tier players it doesnt really matter how good the tutorial is. Sure it could be better but at the end of the day no one started the game as a top tier player. The difference is that the top tier players just cared enough to learn instead of running to the forums asking for mechanics to be deleted because someone else wrecked them. You can delete as many mechanics as you want. A top tier player will still wreck an average player not because of the mechanics but because of their different mindset.

Yeah to some extent except I don't think it has so much to do with mindset, as much as just being thorough and practiced. Some calls for nerfs I think do come from legitimately experienced players. I think though that you get a "me" orriented consensus about what is or is not balanced, and it causes a sort of stratified powercreep favouring populism. That's why I think there is a perception of marked decline at endgame, because nerfs hedge against an average of players, and the population of endgame pvpers tend to have a decay rate while the majority of players are pve oriented.

In part I think they need to preface and consolidate discussions on skill balance. What they ought to do is have a separate forum containing a sticky thread poll for each skill, polling for [Overpowered/Average/Underpowered] so that the community voices are consolidated and so that nerf/buff threads aren't constantly being rehashed. Close it to new posts but allow replies, and reset the threads every patch. Then you would see an an accurate viewpoint on the current state of any given skill.

With regard to it as a balance mechanism for tutorials I agree, but generally the purpose of a tutorial isn't to turn a noob into a pro in a 30 minute seminar, it is something though that players should be encouraged to practice during the level progression particularly if they plan to pvp. Another good way to facilitate this might be to have a training station in Cyrodiil at the alliance bases that illustrates the mechanics, tests the player, and then gives feedback based on how accurately the player performed.